Saryn's 4th ability

[Swagernator22663]

Imagine being this mad at people.

[Cibyllae]

20 hours ago, DawnFyreSon said:

Saryn IS an outlier no matter how much you want to deny it.

And shes like because people complained. Like you are right now.

[TenebraeAeterna]

Code Broken, trying again. Text was bleeding into the posts of others.

 

Edited September 26, 2019 by TenebraeAeterna
Broke Code?

[(PSN)thegarada]

I think skill 1 scales and spreads too generously. Other than that, Saryn is great, but not over powered. 

I also find talking about sub level 80 mobs is kinda pointless. And Saryn, while scales well, is by no means killing level 80 mobs+ that fast. This: "holy crap, fully decked Saryn ate my mobs while leveling," is silly. 

[TenebraeAeterna]

On 2019-09-24 at 1:47 PM, Xepthrichros said:

It is safe to assume all of you are complaining about Saryn in low level content. 

This isn't a PVP game. No need to get competitive. Maybe as a new player, you think shooting these brain dead paper thin low level  enemies as something "fun". After you do this for the 500th hour or longer, it's not. There's no need to slowly do something, when it can be done fast.

Also, team mate's kills still gives you XP. Don't act like your team mate is preventing you from leveling. 

Please educate yourself. https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Affinity

 

I remember a time where players asked for Saryns etc. to carry them to Hydron to help them farm affinity. These days we have entitled fussy people that complain about "muh interactivity". Your interactivity will be your boredom once you shoot these walking planks of wood (especially for low to mid level content) for the millionth time and realize they do not and never will pose a threat to you and you are wasting time shooting them slowly one by one. 

Oh wait, I actually still see people who ask for nuking and farming  help at Hydron. It's not a generation thing. Just a "you" thing, and a few others.

Saryn's power is worked for. She is obtained from the boss at Sedna, which is at the end of the Star Chart. Requires many hours of overall gameplay time to reach that point and get her. This is not just looter shooter, it is also an action RPG, in case you missed the memo. Look at your mods and all the leveling you need to put into them. That's a RPG mechanic. Based on the way you talk about things, you obviously missed this memo. Different equipment has different power levels. Saryn is obtained later in the game, and designed to kill mid to high level fodder enemies fast, to sustain high efficiency in a specific content known as Elite Sanctuary Onslaught. Of course, if equipment is meant to do well at high levels, then naturally, they will completely dumpster low level fodder, which is where you are at now. If they nerf Saryn to be crap at low level fodder, then she will be useless at high levels, and she will utterly useless overall - and rival Ember in terms of uselessness. Right now, there is content that Saryn will not work so well in, which you probably have not yet progressed enough to attempt yet - such as Disruptions, Eidolon Hunts, Orb Mother fights and Arbitrations. These modes contain certain mechanics like ability immunity or resistance. and various bosses or mini-bosses, and the way you beat them requires things that Saryn cannot do efficiently. You can fulfill your desire for interactivity there. These enemies also do stand a chance at actually killing you pretty well, and you can actually fail your mission, so it is indeed less boring, and can be challenging, if that is what you want.

 

That's all fine and well, but you do realize that some people like to actually kill too...correct? I mean, if players are running around trying to kill and a Saryn player is just nuking the map...it kind of takes the entire point of the game away for anyone else. If the enjoyment of the game for everyone was idling until they achieve the victory conditions, then sure...you'd have an excellent point.

For some players, the mission is just a means to an end...but not for everyone, and especially not for lower leveled players. You're basically telling people, "Don't worry about trying to kill anything until end-game. Eidolon Hunts, Orb-Mother fights, and Arbitrations are when you'll get to actually engage the enemy!"

A bit hyperbolic, but that's essentially what you're saying...and it's silly. I'm saying this as someone who doesn't even want or care if Saryn gets nurfed.

This entire thread reminds me of when I was in a defense mission with a Saryn player who just sat in the middle and nuked the entire map. The rest of us were running around and amused over the fact that right before we engaged the enemy...they would suddenly flail as though terrified by our sheer presence and topple to the ground. Obviously this wasn't some sort of hidden intimidation stat, it was the Saryn player just nuking the hell out of them. We were all bantering about it and said player seemed rather nervous, despite the fact that we were all actually pretty amused, likely because every Saryn player seems VERY fearful of a nurf.

This hasn't happened to me very often, but I can understand the annoyance being on par with Limbo's old troll-tactic of tossing players into Limbo without a means of escape..........because that's exactly what Saryn tends to do in these situations, prevent players from doing anything except run around like a chicken with their head cut off.

2 hours ago, (PS4)thegarada said:

I think skill 1 scales and spreads too generously. Other than that, Saryn is great, but not over powered. 

I also find talking about sub level 80 mobs is kinda pointless. And Saryn, while scales well, is by no means killing level 80 mobs+ that fast. This: "holy crap, fully decked Saryn ate my mobs while leveling," is silly. 

Again, if she's absolutely annihilating all content until end game...you're leaving other players with zero to do until end game. Like I said to Xepth, you're basically telling players that combat only begins when they reach Eidolon Hunts, Orb-Mother fights, and Arbitrations.

Don't get me wrong, I don't mind Saryn and found it rather comical...but I can easily see the absurdity in telling everyone that they only get to really play the game, if they're teamed up with a Saryn player, at end-game and to just get used to idling until then. That's silly.

What's the answer to this?

Hell if I know. I don't want to see her get nurfed, but at the same time...if the situation I described above happened to me more often, I'd be pretty annoyed too. Thankfully, I've only been in that situation a couple of times, so I simply enjoyed it as a novelty and laughed it off. One guy seemed to be getting miffed, but the banter calmed him down and he seemed to be moderately okay with it by the end...but you could tell that he had run into this much more often than we did by the way he was talking.

[(PSN)chris1pat8twins]

You do know there is an option called SOLO right? Why must everybody else stop for you? How about YOU go play SOLO if “FUN” is that matters. People play public for the teamwork, the grinding, maybe even assist. People like you demanding “fun” need to learn to use the solo option cause this is only a you problem. Not the entire warframe community. Find some “fun” buddies to have “fun” with. But don’t be getting mad because most players understand how this game works and make builds specifically for that. 

[Loza03]

1 hour ago, (PS4)chris1pat8twins said:

You do know there is an option called SOLO right? Why must everybody else stop for you? How about YOU go play SOLO if “FUN” is that matters. People play public for the teamwork, the grinding, maybe even assist. People like you demanding “fun” need to learn to use the solo option cause this is only a you problem. Not the entire warframe community. Find some “fun” buddies to have “fun” with. But don’t be getting mad because most players understand how this game works and make builds specifically for that. 

Key point bolded here.

Some people derive their fun and enjoyment from the teamwork. From the idea that they are a vital part of a larger endeavour. A single frame nuking the hell out of everything to the point where there's no point to anyone else even being here is antithetical to that.

And fun is, frankly speaking, the endgoal. How the game works should be in service to that goal.

[Morticoccus]

3 hours ago, Loza03 said:

Key point bolded here.

Some people derive their fun and enjoyment from the teamwork. From the idea that they are a vital part of a larger endeavour. A single frame nuking the hell out of everything to the point where there's no point to anyone else even being here is antithetical to that.

And fun is, frankly speaking, the endgoal. How the game works should be in service to that goal.

That does not happen in high level play though. There she acts more like a debuffer to counteract spongy enemies.

Yes her spores will eventually get to the point where everything dies but at that point they will wipe the field and reset, even with max duration and power her stacks fade crazy fast.

[(PSN)thegarada]

15 hours ago, TenebraeAeterna said:

That's all fine and well, but you do realize that some people like to actually kill too...correct? I mean, if players are running around trying to kill and a Saryn player is just nuking the map...it kind of takes the entire point of the game away for anyone else. If the enjoyment of the game for everyone was idling until they achieve the victory conditions, then sure...you'd have an excellent point.

For some players, the mission is just a means to an end...but not for everyone, and especially not for lower leveled players. You're basically telling people, "Don't worry about trying to kill anything until end-game. Eidolon Hunts, Orb-Mother fights, and Arbitrations are when you'll get to actually engage the enemy!"

A bit hyperbolic, but that's essentially what you're saying...and it's silly. I'm saying this as someone who doesn't even want or care if Saryn gets nurfed.

This entire thread reminds me of when I was in a defense mission with a Saryn player who just sat in the middle and nuked the entire map. The rest of us were running around and amused over the fact that right before we engaged the enemy...they would suddenly flail as though terrified by our sheer presence and topple to the ground. Obviously this wasn't some sort of hidden intimidation stat, it was the Saryn player just nuking the hell out of them. We were all bantering about it and said player seemed rather nervous, despite the fact that we were all actually pretty amused, likely because every Saryn player seems VERY fearful of a nurf.

This hasn't happened to me very often, but I can understand the annoyance being on par with Limbo's old troll-tactic of tossing players into Limbo without a means of escape..........because that's exactly what Saryn tends to do in these situations, prevent players from doing anything except run around like a chicken with their head cut off.

Again, if she's absolutely annihilating all content until end game...you're leaving other players with zero to do until end game. Like I said to Xepth, you're basically telling players that combat only begins when they reach Eidolon Hunts, Orb-Mother fights, and Arbitrations.

Don't get me wrong, I don't mind Saryn and found it rather comical...but I can easily see the absurdity in telling everyone that they only get to really play the game, if they're teamed up with a Saryn player, at end-game and to just get used to idling until then. That's silly.

What's the answer to this?

Hell if I know. I don't want to see her get nurfed, but at the same time...if the situation I described above happened to me more often, I'd be pretty annoyed too. Thankfully, I've only been in that situation a couple of times, so I simply enjoyed it as a novelty and laughed it off. One guy seemed to be getting miffed, but the banter calmed him down and he seemed to be moderately okay with it by the end...but you could tell that he had run into this much more often than we did by the way he was talking.

As I mentioned in my post, I think skill 1 is a bit too strong. As for end game, level 30-50 content is barely even middle game. And while Saryn, with over extend, can hit mobs across halls. The AOE nuking is by no means exclusive to her. Half the frames fully decked, can clear rooms below level 50, almost instantly. You cannot balance frames based on how fully decked will perform in sub level 50 content. 

[Xepthrichros]

17 hours ago, TenebraeAeterna said:

Again, if she's absolutely annihilating all content until end game...you're leaving other players with zero to do until end game. Like I said to Xepth, you're basically telling players that combat only begins when they reach Eidolon Hunts, Orb-Mother fights, and Arbitrations.

There's is nothing absurd about what I am saying. 

What's absurd is how you and others like TC fail to grasp basic RPG mechanics. Saryn is obtained at the very end of the star chart. She is designed for mid to high level fodder enemies. You all are complaining about her being good at killing low to mid level fodder enemies. If they nerf her to being useless at low level enemies, she will just be - useless. Currently, she already falls off in higher end content against bosses and other enemies that come with ability immunity etc. So I say, go there to play. Furthermore, most warframes can nuke Level 1-40 enemies quite easily (Nyx being exception). Take away Saryn and I will bring even my Rhino to show you he can do same. And if I somehow know you are on Earth defense map, I will bring my Vauban with strength modded Tesla and spam it repeatedly to show you just how even Tesla can absolutely function as that turret that many people ask for, and demolish things.

And guess what, 3/4 people on the team, if they see what I am doing, will stay and enjoy the assist in helping them get through the mission faster. It is you folks that are problematic, complaining about nuking. If nukers are not good at what they are designed to do, why even exist? You CANNOT balance a game around low level content and make everything slow there and miss the big picture. If things are bad at dealing with low level, they will be bad at dealing with ALL levels. Then you have to nerf the enemies eventually to bring them down fit the new lowered player power. Which in turn leads to a new question - why bother modding and leveling up if the power difference is not significant between the start of the game and the end of the game? If Defense is the be all and end all of warframe, why even bother since the entire experience is the same? Warframe is growing and has longevity because of the RPG mechanics, leveling up, etc. that requires time to get through and keeps people on longer - and then variety of modes - some easier and can be plowed through with overleveled gear, some clearly endgame and meant for such high level gear and provide challenge, which in turn can help cater to those who want power fantasy or want struggles.

Really, normal people see a nuke frame as a welcome help to speeding up the grind, of which there is ALOT of in this game. Personally, when I was a newb and saw a Banshee or Saryn clearing the map, I was awed and determined to get that same power. We have tons of things to reach MR30, and then forma, and MR30 AGAIN... and again, to reach the desired build... You people want to slow down this process? 

To be frank, this nerf / "power creep" mindset is holding back the entire game. This failure to acknowledge there are RPG mechanics and grinding in the game. Every time DE releases new content that doesn't raise that power meaningfully, and is just some sort of "sidegrade" or fashionframe, is a waste of time. Often you hear folks say "content drought". And also you see the complaints of "no meaningful rewards" - how is DE to release any new meaningful boosts in strength when you have these "power creep" complainers? And then sometimes you get things nerfed, you ruin our efficiency, you prolong the grind. 

Killing weak enemies that pose zero threat in a SLOW manner, which is what you are arguing for, is NOT fun. Especially when you know you can dumpster them and have the means to, and are just doing it slower just because reasons. It is boring and annoying. You want a challenge? Go find one in the appropriate game modes. They are called ENDGAME for a reason. And if you are reading this from a newb perspective - the whole world doesn't stop just for you to catch up. Expecting it to do so, is the real absurdity. 

Edited September 27, 2019 by Xepthrichros

[TenebraeAeterna]

4 hours ago, Morticoccus said:

That does not happen in high level play though. There she acts more like a debuffer to counteract spongy enemies.

Yes her spores will eventually get to the point where everything dies but at that point they will wipe the field and reset, even with max duration and power her stacks fade crazy fast.

You're telling people that they're only allowed to actually play at higher levels if they're matched with Syran players. This isn't a game where players with nukes that only drop in efficiency at higher levels are forced to play only at higher levels.

3 hours ago, (PS4)thegarada said:

As I mentioned in my post, I think skill 1 is a bit too strong. As for end game, level 30-50 content is barely even middle game. And while Saryn, with over extend, can hit mobs across halls. The AOE nuking is by no means exclusive to her. Half the frames fully decked, can clear rooms below level 50, almost instantly. You cannot balance frames based on how fully decked will perform in sub level 50 content. 

The problem still remains.

That said, I've only ever seen Saryn do this...and considering everyone fawns so heavily over her for this very capability..........yeah. If this was a game where you were locked out of lower end content when you've gotten to the point that you can just nuke it all into oblivion, there wouldn't be a problem..........................but then there would be a whole slew of additional problems. So, that obviously wouldn't work...nor would it be fun either.

Again, don't get me wrong...I'm pretty apathetic towards any notion of a nurf for her, but I can see how people might be frustrated over this if they end up in this situation often...much like how people were annoyed with Limbo before the change. I honestly don't typically like the concept of nurfing at all...but I don't really know how to address the problem either.

Edit: I actually come up with a potential solution to the potential problem below.

1 hour ago, Xepthrichros said:

There's is nothing absurd about what I am saying. 

What's absurd is how you and others like TC fail to grasp basic RPG mechanics. Saryn is obtained at the very end of the star chart. She is designed for mid to high level fodder enemies. You all are complaining about her being good at killing low to mid level fodder enemies. If they nerf her to being useless at low level enemies, she will just be - useless. Currently, she already falls off in higher end content against bosses and other enemies that come with ability immunity etc. So I say, go there to play. Furthermore, most warframes can nuke Level 1-40 enemies quite easily (Nyx being exception). Take away Saryn and I will bring even my Rhino to show you he can do same. And if I somehow know you are on Earth defense map, I will bring my Vauban with strength modded Tesla and spam it repeatedly to show you just how even Tesla can absolutely function as that turret that many people ask for, and demolish things.

And guess what, 3/4 people on the team, if they see what I am doing, will stay and enjoy the assist in helping them get through the mission faster. It is you folks that are problematic, complaining about nuking. If nukers are not good at what they are designed to do, why even exist? You CANNOT balance a game around low level content and make everything slow there and miss the big picture. If things are bad at dealing with low level, they will be bad at dealing with ALL levels. Then you have to nerf the enemies eventually to bring them down fit the new lowered player power. Which in turn leads to a new question - why bother modding and leveling up if the power difference is not significant between the start of the game and the end of the game? If Defense is the be all and end all of warframe, why even bother since the entire experience is the same? Warframe is growing and has longevity because of the RPG mechanics, leveling up, etc. that requires time to get through and keeps people on longer - and then variety of modes - some easier and can be plowed through with overleveled gear, some clearly endgame and meant for such high level gear and provide challenge, which in turn can help cater to those who want power fantasy or want struggles.

Really, normal people see a nuke frame as a welcome help to speeding up the grind, of which there is ALOT of in this game. Personally, when I was a newb and saw a Banshee or Saryn clearing the map, I was awed and determined to get that same power. We have tons of things to reach MR30, and then forma, and MR30 AGAIN... and again, to reach the desired build... You people want to slow down this process? 

To be frank, this nerf / "power creep" mindset is holding back the entire game. This failure to acknowledge there are RPG mechanics and grinding in the game. Every time DE releases new content that doesn't raise that power meaningfully, and is just some sort of "sidegrade" or fashionframe, is a waste of time. Often you hear folks say "content drought". And also you see the complaints of "no meaningful rewards" - how is DE to release any new meaningful boosts in strength when you have these "power creep" complainers? And then sometimes you get things nerfed, you ruin our efficiency, you prolong the grind. 

Killing weak enemies that pose zero threat in a SLOW manner, which is what you are arguing for, is NOT fun. Especially when you know you can dumpster them and have the means to, and are just doing it slower just because reasons. It is boring and annoying. You want a challenge? Go find one in the appropriate game modes. They are called ENDGAME for a reason. And if you are reading this from a newb perspective - the whole world doesn't stop just for you to catch up. Expecting it to do so, is the real absurdity. 

Translation:

"Wait until Eidolons, Orb Mother fights, and Arbitration if you want to play the game." Which is, basically, what you said in your previous post.

Yes, that is a very absurd statement to make.

Your Rhino requires you to actually be around the enemies you're killing, not half-way across the map. I wouldn't know anything about Vauban...because I have never seen one played and hear that he's utter garbage now. I have him waiting in the foundry though...so I'll eventually mess around with him. Can't speak on him though...as I've literally never seen him played.

Some of the rest of your rant I actually agree with, but the issue with this is that Syran isn't restricted to top-end content and what you are saying to anyone below top-end content is, "You don't get to play until the last 10% of the game. Deal with it." Once again, yes...that is a very absurd statement to make. Fun is subjective. It's not fun to stand around for 90% of the game and watch other players do everything for you either. You might as well not even be playing the game, at that point. It may have been fun for you to do that, but there's a fair share of people out there who actually want to play the game for more than 10% of it.

I'm fairly new to the game... I started a long time ago, but quit before even completing the tutorial because I just couldn't get into it...hence why I have a Loki as my starter, as finishing the tutorial recently gave me my first pick from way back when, instead of the Volt I chose this time around. Got all the planets unlocked, got this season of Nightwave finished, came in a little while after this season started. Got Syran recently, haven't leveled her yet and completed the entire main story with only a few of the side quests to do.

The only frame I've ever seen do what I've described in my previous post is Syran. Thankfully, I haven't experienced it very often...so it was a novelty to me, something I found to be amusing. If, however, my experience with the game would have been encountering more Syran players...I probably would never stuck around because of how boring that match was. The humor only lasts so long...which is likely why the one guy in that match seemed slightly aggravated, as I suspect he had dealt with this sort of thing more often than the rest of us.

That said, this is all based off theory too.

It was a novelty for me and I've only had this situation happen a couple of times. What I'm saying is based off the possibility of it happening to people often. That doesn't mean it does, which is something they can monitor internally via data. This might not even be a problem for ANYONE. I don't know. What I'm saying is that I could easily see a problem for players if it's happening to them often, that they're being matched up with Syran players.

What's a fix that wouldn't require a nurf? (As stated, I don't like nurfs in general.)

Random match-ups factor in how many times you've been matched with a Syran player and actively seek to avoid matching you up with them too often...or matching you up with too many Syran players that have been tagged as heavy nukers. That would probably work... Off-hours would disable the system if there weren't many players online, and grouping up directly wouldn't factor in the system at all.

That would probably work just fine...if there's even a problem to begin with.

...but telling people that they shouldn't expect to play 90% of the game because you like your nuking power is absurd, you have to understand that.

Edited September 27, 2019 by TenebraeAeterna

[(PSN)mindwarper11]

On 2019-09-25 at 1:20 AM, Xepthrichros said:

Lol the valkyr part. Typical "pls nerf everyone else except me!" mindset. Utterly self-serving.

Again, you keep complaining about abilities. How about you go play modes where enemies are resistant and immune to abilities and enjoy your day, instead of crying? You can already find what you want, but you don't want to go do it.

 

Or are you that even weirder group that doesn't want challenge and also don't want to win fast, but wants to kill brain dead, absolutely zero threat enemies slowly? Are you the kind of person that actually thinks its fun to shoot almost stationary targets at a shooting gallery in a virtual game where you can't even feel any physical recoil or hear the oomph of a shot?

 

And if everything is nerfed, I can flip it around and ask you, who needs to farm new weapons and warframes if the so-called new stuff offer absolutely zero improvements to my gameplay efficiency or power? All of them will end up becoming reskins of one another, fashionframe endgame becomes even more of a reality than it is right now. And adding cosmetics only to a game with RPG leveling mechanics is a bad idea, because everyone who's in it for the RPG mechanics will not be interested in skins, or lame attempt at "side-grades", but rather how to improve their stats further. It is alienating part of the audience of this game. Heck, this is already a problem now. Wisp, Gauss, etc. many of the new frames are absolutely not worth using in terms of power, just lame side-grades or even inferior versions of other warframes that exist in the game. People that care about them are more into fashion and appearance, and again, that's not for everyone. 

That....that was the joke...don't need me, just everyone else!

I'm not crying.

Actually...you are. 

In terms of efficiency, why bother playing if it comes down to hit a couple keys, rinse and repeat...what are you aiming to? You already clear the map, why wait 3 hours for things to get tough? What's the challenge? What's the reward? 

Go play one of the many auto phone games...

It is literally the same thing.

You mentioned killing one at a time, mindless barely moving enemies....butter you're killing the same thing?

And again, it's a team game, that kind of gameplay makes bringing more teammates pointless. They just get in the way, shoot you with a blinding ARCA plasmor, or do other potentially annoying actions...

[Azrael_V]

7 hours ago, Xepthrichros said:

There's is nothing absurd about what I am saying. 

What's absurd is how you and others like TC fail to grasp basic RPG mechanics. Saryn is obtained at the very end of the star chart. She is designed for mid to high level fodder enemies. You all are complaining about her being good at killing low to mid level fodder enemies. If they nerf her to being useless at low level enemies, she will just be - useless. Currently, she already falls off in higher end content against bosses and other enemies that come with ability immunity etc. So I say, go there to play. Furthermore, most warframes can nuke Level 1-40 enemies quite easily (Nyx being exception). Take away Saryn and I will bring even my Rhino to show you he can do same. And if I somehow know you are on Earth defense map, I will bring my Vauban with strength modded Tesla and spam it repeatedly to show you just how even Tesla can absolutely function as that turret that many people ask for, and demolish things.

And guess what, 3/4 people on the team, if they see what I am doing, will stay and enjoy the assist in helping them get through the mission faster. It is you folks that are problematic, complaining about nuking. If nukers are not good at what they are designed to do, why even exist? You CANNOT balance a game around low level content and make everything slow there and miss the big picture. If things are bad at dealing with low level, they will be bad at dealing with ALL levels. Then you have to nerf the enemies eventually to bring them down fit the new lowered player power. Which in turn leads to a new question - why bother modding and leveling up if the power difference is not significant between the start of the game and the end of the game? If Defense is the be all and end all of warframe, why even bother since the entire experience is the same? Warframe is growing and has longevity because of the RPG mechanics, leveling up, etc. that requires time to get through and keeps people on longer - and then variety of modes - some easier and can be plowed through with overleveled gear, some clearly endgame and meant for such high level gear and provide challenge, which in turn can help cater to those who want power fantasy or want struggles.

Really, normal people see a nuke frame as a welcome help to speeding up the grind, of which there is ALOT of in this game. Personally, when I was a newb and saw a Banshee or Saryn clearing the map, I was awed and determined to get that same power. We have tons of things to reach MR30, and then forma, and MR30 AGAIN... and again, to reach the desired build... You people want to slow down this process? 

To be frank, this nerf / "power creep" mindset is holding back the entire game. This failure to acknowledge there are RPG mechanics and grinding in the game. Every time DE releases new content that doesn't raise that power meaningfully, and is just some sort of "sidegrade" or fashionframe, is a waste of time. Often you hear folks say "content drought". And also you see the complaints of "no meaningful rewards" - how is DE to release any new meaningful boosts in strength when you have these "power creep" complainers? And then sometimes you get things nerfed, you ruin our efficiency, you prolong the grind. 

Killing weak enemies that pose zero threat in a SLOW manner, which is what you are arguing for, is NOT fun. Especially when you know you can dumpster them and have the means to, and are just doing it slower just because reasons. It is boring and annoying. You want a challenge? Go find one in the appropriate game modes. They are called ENDGAME for a reason. And if you are reading this from a newb perspective - the whole world doesn't stop just for you to catch up. Expecting it to do so, is the real absurdity. 

Well said.

[Miyabi-sama]

Every time I nuke the damn mobs I dream about happy teammates, smiling and content, watching those affinity and loot, and sometimes focus numbers...

... and then I come to the Forum.

[(PSN)chris1pat8twins]

2 hours ago, Miyabi-sama said:

Every time I nuke the damn mobs I dream about happy teammates, smiling and content, watching those affinity and loot, and sometimes focus numbers...

... and then I come to the Forum.

I had a Valkyr, A VALKYR, complain about my Sayrn powered by a 206% Rhino Roar clearing the map while FARMING FOR RELICS on Hydron. 

Seriously these complainers are a joke. They clearly NEVER really played this game if they complain about the lack of “fun”. I find fun in the kind of teamwork I engage in, such as using rhino to power up teammates like Sayrn, Equinox, etc. to either destroy maps or destroy bosses. 

But most players asked either for my rhino build or my Saryn/Equinox builds. Even the few buddies I play with copied my builds and they get asked a lot for the builds. It’s like how you can meet a lot of people in person and think the area you live in is some kind of utopia, but then get online and find out it is actually worse. 

The excuses these complainers use is just laughable. Everybody else told to play solo when dealing with AFKers or Leechers, but players complaining about not having “fun” slowly picking off one enemy at a time get told “yeah man, what selfish inconsiderate MAJORITY of players”. 

Yep makes perfect sense. 🥴

[(PSN)chris1pat8twins]

23 hours ago, Loza03 said:

Key point bolded here.

Some people derive their fun and enjoyment from the teamwork. From the idea that they are a vital part of a larger endeavour. A single frame nuking the hell out of everything to the point where there's no point to anyone else even being here is antithetical to that.

And fun is, frankly speaking, the endgoal. How the game works should be in service to that goal.

The one major reason I use a pure power strength build on my rhino is to apply a 206% roar all teammates, including Saryn, to destroy all enemies and farm for the resources or relics we need/want. I wouldn’t be holding the amount of platinum I currently have if I just stood back and watch all the Valkyrs and Inaroses run around slowly picked off one enemy at a time.

I actually find “fun” in real teamwork such as combining abilities together to accomplish a goal as quickly as possible, as efficiently as possible, for the soul purpose of farming resources and relics. Not “okay the valkyr gets the north corner, the Inaros gets the south, the Excalibur gets the west, and wukong you get the east. Okay everybody let’s complete this mission and farm for relics as slowly as possible”.

So I’ll say it again. Y’all want “fun” slowly picking off enemies, then play solo, find friends, or go to recruit. Cause DE is not gonna keep making it harder and hard to grind and farm for everybody else just cause a few newbies make “what about me” complaints. 

Don’t like the grind then go play a game that isn’t grindy. 

[DawnFyreSon]

2 hours ago, (PS4)chris1pat8twins said:

The one major reason I use a pure power strength build on my rhino is to apply a 206% roar all teammates, including Saryn, to destroy all enemies and farm for the resources or relics we need/want. I wouldn’t be holding the amount of platinum I currently have if I just stood back and watch all the Valkyrs and Inaroses run around slowly picked off one enemy at a time.

I actually find “fun” in real teamwork such as combining abilities together to accomplish a goal as quickly as possible, as efficiently as possible, for the soul purpose of farming resources and relics. Not “okay the valkyr gets the north corner, the Inaros gets the south, the Excalibur gets the west, and wukong you get the east. Okay everybody let’s complete this mission and farm for relics as slowly as possible”.

So I’ll say it again. Y’all want “fun” slowly picking off enemies, then play solo, find friends, or go to recruit. Cause DE is not gonna keep making it harder and hard to grind and farm for everybody else just cause a few newbies make “what about me” complaints. 

Don’t like the grind then go play a game that isn’t grindy. 

Sounds like all you want is to maximize your efficiency. This however is not fun for most players, especially gameplay where as a rhino all you do is tap roar every few seconds to buff the player (the saryn) that is getting all the kills and is actually getting to interact with the game and have fun. If thats why you play warframe more power to you, but most of us dont really have fun being pidgeonholed into a passive "tap 1 support ability" playstyle.

 

You are missing the entire point of this thread, saryn is an overbearing frame that FORCES her teammates into a support role because they cant do anything else if the mission spawns enough mobs for her spores to self sustain.

 

Not to mention that if all YOU want to do in this game is to support the Saryns of this world then you should go to recruiting and let people actually have a chance at playing their frames the way they are meant to, and not how some toxic Saryn player forces them to.

[Miyabi-sama]

4 минуты назад, DawnFyreSon сказал:

most players

 

4 минуты назад, DawnFyreSon сказал:

most of us

 

5 минут назад, DawnFyreSon сказал:

all YOU want to do in this game is to support the Saryn

Well this is gorgeous. Translating your own wishes to unseen majority and trashtalking a guy who speaks for himself.

I'd say something on topic this time but I'm too lazy to type, and whatever I can come up with is pretty obvious things people etiher forget about or blatantly ignore.
Just a quick tip: there is plenty of opportunities to find yourself a team in forum and in recruitment chat with the same mindset you have.

[(PSN)chris1pat8twins]

28 minutes ago, DawnFyreSon said:

Sounds like all you want is to maximize your efficiency. This however is not fun for most players, especially gameplay where as a rhino all you do is tap roar every few seconds to buff the player (the saryn) that is getting all the kills and is actually getting to interact with the game and have fun. If thats why you play warframe more power to you, but most of us dont really have fun being pidgeonholed into a passive "tap 1 support ability" playstyle.

 

You are missing the entire point of this thread, saryn is an overbearing frame that FORCES her teammates into a support role because they cant do anything else if the mission spawns enough mobs for her spores to self sustain.

 

Not to mention that if all YOU want to do in this game is to support the Saryns of this world then you should go to recruiting and let people actually have a chance at playing their frames the way they are meant to, and not how some toxic Saryn player forces them to.

“Most”? Dude clearly you haven’t been playing this game long or much at all. I’ve played with all sorts of players from MR1 - MR27 and NONE of them complained except for 1 Valkyr during a Hydron defense while farming for relics. Most of them asked me for my builds or thanked me for helping them out. Some even sent me friend requests or asked if they could continue to farm with me. 

Just cause YOU see a few people complain on the Forums about a horde killing frame, doesn’t mean that Y’ALL speak for the majority. You’ll learn one way or another that this game requires A LOT of grinding and people are going to naturally look for builds and frames that reduce the amount of time it takes to grind. 

YOU may not care about the grind but most players that actually play this game do. Some of us have lives outside this game and can not afford to spend hours playing this one game. And we are not gonna spend weeks farming for a new prime because a FEW newbies are too lazy to play solo or find friends that only care about slow grinding “fun”. 

You have an easy option to avoid this “issue”. But you are demanding that DE practically slow the rest of US down for YOU. I know 10 people that play this game and they do not agree with you. Nor do the hundreds to thousands of players I’ve encountered. 

Get your math and facts straight before speaking for the majority. 

Edited September 28, 2019 by (PS4)chris1pat8twins

[DawnFyreSon]

16 minutes ago, (PS4)chris1pat8twins said:

“Most”? Dude clearly you haven’t been playing this game long or much at all. I’ve played with all sorts of players from MR1 - MR27 and NONE of them complained except for 1 Valkyr during a Hydron defense while farming for relics.

Then why does this thread even exist? There is clearly an issue with saryn with how many players complain about her. She is so much better than any other frame at what she does that you are pretty much forced to play her if you want to be efficient, by your own admission. Maybe because you chose to go with the meta and build a Saryn you dont see the issue, but you can be certain that people that dont want or cant play Saryn see that issue. Either give all frames an ability to shred armor and kill without LoS or rework Saryn properly this time. No half-assed nerfs tat are actually buffs.

Do you think its a coincidence that the only two people defending Saryn here are Saryn mains themselves?

Edited September 28, 2019 by DawnFyreSon

[XenMaster]

On 2019-09-24 at 12:17 PM, Hellmaker2004 said:

Saryns Miasma beyond next level damage.....

110 / 125 / 135 / 150  Viral damage per second
Ability Synergy: Miasma deals 400% damage to enemies affected by  Spores.

 

150*4.0 = 600.

Now if we assume you are fighting enemies with only health and / or armor  and they die during the viral status effect, then you could in theory double that thanks to the Viral.

so 1200 damage per second. Is that next level damage?
I mean it is not worthless, but there are plenty of weapons that can deal more damage, there are damage frames that can deal that and even more.

 

The main value in Miasma is that it apply Viral to all foes who are not immune inside the range, and foes suffering from spore will spread spore.

Well, basically the elemental itself is op not the saryn. Half and half armor and health is ridiculous. Try give Mag's polarize viral proc and crush corrosive proc with 100% bonus damage.

[Malziel]

You have the option to play solo. Use it.

[Sohaya-]

If you’re worried about a Saryn in the squad nuking the map and ruining your fun (I personally don’t mind) then playing with coordinated squads from recruiting might be best.

And I find that whenever I do Hydron (Pretty much never) Saryns are a good source of shared affinity because she nukes stupidly fast, which should level your stuff relatively fast - and if you’re lucky spores could wind up softening enemies up for you to kill which means more affinity. Shared affinity is a tad slower than affinity you earn by killing stuff though.

As for everyone else arguing, playstyles differ. What one enjoys might not be shared with others. (I don’t maximize efficiency for everything in normal play either, but I don’t mind being the aforementioned Rhino.) It’s a tradeoff between having fun and having time and everyone has their own balance.

About Saryn: her kit makes her pretty good for wiping the floor with enemies. But she is kind of weak with bosses and I don’t think she can camp. IMO she has enough limitations on her to not warrant a nerf, but I’d say that if you dislike being a support I’d find a way of being able to do something in the mission (e.g. whenever a Saryn appears on defense missions I camp the spawns to nab as many kills as I can)

Speaking as a Hildryn main here.

Also speed Saryn is best Saryn change my mind 

Edited September 28, 2019 by RWBY-WhiteRose

[Pizzarugi]

10 hours ago, Malziel said:

You have the option to play solo. Use it.

Until DE actually improves enemy spawns in solo, it is absolutely not an option.

Also:

Quote

1. No u. Seriously though, this is a co-op shooter. Press-4-to-win frames like Saryn and Mesa takes that concept and throws it right out the window by doing what an entire team should be capable of when playing together. If there's anyone who should be playing solo, its the people who abuse these frames, because they clearly do not need any assistance to delete entire rooms. We all know why they don't, and I'll explain it later.

2. As I explained in point 1, I like Warframe because its a co-op. I like having other people to play with, to carry them or to carry me if they're better, and help the less experienced players get through missions if they're having trouble. Just because matchmaking is at the whim of random people, it doesn't mean DE shouldn't do something about players who'd rather turn the game into a walking simulator by mashing 1 button until its time to extract.

3. Enemy spawns in solo is hot garbage. The game is set to where teammate count directly factors in how many enemies are thrown at you on a regular basis, and those who play solo get the least amount of them compared to a full team. This is more clearly evidenced by playing rounds of survival alone and struggling to keep up on life support drops. Press-4-to-win abusers know this as well, because it directly impacts the amount of resources you can get from enemies. They rely on teammates to bump up enemy spawns, they need spawn-slaves to keep the numbers high. Unless DE gives players a way to increase enemy spawns in solo to give them more of a challenge or an easier time where kills are important, this is just a typical response to handwave away criticism aimed at broken frames.

 

[(PSN)chris1pat8twins]

12 hours ago, DawnFyreSon said:

Then why does this thread even exist? There is clearly an issue with saryn with how many players complain about her. She is so much better than any other frame at what she does that you are pretty much forced to play her if you want to be efficient, by your own admission. Maybe because you chose to go with the meta and build a Saryn you dont see the issue, but you can be certain that people that dont want or cant play Saryn see that issue. Either give all frames an ability to shred armor and kill without LoS or rework Saryn properly this time. No half-assed nerfs tat are actually buffs.

Do you think its a coincidence that the only two people defending Saryn here are Saryn mains themselves?

For starters I’m not a Saryn main. I’m more of a Rhino main since I can use him to power up weak teammates. Do you think it is a coincidence that the only people I see complaining about Saryn are mostly newbies who don’t fully understand how she works, how the game works, and finally that she is not that good against super high level enemies? Saryn takes time to use. And a lot of energy which some players found ways around with like Dig. 

Not every frame is meant to destroy maps. For example, Loki is meant for stealth missions like spy. A Saryn is not a good choice for spies. Even with a rhino roar TRIPLING the damage, Saryn still cannot wipe out level 100s as quickly as people be claiming. Those people are either omitting a lot of info such as the spores building up over time to be able to kill quickly, or they are greatly exaggerating. The Simulacrum is not a very good evidence or proof since there is a thing called True Damage that unalerted enemies take and a paused AI takes more damaged than an unpaused AI. 

I’ve been playing high level missions a lot for Neo and Axi relics, new content, resources, etc. and a Saryn has NEVER done what you people be claiming she does. Which means y’all are specifically focusing on weak missions where any frame could kill hordes quickly. 

The ONLY problem I have had with a Saryn is during fissures, more specifically defense. Cause they are so impatient that they kill all the enemies before they fissure and as a result, don’t drop enough reactants. Had to prove to several Saryn users that they need to stop spamming the 1st and 4th abilities. 

So again, you can play solo, find friends, or go to recruit, if “fun” is all that matters to you. The few people complaining on the forums do not speak for the majority and we aren’t going to waste our time making hundreds of posts on why Saryn or any other frame should NOT BE NERFED. 

For every ONE of you complainers with Saryn, there is like 50-100 people that use Saryn A LOT. Only time I use Saryn is to help a few guys level or farm for relics when a new prime comes out. 

All that trash talking or false claims of speaking for the majority is not helping your case at all.