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[DE]Danielle

(PC) Kuva Liches / Parazon / Kuva Weapons / Etc. Feedback

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Would it be possible to get a UI link between the Lich menu and our Parazon menu and vis versa? It would greatly help in checking mod order and correction.

Edit: I notice the link from Lich to Parazon, but not the other way around.

 

Thanks, loving the update otherwise.

Edited by CuChulainnWD
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Once the player has found all 3 correct requiem mods in the correct order, the Kuva Lich should be a guaranteed spawn in every mission in Lich-controlled territory, from then on. 

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I got... The KUVA Kracken!

I went to get a new Lich. took aim at a level 23 hammer fist. FIRED!

 

....what the.. Fired again, and again, and again.

 

Why was the Lich, the queens Warrior supreme, using this hunk of scrap metal pretending to be a weapon? 

 

Yes it was rank 0. So were the Kuva Twin Stubba I got the other day. It's like comparing a stick taken off a tree and a Master Forged sword. They'll both hit something but the level of Owie is completely different.

 

This one weapon, I already WASTED a potato on it expecting .... something ... out of it since it's with all the other weapons. The idea of feeding this... garbage 5 forma makes me ill.

Edited by AreeSoothsayer
So of course the game now shows my Lich with a 48% Kracken.
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This one is about Liches and not gun, so seperate post.

Before the changes in Murmurs I could finish getting one Lich done and start another. Playing all day.

Now!

I have executed 4 Liches and started on the Fifth.

Waaaay too easy.

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Can we please do away with the Lich's name on our weapons?  It looks ugly seeing gibberish like "KENMAVI BHLIRUKK KUVA KARAK" Simply having "KUVA KARAK" is perfectly fine.  Please, please, please do away with this gobbledyguck.  Or is this just a ploy to get us to spend plat to rename these awful things?

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Le 31/10/2019 à 12:16, [DE]Danielle a dit :

HOW TO WRITE FEEDBACK: 

1. Keep it simple

I'll be simple: Warframe is going astray.

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I am really losing interest in Liches because I keep getting the same weapons over and over again every time I get a new lich. There really should be a way to get rid of a lich quickly or have a system in place where you can't get the same weapon twice in a row.

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Also, Lich weapons should be free to rename, because "Nod Orrts Kuva Twin Stubbas" just looks like crap.

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Something like that was probably already mentioned but let me throw in my brick.

Currently Mercy is almost impossible to do in normal gameplay. They DPS we do is massive and there is no way to react fast enough to an enemy opening up to it.

In my opinion every enemy that we can use Mercy on should be stunned for 5 seconds and become unkillable (HP does not drop below 1). However after the 5 second pass enemy either becomes active again (you still will be able to use Mercy on him) or if their HP is 1 they will instantly die.

This way people both get to take advantage of the mechanic, and in won't force people into it if they don't want to use it.

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On lich fighting abilities, a big suggestion: REMOVE THEYR MELEE COMBO ATTACKS.

Let me explain it a little better:

Right now you can be comboes with melee grabs by the lich, and is fun, it gives you a good sense of danger; problem is, the collision on maps are bad as usual, resulting in your frame being stuck in walls after the grab, falling through the map, being unable to do enything except abort the mission. This happens to me a lot of times, and the /unstuck command only works once, becouse of the cooldown on it, meaning that if you are comboed again and again, you are almost guaranteed to get stuck, with all that this implies.

Please, either remove those attakcs from the lich completly, or fix the geometry of maps first, is no fun to fight a lich worring all the times if this time you're gonna be able to finish the fight, or if you'll just end like a decoration on the wall

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The stockpiling mechanic seems like a pretty ineffective solution to the problem of getting the same weapons over and over.

See, if the player already has a pretty strong weapon (50-60% boost), chances are most duplicates are going to be worse. Thus, there's no reason to merge them, meaning we have the same problem as before (farming for somthing that isn't beneficial to you). Additionally, when trying to get every kuva weapon, the chance of getting a new weapon drops exponentially with every one you obtain, leading players to sink their time into something ultimately unrewarding. This does not have a positive effect on longevity.

So how do we solve this, exactly? It's quite easy (relatively). One I saw on the forums is allowing players to "transmute" two duplicates into a new weapon altogether. Maybe there could be certain combinations leading to certain weapon types. This would alleviate the exponential time investment growth and give players a reason to keep farming duplicates. Alternatively, the warframe the lich is killed with could affect the weapon type, giving players some control over which weapons they get.

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Tl;dr: i dont want to play with friends haaalp

There seems to be a bit of an issue right now playing this mode with friends. Basically if im doing my friends lich missions only his is getting angry if our missions dont overlap. So when im maxed on 3 words and i only did my friends lich missions, my lich will hardly appear because i havent been making him mad. This leads into a conflict of interest situation where i dont want to play with my friends if we dont share lich planets. Dunno what the solution to this is though. Maybe have your lich get slightly mad from you ignoring him like some attention starved A****** he is. Or as someone suggested maybe just have lich have increased probability of appearing once you have all 3 words.

 

Edited by Iretep
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Please make the Kuva Quartakk a manually switchable fire mode, just because the Quatz mechanic was something different, doesn't make it a practical idea.

There is no single practical reason why a weapon has to be setup like this, it's the definition of being different for the sake of being different. And while we're at it, can you convert other weapons like the Panthera into fire mode switch weapons?

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I love the parazon's mercy kills, but i never really get to use them on regular mooks!

Can we please have it so that, instead of enemies becoming vulnerable to mercy right before they die, they instead drop to their knees when their health reaches 0 like the thralls do?
In this state they could be invincible, but only for a second or two, just enough time to react to the mercy prompt.

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In regards to the issue/uproar of having RNG stats for the Kuva weapons and coming across, say, a Kuva Kohm with better base status effect than your now 5 forma'd exilus adapter'd Kuva Kohm, I'd like to reshill my old thread as a potential solution for the future. 

 

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The liches is bugged after latest hotfix.

I got the 1st 2 mods in the correct order after paying a bit more finally revealed the 3de mod and then equipped it. I started to look for my lich and tried to kill her just to die on the 1st mod. Thinking i might have put the mod at the wrong place i looked and seen it was correct. I then went to kill it in solo it worded.

 

 

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The Kuva Lich system is ambitious, I'll Give DE Credit for that. However, this update needs some Serious polish. So at the risk of beating the communal DEad horse, Here we go.

First, Requiem Mods:

I'd be okay with Requiem Mods being consumed IF i had away to build more without having to experience the excessive, Fractal grind.
As of now, we get 6 Kuva missions, of which ONE is a Kuva Flood with a guarantied Relic drop. For the remaining 5, we only have a 30% chance of getting a relic. This means we have, Roughly, a 17% chance to get Nothing, 36% for 1 relic, 30% for 2, 13% for 3, 2.8% for 4, and only 0.2% for 5. Overall, Players will gain 1.5 relics from playing the 5 standard Kuva siphon missions. After that, you then have a roughly 32% chance of getting one of the Requiem mods as a solo player, or, for groups of 4, a 79% chance of getting at least 1 mod selection (40% for 1, 29% for 2, 9% for 3, and 1% for 4),
And this isn't accounting for the current state of lich's Stealing these mods.
Now to their credit, the mods do have 3 charges, rather than just one. But this doesn't solve the core issue: in order to prepare for the coming deluge of Lich farming, players either need to be farming while the lich is hounding them and other players, or stockpiling on a scale bordering on paranoia.

Now, as I said before, I'm okay with something like this being a mild consumable. However, if that is going to be the case, players still need a way to replenish these mods without the fractal grind & padding. For example, a Defiled Requiem Mods could be purified with Kuva: This would Create a 'Fight Fire with Fire' situation where the Lich could still steal from the players, without causing the grind to spiral out of proportion. and best of all, It still leaves the option of stockpiling mods in case the player does not have the required kuva to restore their Requiem mods.

Second: Murmurs

Along side my first confrontation with a Kuva lich, there are testimonies of murmurs requiring 50+ Thralls to be executed in order to be completed. Considering the various codex fragments, Synthesis targets, and somachord fragments that litter the game, this feels like extreme overkill. We all understand that these lichs are supposed to be a long term threat, but this doesn't make it feel like a threat; it makes it feel like an annoyance. I personally used my lich appearing in mission to lure out more thralls in order to gain more murmur information, because as boring and tedious as it was, letting the lich beat me to a pulp sped up the process.

The obvious question then is 'How do we strip out the tedium?' One potential solution may come from the codex fragments; a niche mechanic that has, until now, only been used for hidden audio file related to in game lore. What if that mechanic was retrofitted to studying Requiem murmurs? As players gain more information from thralls, they can also use this system to try to cobble together the meaning of these bit of information. It would still allow for more brute force methods, while allowing players the option to come to their own conclusions. Not to mention, Requiem mods also have a small poem verse written on them, and could easily be hidden in incomplete murmurs as a clue to how best to kill your lich.

Third: Confrontation.

Lich's are meant to be Challenging. And testing out Requiem combinations on a lich is supposed to be a Risk. However, Fear of death isn't much of risk in this game: I try stabbing my lich, I get killed for my effort and lose a revive, and then i complete my mission. It's honestly an annoying bore, and not a big deal. Having a " Press X to maybe DIE" mechanic isn't a challenge. it's just  frustration. And it also defeats part of the purpose of the update; to showcase these Hammy, intense, and potentially interesting villains. If death is my ultimate end for failure, I want to milk it for all its worth; Don't just kill us at the first failure: Make us choose if we want to risk it again! Wrong first Requiem? Transference static 1, taunting, round two as the lich gains a level.. Wrong second Requiem? Transference static 2, Final warning as the the lich grows stronger, Round 3. Wrong Final Requiem? NOW the player dies. 3 failures, a stronger lich, and at least an interesting fight.  And it puts the choice of what to do next into the players hands while upping the stakes for an overpowered adversary: Stay and fight, risking the lich growing stronger as you go, or retreat and save your strength for the final confrontation.

Fourth: Flavor

Even with the custom stats, weapons, and appearance, the Kuva Lich in its current state feels more like a glorified field-boss: find the button to tick it off, and wait for the ensuing Fight. When trying to hunt this lich down, I want to see more of what makes them tick; is this for personal power? Bringing glory to the Grineer empire? the thrill of the hunt? Knowledge? What is this person doing to forward their goals aside from nebulous talk about "optimizing the local populace"?  Admittedly, this part is a bit lofty, as showing what exactly the lich is doing with the sectors under their control may require the addition or modification of tiles to show the exact nature of the lich's plans.
Aside from cosmetic changes to tiles and assets, having simple, secondary objectives would be an interesting way of conveying the lich's motives.

 

As I said before, the Kuva lich system is ambitious. I can never fault anyone for shooting for the stars, and I do see great potential for this new system. But between the excessive grind, unrefined research mechanics, and baseline interactions with this new enemy, this diamond in the rough need some serious Polish.

DE, Make me love to hate these Lich's; not loath even bringing them into existence. After all, Everyone love a good Villain.

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After the latest hotfix, this farm is a lot better, the opt-in is exactly what was needed.
Being able to transfer progress from one kuva weapon to another is a very welcome surprise.
Now for some quality of life:
It would be great if all the kuva lich attempts would be shown on the parazon mod screen (perhaps in the area where weapon stats normally show?)
It's not something I'd say is required, it's just a mild annoyance to have to check each little symbol on the list, switching between screens.

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g4HYjpt.png

This is not cool.
I'm trying to farm traces to upgrade the relic so I can finally kill him.

It's also going to affect my ability to farm primes, which pushes me further into opting out of the system altogether.

In general, the more I play the more I notice how annoying the entire Lich system is.
I previously said I was okay with how it was implemented, but I'm changing my mind:

  • in SoM/SoW fighting your nemesis was based on skill, both in planning and execution.
    Here it's just a matter of RNG and grind.
    If I don't have the things required to finish the fight, I might as well just run away from it.
     
  • In SoM/SoW it wasn't about loot (or at least it wasn't the priority until SoW endgame).
    Here this A****** steals my loot, and every fight I lose against him only expands his area of influence.
    Additionally, the rewards for killing him aren't even that inciting (other than getting MY stuff back).
    Again - why bother?
     
  • In SoM/SoW the nemesis was getting stronger slowly on their own, or rapidly if you lost to them, but you had the possibility of slowing them down.
    Here I'm encouraged to either run away and leave them alone or let them kill me.
    It's completely illogical.

In conclusion, after killing my first lich, If I ever decide to have another one I'll be sure to be as prepared as possible to get rid of him ASAP.
That doesn't really align with what this system is supposed to be about (
"long term rivalry"), does it?

PS
I'm getting truckloads of Kuva which I don't really need. Let me use that instead to power up the Requiem relics.

PPS
Floods still randomly don't give out the relic.

Edited by Shifted
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  • Upvote 4

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the only big issue i have is weapons you can get from lich

i managed to execute 4 liches, weapons i've got:
kraken, ogris, kraken, drakgoon
and then my 5th lich brings me OGRIS
and now i need to kill him too, just to get weapon i've alerady got, ty DE

best part of this update is melee - it feels so easy to control what you doing, some weapons are literally trash now, but thats ok i guess
charge mechanic is questionable - i can take reaper prime, build up red crit and just copter around with huge aoe redcrit whirlwind, but if i make charge attack - sure, i will deal a lot of dmg, buuut i dont want to build that combo meter again
dunno, i think it needs more testing, maybe this approach is very build and weapon-dependent so my arguement is invalid

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Something I noticed about new weapon, Kuva Chakkhurr.
It has no self damage. That is unacceptable,  can this thing have self damage? It is more powerful than kuva Ogris which has self damage

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My kuva lich keeps throwing me into little corners that i can get stuck in, sometimes he does drag me out again with his hook, but still alot of the time i have to /unstuck to be able to continue

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3 forma in my kuva brakk and i already have nothing to use the point on even with a eximus weapon adapter.

DE there is nothing wrong with rank 40 weapon but asking me to put in 5 forma to get to it rank 40 is not.On rank 40 you have 80 mod points and 5+ polarities.On my paracesis i have 5 forma.I have 31 mod point left on it after making a umbra weapon without umbra forma in it. 5 forma is overkill.

Edited by b4timert
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Void blast with operator making Kuva Lich lose their bodies. Happens every time.Warframe2086.jpg

Can I get this as a shoulder armour piece?

Edited by Nichivo
  • Haha 1

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IMO: Kuva Lich biggest issue are rewards.

 

I like disruption but just when axi relics and other stuff were added as rewards it became worth playing them. (Until then I only played arbi disruption).

Same with Kuva Lich. The mechanics are ok and I like most of it (murmur farming takes a bit too much time but the relic drop chance is at least rewarding).

But at the End from what I can see those kuva weapons do not feel rewarding for most of the players.  Solutions? Maybe heavy stats buff or let us sell those weapon for Kuva instead of credits? I don't know but it needs to feel rewarding like disruption does now. :)

 

 

Edited by sorcer3r

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