DE, the Lich System is bad and it needs to change.

[Aldain]

While the flee mechanic isn't quite what I wanted I'll take anything that will make it so people stop complaining about Lich Blocking.

[Sunder]

38 minutes ago, Aldain said:

While the flee mechanic isn't quite what I wanted I'll take anything that will make it so people stop complaining about Lich Blocking.

I'm still not gonna fight. Teammates can take it on if they want to but I'm not going to bother. They pose very little danger and I can complete missions even with one present. 

There's little reward for doing so and I find the suicide mechanic to move on extremely stupid. 

Going to my doom to progress isn't fun DE.

[EinheriarJudith]

does DE actually know what the word solution means? all this does is prolong mission time for no reason.

a better solution would be a contextual key press to make them flee so you only have to down them once.

Edit: something like RMB+X or LMB+X or Ctrl+X or anything really.

 

Edited November 23, 2019 by EinheriarJudith

[Mauverine]

Just got my third lich. No ephemera, Same weapon as first lich. There's no incentive whatsoever to go through the whole infuriatingly boring process once more. "Best" case, I get a Lich to trade in order to do the process ONCE MORE to get a weapon I haven't leveled, and mind you, a weapon I STILL have to waste five formas on. 

I'm not looking forward to updates, I cringe at the thought of whatever new grind there is. I stayed in Warframe throughout the Nightwave grind being introduced, and I have not yet left. But this is wearing my patience really thin.

[EinheriarJudith]

man already seeing bugs with the flee mechanic. just had someones lich not flee after being downed 3 times, 4 times, 5 times we gave up.

ive also noticed that when you attempt to execute sometimes it will do extra as if its 1. ive also had attempts not drop kuva either.

[Cosmic_Elf]

I don't get it or understand it either on how to use it or get liches 

Edited November 24, 2019 by Cosmic_Elf

[DoomFruit]

On 2019-11-22 at 10:44 PM, Tinklzs said:

What I don't understand is it's called a kuva lich, that gives no kuva.

They actually have more connection with kuva than they do liches. At least kuva was used at some point during their production process. They don't display even one lich-like trait.

[DrakeWurrum]

I don't generally agree with your criticism of the whole kuva lich thing. It's a wonky system, I will agree, but I don't generally have a response of RAGE to it all. The RNG nature of it all, the charges on the mods... It's not what I expected, but I don't exactly hate any of it. I don't exactly want to get into it, because subjective opinion is subjective and, to be fair, I haven't killed 60 of these things - only two so far, because I'm also caught up in other games AND my 60-hour workweek (so I've been playing VERY casually lately). I'm having fun, but I can see why others are not, and I can understand the reasons behind your complaints.

As such, I do fully agree with many of your suggestions to improve it, and the reasoning behind them, but naturally have certain points where I don't.

On 2019-11-02 at 5:29 PM, MirageKnight said:

Overall difficulty: Not everyone is capable of running Sortie-level missions or wants to do so. I'd highly recommend dropping enemy levels to 60 at most.

I'd prefer to keep the level range where it is, especially since they start around the 50-60 range, and only get up to the 90-120 range if they've ranked up all the way. Improving the mechanics of how a lich ranks up, or maybe making the ranking up an optional mechanic for the player will solve this problem. Because there are many of us veteran players who want an "endgame" kind of challenge in our content, but often cannot find it. It's refreshing for me to actually have to try in these missions, and actually care about my build rather than curb-stomping the entire mission while half-asleep.

I'd love to see some kind of "risk + reward" option in fighting our lich that we can choose that would result in the lich ranking up through intentional player choice - but only if ranking up the lich also gives us increased rewards that are worth pursuing.

On 2019-11-02 at 5:29 PM, MirageKnight said:

- The Lich nemesis: The Lich nemesis should be defeated by "normal" means, but require the Parazon with the right phrase sequence for kill permanence or conversion to an ally. Conversely, attempting a jab with the Parazon without the right mod sequence should not result in the player getting K.O.'d, nor should it level up the Lich. Instead, have the Lich nemesis initiate an emergency teleport escape to fight another day. The Lich should only be able to level up if it actually defeats you in a fight. If / When it beats you, it levels up and retakes the nodes you previously cleared, but no more than that. Also, the Lich nemesis needs to be a far more active hunter and perhaps have a chance of attacking you in normal missions as well as nodes under its influence. 

Agree with this whole bit, for all the obvious reasons. It doesn't feel like a lich, to start with. I'd prefer that a failed attempt results in it "dying" but coming back, and I've been saying it ever since it first one-shot me after a failed kill. There is simply no reason to fight a lich right now when we have no reasonable expectation of being able to kill it simply because it's a kill-or-be-killed situation. I also very much wonder why the hell my Tenno is even fighting this thing, beyond the "tax" it keeps taking from me. It's not getting in my way - if anything *I* am the hunter. It doesn't feel like an enemy threat that is forcing me to fight back.

I don't agree with that method of lich rank-up. I'd prefer it if the lich ranking up was contingent upon an active player choice, as an optional means of intentionally getting higher-level enemies to fight (ideally with increased rewards for our trouble). I don't want the lich ranking up to feel like a punishment, but the result of a progression of player choices in fighting the lich.

On 2019-11-02 at 5:29 PM, MirageKnight said:

The Lich ally: They need to be far more reliable. Right now they're unreliable and not worth the effort expended in obtaining them. Ideally, allow them to be summoned via a craftable beacon, but restrict the use of the beacon to once per mission. The Lich ally should also be able to revive a player if running a solo mission. I'd also like to see a bit more lore / relationship between the player and their new ally / allies. Think about it...you defeated a really tough opponent that wanted to destroy you on multiple levels, yet you spared their life, gave them an opportunity to redeem themselves, and freed them from the Worm Queen's control. If I were the Lich, I'd be indebted to my former adversary.

Yes to all of this. I haven't converted either of my liches. I actually see no incentive to convert them after hearing about other players' experiences with it. It sounds far too unreliable, and in many cases can simply backfire horrendously, while also taking away a LOT of player agency. I should be able to choose whether or not my allied liches join the fight. I also haven't heard if there's a way to select/appoint a specific lich as my ally.

So, yes to everything you're saying. I want to be able to put down a beacon that calls for my ally to aid me. I also think it would be a great use of the Crimson Branch room in the Dojo if we could appoint a specific converted lich there (if not from the Arsenal, under the Companion tab) to serve as our back-up. Hell, imagine if we could actually outfit our lich with its own kuva/Grineer equipment and modify it in fun ways - I'd love to actually be able to treat our liches as underlings that we can bring to a fight. I do also hope to see some sort of lore tossed in to that room to give us more of a reason to convert liches.

On 2019-11-02 at 5:29 PM, MirageKnight said:

Duplicate weapons: Dupes shouldn't even exist. As a solution, when generating a Lich nemesis for a player, the game could do one of two things. The first would be to check for existing Kuva weapons in the player's inventory and only equip the Lich with a random weapon that the player does NOT have. This would to prevent instances of players winding up with duplicate Kuva weapons. If the player has all the Kuva weapons that are available, the game is allowed to generate a random Kuva weapon for the Lich nemesis. There's still a bit of grind and randomness involved to get the weapon you want, but at least there's no chance of getting a duplicate weapon. Another idea would be to give the Larva a regular version of the Kuva weapon it would get if it became a Lich nemesis. This way, players can quickly decide as to whether or not to simply gun down the Larva and let it die or trigger it so that it turns into a Lich with the appropriate Kuva weapon. The second solution gives the player more agency in what they're getting at the end of the grind and thus involves less wasted grind.

Player: "Hey, that Larva has a Quartakk in this mission but I want to get my hands on a Kuva Tonkor. Never mind." or "Ooooo, that one's got a Stubba! Here we go!"

I wouldn't go so far as to say "dupes shouldn't even exist" but I will agree, with the effort and time a lich takes to kill, that this is a problem and it needs to be done better.

I love the idea of the second option. If the larvling also has the weapon in it's name, like "Kuva Quartakk Larvling" that would absolutely be the best route to take. Keeps player agency in the whole thing.

Because what if I don't want to get a new weapon, but want to make an effort to perfect the weapons I already have? I HAVE to wait until I have all of them? I might get obsessed with the Chakurr I just got, and have zero interest in the Stubba until I get a really GOOD Chakurr.

On 2019-11-02 at 5:29 PM, MirageKnight said:

Kuva weapons in general:  In terms of mastery and modding, they should be treated like any other weapon - max level of 30 and leveling to 30 on the first go gives the player Mastery. In addition, players should be refunded at least 2 Forma for every Kuva weapon they own that's been Mastered for their troubles.

I have zero problem with the Mastery situation on these weapons. Maybe that's just because I'm MR27. I admit my perspective on this may be skewed.

We've been through this with the Paracesis, and I don't think it's a problem. I actually think it's a nifty unique feature to have specific weapons able to reach higher ranks - it doesn't strictly increase their power, but sets them aside as being "more elite" than the rest.

That being said... I don't see why it can't be that these weapons are able to rise up to rank 40, but give max mastery at rank 30. With the extra 10 ranks just being the extra capacity (and whatever else it gives, like the Paracesis being very good against Sentients). Seriously, we don't NEED that extra mastery. I'd live without it just fine.

On 2019-11-02 at 5:29 PM, MirageKnight said:

Murmurs: The number of Thralls that players need to "mercy kill" to get Murmurs really ought to drop by half.

100% agree. The Thrall grind is just too much. Which is actually kind of odd to say, because I also end up with having to farm Thralls specifically to get the lich to spawn. I very much want to be able to actively go on the attack against my lich! Hopefully Empyrean gives us that route.

On 2019-11-02 at 5:29 PM, MirageKnight said:

- Requiem mods: Remove the "charge" mechanic completely (preferably) or at least allow players to recharge depleted mods with Kuva.

- Requiem Relics: Remove Kuva and Ayatan Amber Stars from the drop tables. I'd rather that Requiem mods drop by themselves, but that's never going to happen.

I think the charges would be fine if we could use kuva, or credits, or endo, or something to recharge the mods instead of being forced to get more. Of course, then... what do we do with the extras? Other than just having free Endo. Converting them to Kuva makes more sense, though.
I think they were just trying to make sure the Kuva fissures have a future, rather than just being one-and-done content. Which gets me to that second line.

Do not remove either from the drop table. The numerous people who do play with Rivens are actually glad to have so many alternate paths to collect Kuva. It's also the case that numerous people struggle with Ayatan stars (not me, I have plenty somehow, but that might not last).

I would rather see an alternative path to grabbing Requiem mods, if this concern is addressed at all.

Frankly, I'm not sure going with an extra tier of fissures and a new type of relic, completely separate from everything else we do with the kuva lich, was the right route to take, but we're already here. It's harder to step back from a bad idea than to move forward into one. I think it's better to find a way to make it work - which is why I'm glad they made Thralls capable of dropping Requiem Relics.

On 2019-11-02 at 5:29 PM, MirageKnight said:

- Tax / Tribute system: Either remove the ability to tax us or rework pickups so that you pick up only 50-75% of what you'd normally get, to represent the Lich nemesis and its forces pillaging the area.

I agree the tax needs to go. It's just a purely negative experience. I'm not losing my cool over it, but I also recognize that it adds nothing positive to the player experience. It's supposedly meant to be incentive to take down our lich, give us a feeling of vengeance, and replace the traditional loot drop from a boss kill.

None of which really works out in the end.

If they're insistent on keeping the tax, then I would love to have a special kuva lich mission where we can raid, say, a supply depot of theirs and forcibly take our stuff back without having to specifically kill our lich. This would be a fun way to add in some more lore to it, mind you, but is less desirable than simply removing the tax.

On 2019-11-02 at 5:29 PM, MirageKnight said:

Lich nemesis system in general: Give players the option of extending a "peace offering" to their Lich nemesis so that it will go away and leave the player alone. In addition, Lich "candidates" / Larvalings should be Commander / Eximus units, not normal troops...The "Old Blood" should be a gift bestowed by the Worm Queen and her lackeys to important Grineer they don't want to lose. Also, for a system that requires the player to have finished The War Within, the Operator's part in all this is notably absent. Honestly, it's fantastic that using the Operator to help defeat a Lich nemesis hasn't been forced on us and I'm extremely grateful for that, but it would be nice if using the Operator had a small part in the proceedings. 

I have suggested before that this is exactly what we need - I don't think it's originated by any one person. A peace treaty option that persuades the lich to leave us alone and go bother somebody else, or at least temporarily leave us alone. It could work as, say, bribing the lich with kuva to go away. Maybe it can even be the case that killing the lich later steals back all the kuva spent on that treaty - the whole point is that our Parazon "extracts" kuva from the lich, right?

The War Within is required because kuva. It's not a substance mentioned or used until then. I do agree it would be nifty to use the Operator somehow, but it's kinda hard to add it in to what is already in place. Maybe the Operator could have some special effect on the lich that makes it easier to fight, but anything added at this point would just feel like an unneeded gimmick.

With the Larvling situation, I can take it or leave it. What you say makes sense, though. We're told they're "chosen" by the Queen, but these just seem like they selected a worthless drone, did science experiments on it, and threw them at us as fodder.

On 2019-11-02 at 5:29 PM, MirageKnight said:

Lich Nemesis system "opt-in": It's certainly better now than it was on Day 1 of release, but a better solution would be to have it as a quest that can be run multiple times. Activating the quest generates a nemesis unit that has been given orders to hunt you and other Tenno down...but it isn't a Lich yet. "Killing" the nemesis triggers its retrieval and conversion into a "Lich", whereupon it resumes its hunt for the player.

Yes, that would make more sense. I think it would be more interesting if it was a repeatable quest mission set in the kuva fortress where we infiltrate a kuva harvesting facility, maybe with the main objective of stealing a bunch of kuva or shutting down their operation, and we end up having to kill a larvling in the process. Which obviously backfires as it results in a lich.

Edited November 26, 2019 by DrakeWurrum

[DrakeWurrum]

 

On 2019-11-22 at 4:44 PM, Tinklzs said:

What I don't understand is it's called a kuva lich, that gives no kuva.

Actually, they do now, as of the update that came out with the Dry Dock. Even if you fail to kill them, the whole team gets kuva from them.

[MirageKnight]

On 2019-11-24 at 12:02 AM, DrakeWurrum said:

*snipped for brevity*

Thanks for the well-thought out response and suggestions - have an upvote 🙂

On 2019-11-24 at 12:02 AM, DrakeWurrum said:

Even if you fail to kill them, the whole team gets kuva from them.

And if you don't need / want Kuva, oh well.

I think at this point in time, DE's resolved to bug fix the Lich nemesis system and anything attached to it as is deemed necessary...they've pretty much called it - feature-wise - a day until Railjack gets up and running.

That being said, we need to continue to request more inclusive and immersive features for the LIch nemesis system. It has a great deal of potential and I'd like to engage in it more, but not in the state that it's in right now.

[sam686]

Have 3 known requiem
+ high level enemies
+ requiem failed
+ risk of some items "stolen"
+ cannot change mods while in mission
== I will Abort mission to save time and to change mods. Sometimes I forgot to change requiem mods if I wait to complete mission.

The known requiem in profile is moving around every few seconds. Hard to see moving symbols, moves too frequently that I have to screenshot and look at screenshot to have the known requiem symbols stay in 1 spot.

On 2019-11-18 at 9:47 AM, MirageKnight said:

This punishing feature needs to be pulled. Players should not die when they've got the wrong code sequence nor should the LIch level up.

I agree, death of failed requiem are annoying and bad, it can fail the mission with no more lives left.

Here is how I survive failed requiem in multiplayer squad. Be a client, use action and transference at the same time.

 

[DrakeWurrum]

On 2019-11-25 at 4:41 PM, MirageKnight said:

And if you don't need / want Kuva, oh well.

To be fair, I think it's a bit silly to avoid Rivens entirely at this point. I can understand the thinking, don't get me wrong. I don't mess with Rivens as hard as others do. If I get some interesting ones, I'll roll them and try to see if I can fit them on the weapon, but I don't go desperately hunting down a Riven for my favorite guns to squeeze out every bit of performance possible, either. Sure as hell ain't gonna throw plat at them.
I just think it's silly to NOT get what Rivens you can and make use of them. Gear is gear, and Rivens are just one more progression path.

I don't need kuva simply because I have tons of it and don't spend it fast enough to run out. So I sort of feel ya on the "oh well" bit. The liches definitely need to be more rewarding for simply fighting them, let alone actually killing them.

Hell, I kinda wish the liches dropped Requiem mods directly when we fail to kill them. At least that could maybe help push lich progression forward.

On 2019-11-25 at 4:41 PM, MirageKnight said:

I think at this point in time, DE's resolved to bug fix the Lich nemesis system and anything attached to it as is deemed necessary...they've pretty much called it - feature-wise - a day until Railjack gets up and running.

That being said, we need to continue to request more inclusive and immersive features for the LIch nemesis system. It has a great deal of potential and I'd like to engage in it more, but not in the state that it's in right now.

Also, I think they aren't tweaking kuva lich too hard because it's actually part of Empyrean. Old Blood feels like it's a partial system, not the whole thing. Remember what they showed us at Tennocon - so it feels like they gave us a small piece of Empyrean early as a means to field test it and get some feedback on it before the whole thing is actually launched - separating the kuva lich component and the space battle component, making feedback easier to gather and understand.

I don't think they've "called it" or given up. I think they're just laser-focused on the big enchilada that is finally about to be in our hands, plus New War appears to strongly tie in to what Empyrean is giving us.
It's a complicated series of updates, and I don't envy them for the work that it all takes, let alone the kneejerk responses the community is giving.

In short, yes, I hope and expect that they will continue to work on making the kuva lich desirable content, especially since they intend to release liches for the Corpus and Infested. (maybe even... Sentients? Scary thought)

Because from what I can tell, they intend for this to be a big deal, (to the point that Steve is practically suffering anxiety attacks over it from what I can tell) perhaps even a form of endgame, and uh... if they can't get this all to work well, liches and melee 3.0 and Empyrean, the community will pull away for other games.

23 hours ago, sam686 said:

Hard to see moving symbols, moves too frequently that I have to screenshot and look at screenshot to have the known requiem symbols stay in 1 spot.

O_o What? I do think it's weird to have them moving like that, but... you can just mouse over them and read the name quickly.

Edited November 26, 2019 by DrakeWurrum

[MirageKnight]

1 hour ago, DrakeWurrum said:

I don't need kuva simply because I have tons of it and don't spend it fast enough to run out. So I sort of feel ya on the "oh well" bit. The liches definitely need to be more rewarding for simply fighting them, let alone actually killing them.

Hell, I kinda wish the liches dropped Requiem mods directly when we fail to kill them. At least that could maybe help push lich progression forward.

Agreed 🙂

With regard to my comment on DE leaving the system alone until the rest of Railjack hits, I honestly think they should have waited until the rest of Empyrean was ready to ship.

Even with the tweaks and fixes that have been coming out. It really does feel undercooked and rushed.

 

[CorerMaximus]

Holy hell- yes, yes, YES! All those suggestions are spot on!

[MirageKnight]

So for now and according to Devstream #134...the Lich system is going to be completely ignored. It's "finished" for the time being. They said that they have more important things like Empyrean and the New War to work on.

Called it.

Anyway...First, they're not going to change the "stab and die" mechanic. On the stream today, Steve said they wanted to provide something that could "kick your butt for a change because you kill everyone."

What? Seriously? That's not challenge, that's arbitrary bullS#&$. And a fair number of us hate it because it's unfair. We win a fight, but then lose it because the game says "you need some humility." How about you turn down the player-side power creep a couple of notches and allow enemies to be more challenging if you want to see our butts kicked more often? You created the "lack of challenge" monster, DE...not us. We're just using the tools YOU gave us. If those tools are broken, that's completely on you.

Secondly, with regard to players being saddled with a Lich Nemesis they don't want, there was a little talk about allowing the NPC Paladino to get of or "de-spell" a Lich for you once a week.

Yeah, at this point I'm not touching LIches ever again and I'm even more disappointed with DE than before.

They listened to feedback and once again blew it off with a hand wave and lip service.

 

[Aldain]

Just now, MirageKnight said:

First, they're not going to change the "stab and die" mechanic. On the stream today, Steve said they wanted to provide something that could "kick your butt for a change because you kill everyone."

What? Seriously? That's not challenge, that's arbitrary bullS#&$. And a fair number of us hate it because it's unfair. We win a fight, but then lose it because the game says "you need some humility." How about you turn down the player-side power creep a couple of notches and allow enemies to be more challenging if you want to see our butts kicked more often? You created the "lack of challenge" monster, DE...not us. We're just using the tools YOU gave us. If those tools are broken, that's completely on you.

At least Railjacks are looking interesting and multi-layered...though I don't see myself ever making a Lich even after it hits Switch thanks to that choice.

If DE wants to hold a grudge with leaving in bad design choices I won't bother with it, at least with Empyrean I won't have to worry about playing Russian Roulette with my Drydock because RNG = Challenge for whatever reason.

[Tinklzs]

33 minutes ago, Aldain said:

At least Railjacks are looking interesting and multi-layered...though I don't see myself ever making a Lich even after it hits Switch thanks to that choice.

If DE wants to hold a grudge with leaving in bad design choices I won't bother with it, at least with Empyrean I won't have to worry about playing Russian Roulette with my Drydock because RNG = Challenge for whatever reason.

That you know of. 

 I think with DE being so nonchalant and dismissive of constructive criticisms/ideas for TOB, I fear Empyrean, which relies in part with TOB, isn't going to fair very well either.

[MirageKnight]

You know what really cheeses me off about today's stream? Steve's condescending and dismissive attitude.

DE's clearly looked at this thread and others like it, saw us reasonably complaining about how Lich roulette is bad FOR THREE WEEKS, and Steve essentially said "I don't care. It's not happening. We're too busy with other things anyway."

Right now, I feel like all the effort I went into making this thread and supporting other threads in the attempt to make the Lich Nemesis system more bearable and interesting was for nothing.

I swear, if there's similar BS treatment and regard for player concerns when Empyrean hits and there's a major issue (you know there will be one), I will goddamn riot.

Edited December 7, 2019 by MirageKnight

[Sunder]

4 hours ago, MirageKnight said:

I swear, if there's similar BS treatment and regard for player concerns when Empyrean hits and there's a major issue (you know there will be one), I will goddamn riot.

Just do what I do. Avoid the game mode entirely, and warn all new players from interacting with it at all. I for one want to see this game grow and evolve. We need players and people to constantly come into the game, talk about the game, and invite others. But I also don't want them to see the horrible mechanics that were seemingly rushed into the game to appease some idea of a nemesis system, then get annoyed at it and just leave entirely. I mean seriously....try explaining that to someone.

"Ok you cleared a bunch of story missions, you're decently equipped, and have fought hard up till now....but now we introduce you to Kuva LIches.

1. Go do some level 20+ missions and hope RNG spawns you a Kuva Larva enemy
2. Run Kuva siphon missions and hope RNG drops you a relic corrupted by kuva.
3. Good! Now run a fissure mission and hope RNG drops you a requiem mod. What are they? I dunno. No lore provided.
4. Better hope that RNG is feeling lucky and gave you the RIGHT requiem mod!
5. Run more missions to farm thralls and assassinate them to learn what "Phrases" you need. How do you learn that from them? Dunno, no lore provided.
6. Run some more missions and get your Lich to spawn and hope RNG is kind to you in that you put the words in the right order
   • You did? GREAT! Now do it all over again.
   • BTW each weapon needs to be leveled multiple times like Paracesis. Why? Dunno. 
   • or
   • You didn't? Oh well. You're dead. No you can't fight back or prevent it. Regardless how far you've come in the story or prepared you were. 

It's a flawed system that DE had to cut back on for some reason or another. They pulled a Peter Molyneux move and promised too much, too quick. I understand the TennoCon preview was just an idea fleshed out in-game but damn....if we got even some basic changes to the Lich system I'd play and grind away like I've done with everything else in the game. 

This nonsense though? No thanks. DE can keep their Lich stuff.

Edited December 7, 2019 by Sunder

[MirageKnight]

1 minute ago, Sunder said:

Just do what I do. Avoid the game mode entirely, and warn all new players from interacting with it at all.

Oh I have...and I really hate having to do it.

1 minute ago, Sunder said:

I for one want to see this game grow and evolve.

Likewise, but the way things are going...the future looks pretty grim. I just hope this is a temporary trend.

Thanks for popping by.

[Sunder]

43 minutes ago, MirageKnight said:

I just hope this is a temporary trend.

Makes me think of Peter Molyneux and "Fable".

How much was teased and promised. How it was hyped up and how it failed to deliver. Just really makes me weary of future updates. As though I shouldn't board any sort of hype-train from here on out. Fearful that I'm just gonna get a stripped down version with more basic features we already had in game. Nothing really...."new" and "unique".

[--Aegis--Dandy]

Great post! Thank you for taking the time to write this out.

One other issue I have is how Liches can spawn over 500m behind you, forcing you and your squad to backtrack during your mission. I don't see why the spawn mechanics couldn't be similar to the Stalker or Syndicate escorts in terms of location.

Edited December 7, 2019 by --Aegis--Dandy

[(PSN)Nyamiche]

After watching the de stream and DE Steve saying they’re keeping the rock-paper-suicide mechanic ingame, I’ve uninstalled warframe. I urge fellow players who don’t like this system to either do the same, or just don’t spend your money with DE.  Hit em’ in their pockets and they’ll listen.  They don’t intend to change this, regardless of the majority of the community’s dissatisfaction with the current rock-paper-suicide “Lich” RNG loot box system.  Maybe someone can contact Jim Sterling, his video on the old prime vault changed their model to what it currently is after all.

[Paradoxity]

2 hours ago, MirageKnight said:

DE's clearly looked at this thread and others like it, saw us reasonably complaining about how Lich roulette is bad FOR THREE WEEKS, and Steve essentially said "I don't care. It's not happening. We're too busy with other things anyway."

Nah, I mean, I kinda like it. Now I can go nah, I don't think I'll cop that plat or engage with this whole lich mess because it's as bad a turdburger as archwing was/is. 

 

Maybe in like 4-5 years it'll be revisited. Guess we'll see! 

[EinheriarJudith]

2 hours ago, Sunder said:

 

1. Go do some 20+ missions and hope RNG spawns you a Kuva Larva enemy

i agree with everything you've said except this. 20+ missions to spawn a larva? since when? i can barely go 2 without spawnning one.

Edited December 7, 2019 by EinheriarJudith