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-AI-Silvertap

Hydroid needs a little change

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Since Khora pilfering mod, Hydroid got a bit useless (i think that at least)...

And now with melee rework he becomes more tankie, he doesn't have bad status, i mean he has a bit of armor witch helps for survive a bit more.

So we can have a Hydroid without a rework, but would nice to increase his base armor a bit, maybe a 300 base armor, also would be nice for his1 and 4 to be faster to cast when no charged, a fast cast on these skills would provide more survivability, u may sugest that i use natural talent mod, but i think it would be a waste of a mod space (contraditory?). Another thing that would be nice is to reduce the drain when use 2 for more then one time in roll.

A fun strategy that i have been using is to catch enemies with 3+2, and after i regroup the enemies i undo 3 and kill then when they are on the floor. If 4 was faster and cheaper i could add that to the mix 3+4+2, but it is too slow and wierd...

That is how i'm feeling hydroid should be played lately, what u guys think about?

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all i think is that Hydroid is super weak/clunky and he really need a rework. Full rework, without wasting time on buffing old skills or etc. 

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Puddle Boy needs the Pablo Treatment. 

And the farm-mod stacking nerf should be reverted. This nerf was a reaction to a much deeper problem with Warframe's Game Design.

Want less players to farm the crap put of warframe?

Give players something that will cause them to reciprocate a desired response. 

Want players to not rush objectives and skip everything?

Again it goes back down to:

   Giving <---> Reciprocation.

Make content that provokes/rewards thought, planning, observation, experimentation, and adaptation.

So many people want to love Warframe, that DE doesn't even have to wait for community members to ask. DE can just build it, and players would come.

The current content only gives rewards for chores completed, enemy kills, and/or speed-running. Thus the reciprocated player response is.... (take a guess).

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11 hours ago, Ekemeister said:

Puddle Boy needs the Pablo Treatment. 

And the farm-mod stacking nerf should be reverted. This nerf was a reaction to a much deeper problem with Warframe's Game Design.

Want less players to farm the crap put of warframe?

Give players something that will cause them to reciprocate a desired response. 

Want players to not rush objectives and skip everything?

Again it goes back down to:

   Giving <---> Reciprocation.

Make content that provokes/rewards thought, planning, observation, experimentation, and adaptation.

So many people want to love Warframe, that DE doesn't even have to wait for community members to ask. DE can just build it, and players would come.

The current content only gives rewards for chores completed, enemy kills, and/or speed-running. Thus the reciprocated player response is.... (take a guess).

Farm mod nerf was reverted a  few updates ago. But agree that he needs Pablo

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On 2019-12-01 at 4:11 PM, -AI-Silvertap said:

Since Khora pilfering mod, Hydroid got a bit useless (i think that at least)...

I'm not arguing against some improvements, but seeing as how he's 100% for extra loot and Khora's only 55%, with an extra augment, he's still the king of pilfering, unless you're trying to dismember too.

Edited by TheArcSet
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4 minutes ago, TheArcSet said:

I'm not arguing against some improvements, but seeing as how he's 100% for extra loot and Khora's only 55%, with an extra augment, he's still the king of pilfering, unless you're trying to dismember too.

Alright, u r right, but even so i would play a khora insted, and the funny thing is, that i have seen way more khoras then hydroids at regular plays and also in farms.

Although some changes woudn't be very bad for him too...

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Has he had a rework?. Started to play him a little (him, Baruuk & Khora are frames i want to try) and quite enjoy it but does anyone find undertow is a bit underwhelming?. Feels like its just a escapefrombeingsurrounded type of ability?

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1 hour ago, NigglesAU said:

Has he had a rework?. Started to play him a little (him, Baruuk & Khora are frames i want to try) and quite enjoy it but does anyone find undertow is a bit underwhelming?. Feels like its just a escapefrombeingsurrounded type of ability?

around the time his prime was released undertow was made into a weird infinitely scaling death puddle and his 1 and 4 were given charge mechanics and a way to see the area being aimed at

also he got a kraken that appears when u use his 4, except it does nothing! it just looks like a weird lump of meat that pops up for a second

issue is, being a puddle is boring and doesnt fit the game, also. that kraken should do something

Edited by TKDancer
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I'm with @Melanholic7 on this one. Hydroid needs a full on rework, not just a little change. And by rework I mean a proper rework, not that out-of-the-blue cynical tiny mechanics change he got just before his Prime came out because they needed to make it seem like the PA wasn't going to be a total waste of money. Hydroid's powers are very clunky, boring and just not very good in general and those tweaks made them worse IMO. They are a relic of the old days of Warframe and simply do not fit with the current fast paced state of the game.

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On 2019-12-03 at 7:03 AM, Ekemeister said:

And the farm-mod stacking nerf should be reverted. This nerf was a reaction to a much deeper problem with Warframe's Game Design.

DE don't want to go anywhere near those types of problems, just like how they won't touch the terrible enemy scaling problem. They're afraid of messing up the game in a way that can't be reversed so they just settle for band-aid nerfs. They won't change it back.

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10 hours ago, NigglesAU said:

Has he had a rework?. Started to play him a little (him, Baruuk & Khora are frames i want to try) and quite enjoy it but does anyone find undertow is a bit underwhelming?. Feels like its just a escapefrombeingsurrounded type of ability?

You know, Undertow can kill 165 corrupted heavy guns, it just teakes about 10 secs, witch is very long for the game standarts... It really makes me think that his current skill sets aren't really bad, but almos all of it needs a few tweeks...

Edited by -AI-Silvertap

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1 hour ago, -AI-Silvertap said:

You know, Undertow can kill 165 corrupted heavy guns, it just teakes about 10 secs, witch is very long for the game standarts... It really makes me think that his current skill sets aren't really bad, but almos all of it needs a few tweeks...

Undertow is an incredibly unpopular ability purely because of how it works. It slows down the game to a screeching halt. While DE may have buffed the scaling damage in that cynically timed update, they did not address the core issue; Hydroid is very boring. DE clearly didn't want to do an actual rework for him so they just buffed his puddle and basically made every other power revolve around it, even though the one thing everyone had been saying for years was that the puddle was stupid and should be removed.

Tempest Barrage is uselss without its augment and even then its still useless compared to a lot of other frame abilites.

Tidal Surge is janky to use and is basically Excal's old Slash Dash.

Undertow slows down gameplay to a snails pace, doesn't really fit the new large open tilesets/maps that DE are makingn and is just boring to play.

Tentacle Swarm is the same as Tempest Barrage in the fact that it is useless without its augment and it is just not a good power since you can only really use it in tight corridors, which as mentioned before DE are phasing out with the reworked tilesets.

It's why he needs a full on rework instead of tweaks because his skill set is very old and simply not that great when compared to other frames that do the same thing. He's another resident of the "Everything you can do, others can do better" category.

Edited by TheGodofWiFi
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55 minutes ago, TheGodofWiFi said:

It's why he needs a full on rework instead of tweaks because his skill set is very old and simply not that great when compared to other frames that do the same thing. He's another resident of the "Everything you can do, others can do better" category.

Look, i kind of agree with you, but Hydroid kit kind of makes sense, what i think is that it just needs to be better... I'm not totally agains a full rework, but i see Hydroid more like a thematic frame, he doesn't need to be reeeeally good, but he should be better then he is right.

I can play him using all his abillities, of course i needed to do a full umbral build 190 str + Rage + Arcane Guardian + Arcane Grace + Magus repair + Melee in hand 90% of the time, i can hunt lv5 lich with him (of course, i control the adds, and use a primary or secundary to kill the lich it self)... His undertow and tidal charce are fun to use and cam be combined, i don't use undertow to kill, i use it for defence, for knockdown enemies and for catch enemies, tidal surge is a second panic button or a way to move undertow. i can cast tempest barrage and tentacle swarm to CC and also use then inside undertow. I see a synergy in everything there, it is also fun, but not very strong, specially when i have to use a umbral build to be more confortable.

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23 hours ago, -AI-Silvertap said:

Look, i kind of agree with you, but Hydroid kit kind of makes sense, what i think is that it just needs to be better... I'm not totally agains a full rework, but i see Hydroid more like a thematic frame, he doesn't need to be reeeeally good, but he should be better then he is right.

You can't really make Hydroid better in his current state because of the way his powers work. Buffing up damage and calling it a day again just isn't enough. Hydroid's skill set is just too janky and boring to be enjoyed properly. You know a frame is in dire need of help when the only reason it hasn't completely sunk beneath the Swamps of Total Obsolescence is because it has one augment that makes loot less of a pain to acquire. Even that isn't really saving him now that other frames like Khora are getting loot drop augments on top of being generally more fun to use. Like I said, everything Hydroid can do others can do better at far less cost of time, in-game energy and fun. Even you said yourself you see more Khora's than Hydroids in farms these days.

Hydroid can only be improved if he is given a proper rework to suit the current state of the game.

23 hours ago, -AI-Silvertap said:

I see a synergy in everything there, it is also fun, but not very strong, specially when i have to use a umbral build to be more confortable.

Synergy is nothing if its not also fun. If you find Hydroid's current state fun to play then thats great. But the vast majority of people do not find gameplay centered around sitting in a puddle fun because of how fast paced the game is and how other frames acheive what Hydroid does but only far easier and in a more exciting way. The forced synergy around the puddle is only there because DE wanted to sell his Prime Access and either didn't have the time or want to give him a full on rework.

Edited by TheGodofWiFi

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