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(PS4)alexadusei

Hydroid Is a Loot Fountain, but That's not All He Could or Should Be

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With all the recent talk of adjustments to Warframes looting mechanics, Vauban and Embers rework and his recent Deluxe skin, I've been doing some thinking about Hydroid. And by some, I mean a lot, especially in the shower. Just can't get him outta my mind, you know? Especially with all the ideas I've had that could potentially make him more than the loot fountain he is now. Because as is, that's pretty much what he is; a loot fountain. And not the fun kind, like Nekros or Khora, who double as tanks, healers and crowd control, and don't need to duck into a puddle and hide the moment a level 70 Heavy Gunner shows up. I'm going to keep this brief, because these are some pretty basic ideas (to suggest, not to implement, I'm sure)

1) Tidal Surge is a neat movement mechanic, but that's all it is, a "go faster in one particular direction" ability. I'd like to suggest making it so tapping the key/button tied to the ability makes Hydroid send the wave out as a CC ability. Hold it a second longer and you travel with the wave. Now players will have a choice between casting it as pure CC or CC and movement. Also, suggestion for an augment or feature built into the ability if you don't want to get rid of Tidal Impunity (because it is a pretty good augment, ngl): Tidal Surge inflicts a "Seasickness" effect on enemies, debuffing their aim and making them stumble drunkenly about.

2) Undertow is a really interesting idea, but my beef with it is how it railroads you slowing down your playstyle if you want to use it. My suggestion; free Hydroid from getting automatically sucked down in his Undertow and tweak it a little bit into becoming a more versatile ability. New Undertow would be a fusion between Vaubans Bastille and Wukongs Cloud Walker. Players will now be able to cast it on the ground and leave it to ensnare enemies in one part of the room while they fight with the team in another part of the room. Health getting low? Either spawn Undertow for a quick bailout to get a percentage of your health healed or go jump in the pool you've already spawned to capture enemies. Situation especially dire and Undertow already in use? No prob, summon undertow underfoot and leave the soaked enemies forced out of it for your team to finish off. I'll leave it to DE to think about how they'd implement the healing mechanic. Maybe a greater percentage of your health could come from the enemies captured in it? Another proposed augment; Hydroid gains armor from enemies caught in Undertow along with healing, with his armor depicted as globs of zero g water clinging to his body, acting as an aquatic bulletproof vest. Or DE could make them the scales of the Kraken, up to them.

Now, lets talk a little bit about how these could synergize, not only with themselves, but also with Hydroids Tempest Barrage and Tentacle Swarm. Picture this; you've got a platoon of Grineer closing in on you. Hold down Tidal surge to meet them head on and sweep them off their feet. Combine it with Undertow moments later to send them plunging down into the depths. Continue the combo with Tempest Barrage, and, for extra spice, Tentacle Swarm. Even if somehow the platoon isn't dead from all that, you always have the freedom to jump out of Undertow and rejoin the fight, leaving Tempest and Swarm to pummel and strangle the life out of them. Because that's the essence of this proposed rework; giving players and Hydroid the freedom a space pirate of the high solar winds truly deserves.

So yeah, what do you guys think?

Edited by (PS4)alexadusei
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You know I usually look at most people's idea of a rework and shake my head cos they usually just want to make their favourite frame OP as hell. But you've put some clever thought into this and most of it could work on the frame as well as being very thematical. Bonus points for thinking ahead about potential synergies and augments, bravo. Overall most of this seems pretty good and though there's usually something to exploit, I like the overall ground work you've done on this.

Make sure to post this where devs might see it.

Edited by Zilchy
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Hydroid honestly doesn't need a rework per se, 

He already had one some time back and is in a better place (not the best, but still very useable) 

He is very dependent on his augments though. 

With that said, I don't mind your suggestions as they are tweaks more than reworks. 

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I consider Tidal Surge to be his best ability. I use it to throw groups of enemies against a wall or into a corner before smacking them with my weapon. I find the problem is that his other abilities aren't dynamic and don't mesh well with it. They're all static, and Barrage and Tentacle Swarm both have a significant delay before activation.

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14 minutes ago, Zilchy said:

You know I usually look at most people's idea of a rework and shake my head cos they usually just want to make their favourite frame OP as hell. But you've put some clever thought into this and most of it could work on the frame as well as being very thematical. Bonus points for thinking ahead about potential synergies and augments, bravo. Overall most of this seems pretty good and though there's usually something to exploit, I like the overall ground work you've done on this.

Make sure to post this where devs might see it.

Aw, thanks, my dude, appreciate it. We talkin' Twitter? Because that's the only place I know about that could capture a [DE]'s eyeballs

 

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1 minute ago, schilds said:

I consider Tidal Surge to be his best ability. I use it to throw groups of enemies against a wall or into a corner before smacking them with my weapon. I find the problem is that his other abilities aren't dynamic and don't mesh well with it. They're all static, and Barrage and Tentacle Swarm both have a significant delay before activation.

Yup, he's too clunky and...I dunno, stiff. Static, like you said. There really aren't many way to play him besides as a Hydroid hiding in his Undertow bunker while spawning your tentacles and sending Barrages down. Not very space ninja.

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3 minutes ago, (PS4)alexadusei said:

Aw, thanks, my dude, appreciate it. We talkin' Twitter? Because that's the only place I know about that could capture a [DE]'s eyeballs

 

Nah more thinking feedback, frame suggestions etc.

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Just now, Zilchy said:

Nah more thinking feedback, frame suggestions etc.

Oh, ok...any way to link this there? Or am I going to have to copy/paste and tweak the title to avoid it being seen as spam?

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Just now, (PS4)alexadusei said:

Oh, ok...any way to link this there? Or am I going to have to copy/paste and tweak the title to avoid it being seen as spam?

Haha ask a mod to move it maybe. Might work.

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Really, Hydroid's main problem is the same as all the other CC focused frames. Because DE keeps adding more super powerful CC effects to all melee attacks, CC frames are losing their niche. Why bring a CC frame, when your melee can do it better? Your powers are just redundant, then.

I do really like your suggestions, though. Having the option to decouple the attack and movement aspects of his powers would make him a lot more flexible. Plus, adding a bit more survivability to undertow without having to stay in place would be really nice. It would make it much more useful outside of stationary missions, like defense.

And, as Zilchy said, put this in feedback, so DE might actually see it!

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3 minutes ago, Zilchy said:

Haha ask a mod to move it maybe. Might work.

Oh...is it that easy to talk to a mod? Sorry about the thousand and one questions, but I'm really new to the forums, got no idea whats up from down around here. I only figured out how to post a month or so ago, lol, and how to reply just about two weeks ago

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Just now, (PS4)alexadusei said:

Oh...is it that easy to talk to a mod? Sorry about the thousand and one questions, but I'm really new to the forums, got no idea whats up from down around here. I only figured out how to post a month or so ago, lol, and how to reply just about two weeks ago

All good just report your thread and ask them to move it in the reason. 

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Just now, Zilchy said:

All good just report your thread and ask them to move it in the reason. 

Gotcha, I'll do that. Hopefully I don't lose you guys in the move. It's been great talking to and reading all your posts.

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Haven't ever really had a problem with Hydroid. only real bummer i'd say someone else brought up is he does feel a little augment dependent. but i run him with curative undertow and corroding barrage and he can take on quite a bit. saying he's stiff however I don't get the changes he's has and the mobility allowed in undertow and surging around or jumping out of puddle to shoot or bullet jumping into puddle into a little barrage at your location he's very fluid puns fully intended.

Honestly I don't even use him for loot just for fun sometime swashbuckling around is a fun time. (Zarr and Twin Rogga) 

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These are some quite nifty sounding rework ideas, I like them! My current grievances with Hydroid really boil down to his obnoxious casting times; if a player is already being taxed for twice as much energy to charge Hydroid's powers, why should their casting times also be three or four times longer? It's unnecessarily harsh, and nobody's got the available slots for Natural Talent in a crowded build with one or more augments. Some fresh insight is definitely appreciated though; these suggestions give Hydroid a lot more options to engage enemies than he currently possesses. If I have one criticism, your proposed seasickness augment seems really superfluous considering that there's already five or more status effects that accomplish functionally the same thing (temporarily slowing down or incapacitating the enemy).

I sincerely hope Hydroid gets a touchup sooner rather than later, because his playstyle right now is—with the exception of tidal surge—really static.

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Tbh, he feels static, his augs should just be imbeded in his abilities and as far as "loot fountain" goes, Nekros and Khora are better and play better.

He could be a utility beast, but currently it feels like he has 4 CC abilities with a gimmick.

Edited by Ver1dian

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5 hours ago, Ver1dian said:

Tbh, he feels static, his augs should just be imbeded in his abilities and as far as "loot fountain" goes, Nekros and Khora are better and play better.

He could be a utility beast, but currently it feels like he has 4 CC abilities with a gimmick.

Oh yeah, no doubt. He's currently last pick for anyone looking to farm stuff because he can't tank, he's not very mobile and he can't heal. Hopefully that changes sometime soon

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I agree that people seeing Hydroid as nothing more than a loot frame is a tad disappointing or narrow minded, but AGayGuyPlays did a video about the last devstream and in mentioning the new Hydroid Deluxe skin that's coming, he showed his Hydroid build and Pilfering Swarm wasn't on there, two other augments were instead.

Which says to me he does have more utility than just being an item farming loot stealer. 

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Honestly i love how hydroid work, he can be water.

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I love the concept of Undertow, but the whole camera being on the ground makes targeting enemies difficult and inefficient.

The ability to cast it on the ground without you is great, if the camera were to stay regular if you were to decide to go in it, that would perfect it

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I started this game when he launched, and he's been my main ever since.
I use Currative Undertow and lots of life sustaining mods.
His 4 is janky. I've only ever used it to hold a doorway or keep tabs on a group of enemies I wasn't ready to deal with.

It's a bummer he's only used for loot, but with the drop tables as they are, I can't say I'm surprised.

Absolutely adore Hydroid. He's my boy!
Kit could use some work..
would like his 1 more like rain, and 4 less like a disaster at a sushi bar..
but his 2 and 3 are the business.

Edited by kapn655321

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