Dev Workshop - Kuva Lich Changes Coming Soon™

[SilverBones]

Greeting, Lich Hunters!

After the release of the Kuva Lich System in Update 26: The Old Blood, you have been providing us a lot of feedback on what you do and don’t like about hunting your personal Lich. While we have made many improvements over the past week, we have more to come. We are adding the following very soon, based on your feedback:

• WEAPON RNG REDUCTION - Your Kuva Lich will no longer have the same weapon twice in a row. While you may get a duplicated weapon down the road, your Kuva Lich will have a guaranteed different weapon than its immediate predecessor.
• RECYCLE YOUR REQUIEM - 4 Defiled Requiem Mods can now be Transmuted into a random, fully charged, Requiem Mod. This gives them some additional use, as well as helping you clean up your inventory.
• TRADE YOUR LICH - If you have a Converted Kuva Lich, you may trade them with another player, who may be looking for a specific Kuva Lich Weapon or Ephemera. This system will be coming soon, including the use of a brand new Dojo Room inspired by the early ‘War Room’ design from the King Pin System!
• MORE TO COME - We are looking at other ways in which we can make the Kuva Lich system more rewarding and unique, although there is still a lot of internal discussion surrounding the ‘hows’ while maintaining the design intent. More on this as it is finalized.

Monitoring, tweaking and balancing this new process is an ongoing effort, and we rely on your feedback to let us know what you think. Please keep your feedback constructive and succinct, making sure you give suggestions to systems you do not like, while detailing why you do like a system, should that be your opinion.

The hunt continues!
UPDATED: 11.13.19 @ 5.23PM

3 hours ago, [DE]Bear said:

We wanted to add some clarity: a Kuva Lich can only be traded once. A player can convert a Kuva Lich which then can be traded to another player as an active Kuva Lich for the recipient. If that Kuva Lich is converted again, it will not be eligible for trading. Should the traded Kuva Lich also have an Ephemera, then both the original Tenno and the receiving Tenno will earn the Ephemera upon defeat or conversion.

As for the Ephemera’s themselves, we are going to be doubling the drop chance of Ephemera for all newly generated Kuva Liches.

We still have more changes to make and discussions are still ongoing.

[Voltage]

Awesome!

Any chance DE could look into upgrading Kuva weaponry? As in, if I own a 50% Toxin Kuva Kohm, and I keep getting 25-30% Toxin Kuva Kohms, I could fuse them into my 50% Toxin Kuva Kohm to slightly work my way up to 60%? Valence Transfer is nice, but it does not address duplicates with poor stats. This would also make farming the Ephemeras less painful as the Impact/Magnetic/Cold buffs could be used in the fusion process.

In the upcoming changes, I could convert the Lich and trade the contract away to solve the duplicates issue, but I don't see how another player would value my contract unless they were missing the Kohm entirely from their inventory.

Also, Could the Bonus Relic in Kuva Survival Requiem Fissures be a Requiem Relic? This would make the endurance mode a bit more rewarding without breaking the system.

[Senguash]

Nice!

Requiem transfusion is particularly welcome...

I'm still hoping we see some revisions to murmur requirements. 30/30/70 just feels really weird. 

If you have 24/30 (80%) murmurs on the second requiem, and you guess the second it puts you at 56/70 (80%) on the third one.

It's a weirdly huge swing, and it exceplifies why 30/30/70 generally feels a bit weird.

How about 30/40/50 instead? Or maybe 30/30/30?

 

Also, right now you're not really able to play with your friends all that well. You don't get enrage progress and your lich can't spawn if you get taxied to a node you don't have, and you and your friends won't randomly have same nodes as you most of the time. 
Can we get it changed so that being taxied just works? I just want playing with friends to be equal to playing with pubs.

[RobWasHere]

2 minutes ago, [DE]Bear said:

RECYCLE YOUR REQUIEM - 4 Defiled Requiem Mods can now be Transmuted into a random, fully charged, Requiem Mod. This gives them some additional use, as well as helping you clean up your inventory.

Right after I dissolved them for 2k endo 😕

[Hixlysss]

Wooo! Yay~

[Echoes]

hace 3 minutos, [DE]Bear dijo:

you’re Kuva Lich

Cannot unsee 😞

[SilverBones]

1 minute ago, Echoes said:

Cannot unsee 😞

I don't know what you're talking about...

cough

[LSG501]

37 minutes ago, [DE]Bear said:

snip

 

No change to the necessary wasting of 5 forma for full xp from kuva weapons due to them going to rank 40 for no real reason.... funny that....

RECYCLE YOUR REQUIEM - Personally I'd prefer their limited use to just be totally removed or at the very least increased quite considerably over the current 3 uses, it would lower the overall amount of rng and grind necessary far more than this change will...

[(PSN)Hikuro-93]

17 minutes ago, [DE]Bear said:

WEAPON RNG REDUCTION - Your Kuva Lich will no longer have the same weapon twice in a row. While you may get a duplicated weapon down the road, you’re Kuva Lich will have a guaranteed different weapon than its immediate predecessor.

Better than nothing, but I doubt this will cut it somehow. Maybe enabling some extra choice to the players and less rng walls for the same mechanic would be the way to go.

 

17 minutes ago, [DE]Bear said:

TRADE YOUR LICH - If you have a Converted Kuva Lich, you may trade them with another player, who may be looking for a specific Kuva Lich Weapon or Ephemera. This system will be coming soon, including the use of a brand new Dojo Room inspired by the early ‘War Room’ design from the King Pin System!

I'm guessing we'll have to wait another month on consoles for this, right? Well, at least everything will be new for that time span, so I guess it could be worse.

[HIGHDAMAGE]

finally some great news ty 

[ThePhantomMan]

will anything be done about the randomness of the elemental percentage of the weapons? simply being able to convert one bonus to another is really not enough.

[Tromeo]

taking a break 'till the rng reduction implemented... because am at my 3rd Drakgoon in a row 🤮

[GmG-ITA]

Can you fix Kuva Larving stopped spawning

 

[Afterburner_X]

Nice, Kuva Lich Changes. Maybe I will hate that System a bit less in the future. 

Why not make stuff more enjoyable from the beginning? In my opinion it was very predictable that people will hate certain stuff about that Kuva Lich System. 

"Please don't play our big update, because it will not value your time. But don't worry we will fix that soon..."

Tradechat here I come: WTB Kuva Lich Weapon/Kuva Lich Ephemera 10p each. ^__^

[Aceofgods]

Any update on co-op incentives? I still have no reason to play with friends if their lich has control over different planets than mine. It was alot more fun when them failing their lich provided me with 10 murmurs.

Can you elaborate on how the trading system will work? I'm glad to see Converted Liches will have further use, but I'm a bit worried on how they will look in trade. Will we be able to see, at least, the weapon, element and % bonus or the presence or lack of an ephemera? There's alot of room for toxicity and scamming without proper implementation.

Lorewise, the Kuva Liches are very interesting, but gameplay wise the name is very misleading. It would be interesting to see Kuva thrown in somehow. A few suggestions:

• Allow Defiled mods to be recharged with Kuva. 2500 to go from Defiled to Full would be logical, and make the 1200 kuva common reward from the requiem relics useful for the content.
• Use Kuva to reroll % bonuses on Kuva Weapons. One idea would be to make it so you HAVE to keep the new value. This makes rerolling an already high weapon less appealing than farming or trading for another lich.
• Spend Kuva to charge murmurs, using a charging value similar to Focus schools use, where holding the button spends kuva to charge the meter, and the selection can be cancelled if the result isn't desirable (Without revealing the Requiem Mods, of course!)
• Use Kuva to bait out your lich, making their appearance more likely at the cost of perhaps strengthening them.
  • Potential to make the weapon stronger %? Would be nice to have some way to influce the weapon's rolls after the lich has been generated.

Can the Search Bar in the Codex > Universe > Kuva Lich History be improved? As far as I can tell, it doesn't search anything. I've tried searching for both lich names and for weapons, but nothing seems to populate when using it. With trading being added, it would make it easier to find what you need to trade.

Some toxic, or perhaps unwitting, players are leaving their liches and not mercy-ing them. This is causing player frustration as it prevents others from spawning their lich. Some argue that the lich will spawn more thralls this way, while others simply say nothing and go to extraction. Please incentivize eliminating your lich as swiftly as possible.

Keep being awesome DE. You'll polish these edges in time, I'm sure.

[Jarriaga]

Sweet!

[BubblePoof]

Could we add some real rewards to this whole thing? Maybe a few credit and endo caches, some resources from the planets they're controlling

[xRufus7x]

While these changes sound nice we still need something additional to do with undesirable weapons like breaking them down and Lich allies need a tuneup to make them worth converting. Would be nice if they used their abilities.

 

Also, can we get confirmation on if having multiple allied liches increase their chances of spawning in mission?

[Aldain]

13 minutes ago, [DE]Bear said:

Monitoring, tweaking and balancing this new process is an ongoing effort, and we rely on your feedback to let us know what you think. Please keep your feedback constructive and succinct, making sure you give suggestions to systems you do not like, while detailing why you do like a system, should that be your opinion.

All looking good, just gotta get that automatic death and instant level up upon mercy-ing your Lich gone and I'll be more than satisfied personally.

Maybe that and a few more co-op incentives to make driving off the Lich helpful for everyone rather than a only a negative for the player who does so, maybe some.

That would go a long way towards removing some of the complaints people have about people not driving their Lich off and blocking the spawns of other players, as well as make them not level up at too quick a rate.

[Revanx]

Nice!

19 minutes ago, [DE]Bear said:

• WEAPON RNG REDUCTION - Your Kuva Lich will no longer have the same weapon twice in a row. While you may get a duplicated weapon down the road, your Kuva Lich will have a guaranteed different weapon than its immediate predecessor.
• RECYCLE YOUR REQUIEM - 4 Defiled Requiem Mods can now be Transmuted into a random, fully charged, Requiem Mod. This gives them some additional use, as well as helping you clean up your inventory.
• TRADE YOUR LICH - If you have a Converted Kuva Lich, you may trade them with another player, who may be looking for a specific Kuva Lich Weapon or Ephemera. This system will be coming soon, including the use of a brand new Dojo Room inspired by the early ‘War Room’ design from the King Pin System!
• MORE TO COME - We are looking at other ways in which we can make the Kuva Lich system more rewarding and unique, although there is still a lot of internal discussion surrounding the ‘hows’ while maintaining the design intent. More on this as it is finalized.

I think this is a very good start to making the system feel better. I really wish these changes were in the system from the start (even if it meant delaying another week or two) but having them added now is the next best thing.
I'm not sure about how trading weapons will feel down the line. I expect everyone to be trading any weapon for another on a 1 to 1 basis when its released (similar to how requiem mods are traded right now) but in further down the line expect people to only be looking for 50% weapons or higher. I wish lower dmg weapons could be used or combined in someway useful.
Lastly, I was hopeful of some benefit to actually playing with other players/clanmates. Possibly in some conjunction with murmur farming (30/30/70 is a bit of an awkward feeling). 

[CrimsonPenguino]

17 minutes ago, [DE]Bear said:

TRADE YOUR LICH

How about no. The nice part about this system was the fact that you had to actually do this stuff on your own and farm it yourself. With that being a thing, it just makes it another thing that can be monetized. Now people can save their liches that have crazy bonuses on their weapon and trade it to someone for a ton of plat. That is a horrible idea. Incoming rivens 2.0

[Xolgys]

vor 18 Minuten schrieb [DE]Bear:

snip~

there are 2 important thing which are totally unmentioned but throw off a lot of people:

1: whats with the bug thats been ingame now for over a week and basically rendering some kuva weapons barely an upgrade, especially kuva ogris which is basically worse than regular ogris - the dmg math that keeps reducing the base innate elemental due to the RNG elemental...whatever the reason is, this needs a fix retroactively because people farm more and more lich weapons and whilst many know its a bug it makes many worse than they actually could be, especially mentioned kuva ogris.

2: give the lvling to lv 40 a purpose. paracesis has a passive which gets increased for every forma put on it up to 40 max level. the kuva weapons would be strong (if the dmg bug was finally fixed) but there is actually 0 point in maxing them out with 5 forma when most dont require more than 3, which means 2 are practictally wasted unless someone really wanted the exilus slot filled, then maybe a 4th. if u introduce such a feature on weapons other than the paracesis, which was the only with this prior to kuva weapons, then give it real purpose because capacity is not. max level 40 just gives 20 more points, thats 3 more forma on a regular weapon depending on whats put inside the slots, meaning it could even be 2 forma more only but considering kuva weapons are mostly fine with 3 forma for a finished build thats exactly the 2 extra forma required to max them to 40 which arent needed but bascially what would allow a full build on most other 2ndaries just the same, at worst a 3rd, totaling at 6 forma. it results in more or less the same effort when someone maxes a kuva weapon but thats actually 2 forma wasted without any gain.

the max level 40 is 100% pointless like this. give it value by giving the weapons a boost on some stats or anything thats actually a legit reason to max these out for. capacity alone is NOT a reason.

i wondered if weapons gained anything by maxing to 40 and wasted forma and ive seen ppl ask that same question i answered to myself, because i wasted many many many forma already anyway. i wont scroll down my weapons pages and count the forma.....that still doesnt mean its fun to max a weapon just for the sake of it and no actual benefit....

[Hello]

When can we just dump the Lich dude? Stuck on another duplicate at the moment and I don't even want to finish it. Preventing a couple in a row isn't really going to solve much especially in the event we get say 2 duplicates in a row for 2 different weapons.

[-Milmo-]

Buff the Kuva Ogris

[Xolgys]

Gerade eben schrieb --Brandt--:

When can we just dump the Lich dude? Stuck on another duplicate at the moment and I don't even want to finish it. Preventing a couple in a row isn't really going to solve much especially in the event we get say 2 duplicates in a row for 2 different weapons.

keep going dude. i just had a streak of kohm (i hate kohm btw) duplicates and now suddenly my 1st seer dropped....56% radiation innate.

the next one might finally finally be quartakk....probably the lowest rolls for eternity since i wanted this weapon only from the very beginning aside of the sadness kuva ogris currently is....