Murmur Farming, Tips and Tricks

[Remedyheart]

Yo! Remy here and I figured I'd drop some tips on how to be efficient at killing those thralls. I won't go too far into detail and leave it at an easily acessible and resonable guide form so that it sticks to players' minds better. I have been finding a ton of players making mistakes during their murmur farming and many whom believe themselves to be more effective at murmur farms than most others. It is for this reason I want to share my views and help the community a little while doing so.

So the first thing to know is that short missions, such as exterminate, sabotage, and rescue, are bad for murmur farming. The best way to farm thralls is with longer missions, suh as defense, interception, and survival. There's a couppe of reasons why and the biggest reason being it saves you time and maximises your uptime for these spawns.

Shorter missions last 2 to 3 minutes where as thrall spawns last for the first 5 minutes of a mission. Completing quick missions may make you miss out on additional thrall spawns by extracting too soon. This fact alone increases your time on the loading screen and creates more downtime than needed, so not only do you miss out on thralls for those missions you yourself end up sitting there waiting going back and forth between missions more than necessary.

Longer missions on the other hand allows for more lich spawns (which in turn can generate more thralls, as lichs can convert active enemies at random not just near them), smaller maps allow for a lot pess travel time between each thrall, and these missions bring the thralls your way rather than making you sprint from thrall to thrall.

Keep in mind though that an active lich doesn't mean a big boost in thrall spawns. At most they can give out 2 to 3 extra thralls which isn't as noticable as the 10 given from said lich for a stab attempt. So best strategy for active lichs is to stab attempt and allow another to spawn. If and when you get yours you'll get a big boost for just attempting to stab your lich.

There are a couple of reasons to stab your lich that are highly positive and outweight any negativity towards not stabbing them. First and foremost you get a big chunk to your murmurs, about ten thralls. Second a lich ranking up allows them to control another sector of another planet, which opens the way for more of the missions we want, defense, interception, and survival. These reasons combined with making the current mission smoother are the definite reasons why you should always stab your lich as a priority. Making the mission less annoying for other players is just icing on the cake.

Once you reveal your first mod, you should place it on the first slot to your parazon and then try a stab attempt. Doing this helps greatly in the guessing sequence part of the hunt. This can help in determining the position of the revealed mod by either eliminating the first slot for its placement or cementing its place on the first slot. When you get another attempt, it should reveal where that first mod should be placed. This makes guessing the second mod placement much easier and sometimes can even net you an easy kill by guessing the third one correctly in a 1/6 chance.

Lastly, always play with a full squad. This one is simple and its sad that I find pub players still just trying to run it on their own. A full team allows for more spawns. Teammates make it easier to complete the assigned objective while also claiming those precious murmurs. This is another reason why we love defense, survival, and interception. You are all actively completely the objective while farming thralls. Where a mission such as Rescue or Mobile Defense forces you to pay attention to the objective while trying to juggle thrall kills at the same time. 

TLDR Version.

1 - Play longer missions, short ones suck for murmurs.

2 - Always stab your Lich, the outcome is worth it.

3 - Always play with a full team. If sent to mission, wait for more players.

4 - Start guessing mod order upon first mod revealed, not later.

5 - Help with liches, you want a chance to spawn yours for a stab attempt.

Conclusion. So you see there are plenty of ways of doing this, but if you want to save time and make this easier for yourself you may want to follow these tips. This is what works best for me and if you have a differefent method feel free to share your own tips as well. I have defeated 16 liches on a regular work schedule by the creation of this guide and the 17th will be finished today.

Following these tips reduces my grind down to a couple of hours at most and makes my gameplay less stressful. I usually bring a Grendel when forced to do shorter missions and a Ledgermain Mirage Prime for the longer ones to nuke out the entire map.

So that's about it. Figured I'd help with murmurs since many people complain about the time it takes them to complete this section of the hunt. So its not their fault per say but everything about farming murmurs is about time reduction and ease of gameplay. This style just goes by the phylosophy of "Smooth is fast, rushing creates mistakes."

So there you have it feel free to comment and let us know if these tips help you or not. I may even edit this to include other tips to help players.

[Domaik]

Nice points I just hate when it spawns for other players and they don't stab theirs. DE needs to do something about only 1 lich spawning at a time.

[(PSN)corpusbonds]

Thank you! This will be helpful when we get the update.

[Masquerine]

If you want to send a lich away and someone won't stab it, play revenant. Use 1, then 3 and when its hp bar drops, it will exit the mission. I've encountered this in some parties recently with people that are playing revenant.

[Remedyheart]

15 minutes ago, Masquerine said:

If you want to send a lich away and someone won't stab it, play revenant. Use 1, then 3 and when its hp bar drops, it will exit the mission. I've encountered this in some parties recently with people that are playing revenant.

They's gonna patch that. I mean a lich is out to kill the player so having an exploit to make it ghost away is absurd.

[EpicD]

Just now, Remedyheart said:

They's gonna patch that. I mean a lich is out to kill the player so having an exploit to make it ghost away is absurd.

A ghost killing a ghost.

It would be ironic to patch it out

[Hyohakusha]

I want you to know that this isn't any kind of personal attack, but almost everything in this post is the exact opposite of what you want to do.

26 minutes ago, Remedyheart said:

So the first thing to know is that short missions, such as exterminate, sabotage, and rescue, are bad for murmur farming. The best way to farm thralls is with longer missions, suh as defense, interception, and survival. There's a couppe of reasons why and the biggest reason being it saves you time and maximises your uptime for these spawns.

Shorter missions last 2 to 3 minutes where as thrall spawns last for the first 5 minutes of a mission. Completing quick missions may make you miss out on additional thrall spawns by extracting too soon. This fact alone increases your time on the loading screen and creates more downtime than needed, so not only do you miss out on thralls for those missions you yourself end up sitting there waiting going back and forth between missions more than necessary.

Actually this is completely backwards. Defense is probably the worst, as you only get 5 waves. Spy isn't any good either, as the overall thrall spawns seem to be much less. Survival isn't bad, but the thralls spawn in a burst that dies out rather quickly, and it's not good for taking advantage of converted thralls since there's a time limit and the need to get life support. Interception can be good, but only in a group, and due to the sheer amount of bad information on liches, running in a group is almost always more trouble then it's worth. Exterminate, Capture, Moblile Defense and Sabotage are the best, as there is no time limit.

Taking your time is indeed the best way to go about it, however, I mean you need to kill every enemy on the map and explore every section of it. Spending 10 minutes in an exterminate can net you 15-25+ murmurs when you do it right. Rushing through the mission on pub in a group is a big mistake.

30 minutes ago, Remedyheart said:

Keep in mind though that an active lich doesn't mean a big boost in thrall spawns. At most they can give out 2 to 3 extra thralls which isn't as noticable as the 10 given from said lich for a stab attempt. So best strategy for active lichs is to stab attempt and allow another to spawn. If and when you get yours you'll get a big boost for just attempting to stab your lich.

This is also incorrect. Liches will convert anywhere from 5-10 enemies on average, and those converted thralls do not count against the cap for thralls that spawn into the mission normally. When a lich spawns, don't attack them, don't kill any enemy near them. They won't convert enemies when they're knocked on one knee; they have an animation where they point to the grinner they're converting and they need to be able to do that. An incredibly tanky frame like Inaros and Rhino with a very accurate hitscan weapon works wonders; simply dodge and roll to avoid getting killed by the crowd of twenty dudes shooting at you, then pick off the thralls the lich converts. 5-10 converts + 5-10 spawned will net you twice the thralls on average. You'll see the difference when I post my lich list at the end.

35 minutes ago, Remedyheart said:

There are a couple of reasons to stab your lich that are highly positive and outweight any negativity towards not stabbing them. First and foremost you get a big chunk to your murmurs, about ten thralls. Second a lich ranking up allows them to control another sector of another planet, which opens the way for more of the missions we want, defense, interception, and survival. These reasons combined with making the current mission smoother are the definite reasons why you should always stab your lich as a priority. Making the mission less annoying for other players is just icing on the cake.

This is also incorrect. You only get 4-8 thralls worth of murmurs on average on a failed stab. It's extremely rare to get more than that. The second part isn't correct because those are the mission types you don't want, like I explained above. Also, stabbing your lich resets their anger meter and means they aren't going to show up as frequently, which means less converted thralls, which cuts your murmur gain rate in half. Playing on pub isn't any good either, as when you're solo, your lich is the only lich that can spawn. In a group of four people, you only have a 1/4 chance of your lich being the one to spawn, if any lich spawns, and again, if you're stabbing them every time they show up, you also have less of a chance of them spawning at all.

40 minutes ago, Remedyheart said:

Once you reveal your first mod, you should place it on the first slot to your parazon and then try a stab attempt. Doing this helps greatly in the guessing sequence part of the hunt. This can help in determining the position of the revealed mod by either eliminating the first slot for its placement or cementing its place on the first slot. When you get another attempt, it should reveal where that first mod should be placed. This makes guessing the second mod placement much easier and sometimes can even net you an easy kill by guessing the third one correctly in a 1/6 chance.

This is mostly correct. When you have the first one revealed, go into a mission, and let the lich convert as many enemies as possible BEFORE you stab them. That's 5-10+ converts, 5-10+ normal spawns, with the 4-8+ bonus stab on top of it. Because remember, after you stab your lich, they aren't going to show up for a while, and you aren't going to get the bonus converted thralls until they do. If you do it right, you should only have to stab your lich 4 or 5 times. Say I know Fass is one of them. Fass goes in the first slot, I let the lich convert enemies before stabbing them, I stab them, it's wrong. Fass goes in the second slot. I'm not going to stab them again until I have another murmur revealed. Say it reveals Khra. Khra goes in the first slot, Fass goes in the second. Khra light up white, Fass is wrong. Fass goes in the last slot and I know as soon as I get the last murmur done I only need to run into the lich one more time. By not stabbing them and going for converted thralls instead, I'm not only getting more murmurs on average, I also keep the chance of them spawning high, so I don't end up in the situation of knowing what the combo is while having to run five missions just to get the lich to show up, with absolutely no gain (once all murmurs are revealed, thralls no longer drop relics), which is a terrible spot to be in. And again, the total for converted + spawned thralls will always be higher than spawned + one stab, and you don't want to lose that.

48 minutes ago, Remedyheart said:

Lastly, always play with a full squad. This one is simple and its sad that I find pub players still just trying to run it on their own. A full team allows for more spawns. Teammates make it easier to complete the assigned objective while also claiming those precious murmurs. This is another reason why we love defense, survival, and interception. You are all actively completely the objective while farming thralls. Where a mission such as Rescue or Mobile Defense forces you to pay attention to the objective while trying to juggle thrall kills at the same time. 

This is a bad idea. Like I said before, by playing in a group you are giving yourself a 1/4 chance of your lich spawning, instead of being guaranteed that your lich will spawn if a lich spawns at all. Most players still think that powering through is the best way to do this; it's not. Demanding that people stab their lich is only costing everyone murmurs, including that player, and increasing the grind. Again, you get less converts, and you reduce the chances of your lich spawning.

I've taken out 30 liches so far. Here's my list. I'm only missing the Ogris.



Again, this isn't anything personal, I'm just trying to help you and anyone else who'll take a minute to read and think. Always let your lich convert as many enemies as possible, only kill the converted thralls around them until they stop converting thralls. Then, if you know what one of the mods you need is, stab them AFTER they've converted as many thralls as possible. Do not stab them every time they show up, you're only reducing the chance for them to show up more frequently, and costing yourself bonus converted thralls in the meantime. You don't even have to stab them at all, you are free to just gather information on them by killing their thralls and leaving; unless they've got a Shildeg, they aren't going to be following you anyway. And unless everyone else in the group knows this, running in a group, much less a pub, is only going to make everything take longer than it should. You can get 5-10 spawns + 4-8 from the stab bonus every now and then while reducing the chance for your lich to spawn, while giving yourself a 1/4 chance of your lich spawning. Or you can get 5-10 spawns and 5-10 converts consistently, plus the 4-8 stab bonus on top when you know a mod, while keeping the chance of running into your lich high, and guaranteeing that your lich will be the one that spawns.

Liches are puzzles, not brick walls. Use your brains and happy hunting.
 

[k05h]

vor einer Stunde schrieb Remedyheart:

4 - Start guessing mod order upon first mod revealed, not later.

and not earlier. This guide has almost all your points:

https://xplainthegame.com/kuva-lich-guide/

 

[DesertEagle1280]

It is not in my best interest to stab my lich if I don't already know 2/3 requiems IMO - it risks leveling him needlessly, and if I get position 1 right I also lock in the known 2nd mod's position (either it's in 2 or 3, and if the stab doesn't give 2/3 that means known #2 is in pos 3, and unknown is pos 2).  Also it levels up my lich which only makes killing him more of a pain, and the benefit in murmur progress isn't worth the PITA it results in later. Since leveling the lich doesn't have any other benefit - eg increasing the ele % - which would make higher level more desired, I refuse to stab my lich.  I agree it shafts the rest of the team, and DE should find a way to fix that - but that's not my problem, that's DE's problem. They should either let me send him away without leveling him up, or give a failed kill some appreciable benefit besides making it a chore to kill him later, have him run away after being ignored for a couple downs, something like that.

[Remedyheart]

54 minutes ago, Hyohakusha said:

I want you to know that this isn't any kind of personal attack, but almost everything in this post is the exact opposite of what you want to do.

Actually this is completely backwards. Defense is probably the worst, as you only get 5 waves. Spy isn't any good either, as the overall thrall spawns seem to be much less. Survival isn't bad, but the thralls spawn in a burst that dies out rather quickly, and it's not good for taking advantage of converted thralls since there's a time limit and the need to get life support. Interception can be good, but only in a group, and due to the sheer amount of bad information on liches, running in a group is almost always more trouble then it's worth. Exterminate, Capture, Moblile Defense and Sabotage are the best, as there is no time limit.

Taking your time is indeed the best way to go about it, however, I mean you need to kill every enemy on the map and explore every section of it. Spending 10 minutes in an exterminate can net you 15-25+ murmurs when you do it right. Rushing through the mission on pub in a group is a big mistake.

This is also incorrect. Liches will convert anywhere from 5-10 enemies on average, and those converted thralls do not count against the cap for thralls that spawn into the mission normally. When a lich spawns, don't attack them, don't kill any enemy near them. They won't convert enemies when they're knocked on one knee; they have an animation where they point to the grinner they're converting and they need to be able to do that. An incredibly tanky frame like Inaros and Rhino with a very accurate hitscan weapon works wonders; simply dodge and roll to avoid getting killed by the crowd of twenty dudes shooting at you, then pick off the thralls the lich converts. 5-10 converts + 5-10 spawned will net you twice the thralls on average. You'll see the difference when I post my lich list at the end.

This is also incorrect. You only get 4-8 thralls worth of murmurs on average on a failed stab. It's extremely rare to get more than that. The second part isn't correct because those are the mission types you don't want, like I explained above. Also, stabbing your lich resets their anger meter and means they aren't going to show up as frequently, which means less converted thralls, which cuts your murmur gain rate in half. Playing on pub isn't any good either, as when you're solo, your lich is the only lich that can spawn. In a group of four people, you only have a 1/4 chance of your lich being the one to spawn, if any lich spawns, and again, if you're stabbing them every time they show up, you also have less of a chance of them spawning at all.

This is mostly correct. When you have the first one revealed, go into a mission, and let the lich convert as many enemies as possible BEFORE you stab them. That's 5-10+ converts, 5-10+ normal spawns, with the 4-8+ bonus stab on top of it. Because remember, after you stab your lich, they aren't going to show up for a while, and you aren't going to get the bonus converted thralls until they do. If you do it right, you should only have to stab your lich 4 or 5 times. Say I know Fass is one of them. Fass goes in the first slot, I let the lich convert enemies before stabbing them, I stab them, it's wrong. Fass goes in the second slot. I'm not going to stab them again until I have another murmur revealed. Say it reveals Khra. Khra goes in the first slot, Fass goes in the second. Khra light up white, Fass is wrong. Fass goes in the last slot and I know as soon as I get the last murmur done I only need to run into the lich one more time. By not stabbing them and going for converted thralls instead, I'm not only getting more murmurs on average, I also keep the chance of them spawning high, so I don't end up in the situation of knowing what the combo is while having to run five missions just to get the lich to show up, with absolutely no gain (once all murmurs are revealed, thralls no longer drop relics), which is a terrible spot to be in. And again, the total for converted + spawned thralls will always be higher than spawned + one stab, and you don't want to lose that.

This is a bad idea. Like I said before, by playing in a group you are giving yourself a 1/4 chance of your lich spawning, instead of being guaranteed that your lich will spawn if a lich spawns at all. Most players still think that powering through is the best way to do this; it's not. Demanding that people stab their lich is only costing everyone murmurs, including that player, and increasing the grind. Again, you get less converts, and you reduce the chances of your lich spawning.

I've taken out 30 liches so far. Here's my list. I'm only missing the Ogris.



Again, this isn't anything personal, I'm just trying to help you and anyone else who'll take a minute to read and think. Always let your lich convert as many enemies as possible, only kill the converted thralls around them until they stop converting thralls. Then, if you know what one of the mods you need is, stab them AFTER they've converted as many thralls as possible. Do not stab them every time they show up, you're only reducing the chance for them to show up more frequently, and costing yourself bonus converted thralls in the meantime. You don't even have to stab them at all, you are free to just gather information on them by killing their thralls and leaving; unless they've got a Shildeg, they aren't going to be following you anyway. And unless everyone else in the group knows this, running in a group, much less a pub, is only going to make everything take longer than it should. You can get 5-10 spawns + 4-8 from the stab bonus every now and then while reducing the chance for your lich to spawn, while giving yourself a 1/4 chance of your lich spawning. Or you can get 5-10 spawns and 5-10 converts consistently, plus the 4-8 stab bonus on top when you know a mod, while keeping the chance of running into your lich high, and guaranteeing that your lich will be the one that spawns.

Liches are puzzles, not brick walls. Use your brains and happy hunting.
 

I find your method strange and I've tried doing something to that sort of tactic.

Yeah around 7 minutes is when my team noticed no more thralls and the longest I've been in a Kuva Lich mission is 8 minutes where we clearly had several minutes fighting a lich who did not convert.

They also do not do the whole finger point and convert thing. Could be me and my lag, but I have yet to see or hear that as an ability. It also doesn't help that there's so little data on these mechanics. Not to mention how the negativity wave just dampens the chance of receiving any good guides that mention actual murmur mechanics.

So I cannot deny nor confirm if your method is any better than mine or vice versa. I can only state my own experiences. If that works for you then great. But I'm not sure if its for me.

I would also like to mention that my method works for a normal work schedule and is great for a busy player who may not have time to play all the time. So the 20 to 30 minutes devoted to a single mission may not be optimal. Also that leaves the chances for DCing and missing out rewards.

[Remedyheart]

2 hours ago, Hyohakusha said:

I want you to know that this isn't any kind of personal attack, but almost everything in this post is the exact opposite of what you want to do.

Actually this is completely backwards. Defense is probably the worst, as you only get 5 waves. Spy isn't any good either, as the overall thrall spawns seem to be much less. Survival isn't bad, but the thralls spawn in a burst that dies out rather quickly, and it's not good for taking advantage of converted thralls since there's a time limit and the need to get life support. Interception can be good, but only in a group, and due to the sheer amount of bad information on liches, running in a group is almost always more trouble then it's worth. Exterminate, Capture, Moblile Defense and Sabotage are the best, as there is no time limit.

Taking your time is indeed the best way to go about it, however, I mean you need to kill every enemy on the map and explore every section of it. Spending 10 minutes in an exterminate can net you 15-25+ murmurs when you do it right. Rushing through the mission on pub in a group is a big mistake.

This is also incorrect. Liches will convert anywhere from 5-10 enemies on average, and those converted thralls do not count against the cap for thralls that spawn into the mission normally. When a lich spawns, don't attack them, don't kill any enemy near them. They won't convert enemies when they're knocked on one knee; they have an animation where they point to the grinner they're converting and they need to be able to do that. An incredibly tanky frame like Inaros and Rhino with a very accurate hitscan weapon works wonders; simply dodge and roll to avoid getting killed by the crowd of twenty dudes shooting at you, then pick off the thralls the lich converts. 5-10 converts + 5-10 spawned will net you twice the thralls on average. You'll see the difference when I post my lich list at the end.

This is also incorrect. You only get 4-8 thralls worth of murmurs on average on a failed stab. It's extremely rare to get more than that. The second part isn't correct because those are the mission types you don't want, like I explained above. Also, stabbing your lich resets their anger meter and means they aren't going to show up as frequently, which means less converted thralls, which cuts your murmur gain rate in half. Playing on pub isn't any good either, as when you're solo, your lich is the only lich that can spawn. In a group of four people, you only have a 1/4 chance of your lich being the one to spawn, if any lich spawns, and again, if you're stabbing them every time they show up, you also have less of a chance of them spawning at all.

This is mostly correct. When you have the first one revealed, go into a mission, and let the lich convert as many enemies as possible BEFORE you stab them. That's 5-10+ converts, 5-10+ normal spawns, with the 4-8+ bonus stab on top of it. Because remember, after you stab your lich, they aren't going to show up for a while, and you aren't going to get the bonus converted thralls until they do. If you do it right, you should only have to stab your lich 4 or 5 times. Say I know Fass is one of them. Fass goes in the first slot, I let the lich convert enemies before stabbing them, I stab them, it's wrong. Fass goes in the second slot. I'm not going to stab them again until I have another murmur revealed. Say it reveals Khra. Khra goes in the first slot, Fass goes in the second. Khra light up white, Fass is wrong. Fass goes in the last slot and I know as soon as I get the last murmur done I only need to run into the lich one more time. By not stabbing them and going for converted thralls instead, I'm not only getting more murmurs on average, I also keep the chance of them spawning high, so I don't end up in the situation of knowing what the combo is while having to run five missions just to get the lich to show up, with absolutely no gain (once all murmurs are revealed, thralls no longer drop relics), which is a terrible spot to be in. And again, the total for converted + spawned thralls will always be higher than spawned + one stab, and you don't want to lose that.

This is a bad idea. Like I said before, by playing in a group you are giving yourself a 1/4 chance of your lich spawning, instead of being guaranteed that your lich will spawn if a lich spawns at all. Most players still think that powering through is the best way to do this; it's not. Demanding that people stab their lich is only costing everyone murmurs, including that player, and increasing the grind. Again, you get less converts, and you reduce the chances of your lich spawning.

I've taken out 30 liches so far. Here's my list. I'm only missing the Ogris.



Again, this isn't anything personal, I'm just trying to help you and anyone else who'll take a minute to read and think. Always let your lich convert as many enemies as possible, only kill the converted thralls around them until they stop converting thralls. Then, if you know what one of the mods you need is, stab them AFTER they've converted as many thralls as possible. Do not stab them every time they show up, you're only reducing the chance for them to show up more frequently, and costing yourself bonus converted thralls in the meantime. You don't even have to stab them at all, you are free to just gather information on them by killing their thralls and leaving; unless they've got a Shildeg, they aren't going to be following you anyway. And unless everyone else in the group knows this, running in a group, much less a pub, is only going to make everything take longer than it should. You can get 5-10 spawns + 4-8 from the stab bonus every now and then while reducing the chance for your lich to spawn, while giving yourself a 1/4 chance of your lich spawning. Or you can get 5-10 spawns and 5-10 converts consistently, plus the 4-8 stab bonus on top when you know a mod, while keeping the chance of running into your lich high, and guaranteeing that your lich will be the one that spawns.

Liches are puzzles, not brick walls. Use your brains and happy hunting.
 

Just tried your method and I am happy to report it does work. There are some issues with it though and makes it stressful especially with the wrong frames weapons and or builds.

Your method is not bad and provides a constant fountain of thralls done in private. The biggest issue here is the difficulty easily creating a large amount of stress. Levels 60 and 70+ is consider very hard already and is not new player friendly. This method forces you to use a tanky frame and a completely built weapon, both that need to easily topple at least stage 2 sortie level.

Though I'd advise stronger still as the goal here is to summon your lich and AVOID them at all costs. Your lich only converts nearby enemies and must be actively HUNTING YOU DOWN. This method is useful only to players who know what they're doing. Otherwise they may find themselves downed four times so quickly that they won't benefit anymore than the casual method of pubbing.

Having a full team is not just a great benefit but also acts as a safety net incase you can't handle your lich. Another issue is the spawning rate. As a solo mission the spawn rate is much lower and eventually you will run short on enemies and again the player must know what they're doing to benefit from this. Because this requires leading and baiting an entity that is essentially boss level for lower players.

So, smart play from you, but definitely not for everyone.

[Ogundiety]

I would like to make cases for the two times when it is - actively bad- to stab a lich.

 

The first one is obvious.  When you are at or incredibly near to the third code, and know the positions ( you are actively going to have a kill code the moment the mission ends), you are harming yourself by random guessing, because in the very likely situation where you guess wrong you will have to regain the anger you just spent.  This is worse the lower your lich's level is, as well.  You can easily be adding 4-5 missions of filler into your time.

 

The other is if you are in a longer mission ( not 'long', but longer- survival vs exterminate/capture) and you gave a guaranteed kill code, especially if you are going to convert.  In short, that kills spawns dead for the mission, so you are at that point wasting time of everyone else.  Far better to announce to the group then ignore it as reasonable.

 

Stabbing the lich blind ( knowing no code data) is not optimum in terms of time, but often your best course.  Primarily, if your mission nodes are very bad, you can do this early to jump it to another planet.  In addition, if you are running with a friend, you can try to get overlap by doing this.  If you are running with a friend, taking turns on who pilots let's you avoid that situation somewhat (person 1 has no data, person 2 tests a few codes, then back to person 1 while person two locks in code 3, etc), and is I find far more efficient overall.  It also let's you keep boredom at bay, and level up weapons comfortably because the other person has your back.

 

After 6 rows of liches and 3 ephemera, I am personally taking a pause, probably, but I would be lying if I said that I had not enjoyed this journey ( last weapon was twin stubba, which is probably my favorite, go figure).  I do hope that they lower the randomness more than has been proposed.

 

One final note- try to run one or two requiem mod runs after each lich.  Each one fully depletes one mod ( 1 charge of 3 mods ~=1 full mod), and if you do that or slightly more you will keep ahead of it.  Trade for the ones you are short.  Also talk in group, odds are others are looking for company/conversation /amusement.

[Test-995]

5 hours ago, Remedyheart said:

2 - Always stab your Lich, the outcome is worth it.

4 - Start guessing mod order upon first mod revealed, not later.

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

[Fire2box]

2 hours ago, Remedyheart said:

Levels 60 and 70+ is consider very hard already and is not new player friendly.

nothing about kuva lich is new player. You can't even do them as a new player unless taxi'ed to a thrall node. 

[WindigoTG]

7 hours ago, Remedyheart said:

2 - Always stab your Lich, the outcome is worth it.

No, it is not.

Not only suiciding by the lich without mods does not help you, it actually actively sets you back.

If you commit suicide by tour lich, he becomes disinterested in you, and you have to regrind a gajillion more thralls to enrage him again to face him when you are ready.

Ten steps forward and, like, 40 steps back.

So keeping the heat and always keeping him arownd saves you more time.

[zoffmode]

6 hours ago, WindigoTG said:

No, it is not.

Not only suiciding by the lich without mods does not help you, it actually actively sets you back.

If you commit suicide by tour lich, he becomes disinterested in you, and you have to regrind a gajillion more thralls to enrage him again to face him when you are ready.

Ten steps forward and, like, 40 steps back.

So keeping the heat and always keeping him arownd saves you more time.

Depends. If you play solo, you can go with that. In group or public, someone's Lich is bound to come up eventually so you might as well stab away. If you play with static group, it's even better cause you share more planets with your friends. I mainly stab for that (and some bonus progress of course).

But yeah, don't discount guessing stabs. This is my last Lich. First stab done at 90% of first Requiem unlocked. Then second stab and guess one very short while after. So I guessed 2 Requeims outright and that sped me up quite a bit while transfering my progress right from first Requeim.

Edited November 14, 2019 by zoffmode

[BelialEliatron]

Il y a 13 heures, Remedyheart a dit :

Yo! Remy here

Hi Remy, i'm Remi.

[z3us32610]

12 hours ago, Masquerine said:

If you want to send a lich away and someone won't stab it, play revenant. Use 1, then 3 and when its hp bar drops, it will exit the mission. I've encountered this in some parties recently with people that are playing revenant.

I just recently discovered this but on my own lich. That's awesome it works on others!

[Kaotyke]

14 hours ago, Domaik said:

Nice points I just hate when it spawns for other players and they don't stab theirs. DE needs to do something about only 1 lich spawning at a time.

I know exactly what will happen if 4 spawn.

4 Liches will grab one Tenno and YEEET them in 4 different directions. The Ragdoll will be incredible.

[iArucard]

If you run a public game , please X your own lich so others player lich can spawn.

If you do not intend to X your own lich , please don't join a public and run your own solo game and X those thrall for murmur.

I see people just not wanting to X their lich because they scare their lich level up , well then run your own private game so you can avoid your own lich.

[Remedyheart]

7 hours ago, WindigoTG said:

No, it is not.

Not only suiciding by the lich without mods does not help you, it actually actively sets you back.

If you commit suicide by tour lich, he becomes disinterested in you, and you have to regrind a gajillion more thralls to enrage him again to face him when you are ready.

Ten steps forward and, like, 40 steps back.

So keeping the heat and always keeping him arownd saves you more time.

You should read my post on experimenting with the conversion theory. It works but it requires guessing when your lich comes out. So far, I've had liches who pop out on every mission and others where I have yet to find them and I've alreay unlocked 2 mods for her. She was shy suffice to say it is not a newer player friendly method. 

Lich conversion is unreliable on many different levels therefore I cannot recommend it. It is best done solo and usually when only looking out for numero uno rather than interacting with others.

[-CdG-Zilchy]

13 hours ago, DesertEagle1280 said:

It is not in my best interest to stab my lich if I don't already know 2/3 requiems IMO - it risks leveling him needlessly, and if I get position 1 right I also lock in the known 2nd mod's position (either it's in 2 or 3, and if the stab doesn't give 2/3 that means known #2 is in pos 3, and unknown is pos 2).  Also it levels up my lich which only makes killing him more of a pain, and the benefit in murmur progress isn't worth the PITA it results in later. Since leveling the lich doesn't have any other benefit - eg increasing the ele % - which would make higher level more desired, I refuse to stab my lich.  I agree it shafts the rest of the team, and DE should find a way to fix that - but that's not my problem, that's DE's problem. They should either let me send him away without leveling him up, or give a failed kill some appreciable benefit besides making it a chore to kill him later, have him run away after being ignored for a couple downs, something like that.

Mate once you are strong enough to not care if your lich levels up the murmur gain increase is absolutely worth it.

[-CdG-Zilchy]

I take about 1 hour per lich, this is what I have found works. Mobile Defense, CrossFire, Survival and Capture. Capture is the only mode that reliably spawns thralls after you complete your mission objective so keep that in mind. In missions that do not require me to perform a genocide I leave the enemies alive, save the spawning thralls. Once the lich spawns they will convert all these enemies you ignored into lich's. It's easy to get 20+ per mission doing this. I always stab my lich to more quickly zero in on what 3 I need and what order and levelling up the lich increases murmur gain as well, well worth 1 extra minute to kill them next time as well as making the lich take new territory so I never have to farm defense, interception etc. I do this in solo. Usually the lich is dead in 8-10 missions.

Edited November 14, 2019 by -CdG-Zilchy

[Remedyheart]

55 minutes ago, -CdG-Zilchy said:

I take about 1 hour per lich, this is what I have found works. Mobile Defense, CrossFire, Survival and Capture. Capture is the only mode that reliably spawns thralls after you complete your mission objective so keep that in mind. In missions that do not require me to perform a genocide I leave the enemies alive, save the spawning thralls. Once the lich spawns they will convert all these enemies you ignored into lich's. It's easy to get 20+ per mission doing this. I always stab my lich to more quickly zero in on what 3 I need and what order and levelling up the lich increases murmur gain as well, well worth 1 extra minute to kill them next time as well as making the lich take new territory so I never have to farm defense, interception etc. I do this in solo. Usually the lich is dead in 8-10 missions.

Excellent point.Let's not forget that rank influences thrall spawn rate. So down time after stabbing an enraged lich becomes more beneficial.

Edited November 14, 2019 by Remedyheart

[-CdG-Zilchy]

Just now, Remedyheart said:

Excellent point.Let's not forget that rank influences thrall spawn rate. So down with after stabbing an enraged lich becomes more beneficial.

Yeh it's more of an issue for lower level or newer players I think. I can easily drop my lich in a few minutes at rank 5 like many others but I'm well aware that other players may find them a bit tough to want to do that.