ikkabotz Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 I don't and find it a bit perplexing how conversations around some issues still are discussed in circles for years on forums (like "end game" for example). DE are pretty locked in on what this game is, people should be more acceptant of that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AuroraSonicBoom Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 (edited) Haven't seen this one posted, forgive me if it was. Light on the actual info, but might still be worth a watch. My take on it(not the point of the thread, no need to read, but I felt like getting it off my chest): Spoiler Something that surprised and disappointment me is how matter of factly Reb speaks about how DE sees grind and RNG to be fundamental to the game. They've accepted it as necessary evil, apparently. "Sure", you might say, "A free to play game has to entice the player to spend money somehow, even if its by frustrating them." I wont argue with the incentivizing of players to spend money, however, from the sound of it they dont seem to feel the need to innovate at all in this area. I dont mean innovate in the direction that is detrimental to the player base(i.e. additional random gear stat layer) but by making warframe a game that progress in through other means than an endless gear treadmill. I get the impression that is all the game is really seen as by DE, at least that's how it sounds, and looks to be, judging by recent updates. This interview only strengthens my assumption. When I started playing the game, I accepted the fact that weekly gear grind releases were a necessity to flesh out the game's core, but now, 7 years later, little has changed. It's still 95% about getting gear or mods, getting the MR, maxing out the few you like and dumping the rest. There's always the argument about one not playing the game if one doesnt like grind, but this usually dismisses any criticisms about the game's depth and intrinsic play value in favor of proving someone wrong just for the sake of it. The term grind also encompasses so many different aspects, from the kinds of goals to the methods, and the integration, that saying "dont play warframe if you dont like grind" would be akin to saying "dont eat Asian if you dont like rice" I always thought of warframe's progression as being envisioned with two complementary aspects. The in-world, non loot based progression, and the loot based progression, which DE has chosen to monetize. The former being a set of game mechanics that allow players to keep playing and changing themselves or the world on a meta level, while using the latter mechanics in order to improve their experiences in the former. I never expected DE to work on the former back in 2013 when they were struggling for survival, but at some point I was wondering why year after year nothing but differently dressed gear treadmills were getting released. There was no sign of working on systems non-loot based progression at all, and what few mechanics there are were even neutered in their effect on the game world(most notably invasion aftermaths). With this in mind, it's especially egregious to watch random stats on gear gradually make their way into the game more and more, taking away a player's distinct goal and replacing it with a fuzzy one to keep that gear grind going for as long as possible. If you think my ranting sounds suspiciously like many other posters' cry for some kind of endgame, you're not entirely wrong, just that I don't want some artificially difficult, coop forcing loot based dungeon like trials were, but an open to all gear and skill levels system that rewards players by making them feel agency on a game wide scale. Seeing this interview though, it looks like I'd be better off not waiting for anything of the sort. Edited January 25, 2020 by AuroraSonicBoom 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)SolarPhantom82 Posted January 25, 2020 Author Share Posted January 25, 2020 1 hour ago, (XB1)MandlorPrime said: This cat lololol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(XBOX)GearsMatrix301 Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 I mean the games Free 2 play. Having a grind creates more of an incentive to buy things in the game. The issue now is that DE majorly overstepped their boundaries with the Lich and Railjack grinds with things like Stacking 7 layers of RNG and RNG stats. Things that do not respect the time and effort the players put into the game. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luciole77 Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 (edited) lichs can be solo but railajck not.... I really hope DE fix railjack for solo experience! Play with co-op is....horrible thing. Need to low tasks in railjack..its sux to leave our chair to kill crews all the time and we get shot from all ships.... railjack rework now DE! Edited January 25, 2020 by Luciole77 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaotyke Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 1 hour ago, (XB1)MandlorPrime said: Omg, GTA V is just killing everyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yamazuki Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 Railjack parts and Kuva Lich weapons having random stats wouldn't be inherently bad if there were ways to just continuously increase them until they hit the cap. In the case of Railjack parts, excess parts and resources could have been used to optimize parts adding x.x% to the bonus. One could either keep rolling the dice, or just settle on something in the middle to upper range and just dump resources improving that instead. I don't like the whole just make things tradeable as a solution to the RNG, especially when their argument to justify the RNG is to make it feel like your own. It just makes it look like they want people either buying plat to skip the RNG, or just encourage people to play other content to get around RNG. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeMonkey Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 1 minute ago, Kaotyke said: Omg, GTA V is just killing everyone. What's the occasion? I know there were some new heists, but that was weeks ago I thought? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaotyke Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 Just now, DeMonkey said: What's the occasion? I know there were some new heists, but that was weeks ago I thought? Its the casino. The roulette... The horses, the blackjacks, the slot machines, the loot boxes, the surpise mechanics, the kinder eggs... They just make people go back... Or maybe its because its on sale right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(XBOX)YoungGunn82 Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 (edited) 12 minutes ago, Kaotyke said: Omg, GTA V is just killing everyone. Legitimate updates will do that. Lol 10 minutes ago, DeMonkey said: What's the occasion? I know there were some new heists, but that was weeks ago I thought? That bad boi came out December 12. Meanwhile, in Warframe Emperian. Edited January 25, 2020 by (XB1)MandlorPrime Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaotyke Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 1 minute ago, (XB1)MandlorPrime said: Legitimate updates will do that. Lol That bad boi came out December 12. Meanwhile Emperian came in like Ya, we need a casino in this game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(XBOX)YoungGunn82 Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Kaotyke said: Ya, we need a casino in this game. The ability to play that one game in the Umbra quest would be a good start.. but nah let's release more broke ass S#&$ cause we need more new players. /s Edited January 25, 2020 by (XB1)MandlorPrime Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaotyke Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 Just now, (XB1)MandlorPrime said: The ability to play that one game in the Umbra quest would be a good start.. nah let's release more broke ass S#&$ cause we need new players. /s We need more ways to spend plat. My credit card is not ready for the hole that will be drilled into it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voltage Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 (edited) I'm not a fan of how Steve's survey keeps being used as accurate statistics on the state of the game. The people who follow Steve on Twitter obviously have a certain bias going into the survey, and it was not advertised well beyond that. If DE wants to use a poll, they should do another Community Hot Topic like [DE]Drew did years ago (only this time around posting on Reddit and other platforms like their Discord server): 1 hour ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said: I mean the games Free 2 play. Having a grind creates more of an incentive to buy things in the game. The issue now is that DE majorly overstepped their boundaries with the Lich and Railjack grinds with things like Stacking 7 layers of RNG and RNG stats. Things that do not respect the time and effort the players put into the game. This too. One of the major factors into this is disconnection with the game, it's gameplay, and the nature of many aspects of the game. This is obviously never a developers strong suit because they don't have time to play constantly. However, Liches, Railjack, and now Pablo's UI propositions are clear indicators of this dilemma DE faces. There has been a recent trend of DE commenting on more threads here on their forums platform which I believe is a great start towards communication with the player base. Edited January 25, 2020 by Voltage 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Killa_Byte Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 so i can go to the forums and reply to stupid questions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)SolarPhantom82 Posted January 25, 2020 Author Share Posted January 25, 2020 22 minutes ago, (XB1)MandlorPrime said: Legitimate updates will do that. Lol That bad boi came out December 12. Meanwhile, in Warframe Emperian. hey with more updates like railjack maybe we can fall out of the top 20 by the end of the year. Come on DE I believe in you lololol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vesiga Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 I only play when there's a new update. max the stuff, then go back to other games. nothing to do anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ham_Grenabe Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 They should probably just shell out for a consultant that can do good survey design and customer research. Don’t do this stuff in-house. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)AbBaNdOn_ Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 The raijack patches sound like things are being improved alot. What Scott said about Lichs on devstream sounds like our feedback was heard and changes to how we hunt liches are incoming. Those two issues are very encouraging and will lead to alot of fun in-game. After that the communities wishlist becomes extremely fragmented. For example my #1 gameplay wishlist item is a Revamp of conservation. Hunting critters in open worlds is super relaxing and fun. The poop/track method is garbage though, and more importantly animal AI in Orb Vallis is incredibly broken. My other big wish thats not gameplay related is the ability to resize decorations on your orbiter. Lifesize warframe articula = awesome. But a ton of other things should be allowed to be resized. I baught that corpus locker to decorate my ship and its freaking miniature wtf.... the #1 Bug they need to fix on ps4 is desync issues. I pop relics with people and get screwed out of being able to see or choose my relic all the time. Disruption/Sanctuary Onslaught progress and rewards dont even get awarded. Sometimes I cant even advance to the next map is sanctuary onslaughts even after I go through the portal. After all that stuff I just want QoL fixes like handing in sentient cores to onnko? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
844448 Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 2 hours ago, AuroraSonicBoom said: I dont mean innovate in the direction that is detrimental to the player base(i.e. additional random gear stat layer) but by making warframe a game that progress in through other means than an endless gear treadmill. Perhaps you have an idea for that? My idea so far is making quest related weapons that you can't buy from market at all. Perhaps some wreckage of an orokin weapon where you go through a long chain of missions and objectives to repair it and get a homing laser arm cannon as secondary mode like psycho-gun from cobra the space pirate instead of gear treadmill like you said Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)Herrwann69 Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 Il y a 3 heures, (XB1)MandlorPrime a dit : Wow, that's harsh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trst Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 Just on the topic of grind having more things gated behind one and now the addition of rng stat rolls are a product of the playerbase. Regardless of what DE has done or added to the game the outcome has always been the same with thousands of players coming back for an update then just as quickly leaving the moment they've finished it. It made no difference what the updates have been even when they were exactly what players wanted to have added or was something being changed to exactly how players wanted. The pattern has always persisted. So what else is DE to do besides trying to lengthen grinds or even try to make them near indefinite with stat rolls? People can list off whatever ideas they have for an alternative to this but that is the exact thing DE has been doing. How many times should they continue to throw ideas at the wall until something sticks when the entire concept of stat rolls has already been tried and proven with many other games? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aggh Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 Sees hat *pours one out for TAE* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)GEN-Son_17 Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 5 hours ago, Luciole77 said: lichs can be solo but railajck not.... I really hope DE fix railjack for solo experience! Play with co-op is....horrible thing. Need to low tasks in railjack..its sux to leave our chair to kill crews all the time and we get shot from all ships.... railjack rework now DE! Please don't. I've mastered solo up until the veil and without relying on my archwing and I'm VERY MUCH enjoying the gameplay. Learn evasion, junk resupplying and tinker with armor, Hull and engine speed. The Railjack comes very much alive when it's fast! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tyreens Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 vor 20 Stunden schrieb o0Despair0o: I spent 5 years or so here and invested more money then I'd like to admit. I'm not gonna leave now and let it go to waste. So true. That is the only reason i get my login rewards. When another game had such bad content updates, i would have uninstalled it a long time ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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