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Delete Stamina.


Aspari
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It's ridiculous that conditioned super space ninjas wearing the most advanced technology ever known to the solar system can still get tired just from running for a few seconds. Did the Orokin really not have a provision for fatigue that comes from a simple motion? 

 

So I said it, delete the stamina system. Warframes aren't so advanced if they can't even take care of some of the most basic things about the body of a bipedal organism. 

 

 

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I think stamina does still have a place for things like blocking and maybe wall running, but yeah hyper badass space ninjas should not get pooped from running two feet

As far as blocking they could make an Action Gauge. This works exactly like the Energy Gauge except it's more oriented towards non-Power abilities. Blocking bullets would be such an action that uses the Action Gauge. For Wallrunning I think there should be a limited amount of time before a player has to come back down, due to gravity, friction, and loss of momentum.

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You are correct in that a Warframe should be able to counteract stamina; but the addition is nice because it's just another factor you have to be wary of during game-play. The only thing I dislike about stamina at the moment; is the bugged stamina orbs in the Obstacle Course Room.

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im fine with either keeping or removing stamina, it doenst really matter to me. if they keep it, it would be nice to change the way blocking works.

 

I hate how blocking drains stamina so quick, i used to love just standing around blocking, it was fun and it looks badass.

 

instead they should have the ability to block as long as you want, but have charges build up similar to sheilds that can only block so many hits.

Example: you can sit around holding block forever, until someone shoots you then, you can only block 10-20 or so bullets before your block stamina is out and u have to run and hide until it builds back up.

 

or something like that would be awesome

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You forgot to mention the pounds of bulletproof whatever it is they are wearing. Not to mention their guns

 

by that logic i feel sorry for the heavier ones.... like frost and rhino.... mainly rhino....

or any slim warframe with a heavy weapon like fragor or scindo.... those look heavy as hell....

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Honestly though, the stamina bar is what makes spamming the slide maneuver so common for getting around faster. You get a small speed boost from the sliding on top of allowing for stamina to recover while you slide.

 

You get rid of the small speed gain from the sliding - and the speed boost without any sort of propulsion isn't feasible at all - as well as get rid of the stamina bar, you get happier Tenno who won't run out of breathe after 5 seconds of sprinting and are more free to be as agile as they want in battle.

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I wouldn't be opposed to getting rid of stamina for *running*. I would want to see stamina change if they ever overhual blocking/dodging to have a significant impact. That said, I'm pretty okay with where stamina is at for the moment since the hotfix addressed the u10 changes. Quick Recovery or Marathon alone is enough to satiate your stamina needs. Rush is naturally optional but also helps out with general gameplay. If you don't want to use any of those then you can be more active about sliding to keep your stamina up or if you're feeling really cheesy you can... use zorens. 

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Removing the speed boost from slide will ruin the Run-Crouch-Catapult maneuver though, and I really love that move! :D

 

I agree that stamina needs to be wall-run only though. There could be other ways of limiting 'mobility' and too-quick advancement through the stages, like more two-person locked doors or bosses like Jackal that wait for everyone.  Double locked doors would give slower frames more time to catch up, without something like stamina getting in the way of simple movement. I feel that the warframes in this game need to get more mobile all together, but that is a different issue from encouraging co-op stage progress - unfortunately I feel like the stamina reduction is supposed to address the latter issue and it feels like a bad way of going about that.

 

Wall running needs to be made easier as well. I'd like to see more Wallrun-Leap-Melee maneuvers, or even the run straight up the wall and backflip onto your enemy maneuver. Its not that the concept of doing this is difficult, but if you're not confident that the move is going to execute when you tell it to, the more solid option seems to just keep pulling that trigger and aiming for headshots instead of going for the flourish. The mechanic that recognizes wallrunning needs some serious work.

 

Large damage bonuses for doing these moves would be nice.

 

As is, hardly anyone wall-runs or is doing stealthy, ninja-y tricks and moves in a game about being a space ninja. I go for the tricky wall attempt whenever I feel that I can, but its ridiculous getting stuck in a room where the only way out is wall-running upward - and watching all four ninjas get stuck since the wallrun isn't activating appropriately. Currently it seems like the ninja moves are for the skilled (or lucky!)... ok by me personally. I get around. But in all honesty I'd like to see everyone running around like space ninjas. Not just a select few.

 

 

Keep on rockin', Space Ninjas.

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Having the stamina bar go down/up 5x slower would be cool, and staying still will make the stamina go up faster than jogging.

 

This would make the gameplay more realistic without having to remove the stamina

Edited by SyriKz
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Stam is so that you can't hold down shift and w. I like it.

 

Yeah i cant just press W to go across some huge empty room, im supposed to do some contrived butt slam nonsense to get around. Because pressing Ctrl repeatedly like a robot shows how pro the tendons in my left forearm are. I like it! [/sarcasm]

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Stamina is there to create importance of the mechanics that use it, however all of the mechanics except sprinting are broken, making the whole thing irrelevant.

Stamina should not be removed, instead the mechanics using it should be reworked.

Stamina also now has a 0.5 seconds delay before regenerating, and regenerates at around 10% per second. This is incredibly fast, especially for a game with no fatigue system (stamina goes to 0% and you can't use any stamina-consuming maneuvers for a few seconds, not that Elsword fatigue). In fact, regeneration of stamina is so efficient right now, it is almost like stamina really DOESN'T exist right now.

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Stamina is also a factor in pacing a game.

 

Games with stamina generally emphasize tactical movement and the use of cover for recovery.

They make the players think ahead and plan out their route before moving. Positioning is key.

That makes the gameplay significantly slower but also allows for good coordination between teammates.

 

Games without stamina emphasize movement as a form of cover.

They make the players fight and shoot on the run and rely more on their instinct. Reflexes are key.

That makes the gameplay frantic and 'fun' but also heavily chaotic.

 

Warframe has the potential to be both or neither depending on your mod layout.

Ideally, via the use of mods, you should be able to play this game as either of the two, or sth in between that suits you.

 

Problems, however are manyfold.

Different mod layouts lead to the rusher problem, where frames geared for fast gameplay leave the others in the dust.

The way the mod system works makes fast frames even faster compared to slow frames, increasing the discrepancy even further.

AI aimbot and CC counteracts movement as form of cover, especially when the enemy are Grineer.

Manouvers are clunky to use and often trigger too early or too late, making them unreliable (especially in combat).

Creative use of cover is either unnecessary or won't save you because enemies tend to be either too weak or too strong.

Parkouring is seldomly rewarding. 'Secrets' are nice but too situational.

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If we're talking "highly trained space ninjas shouldn't get tired" lore, keep in mind that they're wearing warframes which are probably very heavy. Or at least they're sometimes heavy..? Like when they fall really far they seem to be heavy? But also you can jump stupid long distances in them while kicking? Actually, there is no lore with stamina. It's all up in the air. Nevermind.

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If we're talking "highly trained space ninjas shouldn't get tired" lore, keep in mind that they're wearing warframes which are probably very heavy. Or at least they're sometimes heavy..? Like when they fall really far they seem to be heavy? But also you can jump stupid long distances in them while kicking? Actually, there is no lore with stamina. It's all up in the air. Nevermind.

Let's just say that if the Tenno actually have to worry about the weight of their Warframes and the Warframes themselves don't eliminate the issue of stamina in the pilot, the Orokin aren't nearly as advanced as the lore claims them to be.

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