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(PS4)Vexx757

The issues with warframe augments

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In my opinion augments should be used as a choice for people, an option to use in certain missions however with most augments this is not the case. There are seven types of augments;

 

  • ·       They make the ability better and if taken off the ability is useless.
  • ·       It`s should be a part of the warframe`s abilities or made into an ability.
  • ·       They change how the ability works and gives players another option.
  • ·       While the augment is good, it`s for the wrong warframe.
  • ·       One is good for only type of mission vs one good for all missions.
  • ·       They do the same thing for different warframes but nothing that stands out.
  • ·       It`s bad/useless overall.

 

I’m going to go through each point by giving some examples of these augments

 

 

Point 1

Ash`s 1st ability augment seeking shuriken

This is very useful because of the armour strip (mainly at high-levels) however the ability by itself is only good for low to mid-level enemies which means Ash`s 1st ability need to be improved.

Here is what I would do to improve this ability;

Spoiler

1st Ability:

·       If enemy is killed in one hit it is considered as a stealth kill.

·       Holding the ability will make both shurikens target the enemy you`re aiming at dealing double slash damage and adds critical damage based on what mods you have equipped on your melee weapon.

·       The more health the enemy loses, the slower the enemy moves when bleeding out.

·       When the enemy stops bleeding, it will go back to its normal movement speed.

 

Point 2:

Valkyr`s 4th ability augment hysterical assault

I like this augment, this makes Valkyr pounce on enemies which makes sense since she has claws and she`s a raging killer. This to me is something that should be an ability for her, I would get rid of her current ability and replace it with this.

This is what I would do to the 1st ability;

Spoiler

1st ability REWORK: Valkyr pounces on enemies dealing damage with her claws, having a chance to open them up to finishers.

·       The claws deal 700 damage.

·       The claws use the multi-hit combo. (the more you use it the less energy it takes, the more damage it does)

·       You have to target an enemy to cast the ability.

·       Can be used in the air and on the move.

·       Holding the ability will launch you in the air.

·       Enemies will be dismembered if killed in one hit.

·       Visually the claws temporarily appear when the ability is cast.

·       (Synergy) 2nd ability can increase its cast speed by 30%.

·       (Synergy) 4th ability can increase its damage by 40%.

 

Point 3:

Mag`s 3rd ability augment counter pulse

This is an augment I use on mag permanently, this augment jams enemy weapons and disables robotic enemies for a short duration which changes the ability from de-buffing enemies to that plus cc however there are times when and when not to use it. Using this in an interception is great because it stops enemies reaching the terminal though using it in a defence is not a good idea since you want enemies (with guns) to move out of cover and this mod will slow the progress of the mission. So, this is an augment when you have to use in the right situation however you still have the choice.

 

 

Point 4:

Inaros` 4th ability augment negation swarm

This augment blocks status effects from affecting Inaros, draining a percentage of bonus armor for every status effect blocked. On paper, this is a very good augment unfortunately, Inaros doesn’t need it due to the fact it`s he has a lot of health and has more than one way to regenerate health. That being said in my opinion, this augment should have been made for Nova. Imagine if this was an augment for Nova`s 1st ability which consumes particles and the particles don`t seek out enemies, this will improve her 1st ability drastically by giving her survivability since she doesn’t have any unlike Inaros.

 

 

Point 5:

Ash`s 1st ability augment seeking shuriken VS Trinity`s 2nd ability augment vampire leech

Even through Ash`s augment is useful in high-level missions if you`re playing low level missions, this augment is useless since there is no point in striping armour from weak enemies plus, it only works for enemies with armour. On the other hand, Trinity`s augment gives allies and herself over-shields which is useful no matter what level mission you are playing.

 

 

Point 6:

Ash`s seeking shuriken and Banshee`s sonic fracture

Sonic fracture strips 70% armour for 8 seconds… and so does Ash`s augment. Even through both augments are good, there is no difference between the two augments which gives player no reason to pick on over the other. If I were to make a distanced difference between the two I would;

Ash augment – Ash`s shurikens now strip enemies defences by 70% for 8 seconds.

Banshee`s augment – Sonic Boom strips enemy armour and decreases enemy damage by 70% for 8 seconds.

As you can see there is a difference between the two.

 

 

Point 7:

Valkyr`a 1st ability augment swing line

This augment makes it to when the next cast while airborne will cost no energy, this is the most useless and pointless augment in the game since receiving parkour 2.0. If I had to make a prediction, I think Valkyr will receive a rework since DE know this augment is bad but they haven`t even made changes to it when they had the chance.

On solution I can think of is whatever the warframe is lacking in, the augment should add to it. (Loki lacks damage so augment gives him that)

If I had to come up with some augment for warframes here is what I would come up with;

 

 

Improved: Banshee`s 3rd ability augment – Enemies affected are open to finishers. Each enemy killed by finishers gives banshee and team 100 armour (60% max) for 20 seconds.

New: Titania`s 1st ability augment – Each enemy killed by Titania and allies will either regenerate 60 health or regenerate 10 energy for 5 seconds.

Improved: Inaros` 4th ability augment – A full charge gives Inaros 200% power strength. Power strength and charges will decrease when taking damage.

New: Wisp 1st ability augment – When picked up, Wisp and allies receive 20% damage reduction, (60 max) pods will deal damage to any enemy that steps in its radius. Vitality pod – fire damage, haste pod - toxin damage and shock – electric damage and you can combine them to change damage types.

Improved: Loki`s 3rd ability augment – switching with allies grants them with invulnerability for 6 seconds while switch with enemies will give Loki 500% damage for 10 seconds.

New: Gauss` 2nd ability augment – Enemies attacking Gauss will reflect 700 damage back at them having a 75% chance to receive viral procs.

 

 

In order for augment to improve DE need to take these points into consideration.

 

 

 

Edited by (PS4)Vexx757
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47 минут назад, (PS4)Vexx757 сказал:

New: Titania`s 1st ability augment – Each enemy killed by Titania and allies will either regenerate 60 health or regenerate 10 energy for 5 seconds.

Thanks for another useless augment.

Titania has no problem healing. Titania cannot regenerate energy when she is in the razorwing. I don't have any augment slots anyway. Sorties level mobs are very hard to kill when they are flying everywhere.

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21 hours ago, zhellon said:

Thanks for another useless augment.

Titania has no problem healing. Titania cannot regenerate energy when she is in the razorwing. I don't have any augment slots anyway. Sorties level mobs are very hard to kill when they are flying everywhere.

If that's what you think, can you come up with a good augment for Titania? I would like to hear what you suggest.

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1 минуту назад, (PS4)Vexx757 сказал:
If that's what you think, can you come up with a good augment for Titania? I would like to hear what you suggest.

To begin, I would have preferred that Titania has received the changes. If Titania gets augments, it means that the developers agree with her current state, which is just awful. This is the worst dream. 

As I said above, there is simply no place for augment in Titania. Even such a "useful" razorwing blitz is useless for this reason. Well, also because of how inefficiently Titania manages energy. Yes, it can be done to kill energy spawn  orbs targets, but this will be a patch that should already exist in the kit. Don't get me wrong, but Titania is already suffering from excessive shamanism.

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The base problem with Augments is that the overwhelming majority of them are straight buffs, only about 6% of them are genuinely functions that change how you use the ability or how it functions.

But the reason there are so many buffs, but not all Augments are considered 'good', or 'worth the slot' is because of the base abilities. If the ability is already good, then the Augment makes it better. If the ability is bad and the Augment doesn't make it amazing (like Ash's 1 or Banshee's 1) then it doesn't matter, it's a bad augment.

Example, Trinity's Pool of Life. Well of Life becomes functionally null from the moment you level Trinity up enough to unlock Blessing. It doesn't matter that Health Orbs are pickups for use at the time that's convenient for the player, or that they combo in with mods and Arcanes, if you have a Trinity on your team you shouldn't have to pick up Health Orbs. The ability is redundant, so the augment is redundant.

Also...

21 minutes ago, (PS4)Vexx757 said:

If that's what you think, can you come up with a good augment for Titania? I would like to hear what you suggest.

Spellbind Augment: Spell Burst.

Spellbound enemies are tethered to casting area. Killing an enemy that has been Spellbound triggers a new cast of Spellbind centred on the killed enemy which lasts for the remaining Duration of the original cast.

Basically a spreading float that prevents the enemies from floating off into the skybox and getting lost, but also makes the cast more efficient by re-affecting enemies based on you killing them. Best part is we know this function works because it works for Equinox.

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I have two issues augments:

1) They are frequently used to make a terrible/problematic skill viable. Valkyr example eternal war. War cry has so many issues, low duration, high cost and very long cast time. Eternal war makes the skill usable... It does not do anything in either buffing the skill or changing its functionality. Another example is Mag Polarize. Polarize on its own does close to nothing. The damage is limited and magnetize as an effect is nearly useless. Here comes Counter Pulse, transforming the skill into 4 sec CC. Considering Mag's limited defensive tools, this skill augment is absolutely necessary

2) Being and Exilus slot. Some augments are some augments are not. Why? No one knows. Obviously, the ones that are Exilus are much easier to fit in a build. 

 

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1 hour ago, (PS4)thegarada said:

2) Being and Exilus slot. Some augments are some augments are not. Why? No one knows. Obviously, the ones that are Exilus are much easier to fit in a build. 

No, DE has explained why some augments go into exilus. If it the only thing the augment does it's give some kind of movement (Mesa Waltz, Hysterical Assault), them it gets exilus treatment.

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2 часа назад, Birdframe_Prime сказал:

Spellbind Augment: Spell Burst.

Spellbound enemies are tethered to casting area. Killing an enemy that has been Spellbound triggers a new cast of Spellbind centred on the killed enemy which lasts for the remaining Duration of the original cast.

Basically a spreading float that prevents the enemies from floating off into the skybox and getting lost, but also makes the cast more efficient by re-affecting enemies based on you killing them. Best part is we know this function works because it works for Equinox.

This too will be a useless augment. You will need a radius for effective control. You will simply reduce the effectiveness of razorwing. You know? I can just use razorwing and have constant control over opponents thanks to razorfly. 

The second point, you make an augment given that Titania is an effective killer, but Titania was never a killer. It just so happens that the only damage ability is now the most popular thanks to archwing mechanics. The other point is, you do nothing to expand the support potential of spellbind. Now there is a certain problem with understanding what role Titania should play, because, unlike other dps frames, Titania has only one damage ability, which is also the ability to protect and control. Personally, I wouldn't want Titania to turn into a DPS because DPS are boring. But that's my opinion.

The third point is that actually the mechanics of flying enemies are fun. But the problem is, there's no way Titania can control it. That is, the mechanics of the ability make enemies fly, but we don't get the benefit of it. Removing this solve the problem? Yes, but you'll also make it look like rhino stomp, which isn't fun at all. You simply commit a skill useful, but remove his mechanics. I don't think that's what augment should be doing. 

 

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1 hour ago, zhellon said:

This too will be a useless augment. You will need a radius for effective control.

Spellbind has a radius, it's low, but it has one, and this would actually help with that by repeating casts at the edges of the original cast.

2 hours ago, zhellon said:

Titania was never a killer

Rrright... Despite the fact that I didn't point this out as making her a more effective 'killer', but make Spellbind more effective based on whether you actively engage in killing the enemies affected by it.

2 hours ago, zhellon said:

but you'll also make it look like rhino stomp, which isn't fun at all.

Oh, great, pulling the 'fun' card out when talking about function. Stomp is functional, and the lift function is so good they're adding it into Melee in the next update. The point of my suggestion was to make a functional augment, one that improves the ability and does what the actual point of an augment was originally stated to do; change how the ability works to provide an alternative way to use it.

It's also completely deliberate to deal with your first point; the range. If they don't go more than a few feet above the ground, guess what? They don't need as much Range on them to still be effective, you can use the base range of the ability and it still works. Whereas if they're floating into the sky, then you'd be right and it wouldn't work.

Think the points through. This isn't about making Titania a DPS frame, although she already has that function, it's about making Spellbind have an alternative function that means she can cast it the same way, but the result is different and still functional, if not more functional so that it's worth the slot.

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@Birdframe_Prime I'll try to make it more clear to you. It's just that Zephyr has an augment that does the same thing. 

I don't know if this makes Zephyr more useful, but I haven't found a use for it. It's the same thing. It does things, but it's not necessary because Titania already has 3 kinds of control. You just change 1 kind of control to a more useful one, but why do I need control when I can just kill everyone or gather around Laterns? 

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2 minutes ago, zhellon said:

I don't know if this makes Zephyr more useful, but I haven't found a use for it. It's the same thing. It does things, but it's not necessary because Titania already has 3 kinds of control. You just change 1 kind of control to a more useful one, but why do I need control when I can just kill everyone or gather around Laterns? 

Actually, yes, it does. You've kind of come to the wrong player on that, as I even have an Umbral build specifically for taking advantage of Funnel Clouds.

Besides, as I pointed out, if I didn't make that change to the Float, then the entire function of making it do recasts on the area for killing an enemy wouldn't work. Spellbind has a range, it's not very big, and so to make use of it you have to find a way to keep the enemies where they'll be near other enemies. Thus, a lift, rather than a float, because that solves both of the known problems (that enemies would float away and that the range is quite small) and makes the cast stronger as a result.

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How to make every augment more usable than it is now: make all of them become Exilus mods.

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On 2019-10-18 at 2:35 PM, zhellon said:

To begin, I would have preferred that Titania has received the changes. If Titania gets augments, it means that the developers agree with her current state, which is just awful. This is the worst dream. 

As I said above, there is simply no place for augment in Titania. Even such a "useful" razorwing blitz is useless for this reason. Well, also because of how inefficiently Titania manages energy. Yes, it can be done to kill energy spawn  orbs targets, but this will be a patch that should already exist in the kit. Don't get me wrong, but Titania is already suffering from excessive shamanism.

I see what your saying. but me personally I like her 1st ability. Now if I was asked to improve her 1st ability, my augment idea would be included with her ability. And for anyone else if you have a good idea for Titania`s 1st ability augment put it down I would like to hear your suggestion.

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18 часов назад, Birdframe_Prime сказал:

Actually, yes, it does. You've kind of come to the wrong player on that, as I even have an Umbral build specifically for taking advantage of Funnel Clouds.

Besides, as I pointed out, if I didn't make that change to the Float, then the entire function of making it do recasts on the area for killing an enemy wouldn't work. Spellbind has a range, it's not very big, and so to make use of it you have to find a way to keep the enemies where they'll be near other enemies. Thus, a lift, rather than a float, because that solves both of the known problems (that enemies would float away and that the range is quite small) and makes the cast stronger as a result.

In fact, your words make sense. But augment is not needed for this. If spellbind stopped enemies that are already in the air, it would solve the problem with both Latern and Spellbind. But I don't think it's necessary to augment under an ability that should already work like this. I don't like that the ability is useless without augment.

18 минут назад, (PS4)Vexx757 сказал:

I see what your saying. but me personally I like her 1st ability. Now if I was asked to improve her 1st ability, my augment idea would be included with her ability. And for anyone else if you have a good idea for Titania`s 1st ability augment put it down I would like to hear your suggestion.

The ability has two problems. The first: flying enemies give nothing. The second: it is simply inconvenient to use. The second problem is easy to solve if you just get Titania to spray the ability around her (at least in razorwing mode, because it makes sense). The first problem should be solved with other tools in its set. Titania must be able to attract enemies, collect them in a pile, move them where it will be useful to her and her team. It is quite possible to do based on the mechanics of the Lantern, when Titania is drag and drop the Lantern in his hands, and the flying enemies will be attracted to Lantern. Then just throw the Lantern where it is necessary for the killing or the joy of Nidus.

By itself, the mechanics of flying enemies is not bad. The problem is that she, like the entire Titania set, seems to be in alpha test. The idea of the ability is good, but the implementation needs to work and work.

Edited by zhellon
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6 hours ago, zhellon said:

In fact, your words make sense. But augment is not needed for this. If spellbind stopped enemies that are already in the air, it would solve the problem with both Latern and Spellbind. But I don't think it's necessary to augment under an ability that should already work like this. I don't like that the ability is useless without augment.

Correct ^^ But I don't see Titania getting that kind of rework any time soon... unfortunately.

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2 часа назад, Birdframe_Prime сказал:

Correct ^^ But I don't see Titania getting that kind of rework any time soon... unfortunately.

I hope they will fully engage with Titania's rework when they release Ivara prime. At least they should fix the bugs, which are many. To be honest, I still don't understand why they think Titania is okay. It's like all the problems are just ignored.

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1 hour ago, zhellon said:

I hope they will fully engage with Titania's rework when they release Ivara prime. At least they should fix the bugs, which are many. To be honest, I still don't understand why they think Titania is okay. It's like all the problems are just ignored.

The next update should be interesting; They're giving her Thorns buff actual Damage Reduction, not just Reflection, and allowing Razorflies to pick up the buffs for her. After they also normalised all her buffs to have the same large radius and only need one pickup to function, this ability might actually be functional at last. Not great, but functional.

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19 часов назад, Birdframe_Prime сказал:
The next update should be interesting; They're giving her Thorns buff actual Damage Reduction, not just Reflection, and allowing Razorflies to pick up the buffs for her. After they also normalised all her buffs to have the same large radius and only need one pickup to function, this ability might actually be functional at last. Not great, but functional.

This will only be useful against the infected. The other factions have very few melee enemies and you won't be able to maintain this all the time. Yes, it is useful, but not as much as it may seem. The radius is also not very large. On fact this not gives at all no functionality, because buff so remain useless (except 50% DR, about problem which I already told) 

The fact that razorfly is now collecting buffs is the only thing I liked. But it's not because it's vacuum for buffs, because I don't have a problem with it. You now get control of razrofly's location. But given how weak razorfly is at above 50, I won't use it, as I'll still have to recast razorwing in the location I need. Or I'll just facebank because my build lets do that.

These changes do not make Titania better as a support, as a controller, as a tank, even as a DPS. Personally, I do not understand why these minor changes are needed, which do not actually change anything. Yeah, cool, now people will have another reason to play as Titania for another two weeks and throw her into oblivion. And I so enjoy her 4 and hate her first 3 skills. Nothing changes. 

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On 2019-10-17 at 5:52 PM, zhellon said:

Thanks for another useless augment.

Titania has no problem healing. Titania cannot regenerate energy when she is in the razorwing. I don't have any augment slots anyway. Sorties level mobs are very hard to kill when they are flying everywhere.

Titania 1 isnt the fly off everywhere, it does float but its her 3 that makes enemies invulnerable and yeet across rooms at a stupid pace.

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1 час назад, Andele3025 сказал:

Titania 1 isnt the fly off everywhere, it does float but its her 3 that makes enemies invulnerable and yeet across rooms at a stupid pace.

I don't know what you're talking about. Titania 1 works the same way as Titania 3. Yes, you can say it is not a problem because Spellbind does not impose invulnerability and you can kill enemies, but the problem is that it is not a problem only in 30 levels. The higher the level of enemies, the more this ability becomes useless. And the biggest problem is that I don't need this ability at level 30 because enemies can't kill me. You can make enemies fly or just kill them. I think the second option is preferable.

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to me the only argument for an augment's use is that it augment's an ability in an essential way that demands a mod slot over something else that is more important (more survivability, more dps, better movement, etc), preferably the ability is good without it, but is altered to a more preferable state.

 

Edited by Klokwerkaos

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On 2019-10-19 at 3:10 PM, zhellon said:

-snip-

If I were to improve her 1st ability, here is what I would do;

 

Titania:

1st ability:

·       Increase ability radius from 5m to 10m.

·       Instead of them rag dolling, make them just hover in the air.

·       Enemies affected are vulnerable to damage.

·       Killing enemies will have a 50% chance to drop a health orb. When picked up, it will send out a 15m wave of health regeneration giving her and allies 10 health a second for 5 seconds.

Synergy: if you use the 2nd ability on an enemy affected by the 1st ability, they have a 75% chance to drop energy orbs. It can also move the hovering enemy.

 

Original augment idea: When adding status affects to enemies, when a affected enemy is killed, the status will spread to nearby enemies in a 15m radios increased the damage and status duration by 50%.

 

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38 минут назад, (PS4)Vexx757 сказал:

If I were to improve her 1st ability, here is what I would do;

 

Titania:

1st ability:

· Increase ability radius from 5m to 10m.

· Instead of them rag dolling, make them just hover in the air.

· Enemies affected are vulnerable to damage.

· Killing enemies will have a 50% chance to drop a health orb. When picked up, it will send out a 15m wave of health regeneration giving her and allies 10 health a second for 5 seconds.

Synergy: if you use the 2nd ability on an enemy affected by the 1st ability, they have a 75% chance to drop energy orbs. It can also move the hovering enemy.

The second ability to works on one enemy, on this this not particularly effectively for displacement enemy. If it caused pulling enemy in the target, maybe it would be useful for more efficient enemy control. Another point is that you can only use the tribute once per enemy. This idea is good, but not particularly effective. Plus you make everything more random, which reduces the benefit of the ability. 

And I still don't understand your obsession with poor health regeneration. Titania doesn't need it because she can use melee. Plus you have a variety of healing items. It also does not help in healing objects that have a very large amount of hp.

38 минут назад, (PS4)Vexx757 сказал:

Original augment idea: When adding status affects to enemies, when a affected enemy is killed, the status will spread to nearby enemies in a 15m radios increased the damage and status duration by 50%.

If radius mods work, then this thing will be one of the hard nuck things combined with a Dex Pixia or Pox. This is a really good augment that I would like to use even in the current state. But this is bad in view of the fact that Titania is becoming a nuck frame, and I don't really want that. But this is a personal reason. Titania + garuda and you will be able to kill things 9999 level on entire map.

Edited by zhellon
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On 2019-10-18 at 10:29 AM, Atsia said:

No, DE has explained why some augments go into exilus. If it the only thing the augment does it's give some kind of movement (Mesa Waltz, Hysterical Assault), them it gets exilus treatment.

Unfortunately, the vast majority of augments are too weak to take a mod slot. Exilus mods are far less competitive. Also, we have exilus mods like power drift, so it is not exactly that exilus mods are only utility by any stretch.

Edited by (PS4)thegarada

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1 hour ago, (PS4)thegarada said:

Unfortunately, the vast majority of augments are too weak to take a mod slot. Exilus mods have far less competitive. Also, we have exilus mods like power drift, so it is not exactly that exilus mods or only utility by an stretch.

I'm not reasoning for the exilus slot in general, I'm just giving what the DE explanation for augments in the exilus slot is. I agree with the reasoning and would rather see abilities be made worthwhile to use an augment since most augment mods are direct buffs to the ability itself.

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