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In Preperation Of The Ps4 Debut, Can We Just Scrap Stamina And Start Over?


b4dkarm4
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Im sorry, I know this is probably going to be a fairly flamebaitish topic to start with.

 

I can imagine (thats all I can do in this regard) that for a game dev its got to be hard to come to terms with this but, the stamina mechanic sucks and its fairly stupid. I know that kind of blows, its a bitter pill to swallow, but its got to be said.

 

You have very conflicting ideologies at play here with the central characters of the tenno. I know Im not the only one that sees this and probably am not the first person to bring this up either. You have clips and trailers all over youtube lauding the special nature of the tenno, the ninja like movement and general advanced nature of their suits. Teleportation, conjuring fire from nothing, raising the dead, making oneself impervious to almost all negative effects including bullets. These feats are nothing for a tenno to do.

 

But god help us if we try and sprint for more than a few meters. Oh god anything but that!

 

Of course we can extend our sprinting distance ...... by SLIDING ON OUR BUTTS.

 

Seriously ..... DE.

 

Scrap stamina, it does not fit in this game.

 

I dont envy you guys, honestly. You really have kinda painted yourself into a corner with this one. You have stamina mods all over the game, so removing the stamina mechanic all together would create issues and tough questions later on for new players. If you replace stamina with something else like maybe a frame specific quicktravel dodge or short range teleport you make other frames that already sport some sort of dash/quicktravel ability moot and you'll &!$$ a lot of players off.

 

I dont have any solid solutions and for that I am sorry, but I still stand by my opinion that stamina needs to go. Its a stupid mechanic that doesn't fit into the theme you are pushing.

 

Sorry! :(

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Increase base speed, increase sprint speed. Sprint shouldn't take stamina. Give dodge invulnerability frames and over all speed boost, dodge drains stamina. Have blocking absorb all or at least 90% of all incoming damage, blocking drains stamina per hit basis. Increase amount of base stamina, increase regen rate and regen delay. 

Keep all current speed/stamina mods.

 

Gameplay should now be faster and not rely on zorens entirely.

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I remember seeing a side-step dodge feature instead of the very slow and not entirely effective roll feature being suggested a while ago, could be a good start.
Stamina for sprinting is ridiculous, realistic games like Skyrim or Far Cry 3 actually STOP being realistic because of it. And this is Ninjas. I'd rather go for the Ninja Gaiden approach on mobility, or even Tenchu, at least I could sprint and forward roll double jump without stamina.

Example, in an unmodded Skyrim, you are the Dragonborn, level 81, killed everything and everyone in the land, dragons fall down in one hit of your daedric two handed sword, but god forbid you try to sprint from the entrance gate of Whiterun to the Companions' mead hall. I'm fat and I could sprint that without losing my breath, honestly.

Stamina systems have a purpose, and I guess it sort of stops speed runners (except zorens, cleavers, quick frames with Rush and/or Nova worm holing around or Volt or anyone with decent knowledge of wallrunning impulse jumping), yea, except it doesn't.
If you don't want people to speed run, make it so it isn't more beneficial to run through as an invisible Loki with no enemies even being aware of your presence than it is to be an effective space killing ninja on a mercenary mission.

Harder to do than to say, I suppose, but that's the challenge, isn't it?
And there have been quite a few suggestions on it.

Stamina is a good mechanic for meleeing and advanced manuevers maybe. If it made block more useful that'd be excellent as well.

Instead of fighting speed runners, my suggestion would be to give them what they want, give them a game mode where rushing is beneficial, and the enemies are higher level than usual so you REALLY don't want to be shot. Like when integrity is compromised after destroying a reactor, but a whole mission like that and make that mode rewarding.
Also revamp a little how experience assigning works, so getting experience is more viable than just survival and defense as the simplest ways.

Edited by Gregio
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So what you are saying is running, either it being up a wall, across a huge room, running, jumping, flipping over enemies, and then swinging swords around like a mad man/woman... Shouldn't take any stamina away from you?

I'm sorry, but even in a suit that is worn to heighten a persons reflexes and abilities would do some wear and tear on the person inside the suit. So I see no reason to simply get rid of it. It's a viable mechanic.

Next thing you're going to ask is take away the stagger effect/knock down that the enemies do because we are in a high powered suit of armor. Knock down recovery does need to be fixed though.

Stamina is fine to me. But if the recovery time was a tad quicker (even without the use of mods) then that would be great.

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The problem is not the stamina system itself. It was working very well before the recent updates.

 

They stated in livestream that they changed the stamina regen because we should pay attention to our stamina rate and how we use it (mods). I have to admit that, when I heard that, I was kind of feeling like I was punished for something that is not my fault. I was just playing the game the way it was.

 

Anyway...

 

What they forgot is that we only have 10 slots available, 6 for people with 4 powers/no forma. So yeah cool, I understand I should use stamina mods now but... just tell me how? Because, I don't want to loose Focus, or Stretch, or those mods considered as the "basic build" for your frame. With the power race, that is also your own system, how am I supposed to do that?

 

Yeah, so it's simple. You want to make us use stamina mods, just give us the possibility to equip those. Because right now, we just can't.

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Revert stamina changes yes plz, or make a separate screen where we can equip them independent of our power mods' energy points

Speaking of upgrade scrern, i have 27 pages completely off the left side of my screen, so i can't scroll bag thru those without reopening and hitting next 27 times

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Increase base speed, increase sprint speed. Sprint shouldn't take stamina. Give dodge invulnerability frames and over all speed boost, dodge drains stamina. Have blocking absorb all or at least 90% of all incoming damage, blocking drains stamina per hit basis. Increase amount of base stamina, increase regen rate and regen delay. 

Keep all current speed/stamina mods.

 

Gameplay should now be faster and not rely on zorens entirely.

Pretty much this.  Action RPGs have been doing that for a long time now and it works.  I don't even know what their vision of stamina was to be, but with U10 it is clear that they don't have one in the first place. 

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Now the rushers can't rush!

Wrong, the gap between the people using Zorencopters and Fangarangs compared to non-slideslashing frames just widened, causing a bigger gap between rushers and other players and being completely counter-intuitive

Edited by Aishi
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Hey, anything to stop the speedrunners. Am I right?

Speedrunners are hardly affected by stamina as long as they have a pair of level 9 Zorens on them.

Hell, even during the first part of U10 when stamina was nerfed into the ground, speedrunners were the only ones who were unaffected, since they were the only ones who could equip Stamina mods without sacrificing something that they wanted or needed.

If you want to stop rushers, then remove the Coptering ability. Slamming down on Stamina will cause the exact opposite of what it was intended to do.

Edited by SortaRandom
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 Too bad it is futile to try to force people to play a way they don't want to.

 

It's not futile.

The original stamina changed showed it can be done but DE didnt stick to their guns.

 

I say we go back to that original change and let the people that want to speed to load up those stamina mods.

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So what you are saying is running, either it being up a wall, across a huge room, running, jumping, flipping over enemies, and then swinging swords around like a mad man/woman... Shouldn't take any stamina away from you?

I'm sorry, but even in a suit that is worn to heighten a persons reflexes and abilities would do some wear and tear on the person inside the suit. So I see no reason to simply get rid of it. It's a viable mechanic.

Next thing you're going to ask is take away the stagger effect/knock down that the enemies do because we are in a high powered suit of armor. Knock down recovery does need to be fixed though.

Stamina is fine to me. But if the recovery time was a tad quicker (even without the use of mods) then that would be great.

Thing is, I'm pretty sure warframes aren't suits, they're some kind of symbionttechnocyte doodads, meaning the person "inside" is long gone. And besides, how does it make sense that a super powered cyborg whatever can only sprint for like 10 seconds at a time if that. I'm not in good physical condition and even I can sprint for 2 minutes or longer, haven't tested in a while.

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Yeah, so it's simple. You want to make us use stamina mods, just give us the possibility to equip those. Because right now, we just can't.

 

Yeah it is simple, if you want the advantage of better stamina usage you have to forgo another advantage. You can equip the mods, you just want the benefits without making the tradeoff.

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