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(PS4)Hopper_Orouk

Heat procs shouldn't reduce armor

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Posted (edited)

Well because there are alot of abilities now and weapons that strip armor

And heat is easier to obtain than corrosive 

Add on that you can have corrosive and heat builds

Having 2 elemental that can strip armor is too much in my opinion 

What i would suggest however is to give it that magus accelerant treatment where further heat procs makes enemies more vulnerable to heat damage ticks, or heat damage

Still 6 seconds

Still doesn't stack

But increase in damage ticks as you build in more heat

And don't underestimate heat ticks when they are huge, i've learned that from gauss 

Heat damage is good...it's only negative is against proto shields...it's neutral towards armor

Heat should be the damage amplifying type not the CC or the armor debuffing type

 

Edited by (PS4)Hopper_Orouk
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Is de out of ideas? Hm lets see we have this fire thingy that nobody uses but everyone uses corrosive hm oh oh oh lets make fire corrosive. Oh and magnetic best idea is to make it corrosive as well. Damage v3 done. Tara

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6 hours ago, (PS4)Shustas said:

Is de out of ideas? Hm lets see we have this fire thingy that nobody uses but everyone uses corrosive hm oh oh oh lets make fire corrosive. Oh and magnetic best idea is to make it corrosive as well. Damage v3 done. Tara

I know right? Heat can be such a potential damage type...we don't want another armor strip 

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Heat melts stuff. Heat melts metal for example. Armor is metal so, heat melts armor. Armor is melted then armor is reduced.

I might as well add that just making enemies more vulnerable to fire wouldn't be useful at all. Since their armor will just outscale whatever dmg you do to them. If you melt their armor -as fire should do- then you can deal actual damage.

And also your idea would make an arcane pointless. So good job on that one.

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Posted (edited)

Realistically heat melts armor by giving the metal exposure to more heat...until it surpasses/reaches it's melting point, more heat means more damage 

 

In game...it's irrational to have 2 armor stripping damage types in one build

It's just ridiculous, having heat to increase it's damage overtime will synergies well with corrosive, more corrosive means weapon deals it's potential damage and more heat meand weapon deals more potential damage

 

Thus more damage overall

Edited by (PS4)Hopper_Orouk
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1 hour ago, (PS4)Hopper_Orouk said:

Well because there are alot of abilities now and weapons that strip armor

And heat is easier to optain than corrosive 

Add on that you can have corrosive and heat builds

Having 2 elementals that can strip armor is too much in my opinion 

What i would suggest however is to give it that magus accelerant treatment where further heat procs makes enemies more vulnerable to heat damage ticks, or heat damage

Still 6 seconds

Still doesn't stack

But increase in damage ticks as you build in more heat

And don't underestimate heat ticks when they are huge, i've learned that from gauss 

Heat damage is good...it's only negative is against proto shields...it's neutral towards armor

Heat should be the damage amplifying type not the CC or the armor debuffing type

 

Impact staggers, electric stuns, blast knocks down. 

Heat lowering the effectiveness of armor makes sense. Not seeing how adding an effect to element is a problem. But ok...

I guess people will make an issue of anything

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Removing or reducing armor or even applying more damage to armor, what is the difference?

Players are going to just use Corrosive Damage/Auras and powers that strip armor anyhow and thus making the "heat should not do x" argument pointless, cuz even a new player at some point will have be able to corrosive damage, it's not rocket science.

 

 

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8 minutes ago, (PS4)Hopper_Orouk said:

It's just ridiculous, having heat to increase it's damage overtime will synergies well with corrosive, more corrosive means weapon deals it's potential damage and more heat meand weapon deals more potential damage.

Actually it makes even more sense how fire would work now.

Basically the corrosive + fire build would be even more powerful. Which is not really a good idea since we would just become more over powered.

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4 minutes ago, (XB1)Phantom Clip said:

Impact staggers, electric stuns, blast knocks down. 

Heat lowering the effectiveness of armor makes sense. Not seeing how adding an effect to element is a problem. But ok...

I guess people will make an issue of anything

 

3 minutes ago, Circle_of_Psi said:

Removing or reducing armor or even applying more damage to armor, what is the difference?

Players are going to just use Corrosive Damage/Auras and powers that strip armor anyhow and thus making the "heat should not do x" argument pointless, cuz even a new player at some point will have be able to corrosive damage, it's not rocket science.

 

 

Well because Whenever something doesn't work properly...the prime solution is "just make it strip armor"

I'd much love heat to increase it's damage than to strip armor, it's the same thing but it's viable for all factions and health types

Why have heat plus corrosive build that can overstrip? Just why? What's the point? 

Can't we think of something more creative?

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1 minute ago, JackHargreav said:

Actually it makes even more sense how fire would work now.

Basically the corrosive + fire build would be even more powerful. Which is not really a good idea since we would just become more over powered.

Which bad idea are you referring too

Corrosive+ heat that strips armor?

Or corrosive+ heat that increase in damage?

Because both don't make much difference against armor

But the latter is more viable against other health types

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, (PS4)Hopper_Orouk said:

Which bad idea are you referring too

Corrosive+ heat that strips armor?

Or corrosive+ heat that increase in damage?

Because both don't make much difference against armor

But the latter is more viable against other health types

Armor strip + increase damage.

And since fire will stack that will make the damage type already good against anything.

Infested is weak against everything already and with corpus you have the classic magnetic toxic which works fine. (Vallis being an exception since enemy units have both shield and armor.)

Edited by JackHargreav
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1 hour ago, (PS4)Hopper_Orouk said:

Well because there are alot of abilities now and weapons that strip armor

And heat is easier to optain than corrosive 

Add on that you can have corrosive and heat builds

Having 2 elementals that can strip armor is too much in my opinion 

What i would suggest however is to give it that magus accelerant treatment where further heat procs makes enemies more vulnerable to heat damage ticks, or heat damage

Still 6 seconds

Still doesn't stack

But increase in damage ticks as you build in more heat

And don't underestimate heat ticks when they are huge, i've learned that from gauss 

Heat damage is good...it's only negative is against proto shields...it's neutral towards armor

Heat should be the damage amplifying type not the CC or the armor debuffing type

 

Heat destroying armor works in the real world. Heat destroying armor is virtually every scifi setting ever made (star wars, mass effect, star trek, warhammer 40k, keeping up with the kardashians)

I'm tired of having to set aside two slots as mandatory content to go with my other 4-3 mandatory content slots.

Armor in this game is broken. It's *^%(*^$&(^ broken and has been since day one.

Furthermore, the blast/corrosion combo won't be leaving melee any time soon as blast procs twice ergo instant 3.2 modifier + true damage followup.

I have a prime heat mod that's on literally 7 guns out of over a hundred.

Infested are due for a rework anyway as literally anything kills them at this point. Your waifu smells bad and you should feel bad.

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Posted (edited)

The armor debuff it weird since we have corrosive, I dunno why they are putting on fire too. Tick per sec getting the same additive like slash and toxic would be a ok upgrade.armor strip is weird.

it kind make sense but, if you want really, really to think logically, since the fire is so strong, that it melt armor, would also probably kill anything inside too, logically. So make it oneshot if it armor melt, duh.

It is a game, don't have to be too logical, over buffed status proc is no good.

Edited by MPonder
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I joked in another thread that they'll just change corrosive to ignore armor and strip it at the same time.

Jokes aside, I think this redundancy in mechanics is a little worrying. There are a lot of ways to get around armor already but they seem heck-bent on applying it in a lot of strange areas(see Psychic Bolts). After sufficient escalation, armor will be rendered completely defunct and a mechanic in name only.

For some fun, we can spin this to absurdity if we really want to:

Impact could crack armor and break it apart. Shattering Impact is already a creative way to handle this.

Puncture already ignores a portion of armor. While it's punching holes, it should reduce armor because it is theoretically eliminating it.

Cold makes metal brittle and easier to break. That should reduce armor, too!

Electricity causes heat. Heat reduces armor. So, electricity should reduce armor.

Blast should completely remove armor from shockwaves.

***

There might be some more silliness we could squeeze in here but mechanics should be distinct and overlapping as little as possible. I will agree with the above post that Impact, Electric, and Blast procs are already pretty similar. Personally, I would hate to see more blending.

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52 minutes ago, (PS4)Hopper_Orouk said:

 

I'd much love heat to increase it's damage than to strip armor, it's the same thing but it's viable for all factions and health types

Why have heat plus corrosive build that can overstrip? Just why? What's the point? 

Can't we think of something more creative?

Heat procs stacking IS an increase in damage...

There's no down side to heat + corrosive over stripping armor. Heat is effective against health. The bonus damage you lose for using corrosive after armor is gone will be made up by heat. Plus corrosive by itself on a weapon takes a long time to fully strip armor. 

Seems like a great combo. Maybe can even replace using CP aura so often. 

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for a while i just assumed that it was only ember's flames that melted the armor, but apparently they are redoing the entire element. wonder how they will make corrosive element relevant. stuff like the ignis and atomos just got a whole lot better.

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8 minutes ago, ArcKnight9202 said:

I will agree with the above post that Impact, Electric, and Blast procs are already pretty similar. Personally, I would hate to see more blending.

Armor really isn't great protection from radiation, viral, or gas. You need a hazmat suit... 

The stumbled by making armor almighty. If anything shields should have been the top dog. 

I can understand the amount of work that would go into an enemy armor rework. Just add more things to strip it.

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But heat melts armor in real life, so.. why not? I don't see any issues. It's nice having choice to pick different stuff and deal with armor.

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2 minutes ago, (XB1)TyeGoo said:

But heat melts armor in real life, so.. why not? I don't see any issues. It's nice having choice to pick different stuff and deal with armor.

Because heat is allready the only CC proc that has a dot, the CC proc that does the most damage, it is in a corrosive\heat build allready superior on most status weapons to other options against high level armor and it would massively devalue corroisve(that does exactly 0 damage on a proc).

Just because the normal Ember player is not competent enught to realize that a status weapon with corrosive\heat will give him litterally infinite scaling against armor(works for me since 2014) does not mean it is a good idea to change how heat status effect works, because this change does devalue a lot of other status effects.

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while its nice that heat is gonna be useful again, it just being another corrosive is both power creep and unimaginative. the mere fact that it can stack with corrosive is gonna make that combo the new "mandatory" on any gun. 

and to the people who are saying that "heat melts armor irl, so it makes sense", since when realism is the point of balance in anything within this game? or did i miss the science class where they teach that being exposed to radiation will make you hit your friends?

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By adding all these new ways to deal with armor, DE is ignoring the fact that armor scaling is completely broken, and are instead trying to cover it in little band-aid fixes until people stop complaining. They are ignoring the actual problem, and instead treating nothing but symptoms, which won't solve anything in the long run.

Sure, adding more options to deal with armor will help a bit. But fixing the armor scaling itself would help so much more.

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Posted (edited)

All I'm going to say is that there's no pleasing this community, as we all have different tastes. And that in my eyes fire melting armor and stuff does make sense. I like the change better that some temporary panic state alone.

Edited by (PS4)Hikuro-93
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Posted (edited)

Fire Status not stacking the DoT really hurts its practicality. as you can't do anything to make the DoT good other than use an Artillery Cannon to apply the DoT. and so... Fire Status is then only useful on Spike Damage Weapons? that's just awful.

if you want to amplify its offensive capabilities without the DoT stacking, there has to be ways in Gameplay for the Player to make the DoT relevant. if it's not stacking, what else can the Player then do to make it compete with the other DoT's. it'a gonna need something.

34 minutes ago, Djego27 said:

the CC proc that does the most damage

(if Enemies are grouped, Electricity wins that award though, hehe)

Edited by taiiat
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Theres allot of things they could do with heat.

Just make it a dot that spreads to objects in a radious.

Have it cause mines, grenades and ammunition to detonate (emptying magazines). Or destroying spare ammo clips. It can work both ways.

*my personal favourite (big head mode) or DK mode.. Enemies under heat have thier head and limbs inflate like a balloon.

causes weapons to jam for a short period.

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