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Zyga21

Feedback on Mod Drop Booster

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I don't like it because it sets a precedent that we don't need. While I get you guys need to make money, and I also get by making them "needed" you also can sell them more, resource boosters and drop chance boosters have already been bad enough because they're boosting kuva/vitus, which are directly tied to platinum, and thus needed if you're farming either resource. Simply put, please do not have boosters impact (either directly or inadvertently) market gains. Mods sell directly for P, kuva goes into making rivens good which sell for P, vitus is used for kuva or rivens which means theyre directly tied to P still.

Resources which are bound to the player, credits which are bound to the player, and affin which is bound to the player, are fine but... if you also made boosters for Relics or Arcanes or rare round rewards etc you'd see why that's on the end of "bad things do not touch". Please do not force us buy boosters in order to make plat on par with other people.

 

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It definitely is a subject to be watched closely.

I'm just going to do some (probably irrelevant)math here, basically live, I have no idea how this will turn out...

First things first, reliably dropping mods that can be used to make plat, like the Corrupted mods will be unaffected, because they are a guaranteed drop.

So, let's take Condition Overload, 0.02% dropchance and sells for about 60p.

Let's say we have someone farming it for three days/maybe 12h. I have no idea how many condition overloads one could reasonably farm in that timeframe, but I don't think one could expect more than maybe 2. So for the one who paid 40p for a booster, that would be say 4.

2 x 60 = 120 vs 4 x 60 - 40 = 200

So for now it seems it would give quite an advantage. Meaning quite some people would use it. That means the price would fall, say to about 30p.

2 x 30 = 60 vs 4 x 30 - 40 = 80

I'm not really sure which mods people are farming for plat, but I'm pretty sure it isn't Condition Overload as just doing vaults seems way more lucrative.

I'd like to know though.

From what I suspect, the new Booster, if it will ever be sold in the shop (yes it's sold in prime access, but noone is going to buy that only to get the booster) would be mostly interesting to mid-level players who don't want to trade for mods.

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I'm more pointing to the idea that you basically need it if you want to have a decent chance at getting these rare kind of mods, and of course the whole slippery slope part.

 

But also it's more than just one mod, when you buy the booster you get a boost to all the rare mods that exist, not just condition overload. Plus (I'm pretty sure) the mods will drop for everyone so that's extra "profit" too.

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I dont think its that good.. i mean, ive never had a problem farming mods with a 5 or 10 percent drop chance. Buffing it to 10 to 20 percent is nice but not that much more essential considering the fact that ill only need one most the time.

 

Even if something has like a 1% drop chance, buffing it to 2% makes no difference to me. Im assuming the dropchance is just doubled like other drop boosters

Edited by (PS4)IIFrost_GhostII
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1 hour ago, Zyga21 said:

I'm more pointing to the idea that you basically need it if you want to have a decent chance at getting these rare kind of mods, and of course the whole slippery slope part.

 

But also it's more than just one mod, when you buy the booster you get a boost to all the rare mods that exist, not just condition overload. Plus (I'm pretty sure) the mods will drop for everyone so that's extra "profit" too.

As long as they don't change dropchances, I don't see how you would need them, when we're mostly fine right now. It's also just doubling the chance, so if it's a rare mod, that'd be like 0.1%.

There are also no plans yet to sell the booster (prime access doesn't count, because buying that for the booster would never be worth it, It's basically only a bonus if you where allready going to get it) only make it available from sorties/nightwave, so it wouldn't be that you have to get it but more likely "oh, I got the booster, I'll better farm mods for the next week"

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See, the issue I have with this sentiment, not that it’s precisely wrong, but that in all of the things claimed to be Plat based... they’re also personal resources.

Mods are something everyone needs to farm, yes, and while some do sell for Plat, this isn’t the only thing the Drop Chance booster affects, they’re just a drop like any other. Mods that you get as duplicates dissolve into Endo (I recently dissolved the ten highest stacks of duplicates I owned into around 20k Endo, which came in handy), and that’s a resource that players farm a lot over their game time.

Meanwhile, yes, Kuva is affected by Resource Boosters and it does translate to Rivens, which can, to some players, become Plat... they are also a resource needed for building some blueprints, and likely more in future. And again, this isn’t the only resource that this booster affects.

More to the point of my issue... players not too different from you directly requested that this situation with boosters happen. Well, not sure about the Drop Chance one and Mods, I wasn’t around for that early of a change, but Kuva being directly affected by the Resource Booster was a very hot topic and DE specifically included it due to that player feedback.

So there’s some merit in not linking Platinum gains to something that can have a paid boost, but at the same time it’s there specifically because it was asked for. 

On yet another hand, think about it the other way; what are you earning with Rivens and Mods? Plat. What purchases Boosters to gain you more resources for Rivens and more Mods? Plat.

A player using this method is a snowball, more gain breeds more gain, and you can keep going with your own earnings. You are not obligated to pay in order to benefit even from the Boosters.

With that in mind... what pay to win is there that can’t be achieved free?

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I don't really see a huge problem from a mod like this.

If it works like all of the other boosters it'll just double the enemy mod drop chance from 3% (in the vast majority of cases) to 6%.  The biggest changes will honestly be from the executioners in the rathuum which will have their mod drop chance changed from 20% to 40%...but their mods consist purely of endo and no actual mods that can be traded.

Its not like its really going to make any rare mod that much more common.  Honestly the biggest thing is that it'll make endo more common since that is generally the most common "mod" drop in the enemy mod drop tables.

After all the ultra rare and legendary mod drops will still have a 1% and 0.5% chance of dropping from enemies.

Edited by Tsukinoki
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Apparently the subreddit is all up in arms about how awful it is and how DE is worse than EA, while I'm just wondering "Huh, that doesn't sound especially useful.  Neat as a bonus, though.  Might pick one up once it's in the shop if I want to farm that Archwing Thruster mod or something."

I don't know why anyone assumed it would be PA-exclusive forever, or that it would affect missions rewarded-mods, or that it would somehow irreversibly damage future balance choices (when the two boosters regarding Resources already exist and we already have mods that drop at a fraction of a percent).  The first is a baseless assumption that was quickly dispelled but keeps being said for some reason.  The second is just a misconception, but I'm not exactly sure what they expect would happen to a mission's drop table if it did.  The third, though, is what gets me.  "They already balance around the assumption you're paying extra for other boosters!"  They really don't.  "But what about the Sibear or the Hema?"  Those are extreme outliers even with boosters, 98% of everything else is an acceptable farm with or without.  And we already have extreme outliers in terms of Mods, for example Condition Overload.  For that matter, given the recent additions to Arbitrations they seem to be trying to move away from highly-powerful mods that are hard to get and more towards more niche and "fun" mods that are hard to get.

I'm still confused about why people are claiming it's all a big conspiracy and this is the next carefully-calculated step in ruining everything ever.  Like, we're still talking about DE, right?  They aren't that clever

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DE nerfs meta farming for mods

Also DE: buy my NEW  7 day mod drop chance booster.

 

DE Nerfing meta farming so DE can flog  a new booster is a bit shady. 

 

 

Edited by (XB1)SixGunLove
Title edited for clarity & image spamming reduced. Also moving to feedback.
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Gerade eben schrieb SenorClipClop:

What do you mean?

DE nerfed the lootframes being able to stack on top of each other, meaning even with nekros and hydroid you can only get one additional roll from a corpse as opposed to the 2 you could get before. DE tried to pass that off as a fix but it was a plain nerf. This affected farming for mods like Condition Overload. Now they introduce a new booster just for that.

A very shady move and I expected better from DE.

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1 minute ago, Drachnyn said:

A very shady move and I expected better from DE.

That's a big oof, hope they'll "fix it" for real

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Farming in Warframe is easy as hek.
And there was nothing wrong with the fix.
And introducing this new booster isn't shady.

OP is the internet in a nutshell.
How about you just hold your horses?

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Gerade eben schrieb Xenox_Ilz-ot:

That's a big oof, hope they'll "fix it" for real

When that dropped forum mods merged every thread about it out of sight so as little people as possible would notice. Since almost no partner talked about it either they got away with it. This happened with Jovian Concord btw.

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2 minutes ago, Xenox_Ilz-ot said:

That's a big oof, hope they'll "fix it" for real

Why fix for something intentional?

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2 minutes ago, Drachnyn said:

When that dropped forum mods merged every thread about it out of sight so as little people as possible would notice. Since almost no partner talked about it either they got away with it. This happened with Jovian Concord btw.

"Out of sight"... if people are unable to use the forum, then that's not DE's fault.
It was pretty easy to follow.

Btw. I wonder how long this thread will be going for until it gets locked for the obvious dev bashing.

Edited by WhiteMarker
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vor 2 Minuten schrieb WhiteMarker:

Farming in Warframe is easy as hek.
And there was nothing wrong with the fix.
And introducing this new booster isn't shady.

OP is the internet in a nutshell.
How about you just hold your horses?

The thing is: they tried to hide that nerf in fixes when they later admitted that they changed their intention with lootframes so they shouldnt stack anymore. That's already dishonest.

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1 minute ago, Drachnyn said:

The thing is: they tried to hide that nerf in fixes when they later admitted that they changed their intention with lootframes so they shouldnt stack anymore. That's already dishonest.

Nothing about this is dishonest.
Actually it's the opposite. It's quite honest of them to admit they changed their mind as time went on.

Are you one of the people that didn't read the ToS and EULA when registering your account?
You accepted that DE is free to change whatever they want whenever they want to.

And again, farming is stupidly easy. No need to make it even easier with stacking lootframes.

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3 minutes ago, Drachnyn said:

DE nerfed the lootframes being able to stack on top of each other, meaning even with nekros and hydroid you can only get one additional roll from a corpse as opposed to the 2 you could get before. DE tried to pass that off as a fix but it was a plain nerf. This affected farming for mods like Condition Overload. Now they introduce a new booster just for that.

I dont see that as an issue and also, perhaps it wasnt really intended for look stacking and none of us here are part of the dev team to be able to confirm i know i wouldnt allow loot stacking if i was a dev. Also i personally dont bother as i never had to team up with someone else in order to get a specific loot.

As for implementing new Booster being shady, i dont see it as shady if they announced it in the update notes. I wont be buying said booster anyways as i dont farm mods for selling and im content with the drop rates so far.

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3 minutes ago, WhiteMarker said:

"Out of sight"... if people are unable to use the forum, then that's not DE's fault.
It was pretty easy to follow.

Btw. I wonder how long this thread will be going for until it gets locked for the obvious dev bashing.

of course they can always lock it but definitely a step backward on f2p direction

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Look at it this way, rather than be forced to run missions with a specific group set up, you have the luxury of running your missions with whichever frame you enjoy. All in all, it's likely going to be better in the long run because drop rates can only be balanced to that 2x drop rate chance as opposed to the possibility that drop rates fly under the radar because the stats would say that everything is fine but it's because half the groups are running loot builds and skewing the data.

Edited by RX-3DR
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vor 4 Minuten schrieb WhiteMarker:

"Out of sight"... if people are unable to use the forum, then that's not DE's fault.
It was pretty easy to follow.

Btw. I wonder how long this thread will be going for until it gets locked for the obvious dev bashing.

That thread became a useless abomination because they merged threads into it that were barely talking about the same topic. 

vor 1 Minute schrieb WhiteMarker:

Nothing about this is dishonest.
Actually it's the opposite. It's quite honest of them to admit they changed their mind as time went on.

Are you one of the people that didn't read the ToS and EULA when registering your account?
You accepted that DE is free to change whatever they want whenever they want to.

And again, farming is stupidly easy. No need to make it even easier with stacking lootframes.

A fix is something for an unintended thing in the game, lootframe stacking was intentional but DE changed their intention, meaning it can no longer be honestly classified as fix. And what does that have to do with EULA and ToS (those dont actually mention changes to the game btw, only EULA and beta agreement do). I never said DE isnt allowed to change it. I'm criticising it. 

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Well, you're wrong.
The nerf was so that frames cant dip together IE- Hydroid+Nekros+Pilfer dome=3 guaranteed shots.
Now it's I take a shot then you take a shot then he takes a shot. I have been in kuva farms where 3 batteries and 2 air pods pop from one creature. but more often, all three fail.
Instead of all 3 getting the guarantee, on top of each other, it's more like I get a shot, then you get a shot and maybe the other guy gets a shot.

There is still a chance that everyone will pop something, just not the same thing and not at the same time. I dont feel like this is making sense but suffice it to say, you're wrong.

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vor 1 Minute schrieb RX-3DR:

Look at it this way, rather than be forced to run missions with a specific group set up, you have the luxury of running your missions with whichever frame you enjoy. All in all, it's likely going to be better in the long run because drop rates can only be balanced to that 2x drop rate chance as opposed to the possibility that drop rates fly under the radar because the stats would say that everything is fine but it's because half the groups are running loot builds and skewing the data.

But already could just farm by yourself with nekros. Nothing about that got better, the better alternative was just removed. Hilariously enough the nerf actually removed variety in farming. Before you had the choice between using 4 nekros and covering the entire area or camping down at one spot with hydroid and nekros.

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