Revert Temp Royale / undo the stitched up mess of cut apart animations

[Andele3025]

August Mesto vertical roll attacks (especially the first one which cancels extremely weirdly) and Resplendent Calmas first spin attacks seem like they got put into opposite attacks.
Ignoring what damage multipliers each have (since those should stay per attack type) it seems like the final 2 attacks of the current "just LMB" combo should flow out of the first attack/the kneeling spin at the start of the "Block foward combo" while the vertical spin attacks that the "just LMB" combo looks like it should move you meters and end up with a stronger slam like the "Block forward combo", yet it doesnt

Why cut apart attacks that way when TR was already almost perfect for direct transfer (Majestic Abandon for LMB only attack, Resplendent Calma for foward block, August Mesto on normal forward and as currently Bold Reprise slam attack for the static block attack)?

 

 

How each attack chain should look badly stitched together from the old gifs:
Majestic Abandon aka Static attack chain (very small steps, can strafe during it)
Resplendent Calma aka Forward attack chain (should be 100% free movement)
August Mesto aka Block Forward attack chain (camera steeer control and soft strafe between each spin at the speed it was)
with Bold Reprise staying the same because it didnt change.

Edited December 31, 2019 by Andele3025

[Andele3025]

TLDR bump for the sake of reverting Tempo Royale attack animations (and smoothness without animation lock and slowdown) back to how they were (Bold Reprise can stay as just the slam tho).

[Randulv]

Agree 100% its way more start/stop and stuttery. August Mesto is some sort of impostor. It felt way better to use before by far my favorite combo that had no issues being used. It did not need to be changed because it was already perfect.

[raposo90]

I mainly use Heavy Blades with Tempo Royale Stance, and in my opinion, this new update messed up the combos and animations

It feels like Replendent Calma (before E, E, Pause, E, E,E) was split in two as the new Majestic Abandon and Replendent Calma. And the foward momentum that you had with Replendent Calma and August Mesto are gone

I'm not an expert on this, but my opinion is:

- Majestic Abandon should stay as E, E, E, E as before update 26

- Replendent Calma (keeping the entire combo animations as the one before update 26 and forward momentum) as Forward+E, Forward+E, Forward+E, Forward+E, Forward+E , or sometihng like Majestic Abandon (doing thefirst two moves of it) and then go with 3 times Forward+E

- August Meto (keeping the entire combo animations as the one before update 26 and mobility) as Forward+Block+E, Forward+Block+E, Forward+Block+E, Forward+Block+E , or going first with Majestic Abandon (doing the first move from the combo) and then go with 3 times Forward+Block+E

- and Bold Reprise as Block+E, Block+E, Block+E

Right now, as of this update 26, Tempo Royale does not feel right

Edited November 3, 2019 by raposo90

[Andele3025]

Reminder that Tempo Royale is still not revived to its original self and un-gutted from the current hastily butchered and stitched together with animation locks as glue version.

• Static combo 3 diagonal attacks that do small forward steps (but animation lock removed to let you strafe if you are holding the input instead).
• Forward combo being signature doublespin with the Resplendent Calma 4th attack/horizontal swipe ALL WITH FREE MOVEMENT.
• Forward Block being just August Mesto OR in worst case, the 3 vertical flips into the current slam BUT WITH OLD PLACE AND STEER CONTROL.
• Static Block remaining as it is because its the only move that wasnt gutted, but instead "improved"/sidgeraded really/just gets right to the point of the slam attack

And if DE cant fix the Resplendent Calma spin slide (which was already the weakest move of TR) to be as fast as it was with better hibox, then removing it and reverting with a simple free movement forward combo is the least that should happen (as the 2 moves TR is known for are the double spin and triple vertical flip, first being for free movement multihit aoe, second the smooth mobility).

Edited November 15, 2019 by Andele3025

[Andele3025]

How each attack chain should look badly stitched together from the old gifs:
Majestic Abandon aka Static attack chain (very small steps, can strafe during it)
Resplendent Calma aka Forward attack chain (should be 100% free movement)
August Mesto aka Block Forward attack chain (camera steeer control and soft strafe between each spin at the speed it was)
with Bold Reprise staying the same because it didnt change.

Added to first post.

Edited December 31, 2019 by Andele3025

[Andele3025]

Reminder that the supposedly sweeping strikes and twisting slashes are still choppy slams and animation locked sweeps.

[Lone_Dude]

I agree.

I played with all 3 stances. I used them with high and low attack speed setups on different Heavy Blades.

While not perfect, both Rending Crane and Cleaving Whirlwind have flow to them and I personally find them fun to use. Combos can be properly chained and don't feel out of place when it comes to their inputs and actual combat use. Moreover, animations look smooth for the most part(Rending Crane suffers from how short it's animations are, but I suppose it's more of a limited moveset issue rather than poorly cut up visuals).

Meanwhile, Tempo Royale feels extremely limiting. Combos, while chainable, lack flow. Both W+E and W+RMB+E combos provide subpar mobility. RMB "combo", that is supposed to be a long wind up, heavy damage strike, is extremely weak compared to other combos even if you disregard it's low speed that further decreases it's combat effectiveness. E spam combo also doesn't feel any better.

It doesn't look pretty, it doesn't feel fun to use and it doesn't work well in active combat. Basically, Tempo Royale lost it's tempo and royal grace lmao.  

Edited November 27, 2019 by Lone_Dude

[Andele3025]

Reminder that Tempo Royale is still gutted with animation locks.

[(XBOX)GodMasterTP]

I feel your pain, they nerfed my Broken Bull damage multiplier (Cleaving Whirlwind stance) to give us (Cleaving Whirlwind users) some bootleg mobility increase we never asked for.

 

[Maxim_M_Payne]

It isn't just Tempo Royale, DE did this with every single blasted Stance we once had.

We've gone from combos that looked and felt fun, alongside easily flowing between each other; into having janky, clumsy messes that look dumber, require movement key as part of the input when we asked for Stances to synchronize with our movement instead of interrupting it, and all-around feel less natural and more artificial to perform.

I liked using pauses, tapping, and held E to perform stance combos; it felt organic and smooth; like the natural tensing, relaxation, and release of different muscles when swinging an object.

Melee 3.0 was a disgrace with Phase 1 during Buried Debts; Phase 2 post-Old Blood is a flat out steaming pile of garbage. I am having less fun with melee than I ever have had the entirety of this miserable year starting with February.

Give. The. Old. Controls. Back.

[Andele3025]

15 hours ago, Maxim_M_Payne said:

It isn't just Tempo Royale, DE did this with every single blasted Stance we once had.

I know, its just that Tempo Royale had the biggest nerf in its moveset itself ontop of having animation locks sprayed in (tho technically it begun yee back when 2h melees lost their hyperarmor/poise during swings and then crept into some stances not benefitting from sprint). Very few other stances had that level of butchering and restitching together using animation locks as glue, thus im focusing on just TR here.

As far as input, i just say rather let players keybind stances and attack chains. Personally using movement keys as part of the input isnt a issue if the stance does what the input should do (instead of the "forward" combo rooting you in half steps while the no input combo moves you forward but doesnt allow you to strafe).

[Zhandii]

+1, new tempo royale sucks

[(XBOX)GearsMatrix301]

While they’re at it can they also un-ruin wise razor?

[Andele3025]

New years reminder that animation locks and stance attack chain animations being butchered and restitched badly is still a issue, no matter if high attack speed lets one """mostly ignore it""".

[SpringRocker]

On 2019-12-13 at 12:47 PM, Maxim_M_Payne said:

We've gone from combos that looked and felt fun, alongside easily flowing between each other; into having janky, clumsy messes that look dumber, require movement key as part of the input when we asked for Stances to synchronize with our movement instead of interrupting it, and all-around feel less natural and more artificial to perform.

This is pretty much it.

It's gone from combos we can use to rapidly pressing a button. What's the point of a combo if you're just holding down forward and/or aim and spamming a button? As soon as you let go or try pressing another button it just drops whatever combo was going on and starts in on the new one.

It's not combos anymore. It's basically looking up the wiki to find which "combo" has the highest damage multiplier, say "Yup, that's the one I'm just going to spam, for the most damage", and just hold aim (or whatever button) while spamming melee.

Tempo Royale used to be a great stance. Now it's like someone chopped the combos into three segments and called it a rework. They even specifically gave the stance a "spam-2-slam" one attack "combo".

Edited December 31, 2019 by SpringRocker

[Andele3025]

7 hours ago, SpringRocker said:

This is pretty much it.

It's gone from combos we can use to rapidly pressing a button. What's the point of a combo if you're just holding down forward and/or aim and spamming a button?

Technically its there to encourage quick swapping around, issue is 1) Players cant keybind it themselves (or at least pick if its no input for static with w for forward vs any input other than s for forward combo with s for static since static combos animation lock rooting you at least kinda makes sense unlike the current "static combo moves you forward faster than the forward combo") 2) There is no mod that allows people to have a attack chain and dodge offset (allow you to e.g. bold reprise slam mid another attack chain and continue that attack chain where you left off), thus letting people choose how to approach attack chains no longer being a node tree but independent input lines.

[Andele3025]

Still no melee 3.0 stance smoothing/fixes to the animation locks used as glue, missing subtle attack modifiers (shift/sprint for faster movement on non-hard animation locks, attacks with movement slowdown but free move, acceleration boost on some slide, latch and air attacks, etc) and reverting the (relatively "few") stances that got absolutely butchered like TR.

[SpringRocker]

14 hours ago, Andele3025 said:

Still no melee 3.0 stance smoothing/fixes to the animation locks used as glue, missing subtle attack modifiers (shift/sprint for faster movement on non-hard animation locks, attacks with movement slowdown but free move, acceleration boost on some slide, latch and air attacks, etc) and reverting the (relatively "few") stances that got absolutely butchered like TR.

Well, they got back earlier this week so I'm hoping we see/hear something in about 2 weeks.

I don't know what's involved nor implications of making the fixes, but I'd assume this wouldn't be the kind of thing that would be rush-fixed (a rushed fix might be just as bad).

[Andele3025]

2 hours ago, SpringRocker said:

I don't know what's involved nor implications of making the fixes, but I'd assume this wouldn't be the kind of thing that would be rush-fixed (a rushed fix might be just as bad).

I mean, the stances animation changes were for the vast majority rush jobs too. Maybe last week restitches at best. Especially from the raw amount of teleporting from the end of one attack to the starting position of another that got glued together with animation locks.

[SpringRocker]

Just now, Andele3025 said:

Especially from the raw amount of teleporting from the end of one attack to the starting position of another

Gah, I thought that was just me and that it related to lag on my end to a host.

Helps to know I'm not the only one 😕 .

[Andele3025]

Another reminder, TR still has forward combo animation locks and forward block combo (ex pause combo spinslide with the now-even-worse-hitbox) has no partial keyboard steer while the static combo moves you forward faster than the forward combo.