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Why are people so annoyed with the Grendel Missions?


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46 minutes ago, Seruai said:

Challenge Bad >:v(

Well no, challenge good, it's just that these missions show that Warframe has some serious trouble giving us actual challenge, as even when stripping players of most of their customization, and thus eliminating a whole lot of potential imbalance factors, the game is still unstable and prone to cheese. Generally, when games do this, it's because they want to provide this hyper-refined, tight gameplay experience, but Grendel's missions are neither, as they're not particularly well-balanced. This is why details matter, and why Warframe needs to start polishing its gameplay, likely overhaul many more of its systems, rather than just hope we'll stay hooked enough on the big picture to ignore its flaws.

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On 2019-11-02 at 11:33 AM, Aldrr said:

So I jump into a grendel challenge mission with Hildryn, hoping that her shield leeching is enough to keep her alive against the corpus and praying that the pod can last 15 waves.

Stalker shows up. Now of all times!

Just... wonderful.

I'll try again later once my blood pressure is back to normal.

Had the same thing happen, meeled him to death and kept on going about my business lol

He isn't even hard lol

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Removing mods is as dumb and lazy as oneshot mechanics. If they removed mods, why did they even implement them in the first place just like if enemies are meant to oneshot you, why not having only one HP like Mario ?

Designing means consistency, removing entire mechanics is only breaking balance and fun. Better spend plat to get Grendel than wasting Vitus tbh. I don't mind the effort, i got all frames through quests before, but this one isn't interesting at all. Especially since Grendel isn't a well polished frame, half of his kit isn't making it.

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This isn't new, and it isn't a reason to suddenly become concerned that it's the direction the game is going....unless, somehow, you've missed the myriad other times your powers have been completely nullified, quests that don't allow something or other(there's been operator only, including operator without all their power, for a looong time), weapon damage types nullified, weapons not allowed, etc, etc, etc, the list goes on.

Gutting part of what you are happens here all the time.  Yes, I agree that it's an awful, lazy, and uninspired way to make challenge.  It's gutless to implement game items and then not have the stones to balance them so that they can be used at all times.

But the only way a person could suddenly be concerned that doing stuff like this is going to become commonplace after the advent of this particular time is to somehow forget all the other times in the past it's happened.  It's already commonplace, already grumbled about every time it happens, and already had the feedback to state that we aren't overly fond of this development route.  This isn't step one down a slippery slope, it's mid-slide at best.

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1 hour ago, Thrymm said:

This isn't new, and it isn't a reason to suddenly become concerned that it's the direction the game is going....unless, somehow, you've missed the myriad other times your powers have been completely nullified, quests that don't allow something or other(there's been operator only, including operator without all their power, for a looong time), weapon damage types nullified, weapons not allowed, etc, etc, etc, the list goes on.

Yes, there were missions that took away abilities, BUT they gave something of it instead, like good times with a storyline or gaining new abilities slowly while playing operator only. This is a very basic rule in game design. There is a difference stripping away all your choices and prolonging a game session with low dps, high level enemies, in same old defense/survival mission with nothing interesting happening in it, and the aforementioned operator quests. I can only repeat myself here. If you dramatically taking away almost everything from the players arsenal, there should be something to balance that out to make it fun.

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On 2019-11-02 at 5:27 PM, XaoGarrent said:

This isn't endgame.

And making content for a tiny fraction of the population isn't realistic, or profitable. And frankly, it's elitist.

This. 0 fun involved in this crap. And it DOES seem like DE is catering to the top 10% elitists who are probaby the only ones complaining about difficulty level. It just seems like another way to maximize Christmas bonuses this year. Every frame in the game and I'm ready to say: "#*!% Grendel"  And honestly, he's probably not worth it. Even with a 75% off coupon. The whole update seems like it was designed for a select few.

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1 hour ago, (PS4)spdwyblu05xrun said:

This. 0 fun involved in this crap. And it DOES seem like DE is catering to the top 10% elitists who are probaby the only ones complaining about difficulty level. It just seems like another way to maximize Christmas bonuses this year. Every frame in the game and I'm ready to say: "#*!% Grendel"  And honestly, he's probably not worth it. Even with a 75% off coupon. The whole update seems like it was designed for a select few.

I sold a bunch of prime parts and just bought him with plat, and my advice to you is: Don't bother. He really, really isn't worth it. He's frankly garbage. Maybe that will change, but right now he's so energy inefficient and his powers are so awkward, unreliable and finicky that he's largely just a waste of your time. He's not even "fun." 

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3 minutes ago, IIDMOII said:

I think they sound kinda fun tbh. 

My problem is that ropalyst fight has me locked out of arbitration.

then just do it?

and the missions for grendal arnt even hard....

i had stalker sow up in one of them, and killed him 2, and he was level 60

im not understanding the issue here? this is not pokemon, u dont gota ketch them all, on top of that, it took me an hour to get the vitus, and another hour and a half to do the missions, then another 5 mins to get argon, then i had to wait 3 1/2 days for him to build, while i went off and killed 4 liches.... at this point, im on lich 6, and was even giving out extra requiem mods and ayatan statues..... i dont even play every day 

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52 minutes ago, (PS4)Spider_Enigma said:

then just do it?

No u

I don't see the issue either. It's meant to be a goofy challenge. It's similar to a modifier in a sortie. 

Let's be fair. They need to sell some grendels too. If the quest is not up your alley, chances are you're the exact person who is intended to buy him. 

Personally I thought the nidus quest was B.S. so I bought him. Done.

Edited by IIDMOII
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On 2019-11-28 at 11:27 PM, 000l000 said:

Removing mods is as dumb and lazy as oneshot mechanics. If they removed mods, why did they even implement them in the first place just like if enemies are meant to oneshot you, why not having only one HP like Mario ?

Designing means consistency, removing entire mechanics is only breaking balance and fun. Better spend plat to get Grendel than wasting Vitus tbh. I don't mind the effort, i got all frames through quests before, but this one isn't interesting at all. Especially since Grendel isn't a well polished frame, half of his kit isn't making it.

Well on forums before this mission came about everyone was asking for End Game and were saying why not just have a mode with no mods to have some challenge. And then we got what they were all asking for. Then everyone took back what they said because they didn't feel like Gods in the game in that mode. I agree it wasn't fun after knowing what frames are capable of doing because it felt like nerf, which we all love. lol

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18 hours ago, kwlingo said:

Well on forums before this mission came about everyone was asking for End Game and were saying why not just have a mode with no mods to have some challenge. And then we got what they were all asking for. Then everyone took back what they said because they didn't feel like Gods in the game in that mode. I agree it wasn't fun after knowing what frames are capable of doing because it felt like nerf, which we all love. lol

I like how you think people on forum is one big entity that has multiple personalities. The people who asked for no mods, if there were really some, aren't complaining about it now. That's ridiculous. Also the same people who asked for no mods, have no clue about game design or at least fun game design.

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My two complaints are:

1. it's massive difference in difficulty solo vs in a squad. For a four man squad that plans ahead these are a cake walk. 

2. Despite being key missions, despite requiring to be invited and that the key is not spent if you fail or abort, the afk timer is still in effect. My team died 100 cryotic short of the goal and I managed to kite and dodge and stay alive long enough to finish it but only I got the part because the afk timer kicked in for those who were dead. 

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2 hours ago, Drasiel said:

My two complaints are:

1. it's massive difference in difficulty solo vs in a squad. For a four man squad that plans ahead these are a cake walk. 

2. Despite being key missions, despite requiring to be invited and that the key is not spent if you fail or abort, the afk timer is still in effect. My team died 100 cryotic short of the goal and I managed to kite and dodge and stay alive long enough to finish it but only I got the part because the afk timer kicked in for those who were dead

ouch 

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3 hours ago, DagoDrakh said:

I like how you think people on forum is one big entity that has multiple personalities. The people who asked for no mods, if there were really some, aren't complaining about it now. That's ridiculous. Also the same people who asked for no mods, have no clue about game design or at least fun game design.

Right, In all honestly most players still want the old Ember back where you can just sit back and relax while it staggers enemies 50 meters away. This primarily why Grendel missions were hated so much. Instead of knowing the range of abilities being 50 meters were now just 10-15 meters which makes most abilities less effective. Even if DE made the game more challenging, the veterans who are not use to trying much would be upset because of the grind for loots/ resources it takes. They say they want to come into the game and just relax. There can never be any happy medium.

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  • 1 year later...

My guess is the main ones complaining mostly run the game nuking. Hey, if that works for you, then fly that flag. Me, this is the type of mission I LOVE!!! Brute force, heck yeah. Took a group of three, me and my Lord Petrus (Hydroid Prime). I had a @#&-_$# blast. Thank you DE, seriously. Thank you!

And to get blood spitty boy on top of three awesome missions, icing on the cake. Bring them on. And I'm no elitist. Ten months playing, not a Nuker by nature, prefer the gunfight.

Chad frame and all.

Bravo Sirs and Madams, Bravo.

Edited by (XBOX)OdinsDottir
Typo
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i mean i dont mind the mission but considering you have to buy the mission from arbitrations you would think they would have made it an arbiters of hexis mission which expands there lore and S#&$...

 

arbiter is here watching the other factions bonding whit the tenno as they explore there back stories sulking in the corner as DE forgets about them 

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Missions are fine. Farmed Grendel 2 times.
What is not fine, however, is how much the beacons cost, i'm surprised that after all this time, it havent been changed at all.
Havent bought a single beacon myself, don't know how people manage to get that much essence, drops just seem non-existent.
I can't imagine having to buy all 3 by yourself, it's like another Harrow\Nidus\Khora farm, people will get Grendel Prime sooner than they'll get enough essence to get the regular version if there's no one to share....

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1 hour ago, Rantear said:

Missions are fine. Farmed Grendel 2 times.
What is not fine, however, is how much the beacons cost, i'm surprised that after all this time, it havent been changed at all.
Havent bought a single beacon myself, don't know how people manage to get that much essence, drops just seem non-existent.
I can't imagine having to buy all 3 by yourself, it's like another Harrow\Nidus\Khora farm, people will get Grendel Prime sooner than they'll get enough essence to get the regular version if there's no one to share....

6 if you want to use helminth. I spent a weekend playing every arbitration survival that popped up to get to the vitus. As much as I don't like playing arbitrations on public, public matches for a couple of day to get the most vitas essence is all you need.  Honestly I hope one day they retire the keys entirely, it just blocks public matchmaking and makes the frames harder to get post launch as vets get what they need and abandon the content because it's annoying to get back into. While alad V keys are a lot more common they still do the same thing to mesa.

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As one of few people who actually liked the challenge by doing it with ppl, forming strategy and combinations with limitations put on us(we were unaware of heavy slam spam trick), it was just.... way too drawn out.

 

20 Min survival, 15 waves of defense, 8 Excavators. Each for a one part bluepoint of one frame that wasn’t really great on launch.

 

Not really satisfactory given the time expected to put into. And that is before talking about Arbitation Vitus Essence required for each key. (I am aware you can share the keys, but good luck finding someone with other keys months after initial release...)

25 per locator(key) is not really trivial, and even for ppl who have a lot, it feels inadequate price for they will use only once or twice.

 

 

 

Edited by OwlOfJune
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