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[DE]Connor

Arbitrations Revisited Part 2

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You know, hadn't thought of something: all those trash Arcanes are going to drop as R0.

 

So you would have to grind for a long time to get all 10 of the Arcanes you want for that one niche build and likely get multiple copies of mods you don't need more then one of (Auras).

That sounds appealing to any one? Not me thou...

 

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Soooooo

We'll get rewards faster but the costs of rewards will go up anyways so what even is the point

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51 minutes ago, Gravemind93 said:

Soooooo

We'll get rewards faster but the costs of rewards will go up anyways so what even is the point

You get double the rewards but the cost only raises by half. Net 50% Vitus gain

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On 2019-09-12 at 2:30 PM, [DE]Connor said:

EDIT 2: Updated names of new Aura mods.

Could you please, at least acknowledge the mountain of feedback that isn't related to cyan stars? All you have to do is tack on "We are still reviewing your other suggestions, stay tuned." There are plenty of things that people are equally or more upset about in your post. Naming the auras that some of us are having issues with and leaving it at that, just makes it seem like you've moved on. Community feedback should be a priority.

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12 hours ago, ArturiaFayth said:

Combat Discipline: -HP on kill for self / +HP on kill for Allies  <---- That aura reads like one people will rarely, if ever use though. Whenever your allies do the killing, you get hp added (whether that is added towards you or the whole squad is not yet revealed so it is not yet clear how the adding and subtracting will work ) but whenever you yourself do the killing, you or your squad lose hp. Unless you are only defending and healing, without doing a single kill, it seems like an useless aura.

I will probably try a warding halo build with health conversion , reaping chakram

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Hopefully you guys will revisit "revive" method... I don't wanna have to be forced to revive an afk leech just because I accidentally stepped on a red kryptonite.

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Excavations will be the new dead Arbitration mode. Bigger drop table, less Endo with same time investment. Even the other modes will give less Endo. You'll keep getting crap you don't want after you got it once. Hope I'm wrong. Will definitely try the Survival, if they increase the life support drops, but won't be holding my breathe.

Edited by RunningChaos

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10 hours ago, Jay1408 said:

I will probably try a warding halo build with health conversion , reaping chakram

Revenant doesn't care about health, so it can work on him. I constantly self damage while playing him.

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23 hours ago, ArturiaFayth said:

Combat Discipline: -HP on kill for self / +HP on kill for Allies  <---- That aura reads like one people will rarely, if ever use though. Whenever your allies do the killing, you get hp added (whether that is added towards you or the whole squad is not yet revealed so it is not yet clear how the adding and subtracting will work ) but whenever you yourself do the killing, you or your squad lose hp. Unless you are only defending and healing, without doing a single kill, it seems like an useless aura.

I think it's like Power Donation. You lose say 1% hp and all allies get 1% hp. So if all 4 has the Aura, everyone in squad will constantly lose 1%, but at same time get 3% hp per enemy killed. If you nuke then you might loose out I guess.

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They rolled the changes as is, apparently changing the names of the garbage Auras and Arcanes was all the feedback they wanted from us... *slow clap*

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So much for "these plans are subject to change both before and after release, based on player feedback".....

17 pages of clear rejection towards the idea of diluting the drop tables with the new rewards instead of getting them from the Arbitration shop.

17 pages of clear rejection of the revive system.

17 pages outright ignored.

Edited by Jarriaga
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Firstly thanks for the upgrade to improve arbitrage this looks promising, now let's go to what is missing in this immediate fix note:
REPAIR WARFRAME VOLT.
RETURN IT TO WHAT WAS BEFORE HOTFIX "Saint of Altra: Update 25.7.0", VOLT'S SECOND SKILL !!! This running animation of the character, now this ridiculous, strange real horror, and now the volt looks more like a turtle so slow than lightning! fix it!

1-Quill Onkko's door won't open.

2- My Riven Rifle does not open, the challenge to fish, mine and kill in 30 seconds, simply none of these activities when performed are computed to open riven, fix it!

3- When the incubator will be permanently eliminated from the game, giving way to some really useful and practical ship module that will allow us to equip any mascot in any loadout slot setup without needing so much bureaucracy to access our mascots!

Edited by Max_Chief
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So you didnt listened to 17 pages of feedback on arbitrations .. 

Once again DE proves that they are stubborn on keeping the game the way they want it to be and make it a grind for casuals while having no real content for vets

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So after all this feedback you decided that reducing endo by 25% wasn't enough and the drop tables should be even more diluted.

What exactly was the point of this thread, to figure out how people wanted arbitrations to be changed and do the exact opposite?

Edited by Rogunz
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Please accept my downvote for this latest changes to arbitration.

(Nothing to add to 17 pages of feedback).

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I don't know where to begin... I no longer dedicate to being concerned about Warframe's balance anymore... So, I'll cut this short.

Players complain a lot for 'bad rewards, lackluster, nothing to do, etc etc...' This is caused by a discrepancy of viability between overpowered weapons and the average stuff. You fix that by bringing the whole to a level, nerf, no other word around it. You give value to lower assets by decreasing the gap between them and the overpowered broken stuff running around the game.

Introducing more ways to multiply damage, like the new Arcanes with further damage multipliers doesn't make weak weapons competitive, it makes stuff that's already off the chart further overpowered ridiculous. More Armor doesn't make low armor frames viable, it makes Chroma, Inaros, Rhino's tankiness further broken OP. It only makes the whole of it, worse.

Now... why someone thought the game needed to introduce new Arcanes with further everything-multipliers, is beyond comprehension...

Edited by Duduminador

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7 hours ago, Rogunz said:

So after all this feedback you decided that reducing endo by 25% wasn't enough and the drop tables should be even more diluted.

What exactly was the point of this thread, to figure out how people wanted arbitrations to be changed and do the exact opposite?

I don't think I'll be playing Arbitration anymore. If you take the 25% Endo reduction and the diluted drop table. You will have to spend twice as long to get the same or even less Endo.

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Since I, a dirty console peasent, apparently am disallowed to comment on the PC updates (wtf?), I'm just going to say this here:

May it be possible that dev workshop posts are a waste of everybody's time at this point? You wasted your time typing and posting it. Players wasted their time typing and posting feedback. All these 18 pages of feedback fest resulted in was to remove the cyan stars before shipping it. Now I look at the PC update post and both (the dev and player posts) look pretty much the same all over again. Who would have thought it would go that way if nothing changed content-wise from the dev workshop post to the update post?

Like, next time you might just ship it right away and let players from every platform comment there instead. What's the point to search for and give feedback in advance if it basically changes nothing before the release anyways? Seems like less of a hassle for everybody involved and we can move the ignored feedback to the release post right away and the feedback that seems to matter and actually gets listened to by you within an hour these days we can leave to the Twitter users who gave the "feedback" to get the (not-so) Universal Medailion (anymore) be made useless for the only thing it was actually interesting for (aside from the fact that they don't even exceed the daily cap unlike syndicate medalions either amongst other things, but I digress...).

Why care about the content of players who write walls of detailed posts of feedback with reasons and explanations (and some salt at this point), if you can just listen to two sentences of complaints on Twitter, right?

 

Edited by (PS4)Deeceem
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Wow DE!!! I really hope that you read all the concerns, comments and player feedback this time. I can feel all the frustration coming in from this thread. Please listen to your community as we are all trying to help you fix this game. Give the players what they want which is LOOT. I do agree with most that the drop tables are bad. Make it available for purchase with all the vitus essences / credits / other resources we have obtained. If I can suggest (which I really do hope you read the player feedback) is to increase the LOOT rewards dropping more often in all game modes. "This is a PVE game after all." This will result in players being more active in across the board - Its an end to the constant hotfixes and will free up lots of time for you and your team to work on actual content. Another tip: Please give us options to select difficulty modifiers for example (Normal / Hard / God / Ridiculous) to all bossess on the star chart and reward players with some serious cool LOOT upon completion.

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Played a few Arbitrations today with the hope that things wouldn't be as bad as the last seventeen pages of comments suggested. And...it turns out it's actually that bad. With all the trash mods and arcanes clogging up the reward pool, Arbitrations are now a pretty inefficient endo farm.

Why do the whole 'one step forward, two steps back' routine yet again DE? It's almost like nobody bothered to read the feedback here.

But I guess it's not a huge deal for me, I'll just go go back to logging on for the sortie and then enjoying other games for a stint.

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Actually I did the math and take back the worries I stated before release, you on average over time and get slightly more endo than before, it's not a lot but more is more, about 26.5 endo more per minute on average after accounting for the drop chances and double and assuming 5 minutes per rotation now and 10 minutes per rotation in the old system.

Not a huge increase, but an increase nonetheless, and they did add new content, even though the new mods and arcanes are pretty terrible, at least they're new, and we're getting slightly more endo on average, so I'm happy with the update, and metering out rewards just FEELS so much better in the classic time frame for rewards rather than the doubled arbitration times.

Edit: Fixing wrongly stated extra endo per minute after double checking my math.

Edited by Sylonus
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7 minutes ago, Sylonus said:

Actually I did the math and take back the worries I stated before release, you on average over time and get slightly more endo than before, it's not a lot but more is more, about 58 endo more per minute on average after accounting for the drop chances and double and assuming 5 minutes per rotation now and 10 minutes per rotation in the old system.

Not a huge increase, but an increase nonetheless, and they did add new content, even though the new mods and arcanes are pretty terrible, at least they're new, and we're getting slightly more endo on average, so I'm happy with the update, and metering out rewards just FEELS so much better in the classic time frame for rewards rather than the doubled arbitration times.

did you include sculptures?

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1 hour ago, agrub said:

did you include sculptures?

Yes

Edit: Using capped star values of sculptures as drops, and here's my math, feel free to double check me:

Treating statues as their endo value turned in at full stars because most people I know and myself do so, and using 5/10 minutes for reward intervals ala survival even though some game modes are slightly faster/slower.

Old Rotation A: Every 10 Minutes
Endo: 1300 @36.5% (474.5)
Ayr: 1425 @18% (256.5)
Sah: 1500 @18% (270)
Valana: 1575 @18% (283.5)
Expected Endo Per 10 Minutes: 1,285.5
Expected Endo Per Minute: 128.55

New Rotation A: Every 5 Minutes
Endo: 900 @40% (360)
Ayr: 1425 @9% (128.25)
Sah: 1500 @9% (135)
Valana: 1575 @9% (141.75)
Expected Endo Per 5 Minutes: 765
Expected Endo Per Minute: 153
A Rotation Difference: 24.25 More Endo Per Minute

Old Rotation B: Every 10 Minutes
Endo: 1600 @48% (768)
Piv: 1725 @20% (345)
Vaya: 1800 @20% (360)
Expected Endo Per 10 Minutes: 1473
Expected Endo Per Minute: 147.3

New Rotation B: Every 5 Minutes
Endo: 1200 @39.5% (474)
Piv: 1725 @12% (207)
Vaya: 1800 @12% (216)
Expected Endo Per 5 Minutes: 897
Expected Endo Per Minute: 179.4
B Rotation Difference: 32.1 More Endo Per Minute

Old Rotation C: Every 10 Minutes
Endo: 2000 @47.5% (950)
Orta: 2700 @29% (783)
Expected Endo Per 10 Minutes: 1,733
Expected Endo Minute: 173.3

New Rotation C: Every 5 Minutes
Endo: 1500 @29.5% (442.5)
Orta: 2700 @20% (540)
Expected Endo Per 5 Minutes: 982.5
Expected Endo Per Minute: 196.5
C Rotation Difference: 23.2 More Endo Per Minute

Edited by Sylonus
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