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nightwave.. opinion just dropped to the floor

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Just now, Crasharr said:

Alerts were okay, Nightwave is okay, together they would be better than each on its own. Would you agree?

No. Alerts were always crap. 

And also we would get into the rewards problem. Which i'm not gonna bother with.

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1 minute ago, JackHargreav said:

No. Alerts were always crap. 

And also we would get into the rewards problem. Which i'm not gonna bother with.

So..... alerts were crap because of the "rewards problem" as you call it... What problem exactly is that? Elaborate please

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My problem with the release of previous content is not much time has passed and its out already. Why bother with it in the first place? I want people to get the stuff they missed, it just now feels like a way to pad the rewards for what will be another example of them running out of ideas, how for the longest time prime mods that were released were incredibly lame. Glad for people who missed out but yeah.

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yeh, they could have just added better rewards to alerts, instant reward, no 'chores' to do. games are for fun after all. nightwaves biggest pull was getting new content at regular intervals. which is now under question

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4 minutes ago, (PS4)AllOrNothinDays said:

My problem with the release of previous content is not much time has passed and its out already. Why bother with it in the first place? I want people to get the stuff they missed, it just now feels like a way to pad the rewards for what will be another example of them running out of ideas, how for the longest time prime mods that were released were incredibly lame. Glad for people who missed out but yeah.

So somehow the undertone of your message has some kind of bitterness in it. You think those that were there first time around, need some time to enjoy their accolades. And lets not kid ourselves here, everyone of us, every gamer is all about accolades but you feel that the recurrence leaves not alot of time to actually enjoy the "spoils of war" so to speak, correct?

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1 hour ago, Sajochi said:

It's deeply troubling you still play a game you obviously don't like.

Opinions and wanting them to put a little thought into something does not equal not liking the game.

Simple fix: give people 50 creds in place of a duplicate. Problem solved. It took me 2 seconds of looking at the rewards to come up with that. How many people worked how many hours on this intermission? 

Last nightwave ended with no kuva, beacon or decoration as an option in the store! So any creds you had saved or got from prestige, hope you needed a 50th extra potato or wanted to reach 200+ nitain. 

Just do better, DE. And stop being white knights. They need to own up to some stuff. 

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5 minutes ago, (XB1)Acehunter32 said:

Opinions and wanting them to put a little thought into something does not equal not liking the game.

Simple fix: give people 50 creds in place of a duplicate. Problem solved. It took me 2 seconds of looking at the rewards to come up with that. How many people worked how many hours on this intermission? 

Last nightwave ended with no kuva, beacon or decoration as an option in the store! So any creds you had saved or got from prestige, hope you needed a 50th extra potato or wanted to reach 200+ nitain. 

Just do better, DE. And stop being white knights. They need to own up to some stuff. 

The person I quoted is known for making extremely vague or unhelpful posts that contribute to the entire joke that is these forums. They've been tired of this game for a long time, for pretty much any reason you can think of but refuse to acknowledge it might not be their thing. 

Also, I never take this place seriously anyways and have my own criticisms of the game I have shared in the past before this place became a dumpster fire so you're calling the wrong person a white knight, which lost its meaning here because it's tossed that much.

Edited by Sajochi
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11 minutes ago, Crasharr said:

So somehow the undertone of your message has some kind of bitterness in it. You think those that were there first time around, need some time to enjoy their accolades. And lets not kid ourselves here, everyone of us, every gamer is all about accolades but you feel that the recurrence leaves not alot of time to actually enjoy the "spoils of war" so to speak, correct?

Don't misunderstand me at all. I'm not bitter. If Baro came out tomorrow and you could get all the stuff with ducats I'd be fine with it. Just don't like how the old stuff is now rewards that could have been new stuff. If there's any bitterness at all it's more towards why this system even exists if you're going to re-release it this early? Just keep it up somehow so new players can switch to it to rank up between the new stuff coming out. I guess why have the time limit/battle pass system at all is where I'm at. 

Edited by (PS4)AllOrNothinDays
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1 minute ago, (PS4)AllOrNothinDays said:

Don't misunderstand me at all. I'm not bitter. If Baro came out tomorrow and you could get all the stuff with ducats I'd be fine with it. Just don't like how the old stuff is now rewards that could have been new stuff. If there's any bitterness at all it's more towards why this system even exists if you're going to re-release it this early? Just keep it up somehow so new players can switch to it to rank up between the new stuff coming out. I guess why have the time limit/battle pass system at all is where I'm at. 

I think i understand you, a bit like vaulted relics? Ofcourse making it alot more "festive"  to get but not blocking items from back then and still provide a challenge and good gameplay to get it now.

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3 hours ago, wargthewarg said:

How exactly does NW full of recycled cosmetic or single use content keep the players occupied if they already got the items they don't want or need more of? 

Do you think any game with a battle pass could get away with something like this?

Do I think that AAA games that charge real money for battle passes would get away with offering mediocrity? I think the answer is subjective, but I will also reiterate that people pay for it regardless. Nightwave is free, and they have already improved upon it multiple times based on community feedback. And on that note, there are some decent suggestions in here such as offering creds instead of duplicate rewards. Maybe DE will continue to listen to feedback and improve the system like they've been doing.

The intermission isn't meant to offer new and exciting rewards. That is what season 1, 2, and eventually season 3 are for. The intermission is a break and chance for other players to catch up which is, I'm assuming, why they named it such.

Edited by IntheCoconut

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I'm completely fine with the intermission being this way, doesn't bother me in the least. If you are not interested in the intermission, then just ignore it till the next Nightwave.

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3 hours ago, Crasharr said:

So..... alerts were crap because of the "rewards problem" as you call it... What problem exactly is that? Elaborate please

What do we get most of the time? Credits, even less than 10k most of the time that I rather drop into a mission and go full kleptomaniac for more than that amount or just bring my secura lecta and go full pimp mode whipping their money out

Dual stat mods like seeking fury or fortitude? Meh, I have many duplicates without using the alert. I have another legit way to obtain them

Cosmetics, aura mods or blueprint? Yeah, one comes out when I'm in the middle of my work or sleep so I should leave whatever I'm doing and quickly log in before losing the alert. I'm sure your seniors or upper ups, or your customers wouldn't appreciate you suddenly opening warframe because there's one hour alert you can't miss or you will wait for no one knows how long to see it again

Why should I stay with this kind of system that requires me to be awake 24/7 or risk losing something?

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7 hours ago, -ToT-CrackCook said:

The idea of lore coming was cool! but now we get intermissions the same length of full season, that don't give any extra lore. 

Did you honestly expect anything else?

Synthesis, Sorties, Prime Trailers, Prime Warframe Codex Entries for that matter, the pattern has repeated itself time and again

I would be incredibly surprised if we get more than like 4 Nightwave seasons and 4 Leverian entries before DE just pushes it to the backburner and forgets about it

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It shouldve been two reward each rank.

 

Example : Some new armor as actual reward + Saturn armor as bonus reward

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7 minutes ago, TARINunit9 said:

Did you honestly expect anything else?

Synthesis, Sorties, Prime Trailers, Prime Warframe Codex Entries for that matter, the pattern has repeated itself time and again

I would be incredibly surprised if we get more than like 4 Nightwave seasons and 4 Leverian entries before DE just pushes it to the backburner and forgets about it

its not that WE expect more, its that the devs decide to KEEP ADDING. they wanted nightwave and now they messed up what THEY said it would be. 
Its not 'did you honestly expect anything else?' its 'did DE really think they could pull it off alongside everything else?' and no they cant, hence the delay on season 3

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3 minutes ago, -ToT-CrackCook said:

its not that WE expect more, its that the devs decide to KEEP ADDING. they wanted nightwave and now they messed up what THEY said it would be. 
Its not 'did you honestly expect anything else?' its 'did DE really think they could pull it off alongside everything else?' and no they cant, hence the delay on season 3

Good to know you have a reality check (and I promise that's not sarcasm), but do remember the title of your own thread:

>opinion just dropped to the floor

Meaning you had hopes that were contrary to the pattern of reality (even if you claim to have acknowledged that pattern before now). That phrasing of the thread title is why I was directing my comment at you

Edited by TARINunit9

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@TARINunit9you make it sound like its illegal to own an opinion. 

And yeah I had hopes for nightwave, until this recent intermission brought to light that DE could not in fact pull off what they said, this time, in the past they have, so what? should i not trust DE ever again? no, even after they do something i don't like much, id rather bring my thoughts to light and hope that DE sees how different people view this and then i still hope for a good outcome in the future. the title is obviously made to be clickbait (although yes it stemming from a truth) but if you read past the title its obvious that this is constructive criticism.

Edited by -ToT-CrackCook
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Just now, -ToT-CrackCook said:

@TARINunit9you make it sound like its illegal to own an opinion. 

Sorry if I sounded hostile. Rest assured, I read your OP. The thing that confused me wasn't between the title and the OP, those are actually consistent

And this:

4 minutes ago, -ToT-CrackCook said:

the title is obvious make to be clickbait

basically explains the one thing that confused me

Long story short we're on the same page, I hope you have a good night

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2 hours ago, IntheCoconut said:

The intermission isn't meant to offer new and exciting rewards. That is what season 1, 2, and eventually season 3 are for. The intermission is a break and chance for other players to catch up which is, I'm assuming, why they named it such.

Which is why the first intermission was also a catch up season, oh wait. An intermission is nothing more than a lull is a story progression which is why it is called an intermission as it is literally a stop in story progression/development, the name has no direct relevance to catching up on anything, and the last iteration we saw had no such practice in it. 

Then the point of Nightwave as a system overall was to give consistent tasks with relatively desirable rewards overall to keep players active and motivated to log on each day while DE worked on other content which this kind of design choice just flat out runs counter to. I appreciate DE wanting to bring back old rewards so they aren't season exclusive, that was an excellent call and a practice I'm glad they have been leaning into more and more (the removal of exclusivities) but this choice seems less than consistent with the purpose of the entire Nightwave implementation and is sort of write-off'ish of to portions of the playerbase. It's hardly good decision making, or even sustainable to be quite blunt, but then I also imagine this is happening less because DE planned it and because DE as usual doesn't think ahead, over shot the mark, and now are too busy to keep up with yet another system so they're doing some caked together last minute bandaid solution as they so love to do, yet again, so that's that. It's not a planned implementation, not an exciting evolution or by design progression, just some cop out to further cover for their frequent over investing and that is likely that. 

Edited by Cubewano
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1 hour ago, Cubewano said:

[snip]

All very good points that I agree with. When they announced Nightwave and I saw the story and rewards involved in Season 1, I was very skeptical that they could maintain that momentum. Not having a clear end date and giving us a very soft estimation of 10ish weeks further confirmed my speculation, and the first intermission pretty much solidified it. I would love it if Nightwave could have a consistent schedule like other battle passes. I think it would be great if, with each new season, we saw noticeable improvements to the quality of rewards like most other battlepasses do. I don't think anyone here would argue against wanting those things but I never went into it expecting DE to achieve them. And maybe this is just me playing the it's-a-free-game-so-I-can-forgive-anything card. Normally I hate that argument, but it does hold water here considering they don't nickle-and-dime their customers, they don't charge for battle passes, and their content drops are free. And maybe that is the problem.

Maybe the solution to their many half-finished projects, inconsistent game design, and many delays would simply be to start charging more money. Put a price on the battle pass, bundle every new content drop as paid DLC and Expansions. Destiny 2 is doing it. The Division 2 is doing it. Anthem tried it. Every AAA games-as-service out there is doing it. Maybe DE could finally meet this communities expectation for quality and quantity on a more consistent schedule if they just charged us money. But they don't. And maybe the game is better for it, or maybe it is worse. I can't say either way what is best for the longevity of Warframe.

I guess it just boils down to how you want to see it. Either you set expectations that you know DE can't meet, and then get frustrated each time. Or you become complacent and accept that this is, and has always been, the way DE makes Warframe. Neither one is right or wrong. I think it is perfectly acceptable and even good for people to want better for the game. Nightwave has evolved a lot from the feedback its received. Melee 3.0 is probably releasing in a better state now had it not been for all the criticism of 2.9. But unless DE starts charging money, I don't see them sticking to a consistent Battle Pass plan, or meeting deadlines for large expansions, or fully realizing the systems they've abandoned. So for me, I'm happy to partake in whatever content they release, whenever they happen to do so. In between, maybe I can grind out a Nightwave if its up, and if not, I'll happily take a break until their next big drop. And why am I so complacent? Because I didn't pay anything for it. If time and inconsistent game design is the cost of being as free-to-play as they currently are, then I'll pay it. But if they decided to start charging money for their content if it meant better quality and more consistency, then I'd probably pay for that too.

Edited by IntheCoconut
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10 minutes ago, IntheCoconut said:

All very good points that I agree with. When they announced Nightwave and I saw the story and rewards involved in Season 1, I was very skeptical that they could maintain that momentum. Not having a clear end date and giving us a very soft estimation of 10ish weeks further confirmed my speculation, and the first intermission pretty much solidified it. I would love it if Nightwave could have a consistent schedule like other battle passes. I think it would be great if, with each new season, we saw noticeable improvements to the quality of rewards like most other battlepasses do. I don't think anyone here would argue against wanting those things but I never went into it expecting DE to achieve them. And maybe this is just me playing the it's-a-free-game-so-I-can-forgive-anything card. Normally I hate that argument, but it does hold water here considering they don't nickle-and-dime their customers, they don't charge for battle passes, and their content drops are free. And maybe that is the problem.

Maybe the solution to their many half-finished projects, inconsistent game design, and many delays would simply be to start charging more money. Put a price on the battle pass, bundle every new content drop as paid DLC and Expansions. Destiny 2 is doing it. The Division 2 is doing it. Anthem tried it. Every AAA games-as-service out there is doing it. Maybe DE could finally meet this communities expectation for quality and quantity on a more consistent schedule if they just charged us money. But they don't. And maybe the game is better for it, or maybe it is worse. I can't say either way what is best for the longevity of Warframe.

I guess it just boils down to how you want to see it. Either you set expectations that you know DE can't meet, and then get frustrated each time. Or you become complacent and accept that this is, and has always been, the way DE makes Warframe. Neither one is right or wrong. I think it is perfectly acceptable and even good for people to want better for the game. Nightwave has evolved a lot from the feedback its received. Melee 3.0 is probably releasing in a better state now had it not been for all the criticism of 2.9. But unless DE starts charging money, I don't see them sticking to a consistent Battle Pass plan, or meeting deadlines for large expansions, or fully realizing the systems they've abandoned. So for me, I'm happy to partake in whatever content they release, whenever they happen to do so. In between, maybe I can grind out a Nightwave if its up, and if not, I'll happily take a break until their next big drop. And why am I so complacent? Because I didn't pay anything for it. If time and inconsistent game design is the cost of being as free-to-play as they currently are, then I'll pay it. But if they decided to start charging money for their content if it meant better quality and more consistency, then I'd probably pay for that too.

Unless you know their exact profits arguing their marketing is honestly a null area of conversation on how to improve the situation, as there is no explicit information suggesting the problems are monetary. People often confuse f2p with low income but that's not remotely accurate, f2p is a marketing style just like b2p, or subscriptions, or paid dlc, it isn't as charitable as the name free to play implies, and many regions lean on it because of just how profitable the model can when monetized correctly. You cite Destiny 2, but what did it just do recently as more or less the first AAA game in the industry? Go partially f2p because they believe it will bolster profits. So far as we know however all perceivable accounts on Warframes financial success imply their methods are doing exceedingly well, and are not a crutch to their success that needs to be adapted away from, which carries it's own set of enormous risk factors. 

I'd hesitate to pin any of this matter on financial success unless you have a deep understanding of what is going on development wise behind the scenes as nothing on the surface would suggest their marketing style is the thing failing them. Heck it'd be more reasonable to assume they just can't find enough desirable workers to hire in their area and fit their development style, we know Steve made references to such struggles in the past with hiring some employees who despite being fully qualified just did not meet the kind of expectations DE has towards working on their game and that being its own thing.

All that aside, my point wasn't to comment on what is a realistic expectation but to point out that this is hardly a good/ideal/planned execution as I felt you were implying it to be. It is a fallout of short sighted decision making in all likelihood, probably one baked up last minute even after they realized they didn't have the time or resources to spend on keeping to the existing time table, due to surprise surprise, other projects they also fell behind on. 

 

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