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luffySama7

Mirage Eclipse heat proc trick got removed with The Old Blood Update

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Why do you do this DE? The self heat proc trick to get Eclipse buff in dark got removed with The Old Blood update.

 

Before the update:

4Hmp5CE.jpg

credit : LeyzarGamingViews. 

 

After the Update:

w0iM4Fx.jpg

 

Check out Leyzar's video on how the interaction worked if you were not aware of it:

Mirage Eidolon Slayer build by LeyzarGamingViews

 

My 8 forma Umbral Mirage(yes that's an Umbra forma spent) max strength build is useless now. I don't like playing Chroma in Eidolon fights or any other mission for that matter.

Mirage is already pretty squishy compared to Chroma, and getting the Eclipse damage buff itself is more clumsy than to get Vex Armor buff. You need to able to re apply heat proc again and again when you want that buff. It is difficult but more fun. I like that play style.

I really hope this was a bug, in which case please revert it.

If this was intentional, it's really a shame. I would feel the devs are biased towards Chroma. This wouldn't have been a problem if the Eidolon hunt community was more accepting towards other frames. But the moment you join a multiple hunt group, they want Chroma as DPS. The recent loot nerf (which now has been reverted) was made with the reason that 'players shouldn't feel like having forced to equip a particular frame for a particular mission'. With Eidolon hunts, people are being forced to equip the Meta frames. 

The other reason I feel devs are biased is Chroma Prime was released with monstrously high stat weapons - Gram Prime and Rubico Prime. Mirage Prime -  not even with her signature weapon Akzani, just got handed the short end of the stick with Akbolto Prime and Kogake Prime. Just shows how much devs care about Chroma. It's as if they want people to use Chroma in Eidolon hunts.

Let me use my frame of choice. Don't force me to use Chroma as DPS in Eidolon hunts. I don't like playing as Chroma, not one bit.

If you say the heat proc giving buff itself was a bug, why not rework her to let the player choose when to get buff/damage mitigation? She already has a pretty clumsy mechanic of having to find dark or lit places. Where am I supposed to find light in Derelict or find darkness in Void? Maybe let her create areas of darkness or light with her Sleight of Hand ability? Or at least something like Arlo's lantern in the recent Halloween event. 

 

REMARKS:

1. Don't blast me saying something along the lines of 'just change your role'. I am just speaking about the role as DPS.

2. I know people have used frames like Rhino, Ivara, Garuda etc to do damage to Eidolon. But then these frames come with the ability kit to do so. I don't think anyone's doing damage with Nekros or Loki for example. Of course every frame specializes in their own thing. Mirage right now is just being specialized in troll though. People were utilizing her as a DPS, but DE decides she should not, and that's my grievance.

Edited by luffySama7
Added before and after images of the interaction and corrected the word from nerf to removed
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10 minutes ago, luffySama7 said:

My 8 forma Umbral Mirage(yes that's an Umbra forma spent) build is useless now

Omg the drama. I swear, this community should have its own reality TV show. Mirage? Useless because of that? Puh-lease

Edited by (PS4)LoisGordils
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4 minutes ago, (PS4)LoisGordils said:

Omg the drama. I swear, this community should have its own reality TV show

Did you even read the whole post mate? It's ok if you feel it's dramatic or whatever, but at least add something that actually contributes to the discussion about Mirage in general.

Your

7 minutes ago, (PS4)LoisGordils said:

Puh-lease

is more dramatic than my whole post.

I just said my Eidolon slayer build (with maximum strength possible) has been rendered useless. Sorry if it came as Mirage being useless in general. I still have a Total Eclipse build which is decent. I'll edit out that part.

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3 minutes ago, luffySama7 said:

Did you even read the whole post mate? It's ok if you feel it's dramatic or whatever, but at least add something that actually contributes to the discussion about Mirage in general.

Your

is more dramatic than my whole post.

I just said my Eidolon slayer build (with maximum strength possible) has been rendered useless. Sorry if it came as Mirage being useless in general. I still have a Total Eclipse build which is decent. I'll edit out that part.

Ah apologies. I thought you meant Mirage as a whole xD

 

Regarding your complaint, I don't think Heat procs should affect Eclipse. However, Prism should be changed to a purely duration based skill that gives the effects of bright lighting when Mirage is near. Tap should release it normally, hold should cause the Prism to hover above her. Providing illumination and offense

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16 minutes ago, (PS4)LoisGordils said:

Ah apologies. I thought you meant Mirage as a whole xD

 

Regarding your complaint, I don't think Heat procs should affect Eclipse. However, Prism should be changed to a purely duration based skill that gives the effects of bright lighting when Mirage is near. Tap should release it normally, hold should cause the Prism to hover above her. Providing illumination and offense

Exactly. I'm pretty sure heat procs affecting eclipse had always been a bug players were exploiting to begin with, which I guess has now been fixed.

The correct solution is to rework Mirage to remove such tedious workarounds for her ability to begin with. I do like the idea of synergy with Prism or her other abilities to influence her Eclipse.

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4 minutes ago, (PS4)Ozymandias-13- said:

had always been a bug players were exploiting to begin with

I don't know why people are calling it a bug or why you saying players were exploiting it.

1. If something catches fire, it gets lit. Simple

2. It's just like the situation where Chroma player uses Concealed explosives on secondary or use a glaive to get self damage in order to get buff. Mirage players light themselves up to get the buff. Otherwise the ability is so situational as I mentioned in the post. Imagine if they capped or even removed the 'self damage' taken by Chroma. Imagine a situation where there are no self damage weapons in the game or maybe recasting Vex Armor resets the fury buff to 0%.

Player1 : Hey Chroma hit the synovia already.

Player2: Wait my Fury buff is still stacking. Let the Eidolon hit me a couple of times more.

The imaginary situations for Chroma I mentioned are what Mirage is dealing with. Not case-to-case match, but the idea remains the same. She has the potential to do damage, but can't because of situation.

Other than that, I agree with your point of some synergy with her abilities.

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1 hour ago, luffySama7 said:

1. If something catches fire, it gets lit. Simple

She's a squishy frame. Having a self-damage mechanic in order to get an offensive buff is counter-intuitive. DE literally just changed Ember's passive for the same reason. Lol

1 hour ago, luffySama7 said:

Imagine if they capped or even removed the 'self damage' taken by Chroma.

I actually do think that should be removed, and the fight be reworked. The fact that it pushed a meta that nearly exclusively encourages using Chroma, along with a very small number other frames to do effectively is highly flawed.

You seem to have this idea stuck in your head that it's better to keep the workarounds in place rather than fix the reason that you need a workaround. That's just bad design. 

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What is the nerf?

Does heat proc not count as lighting at all? Does it not provide full lighting bonus? You posted a screenshot of "before the update", but not one of "after the update".

 

 

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2 hours ago, (PS4)Quantaminum said:

What is the nerf?

Maybe nerf was the wrong word. Sorry.

It got removed. I posted a link to video where it explains how lighting Mirage on fire gets you the Eclipse buff. With the update, proccing heat doesn't light up Mirage and so no buff

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I am... Fairly confident they not only made a change or two to the lighting engine, but also changed the visuals of the heat proc.

If that's true (at work, can't check) then that's why. Eclipse is tied to local lighting not specific effects, if the new heat is less bright (probably to avoid killing player eyes) that'd be why the change.

It's not a direct action against the build, the build just relies on such a bizarre interaction that it got hurt in other changes.

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37 minutes ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:

Seemed only fitting. It was clearly an unintended bug and Mirage needs all the excuse she can get for a rework.

So was Speedva. Negative power strength Nova was not intended. But they didn't remove just because the community liked it.

And the excuse you talking about, where is it? Maybe it would have been ok to remove it if there was a rework. But is there one? People have been blasting about it since long. So maybe if they said in the patch notes "hey we removed it because it was an unintended bug, but we are working on a rework of her abilities" that would have been a different story mate.

Would you be crying out to devs after making this comment about 'Mirage rework' because they removed this trick? I don't think so. You will simply go ahead and use Chroma, totally forgetting about the fact that the devs made the time to remove this trick, but no effort to actually rework her.

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2 minutes ago, luffySama7 said:

So was Speedva. Negative power strength Nova was not intended. But they didn't remove just because the community liked it.

And the excuse you talking about, where is it? Maybe it would have been ok to remove it if there was a rework. But is there one? People have been blasting about it since long. So maybe if they said in the patch notes "hey we removed it because it was an unintended bug, but we are working on a rework of her abilities" that would have been a different story mate.

Would you be crying out to devs after making this comment about 'Mirage rework' because they removed this trick? I don't think so. You will simply go ahead and use Chroma, totally forgetting about the fact that the devs made the time to remove this trick, but no effort to actually rework her.

There isn’t a rework...yet. While Mirage is technically strong she has some really weird and unreliable mechanics. Not to mention that for an “illusion frame” she doesn’t really reflect that very well.

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Honestly they should just make heat add light or rework her 4 so its not utter garbage. Though personally i am for the former. It seems unfair that if the player finds a way to use a mechanic in a way not intended that does not affect others in a negative way / give the player an insanely strong advantage that the unintended mechanic gets removed. What made this heat proc gimmick special is that it relies on interaction outside of her kit, just like chroma and cerata (R.I.P cerata), so is it fair for chroma to self dmg his self for dmg buff but mirage cant self ignite herself for hers?

 

Edited by Gawizard

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4 hours ago, (PS4)Ozymandias-13- said:

She's a squishy frame. Having a self-damage mechanic in order to get an offensive buff is counter-intuitive. DE literally just changed Ember's passive for the same reason. Lol

Please use the frame before saying such, Mirage is one of the few frames that i know of that can resist 99.97% dmg with adaptation and at least 150% power strength on her 3. with that Damage Reduction, you can stand in the gantulyst's "death beam" for almost 14 seconds without dying, chroma on the other hand cannot maintain such DR. Saying Mirage is squishy in eidolon hunts is rather misinformative.
 

5 hours ago, (PS4)Ozymandias-13- said:

I actually do think that should be removed, and the fight be reworked. The fact that it pushed a meta that nearly exclusively encourages using Chroma, along with a very small number other frames to do effectively is highly flawed.. 

The fight should be reworked, or it could be kept the same. Saying that one unintended mechanic pushed a meta that encourages using a different frame is flawed shows something about people following the only meta for eidolons. Meta diversity or even role diversity in general is ALWAYS good, its only if you're gaining unfair advantages is when its debatable. So, tell me, do you leave your squad if the DMG roll brings a mirage instead of a chroma? or are you a chroma main that hates seeing role diversity.

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and about Mirage getting a rework.

Some of her abilities need a rework, not all of them. Her 4 and 2 is the main contenders for such. Her 1st ability is simple and it should be, its the first one you interact with. Her second ability needs nothing but 1 thing, a higher enemy aggro value than everything in the room, an irresistable jewel i've seen enemies walk past while shooting the objective. Changing that would make the ability way more usable with mirage's playstyle(s). Her 3 Ideally needs an addition but not a change, i honestly like it the way it is (while heat still gave off light) but for normal players trying to pick her up, her 3 could be rather annoying, a simple suggestion would be to have the ability to cast and hold to make her gain the opposite buff but to not have it as strong as without gaining the buff, maybe have her create a light / dark orb that follows her around and creates "light" that affects her and her allies (making total eclipse more useful than before). Her 4 honestly needs a total overhaul which i've thought of myself, i've shared such rework ideas privately but if you wish to know them, you can ask me. Leave her passive, mobility is fun in this game, removing mirage's passive would kill that fluidity she has.

Edited by Gawizard

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We should be able to switch between eh8ch buff we would rather use. This light dark bs is well....bs

 

I'll carry arlos lamp if I need to sacrifice a primary or secondary 

Edited by (XB1)Veytok

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