It only took 2 weeks for people to lose interest in Kuva Lich gameplay

[-AiLuoLi-]

43 minutes ago, Emulad0or said:

Actually, I just dont extract... Have been working on this, last few times, the one refusing to kill the lich had to abort because the rest of the squad would not allow him to finish the mission without stabing his lich...

Also, lets turn this around, if you are not willing to stab your lich, play solo

Just don't finish the mission? Plenty of mobile games to play while waiting for the others to give up and extract/abort. 

I'll counter it with community's favorite "Everything goes in pub. Want something done your way? Go solo/pre-made squad."

[Proffebolter]

 

[1st-1]

il y a 13 minutes, TheBlackShawarma a dit :

I promise that I won’t do that anymore! Do you know why? Because I already collected all 13 weapons.

I’ll explain why people do this: they’re not afraid to die, they’re afraid of 5th lvl lich with skills such as CURSED GROUND + POISON CLOUD + TELEPORT. Try to kill this at  5th level and you will understand everything yourself.

Chroma - redeemer (heavy attack build), with a "good enough" build, you can kill any lich (lvl 5) in 1 or 2 heavy attack with the redeemer, chroma is rly hard to kill so you should be safe, and you won't even have to go melee because.. redeemer ! ❤️

So far, i've read few of you saying "go solo", i mean.. RLY ? in a multiplayer game you just tell people to go solo ?

and for others who just don't want to kill their lich no matter the reason, why YOU don't go solo then ? i don't understand.. you know you'll just prevent others from getting their lich, why you still do it then ? i just want to know the WHY

[TheBlackShawarma]

2 минуты назад, 1st-1 сказал:

So far, i've read few of you saying "go solo"

I did not say that.

 

3 минуты назад, 1st-1 сказал:

and for others who just don't want to kill their lich no matter the reason, why YOU don't go solo then ?

Personally, I always killed my lich and helped kill liches of other players.

[1st-1]

Oh, no , i wasn't talking about you for these parts BlackShawarma 🙂 its for everybody in the topic who said that 😛

[Leyvonne]

23 minutes ago, TheBlackShawarma said:

No, not everyone will be able to kill 5 lvl lich, in which case need to limit his level to 3-4.

How is this relevant to what I said? Not playing in a public group still leaves several grouping options (friends, clan, premade) if the person can't or doesn't want to solo.

[KnightOwl_]

I just put the person who doesn’t poke their lich on ignore after the mission.  I’m hoping it means I won’t group up with them again and quite frankly don’t want to. 

[-QUILL_PETER-]

1 hour ago, 1st-1 said:

i want to talk about something I couldnt be asked to actually search the forums to see if it had already been brought up ad nauseum.

 

[Kriegerurteil]

Easy Fix: have the Lich just teleport on the players orbiter and kill him there if he doesn't stab the lich. Because why would the Lich just stand around if the tenno he is after is not coming? Or maybe teleport to the extraction and face the player there so people can't pussie out of the encounter.

[1st-1]

il y a 2 minutes, -QUILL_PETER- a dit :

 

And if you start by reading my 1st post and understand what i wanted to say, u'd see its ironical ... u_u

you're one of these "i don't kill my lich" guy right ? ❤️

[-QUILL_PETER-]

1 minute ago, 1st-1 said:

And if you start by reading my 1st post and understand what i wanted to say, u'd see its ironical ... u_u

you're one of these "i don't kill my lich" guy right ? ❤️

No I hate those people. Liches are for people who are deep in the game and can handle them. If you're a newb and can't then you have no business starting one.

[Test-995]

Should i make the account just to spam this kind of thread?

[Anarbitrio]

Next time I'm playing soccer I'm going to hold the ball and refuse to kick it. Then I'm going to tell everyone else that if they can't respect my decision they can play soccer solo.

[Toran]

Before the thrall changes there was exactly one good reason to not kill your lich: if you were very close to reveal a mod. Resetting Lich aggro and having to wait 3-4 missions for the next spawn, wasn't worth it.

With the new system and lengthy reveal time for the third mod, it no longer matters, on the contrary! These sleepwalkers insisting on their personal right to be dumb increase the grind for all involved team mates.

The real drama is that DE doesn't do anything to improve the situation despite numeral propositions. This crappy update shouldn't have happened in the 1st place...

Edited November 20, 2019 by Toran

[Emulad0or]

1 hour ago, -AiLuoLi- said:

Just don't finish the mission? Plenty of mobile games to play while waiting for the others to give up and extract/abort. 

I'll counter it with community's favorite "Everything goes in pub. Want something done your way? Go solo/pre-made squad."

Hey, I'm playing a JRPG on PS4 that took me 30 hours to finish chapter 1, I'm not in a hurry, I'll just be playing that while I wait...

And, since everything goes in pub, if you want to extract, go solo/pre-made squad

[Emolition]

1 hour ago, NinjaZeku said:

You don't even need to stab your Lich, though.

Just stand in front of them, get killed by their regular attacks, bam, Lich leaves without a rank up.

Yeah he did that to me today when  i solo with nyx didn't hit 4 fast enough and he instant killed me and left before  I could stab him =(

[Aadi880]

1 hour ago, tyreens said:

And they even succeed with it when there are really people who defend them 😄

If you think my post was "defending DE", nah mate, you haven't even seen what actually is defending bs is.

I think you are using a very loose definition of "beta". The one warframe is in is called "perpetual beta" or the banana principle(which ever you like to call it). Almost every software that constantly receives updates to existing systems in the programs are in "perpetual beta", whether or not the DE says it is or does not. Even CSGO is considered to be in perpetual beta when it comes to map testing by the public players.

[DoomFruit]

32 minutes ago, Aadi880 said:

If you think my post was "defending DE", nah mate, you haven't even seen what actually is defending bs is.

I think you are using a very loose definition of "beta". The one warframe is in is called "perpetual beta" or the banana principle(which ever you like to call it). Almost every software that constantly receives updates to existing systems in the programs are in "perpetual beta", whether or not the DE says it is or does not. Even CSGO is considered to be in perpetual beta when it comes to map testing by the public players.

No, he's using a tighter (and more correct) definition for "beta software". Alpha is when you have enough features to consider it a version release and test it internally. Beta is when you ship a build to a limited subset of dedicated beta testers outside of the core team (sometimes an internal group for large organisations, other times it's contracted out to a separate company), who then collaborate closely with the devs on problems and solutions. Release (sometimes called gold) is when you make it available to the general public. Some groups skip the beta phase due to lack of resources and have their core developers do all the testing.

We're not alpha testers - we aren't the core devs. We're not the beta testers either, as there's no close collaboration between us and the devs on any aspect of the game. We are, instead, the general public.

EDIT: So, if this game is indeed a beta version, who are the testers and why are the general public getting a beta instead of a release version?

Edited November 20, 2019 by DoomFruit

[tyreens]

vor 43 Minuten schrieb Aadi880:

If you think my post was "defending DE", nah mate, you haven't even seen what actually is defending bs is.

I think you are using a very loose definition of "beta". The one warframe is in is called "perpetual beta" or the banana principle(which ever you like to call it). Almost every software that constantly receives updates to existing systems in the programs are in "perpetual beta", whether or not the DE says it is or does not. Even CSGO is considered to be in perpetual beta when it comes to map testing by the public players.

I know what a Continuous Beta aka Perpetual beta is. I don't want to go into a comparison with another game but cs:go has at least a beta client. In the f2p gaming industry the continous beta is what i said in my previous post: A way that you cannot be held responsible for the quality and save some bucks on QC at the expense of the players. There is even a german word for it in relation to continuous beta that descripes what is happening here: bananaware. There are many controversial opinions about perpetual betas in the developer scene but the fact is that it is not working for warframe / players.

Edited November 20, 2019 by tyreens

[DoomFruit]

19 hours ago, ShadowExodus said:

Uhhh, gauss doesn't need a buff lol, he's fine as he is.

On PC, yeah. On console... who knows how many releases behind they've been until now.

4 hours ago, SneakyErvin said:

And the 1 in 4 is huge for content designed as "endgame".

The number is not that 1/4 of all players have made a "lich", it's that only 1/4 of players who have already reached the "endgame" point wanted anything to do with this most recent addition. That's a very low engagement rate, especially when it's the only new thing for a long time.

[MirageKnight]

6 hours ago, DoomFruit said:

Yes there is a way to make confrontations dangerous. It's called rebalancing the game. The problem we have here is power creep and massive bloat in the form of umpteen zillion warframes and mods with various interactions that nobody bothered to think through. There's a very well-defined point at which this game's balance was fatally wounded. It's when corrupted mods got introduced. Before that, some team compositions gave more advantages than others, but that could theoretically have been fixed given enough attention. Note how Archwing, which was made from a completely clean slate where nothing carries over (except aura mods), is far better balanced than the main game.

Playing Russian Roulette with 1 empty chamber is not a solution. It's not fun, it's not a challenge and it is most certainly not a deserved loss.

Spot on. Warframe is in dire need of a massive balance pass. The problem is that Steve and Scott can't be arsed to do it.

[Ikusias]

So far all I know about the Lich sistem only encourages me to steer as far away from it as it feels like pure manure compared to all the hipe DE gave it

[SneakyErvin]

10 minutes ago, DoomFruit said:

The number is not that 1/4 of all players have made a "lich", it's that only 1/4 of players who have already reached the "endgame" point wanted anything to do with this most recent addition. That's a very low engagement rate, especially when it's the only new thing for a long time.

No actually it is 1/4 out of all active players that have spawned atleast one lich. The percentage is higher than that within the part of the community that is ready for "endgame". We dont know how much higher, just that it is higher because we dont know how many of the remaining 75% are ready for "endgame" and simply ignored liches. 

I have no clue where you got the idea from that these 25% were 25% out of the players who have reached the "endgame" point, since no statistic whatsoever tells us anything about that. By your logic everyone would be endgame ready since the 25% is based on total players.

[Aadi880]

19 minutes ago, DoomFruit said:

Beta is when you ship a build to a limited subset of dedicated beta testers outside of the core team (sometimes an internal group for large organisations, other times it's contracted out to a separate company), who then collaborate closely with the devs on problems and solutions. Release (sometimes called gold) is when you make it available to the general public.

Beta is not limited to people who are outsourced to test their build. Video games do have "open beta" phase where the software is made public and used, where the players are used to give feedback and find bugs. One example would be Ironsight, which is still in open beta for over 2 years. (that game was released in 2014, only to die and come back again in 2017-ish).

 

25 minutes ago, DoomFruit said:

EDIT: So, if this game is indeed a beta version, who are the testers and why are the general public getting a beta instead of a release version?

Players are better in finding bugs than the staff are, simply because there is a power in numbers. 200k+ people are more likely to find bugs than 300-400 employees. This is common practice when game developers plan to release new content that they never introduced before. If you meant something else and I misunderstood this or the other quote, do tell me.

 

24 minutes ago, tyreens said:

I know what a Continuous Beta aka Perpetual beta is. I don't want to go into a comparison with another game but cs:go has at least a beta client. In the f2p gaming industry the continous beta is what i said in my previous post: A way that you cannot be held responsible for the quality and save some bucks on QC at the expense of the players. There is even a german word for it in relation to continuous beta that descripes what is happening here: bananaware. There are many controversial opinions about perpetual betas in the developer scene but the fact is that it is not working for warframe / players.

Well, in case of CSGO, the beta client is getting obsolete, simply because, well, players aren't using it...? I mean, look at Valve releasing the R8 and did not use the beta client, nor did they did with DangerZone or with the Negev, AUG and SG changes (or at least, I never saw them do it for dangerzone and those guns). Valve probably realized that the feedback they were getting were not enough to test their changes, and went on releasing it on the main game and not the beta client. 

Why am I telling this? Because this "works" for valve. They can do changes (usually after the majors) and are quick to respond with feedback and complaints, resulting in almost weekly balance changes. It gives them the feedback they need and they have the force to utilize this. Moreover, I agree with you that this is not working well for warframe, because the balance changes DE does often feel slow and/or are not enough for a weekly hotfix. There has also been a lack of communication (somewhat), which (hopefully) will be addressed in the upcoming devstream. But I still remain skeptic.
 

[DoomFruit]

34 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

I have no clue where you got the idea from that these 25% were 25% out of the players who have reached the "endgame" point, since no statistic whatsoever tells us anything about that. By your logic everyone would be endgame ready since the 25% is based on total players.

From the steam data: 3.8% at rank 17, 0.9% have made a lich. As already mentioned, MR17 is only a guess for what counts as "endgame" based upon what the highest MR locked item is. If you're counting total players, you want the 0.9% number.

Again, if you have another source, then list it here. We're using steam data because it's all we have.