D.E. Need to stop pushing out half broken updates.

[Kimimoto]

On 2019-11-05 at 10:15 AM, 40PE said:

Please raise your standards D.E.!

Took em three years for this update. If were waiting until it's good enough, then we're waiting forever...

[40PE]

2 hours ago, Fallen77 said:

Soooo easy to say right ?

I'm in IT industry I know what I'm talking about. Project management, project goals, timeline, etc. And that is the basic part of it. Look up six sigma or ITIL and you will understand what I'm talking about.

In game industry there are just no similar project managements going on, you know why? Because rule number one is the goal that the customer want is the project's root. Do you think ANY of the game companies really listen to the customer (gamer) complaints? If something need a lot of work to fix or change, I never ever saw in my life developers go after that particular mass-requested feature or bug fix... because for free, they wont go back to the beginning and start spending even months on fixing some serious flar, or desing bottleneck.
This is not just D.E., its all the game dev. industry.

But doable, for sure. Look at every serious industry, with insane production, like car industry, airplane industry, etc. Everything is doable, everything. Just the question do you really want to spend that much time and resources for a particular goal?

2 hours ago, Fallen77 said:

Fps issues at launch => fix your computer

Aaand you played yourself, thank you.

Like suddenly my machine broke. just after U26. Ohh and the other dozens of games are running just fine, except WF. Ohh man why do I bother...

Edited November 10, 2019 by 40PE

[Ace-Bounty-Hunter]

5 hours ago, Eklectus said:

 

Saying something positive, and going out and saying that DE has the highest standards of all game devs in the past twenty years are very different things.

When you compare them to the multitude of "AAA" developers that are pushing out broken. no effort. microtransaction laden garbage on a yearly basis. DE are the Holy Grail in the cesspit that is known as the video game industry.

Edited November 10, 2019 by Ace-Bounty-Hunter

[Eklectus]

5 hours ago, Ace-Bounty-Hunter said:

When you compare them to the multitude of "AAA" developers that are pushing out broken. no effort. microtransaction laden garbage on a yearly basis. DE are the Holy Grail in the cesspit that is known as the video game industry.

Microtransactions weren't even a thing 20 years ago. However, even if you just take the last 10-5 years into account, there's still other devs that deliver content of significantly higher quality than seen in WF.

[White_Matter]

On 2019-11-05 at 6:18 PM, (XB1)TyeGoo said:

DE and raising their standards ahahahaha 😂😂😂

Sorry for being toxic.

What he said. 

 

[(PSN)ChaosTheNerd]

4 hours ago, Ace-Bounty-Hunter said:

When you compare them to the multitude of "AAA" developers that are pushing out broken. no effort. microtransaction laden garbage on a yearly basis. DE are the Holy Grail in the cesspit that is known as the video game industry.

De is better than them by only a little bit they still make the same braindead decisions at alot of times.

[AzureTerra]

10 hours ago, 40PE said:

I'm in IT industry I know what I'm talking about. Project management, project goals, timeline, etc. And that is the basic part of it. Look up six sigma or ITIL and you will understand what I'm talking about.

 

Im sure you are, answering phones has to be done in every industry.

What DE do, be it fix bugs or release slightly broken patches there will be people whining about it, its what people do. Because it will happen if they do as the OP wants and slams the brakes on to fix all the niggling little things they are complaining about then there will be significantly more whining about lack of stuff to do. 

It is better to have a constant flow of updates and and accept that there may be things that don't quite work, nothing that was listed in the other post is gamebreaker, annoyance maybe sure but you can actually play.

Edited November 11, 2019 by AzureTerra

[DatDarkOne]

13 hours ago, 40PE said:

I'm in IT industry I know what I'm talking about.

Really now.

13 hours ago, 40PE said:

Look up six sigma or ITIL

ITIL is a set of overly long books to describe describe something that can really be said in about 2 or 3 sentences.  How it relates to IT is to show the value of IT to the bean counters in the Boardrooms.  It has nothing to do with actually KNOWING anything about IT or how to fix things.  

Now for you to try and apply ITIL standards to gaming and game development shows that you might not understand ITIL as well as you may think you do.  Why, because the main goal of ITIL doesn't fit the gaming industry or software development.

 

[Flameduel]

On 2019-11-05 at 8:15 AM, 40PE said:

-Rushing an update its a D.E.-s Think / Or they are just late as they probably planned for release much much earlier.
-Trying to advertise weeks prior and then every second third day new ad for the upcoming update: Builds an unnecessary tension and stress for everyone.

But the worse is:
-Bringing out an update near the end of the week when for two days there are no support, no updates for bugs and issues, is just plain bad choice.

Please D.E. Stop this mess. This is not the first time it happened, and not even the second! You don't learn from your mistakes, yes these are BIG mistakes!

Kindly asking you stop this behavior, just stress test more, spend 1-2 more weeks fixing issues and then release on the beginning of the week, monday, latest tuesday!

Thanks and I hope everyone agrees. It just gives a bad wibe for the game, we get very frustrated (I know I got frustrated with the fps issue, and the no requiem relics in Kuva Flood). these are uncalled for, game breaking issues that should not be in the game anymore, after an update releases.

Please raise your standards D.E.!
 

I mean, it is a BETA for a reason. While yes this is not a super good excuse for most things, releasing content when we complain of a content drout and then complain saying they should have waited longer is kind of a *@##$ slap to DE don't you think? (not saying you do this, but think of their position where there IS a lot of players saying it because a lot of their content creators are telling their fans there is a drought). At least give them props for finally giving us content that SHOULD last longer than a week. This is not a special event, idk why people are treating it like one. It's not like Nigh wave where you have 9 weeks or whatever to do, you have until further notice time of working on it. If you don't like the grind of doing the same thing over and over again to get new weapons, then don't. Go to Hydron over and over again to level your weapons instead, that is very different.

Edit: I forgot to add: though I do agree doing it at the beginning of the week would have been better, it might have been the case that was their plan and then a game breaking bug came out so they did it on the next available day when it was patched, but I do see your point there

Edited November 11, 2019 by Flameduel

[40PE]

You know, while we constantly arguing, we have a very bugged update, for a week (or two can't even remember now), on many levels, both technical both gameplay.

Back to square one: If D.E. don't change the update process, the methods the testing and the goals, we constantly tearing our hear out after updates are out. While we want to play the game, we constantly having bugs, non-working features.

THAT IS THE BOTTOM LINE. STOP DEFENDING THEM THIS IS LIKE 6 YEARS AND EVERY UPDATE WAS LIKE THIS (as far as I can remember). THIS IS NOT NORMAL.

D.E. Need to change how and in what form they want to release the new updates.

I personally fed up having graphical issues right now, and the fact that every second Kuva Flood gives no requiem relic. That's a new U26 experience, between awesome ideas regarding kuva lich and CRAZY AMOUNT OF GRIND. IT IS GRIND BY DESIGN.

Sorry for caps sorry for red text, but arguing about my views and bashing my IT knowledge (lol at the last one), while we play the BrokenFrame is just … silly. Don't try to prove that D.E. does it right, they don't, I'm not arguing about them working hard! I'm ASKING for different outcome and views on update methodology!

[Ace-Bounty-Hunter]

21 hours ago, Eklectus said:

Microtransactions weren't even a thing 20 years ago. However, even if you just take the last 10-5 years into account, there's still other devs that deliver content of significantly higher quality than seen in WF.

Do those other devs operate on a completely f2p business model though?

[Ephemiel]

On 2019-11-05 at 1:51 PM, Shinigami_Greed said:

The mistake you made was thinking I expect anything, or have anything to gain from saying so.  This is what I believe.  DE is open with us, they're goddamn funny, and I haven't genuinely enjoyed a game like I've enjoyed Warframe before.

You know, you can pretend that you're not clearly bought out by them you know. If ANY of this was true, players and partners wouldn't be leaving in droves.

[Ephemiel]

8 hours ago, 40PE said:

THAT IS THE BOTTOM LINE. STOP DEFENDING THEM

You're telling the white knights of the Warframe community not to worship the ground DE steps on, that is never gonna happen.

[Eklectus]

1 hour ago, Ace-Bounty-Hunter said:

Do those other devs operate on a completely f2p business model though?

bUt ItS a FreE tO pLaY!!!

Yeah, no. Whether or not the business operates on a free to play model is utterly irrelevant here. Our little shill made a broad statement concerning all game devs, not just F2P ones.

Edited November 11, 2019 by Eklectus

[Shinigami_Greed]

1 hour ago, Ephemiel said:

You know, you can pretend that you're not clearly bought out by them you know. If ANY of this was true, players and partners wouldn't be leaving in droves.

And I can also pretend like you're not a joke, but I'm not in the business of lying.

[Ace-Bounty-Hunter]

41 minutes ago, Eklectus said:

bUt ItS a FreE tO pLaY!!!

Yeah, no. Whether or not the business operates on a free to play model or not is utterly irrelevant here. Our little shill made a broad statement concerning all game devs, not just F2P ones.

Honestly, I don't find that statement too far-fetched. Especially with these once prestigious developers now pumping out utter trash these days. Bethesda with Fallout 76. Bioware with Anthem. Bungie with Destiny 2. (Yeah, I think Destiny 2 sucks. Deal with it!) etc etc.

But please enlighten me as to what developers you think are delivering consistently high quality content.

Edited November 11, 2019 by Ace-Bounty-Hunter

[Eklectus]

6 minutes ago, Ace-Bounty-Hunter said:

Honestly, I don't find that statement too far-fetched. Especially with these once prestigious developers now pumping out utter trash these days. Bethesda with Fallout 76. Bioware with Anthem. Bungie with Destiny 2. (Yeah, I think Destiny 2 sucks. Deal with it!) etc etc.

But please enlighten me as to what developers you think are delivering consistently high quality content.

Firaxis, Red Hook Studios, Hare Brained Schemes, CDPR, Obsidian, Troika, Ludeon, Arkane Studios...

Funny that you mention Destiny though, since, no matter whether you like it or not, it's vastly more polished than Warframe (and, you know, an actually finished product).

[Loza03]

It's not like players are entirely innocent, as 'content drought' complaints are frequent, usually forgetting that content on the scale they want usually takes a very long time to do. A very, very long time.

A not inconsiderable amount of the people who complain about content drought and long for days when DE would bring out lots of smaller updates also poo poo any such smaller updates, like the Quatz Collection. Remember that? Tenno reinforcement, just as they used to do them. No hype, no fanfare, no announcement months in advance, just 'hey here's some stuff'. And nobody gave a damn.

Simply put, DE is stuck between a rock and a hard place. When they try to please people by bringing out their big updates as fast as possible? You get updates like Old Blood, Sacrifice, PoE - things that are (with a little tweaking and balancing) solid foundations that are rarely built upon to produce a full update.

[Ikusias]

DE so far proved itself unable to release sustainable content - to say content that the players want to engage with again and again because it's actually enjoyable and not boring/repetitive.

Kuva liches are a major disappointment in this area: instead of adding murmur discovery to tasks that are part of regular or improved gameplay, we got a grind for special units in nodes isolated from standard gameplay, rinse and repeat until the lich is defeated, same for the next lich and the next and the next again if you haven't uninstalled the game...

Sanctuary Onslaught, Index, Defection, the mission shipped with Nidus... all content with no further interest after farming parts or resources for the current frame...

[AshenHaze]

On 2019-11-05 at 8:21 AM, (PS4)Akuma_Asura_ said:

What would you rather do as a company ? 
 

A.) Push out half finish content/systems & see quick booms in profit. 
 

B.) Fix quality of life problems & complete old incomplete systems? 
 

bottomline Warframe has many many things that are incomplete, & you’re asking for the impossible . PvP was left behind for one example. Channeling also left behind 

Problem is, I'm a "Farmer" by salesman profile. When I was still in a sales industry with commission, I would focus more on relationships with my clients and make sure I was tending to my current clients. My growth rate is steady and my loss rate is lower than average.

Companies definitely prefer "Hunter" profiles. The types of people who will do anything to get a sale. Their growth is insanely high but they also lose a lot, the variance is like a steep roller coaster of ups and downs.

I'm not sure why, economically, the second is preferred. But I guess that's why in my industry I went from office to office before finally getting frustrated and quitting. This is the world we live in, people prefer sudden numbers with huge drawbacks over consistency. Gives me conniptions.

[Ace-Bounty-Hunter]

1 hour ago, Eklectus said:

Firaxis, Red Hook Studios, Hare Brained Schemes, CDPR, Obsidian, Troika, Ludeon, Arkane Studios...

Funny that you mention Destiny though, since, no matter whether you like it or not, it's vastly more polished than Warframe (and, you know, an actually finished product).

You actually believe Destiny is a finished product? 🤣

And if I recall correctly. Not one of those other studios you listed have developed a f2p live service game. So, way to compare apples to oranges there.

[Fire2box]

The only reason DE rushes out updates that are broken (Example: UI being 100% removed when lich mods are being tested to where only the big overlay map and chat works.) is simply because they feel they need to get a update out. Before the Old Blood the last major content update (just a new frame doesn't count imho) we got was the introduction of disruption and ropalyst which coincidence with Wisp release.

Even though this update has been broken and still is badly broken in parts like the UI bug, even plain just not fun when you want the kuva weapons and only get dupe after dupe. It was certainly needed on behalf of the community. Plus even if someone doesn't want to do lich stuff, they don't have to now. Even if you make a lich you can leave it's starting region alone and it's region won't expand. 

Edited November 11, 2019 by Fire2box

[Eklectus]

1 hour ago, Ace-Bounty-Hunter said:

You actually believe Destiny is a finished product? 🤣

Considering it doesn't feel like the entire game is held together with spit, duct-tape and hope, yes, I do.

1 hour ago, Ace-Bounty-Hunter said:

And if I recall correctly. Not one of those other studios you listed have developed a f2p live service game. So, way to compare apples to oranges there.

 

On 2019-11-06 at 4:20 AM, Shinigami_Greed said:

DE has the highest standards of any game dev I've followed in the last twenty years, barring choice people from Nintendo, Capcom, or Namco.

And even if you use the 6-7 years edit, most of the companies I've listed have still released content of significantly higher quality in that timeframe.

[Shinigami_Greed]

4 hours ago, Eklectus said:

Firaxis, Red Hook Studios, Hare Brained Schemes, CDPR, Obsidian, Troika, Ludeon, Arkane Studios...

Funny that you mention Destiny though, since, no matter whether you like it or not, it's vastly more polished than Warframe (and, you know, an actually finished product).

Oh boy, lets break this down.

Firaxis: Civ and X-COM.  Not a fan, not particularly high quality last I played of either.

Red Hook Studios: Darkest Dungeon.  Neat game, but completely different and not comparable.  Tis like comparing apples, and pizza.

Hare Brained Schemes: Whole buncha games I've barely heard of.  Again, by and large completely different games from Warframe.

CDPR:  There's a big one.  The Witcher series, and Cyberpunk 2077.  Kind of an unfair comparison at this point, but both the Witcher and Warframe have more than their fair share of bugs, and I'm sure Cyberpunk, for all it's hype, will be no different.

Obsidian: New Vegas was good but buggy, and The Outer Worlds response has been mixed.  Also, literally everyone I know would rather pirate it than use Epic's store, so... I have no platform to stand on there.  Least Warframe isn't on Epic's storefront, yuck.

Troika:  Nothing impressive in recent memory, but I am looking forward to Bloodlines 2.  Considering how much patching Bloodlines 1 took to be passable, you're leaning on a game that isn't out yet for this one.

Ludeon:  Rimworld, I guess?  Even a cursory look tells me this is a completely different game with different design philosophy than Warframe.

Arkane Studios:  Dishonored, and Prey.  Wolfenstein.  Eh, alright stuff.  Dishonored was buggy as hell, though, which isn't surprising considering the parent company.

None of this is "significantly higher" quality than Warframe. 

Edited November 11, 2019 by Shinigami_Greed

[Learicorn]

On 2019-11-05 at 12:20 PM, Shinigami_Greed said:

DE has the highest standards of any game dev I've followed in the last six or seven years since they've been around, barring choice people from Nintendo, Capcom, or Namco.

ok bootlicker