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[DE]Megan

The Old Blood: Hotfix 26.0.4 + 26.0.4.1

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Melee state doesn't feel very good to get into or get out of.  Can we adjust it so that if we shoot, we leave melee state? Right now if I'm in melee state and I hit the keybind for shooting a gun, nothing happens.  It's very jarring to hit a button expecting something to happen and it doesn't. 

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Larvling Lich creation will be truly opt-in.

That is not a good change. The Kuva Lich system has a ton of problems like the extreme Murmur farm, Death as part of the core gameplay loop and a questionable stealing mechanic (irrelevant for veterans and needlessly punishing for newer players). But making it opt-in doesn't solve any of its problems. it goes completely against the design philosophy you announced for Empyrean: Connection.

The Lich system was too seperate to begin with, with it only being active on seperate nodes. But cutting it off even more will just make it one of the islands Steve said at Tennocon 2019 you don't want to do anymore. The moment people got all the weapons, most will simply ignore the Liches and never see them again. I mean why ould you try to get a harder bossfight for no rewards? In addition to that it takes the flavor of the system away. The Stalker doesn't ask you if he can invade your missions. The Wolf didn't call to make an appointment and Syndicate squads also crash in no matter if its convenient for the player or not. Why? Because they are your enemies. They want to get rid off you. And the Grineer throw Larvlings at you in hopes you kill them "the right way" to create a Lich? That does not exactly make sense.

To be in line with connecting all gameplay parts of Warframe it would make more sense to make the system less annoying and more fun to interact with. At the cost of people not being able to ask "Will you be my Nemesis?"

  • Create a Lich when you get killed. Let's be honest: That makes it opt-in for most players as many people don't exactly die often. And if a Grineer kills a Tenno I think they get the attention of the Queens to be upgraded. It would fit so much better than Larvlings to be honest. Also it makes you care a bit more about the Lich, as you have at least a bit of history with them.
  • Deouple the Lichs from their nodes: Lichs should invade you like the Stalker, their Thralls like Syndicate squads.
  • No Opting out: Liches conquer nodes and even there they are only active when you specifically chose to play their nodes.Instead of doing it like that you shouldn't have a choice. A lich has a node? Well. You will have to deal with them there.
  • Stealing: The most sensible fix for now would be to make sure they only steal from nodes they have control over, not from whole planets. Like that you have the option to clear the node if you don't want to risk to have anything stolen when doing a Sortie or something else there.
  • Murmurs: Instead of making death part of the gameplay loop of Liches, make it so we unlock a special Lich-Assassination-Mission after we kill the Lich with all 3 Murmurs. Until then we are able to kill them temporarely to get part of our stolen stuff back. Would also make sure that their lines about dying over and over make more sense.
  • Rewards: Make killing the Lich more rewarding. Maybe a big chunk of Kuva for Vanquishing / Converting, small chunks of Kuva for temporarely killing them out side of the proposed assassination.

When you make it opt in now it seems like that will never change again in the future, closing the way to a more engaging and interesting Lich-System.

 

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I don't know if anyone else is experiencing this, but each time I start up the game, my frame rate becomes capped at 60, even though its set to default of 75. Fixing this requires me going into the display options and changing it to 60 and then back to 85, upon which it works properly. But even with this, my frame rate constantly drops and stutters on the star chart, loading in missions, and during certain crowded missions such as in Hydron. Sometimes it barely happens, other times the stutter is really noticeable and I lose half a second or more between frames. This never used to happen before the old blood update, and a fix to this would be nice. 

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Honestly, I didn't expect you folks to change Lich system to be truly opt-in. This is massive for me. As well as the ability to "absorb" the initial "weaker" Kuva weapon and all the previous formas, potatoes etc. will be saved. 

Now if you could please, in due time, fix the amp damage nerf or bug (not sure) that'd great! I'd feel like a powerful tenno again. I'm using 3-3-3 as far as I know and there is a clear damage reduction compared to a few months ago.

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b8RVtbw.jpg

 

Here is the problem: since new hotfix, the murmors are broken, and they give you the wrong mod needed. For this lich i had the first 2 murmors before the patch, and the 3rd one, after the patch. i had to try the fight 4 more times changing the last mod every time to kill him, meaning it is killable, but the murmors are wrong. After the patch all murmors are random, and so they become essentially useless

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58 minutes ago, notHunky said:

I try not to complain too much because I know the devs generally have a lot on their plate and provide so much for the game overall despite some controversy, but DE totally blew this last major update... and that's without even taking bugs into consideration.

Aside from Vauban and Ember reworks (most of which I do like so far), everything else is a complete dumpster fire.

  • Heavy attacks drain combo multipliers with no real reward. My normal attacks already work well enough for clearing out most rooms. If I'm going to build up combo multipliers and spend it on a heavy attack, it better cleave through every enemy in front of me within 15 meters for MASSIVE damage, otherwise it's not worth it.
  • Kuva liches are still too grindy even by Warframe standards. 3 LAYERS OF RNG IS NOT FUN!
  • Getting the last murmur should tell you the correct order of the mods OR having the right mods but the wrong order should just make the lich run away instead of instant killing you. Killing players for having the right mods in the wrong order is just bad game design which punishes the player for even trying.
  • The Grendel missions: enough said (which at this point I'm guessing is working as intended to force people to buy him).

I think I've used the heavy attack just once and then realized that I lost my entire 12x combo counter, so I simply unbound the key and haven't used it since. With blood rush as horribly nerfed as it is, that 12x counter is the only way I can even get orange crits with most weapons. losing it for just one slow attack seems like a pointless trade. 

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6 hours ago, [DE]Megan said:

Stockpiled Kuva Weapons: Receiving a better duplicate Kuva weapon after you’ve put work/Forma into an existing one can feel rather disappointing. With that in mind, we’re working on a “duplicate consumption” mechanic where you can combine 2 of the same Kuva weapons, thus transferring its buffs while preserving your Forma, Exilus, Potato, and Lens investment, ergo relieving you of your inner turmoil. 

  • An example for further clarification: everything you've done on Kuva Seer A will stay (Forma, Potato, Lens, Mod Configs, Appearance Configs, etc) when Kuva Seer B is consumed. The buff from Kuva Seer B will be passed onto Kuva Seer A, and Kuva Seer B will cease to exist in your Inventory.

Oh boy, I hope this means we can finally get Blast damage by combining a Cold bonus version with a Heat bonus version.
I am surprisingly hyped for that, let it be possible please.
~

6 hours ago, [DE]Megan said:

Larvling Lich creation will be truly opt-in. Some people want to see the world drown in Kuva and others just want to live a Lich free life! For those that don’t want to be hounded by a Kuva Lich, we’re changing the way Larvlings are killed in order to attain a Kuva Lich. Larvlings will have the same pre death setup as Thralls, except the Mercy action is only available to the player who damaged them last. At that point you either walk up and press X to initiate the Mercy (required for Kuva Lich creation), or just walk away and leave them to eventually die on their own after 15 seconds, thus opting out of Kuva Lich creation.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH!
I don't want to start Lich hunting till I got at least a few runes on hand.

~

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Loving the patch notes. I think the idea with combining kuva weapons is a great idea if done right.

Maybe make it so the one with the highest stat is used +1. So if you end up with a worse gun than you already are using you at least are getting something from it. For example: if you get a 40% fire gun, then next time you get the same gun with fire +30.. you combine to get 41%. This way you wouldn't feel cheated for having spent all that time just to end up with nothing. Also it means you can, like the symbols for farming lich's, get lucky and skip percentages if you get one better but if not, you still at least go up 1%. 

This would mean not only dupes have a use, but means a trading community could be created from people selling rubbish versions for people to 'power level' their own versions. This means people might even start using plat to skip the grind, which means more plat for DE sales 😉

Imagine: people can skip the grind with plat like most everything else in the game, or people can play and get it for free. Keeps the same mechanics as other things, but people who don't have the time, can pay to skip it. 🙂 Everyone wins! 😄 And finally 60% min-max guns won't be unobtainable by most people this way. The odds otherwise are.. well.. get a lottery ticket. 

Edited by LXY_Duckboy

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To be honest I didn't even realise I had these problems with the Kuva Liches :D Nice job and good thinking, thank you for the update :)

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11 minutes ago, Keksus said:

That is not a good change. The Kuva Lich system has a ton of problems like the extreme Murmur farm, Death as part of the core gameplay loop and a questionable stealing mechanic (irrelevant for veterans and needlessly punishing for newer players). But making it opt-in doesn't solve any of its problems. it goes completely against the design philosophy you announced for Empyrean: Connection.

The Lich system was too seperate to begin with, with it only being active on seperate nodes. But cutting it off even more will just make it one of the islands Steve said at Tennocon 2019 you don't want to do anymore. The moment people got all the weapons, most will simply ignore the Liches and never see them again. I mean why ould you try to get a harder bossfight for no rewards? In addition to that it takes the flavor of the system away. The Stalker doesn't ask you if he can invade your missions. The Wolf didn't call to make an appointment and Syndicate squads also crash in no matter if its convenient for the player or not. Why? Because they are your enemies. They want to get rid off you. And the Grineer throw Larvlings at you in hopes you kill them "the right way" to create a Lich? That does not exactly make sense.

To be in line with connecting all gameplay parts of Warframe it would make more sense to make the system less annoying and more fun to interact with. At the cost of people not being able to ask "Will you be my Nemesis?"

  • Create a Lich when you get killed. Let's be honest: That makes it opt-in for most players as many people don't exactly die often. And if a Grineer kills a Tenno I think they get the attention of the Queens to be upgraded. It would fit so much better than Larvlings to be honest. Also it makes you care a bit more about the Lich, as you have at least a bit of history with them.
  • Deouple the Lichs from their nodes: Lichs should invade you like the Stalker, their Thralls like Syndicate squads.
  • No Opting out: Liches conquer nodes and even there they are only active when you specifically chose to play their nodes.Instead of doing it like that you shouldn't have a choice. A lich has a node? Well. You will have to deal with them there.
  • Stealing: The most sensible fix for now would be to make sure they only steal from nodes they have control over, not from whole planets. Like that you have the option to clear the node if you don't want to risk to have anything stolen when doing a Sortie or something else there.
  • Murmurs: Instead of making death part of the gameplay loop of Liches, make it so we unlock a special Lich-Assassination-Mission after we kill the Lich with all 3 Murmurs. Until then we are able to kill them temporarely to get part of our stolen stuff back. Would also make sure that their lines about dying over and over make more sense.
  • Rewards: Make killing the Lich more rewarding. Maybe a big chunk of Kuva for Vanquishing / Converting, small chunks of Kuva for temporarely killing them out side of the proposed assassination.

When you make it opt in now it seems like that will never change again in the future, closing the way to a more engaging and interesting Lich-System.

 

No. The stealing this is not interesting and as many said, even with the changes, it punishes newer players while having literally no effect on veterans. You basically just said "anyone who wasn't playing before this update or got unlucky deserves to have all of the punishment" the opt in system is there for people who don't want to be forced into the tedious hyper grind of liches well before they are ready to start handling 50-110 level enemies. Nevermind the like 12 layers of RNG on top of the actual fight itself. Kuva is largely useless for a fair chunk of the playerbase as rivens are pointless UNLESS you get a god tier, at which point they become broken. The chances of actually getting a god tier riven are miniscule at best, and "you're never gonna see one for yourself" realistically.

You may not like it, but opt-in was the correct decision here. Now if they would move grendel and the other gameplay things from behind the arbitration gate. (Which they promised they wouldn't do in the first place mind) they'd be on a good track, especially for newer players who feel unjustly punished for these recent content drops.

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would like to request that if the bonus is greater than +5%, that it assume the new bonus, but if it is less than that it still offers +5% up to cap.  this means we are wasting much less time on lich farms.  what am I going to do with a kuva weapon with a +25 when I have a +45?  literally nothing, all that time wasted for nothing.

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Please make it so when a requiem is cracked that it shows how many of the rewards you already have.  With 10 different requiem mods, it's difficult to remember which one you might need.  Regular relic rewards show this, so requiems should also

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Any word on changes to the "charge" system that Requiem mods have? I really think this is a highly unnecessary grind to add to an already RNG heavy system, ontop of them being the face of a 835 Platinum priced bundle while being a consumable item with only a specific number of total uses. If not removing the charge system entirely, could we at least get the ability to invest Endo or Kuva into Requiem mods that have used up charges in order to recharge them so we don't have to go through the process of obtaining the specific ones we need again? I personally have a huge hoard of Endo that I have nothing to use on. I really don't like the idea of adding limited time use mods into the game, especially when the Kuva Lich system absolutely requires them.

Edited by DawnoftheWhiteFury
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1 minute ago, DawnoftheWhiteFury said:

Any word on changes to the "charge" system that Requiem mods have? I really think this is a highly unnecessary grind to add to an already RNG heavy system, ontop of them being the face of a 835 Platinum priced bundle while being a consumable item with only a specific number of total uses. If not removing the charge system entirely, could we at least get the ability to invest Endo into Requiem mods that have used up charges in order to recharge them so we don't have to go through the process of obtaining the specific ones we need again? I personally have a huge hoard of Endo that I have nothing to use on. I really don't like the idea of adding limited time use mods into the game, especially when the Kuva Lich system absolutely requires them.

Tbh, I thought they'd have used Kuva to charge them up

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Can we get a "Mute Vauban's Abilities" option in sound settings?  Being in defense missions with him is like walking a factory floor.

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29 minutes ago, Rolav said:

Melee state doesn't feel very good to get into or get out of.  Can we adjust it so that if we shoot, we leave melee state? Right now if I'm in melee state and I hit the keybind for shooting a gun, nothing happens.  It's very jarring to hit a button expecting something to happen and it doesn't. 

That's...uhm, the normal mode already you describe? Without manual block however...

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31 minutes ago, Rolav said:

Melee state doesn't feel very good to get into or get out of.  Can we adjust it so that if we shoot, we leave melee state? Right now if I'm in melee state and I hit the keybind for shooting a gun, nothing happens.  It's very jarring to hit a button expecting something to happen and it doesn't. 

That's what quick melee is for.

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1 minute ago, Vilinde said:

Being in defense missions with him is like walking a factory floor.

THIS!

Teslas Nervos balls are really annoying to hear when all are deployed and running around...and this is coming from a Vauban player.

Could we also speed them up a bit? it's hard for them at times to chase down enemies.

Thanks in advance.

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..thanks for getting to some 'fixes' in timely fashion Dev's..the liches,  🤷‍♀️ just confused, but ty all the same.

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I have come to the realization that I'll just have to live with how heavy attacks are completely worthless and melee sucks now. However, something needs to be done about the zenistar. The zenistar's disc mechanic is now pointless due to the disc's duration being based of of the heavy attack combo counter. The problem with this is that the use of the zenistar was to quickly deploy the disc and then use guns while the disc protects you from enemies that get too close/nullifier bubbles. Now I have to spend a good long while getting the disc ready, only to finally deploy it and my mobile defense target is over halfway done. Also, if I want to deploy the disc right away after it expires, then I will have to have had killed all the enemies with melee to bring the counter up, and I will have deployed the disc for nothing, or I won't be able to bring the counter up due to the disc killing all the enemies first and them not counting towards the combo meter. If the zenistar's disc damage builds the combo meter then at least part of this problem will be solved.

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