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Are Vanilla and Prime Warframes, Tenno Weapons, and Sentinels made at the same time?


(XBOX)YoungGunn82
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So for example when they made Grendel, they also made his Prime at the same time; just saved him away for later. Same with all the other vanilla weapons / Sentinels that are eligible to be primed..  I'm convinced that this is the case because of the absolute out of nowhere release of Baza Prime. Good theory or nah? 

Edited by (XB1)SixGunLove
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4 minutes ago, (XB1)SixGunLove said:

I'm convinced that this is the case because of the absolute out of nowhere release of Baza Prime. Good theory or nah? 

“How many licks does it take to get to the center of a Tootsie Pop?”

Ask Mr. Owl.  We all have our theories that attempt to explain why the lore is the reverse of the actual game development.

If you really want me to “e-bloviate” what I believe, I’ll be happy to oblige.  Lmk

 

Edited by (PS4)Silverback73
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Just now, (XB1)SixGunLove said:

I'm convinced that this is the case because of the absolute out of nowhere release of Baza Prime. Good theory or nah? 

as far as I understand it, Tenno weapons are simplified versions of Orokin gear that are simplified to make mass producing them easier and cheaper. they are more modern, but because corners are cut in order to allow them to be made in great numbers, they aren't as good as the originals. weapon manufacturers do this IRL too. for example, the original AK rifles had milled receivers: they worked, but it took more machining and therefore more expense to make them. then Kalashnikov switched to more simple stamped receivers that aren't heavily machined. they are faster and cheaper to produce as a result of this. over time, rolling changes are made to a line of weapons until the design is as perfect as it's going to be.

considering that the Tenno are an insurgent force that require weapons more than gold trim (fashionframe not withstanding), it's more important and far better to give everyone cheap guns than it is to give just a few people really expensive guns. form what i can gather the Orokin weapons are constantly being rediscovered, so someone, somewhere is trawling through Void towers we don't know about, finding schematics for original, prime weapons. we then use those schematics to make the prime weapons for ourselves.

the lore also supports that primes came first. after the fall of the Orokin Empire, all their tech was genetically locked, and the only people who could access it were already dead. no Orokin weapon materials = no Orokin guns can be made, but people who know the designs can recreate them to some degree using inferior materials, and sacrificing unimportant aspects like decoration in favour of making a simpler, more practical design.

TL;DR: primes came first, non-primes came after because we needed simple-effective guns.

 

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11 minutes ago, (XB1)SixGunLove said:

 because of the absolute out of nowhere release of Baza Prime.


Undoubtedly they'll have a whole bunch assets created and saved up for when it makes sense.
Whether they're all made in the same week, month, or year is anyone's guess.

I imagine there's giant chunks of game just waiting to be fit in the story.
Probably not altogether finished, but ready to be dusted off and snapped in when it applies.


Good example, The Queens were teased for Yeeears.
I wonder how many of those starting assets had been mothballed for like, 3 or more years straight.
Maybe not, but I could see that being a thing.

Edited by kapn655321
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6 minutes ago, magnakoji said:

I have a feeling that Prime gear is treated like augment mods: They are thought of and created after the base is already well implemented in the game.

This. My guess is (asuming we are speaking of development process and not in-game lore) that devs don't really focus on the primed version of the frames/weapons the moment they are making them. They just release their normal versions and then start making their prime counterpart later on.

Edited by General-Pacman
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from a Business perspective, it would be bad business to spend the man hours long before you have any plan of selling the result of it.
so, you can be fairly certain that no, all sorts of different variants of some Equipment are not produced preemptively, as that would not be good business.

things are often tried in Game Development and not everything ends up being shipped, but this is the type of ""content"" that exists strictly for business reasons.

Edited by taiiat
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2 minutes ago, (PS4)robotwars7 said:

TL;DR: primes came first, non-primes came after because we needed simple-effective guns.

Robo I understand the lore of prime and vanilla. I was speaking from a developer point if view. Do you think the release of Baza Prime is sufficient evidence that 

 

4 minutes ago, General-Pacman said:

They just release their normal versions and then start making their prime counterpart later on.

Or is thier prime counter part made along side the vanilla?

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5 minutes ago, (PS4)robotwars7 said:

as far as I understand it, Tenno weapons are simplified versions of Orokin gear that are simplified to make mass producing them easier and cheaper. they are more modern, but because corners are cut in order to allow them to be made in great numbers, they aren't as good as the originals. weapon manufacturers do this IRL too. for example, the original AK rifles had milled receivers: they worked, but it took more machining and therefore more expense to make them. then Kalashnikov switched to more simple stamped receivers that aren't heavily machined. they are faster and cheaper to produce as a result of this. over time, rolling changes are made to a line of weapons until the design is as perfect as it's going to be.

considering that the Tenno are an insurgent force that require weapons more than gold trim (fashionframe not withstanding), it's more important and far better to give everyone cheap guns than it is to give just a few people really expensive guns. form what i can gather the Orokin weapons are constantly being rediscovered, so someone, somewhere is trawling through Void towers we don't know about, finding schematics for original, prime weapons. we then use those schematics to make the prime weapons for ourselves.

the lore also supports that primes came first. after the fall of the Orokin Empire, all their tech was genetically locked, and the only people who could access it were already dead. no Orokin weapon materials = no Orokin guns can be made, but people who know the designs can recreate them to some degree using inferior materials, and sacrificing unimportant aspects like decoration in favour of making a simpler, more practical design.

TL;DR: primes came first, non-primes came after because we needed simple-effective guns.

 

Lore-wise yes, but the question was about the game and asset creation.

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5 minutes ago, (XB1)SixGunLove said:

Robo I understand the lore of prime and vanilla. I was speaking from a developer point if view. Do you think the release of Baza Prime is sufficient evidence that 

oh. lol and I typed all that out xD

 in that case, I imagine they design the vanilla first and then just imagine slapping elaborate gold shapes on it later on. it's what I would do anyway.

Edited by (PS4)robotwars7
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1 minute ago, (XB1)SixGunLove said:

Or is thier prime counter part made along side the vanilla?

I obviously can't be 100% sure, but in my opinion that's probably not the case. Why? Because it's just a waste of resources to make something and leave it on a shelf to release it months (or even years) later, specially when talking about software. I'm a developer myself, and i can assure you that development deadlines tend to be quite harsh, so you normally can't spare time to do something like that. 

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8 minutes ago, taiiat said:

from a Business perspective, it would be bad business to spend the man hours long before you have any plan of selling the result of it.
so, you can be fairly certain that no, all sorts of different variants of some Equipment are not produced preemptively, as that would not be good business.

things are often tried in Game Development and not everything ends up being shipped, but this is the type of ""content"" that exists strictly for business reasons.

With Prime Warframes I get that. But what about weapons and Sentinels? They are considerably less intricate and probably easier to design next to thier vanilla. 

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5 minutes ago, General-Pacman said:

Why? Because it's just a waste of resources to make something and leave it on a shelf to release it months (or even years) later, specially when talking about software. I'm a developer myself, and i can assure you that development deadlines tend to be quite harsh, so you normally can't spare time to do something like that. 

 

2 minutes ago, (XB1)SixGunLove said:

With Prime Warframes I concede to that. But what about weapons and Sentinels? They are considerably less intricate and probably easier to design next to thier vanilla. 

 

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4 minutes ago, (XB1)SixGunLove said:

With Prime Warframes I get that. But what about weapons and Sentinels? They are considerably less intricate and probably easier to design next to thier vanilla. 

no matter what it is, time is money - you want the people you're paying to be doing something that you can sell or attract more Customers, or something like that.
otherwise what they're doing isn't making you money. Business exist exclusively to make money.
however as i mentioned, Games do try things, which function as calculated risks of trying an idea and seeing if it seems like something that will sell well. but not everything ends up meeting those criteria.

even if sometimes i wish it wasn't quite so extreme since that makes Companies make some unfriendly decisions, but sigh.

Edited by taiiat
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1 minute ago, (XB1)SixGunLove said:

So you don't think Baza prime was made during or shortly after they released it's Vanilla and just saved it till now?

i certainly don't. everything will be sold as a 'Prime' eventually, there's no reason to experimentally try it now when you know you're going to sell it later anyways. there's no reason to make a calculated risk as it's a given for the future, it can be left until it's actually time to sell that.

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2 minutes ago, (XB1)SixGunLove said:

So you don't think Baza prime was made during or shortly after they released it's Vanilla and just saved it till now?

The Baza was released two years ago. I'm sure it didn't take them that long to make it and they wouldn't have made it just to hold onto it for a while if it's a weapon, aside from Chinese time limits.

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6 minutes ago, (XB1)SixGunLove said:

So you don't think Baza prime was made during or shortly after they released it's Vanilla and just saved it till now?

Let's invert the approach of this discussion. What makes you think they are doing this? Baza was released on update 22.4, wich, according to wiki, happened more than 2 years ago. If they already had baza prime since the very beginning, why are they introducing it now? why not a year ago, or next year? There are tenno weapons way older that, according to your theory, already have their prime counterparts that we have yet to see. Why is DE not releasing those instead? 

Edited by General-Pacman
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1 minute ago, (XB1)SixGunLove said:

So you don't think Baza prime was made during or shortly after they released it's Vanilla and just saved it till now?

No, that would be dumb. Having multiple, fully modeled weapons, & releasing them years later?

Sure, making concepts & the actual modeling takes time, but you won't make something if it's not to release it in a near future (hint: multiple years isn't near)

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4 minutes ago, Xenox_Ilz-ot said:

Sure, making concepts & the actual modeling takes time, but you won't make something if it's not to release it in a near future

I mean didn't they have Akjagara Prime concept at TENNOCON and it took them what 6 months to release it? I guess I see your point tenor.gif

Edited by (XB1)SixGunLove
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2 minutes ago, (XB1)SixGunLove said:

So your saying Taxon Prime could be ready and waiting to be released?

No, that's not at all what I'm saying. They probably only start ideas on the next Prime stuff when the most recent Prime Access is implemented, which gives them roughly three to four months of time to flesh out a frame, two weapons, and accessories.

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1 minute ago, magnakoji said:

No, that's not at all what I'm saying. They probably only start ideas on the next Prime stuff when the most recent Prime Access is implemented, which gives them roughly three to four months of time to flesh out a frame, two weapons, and accessories.

 

3 minutes ago, (XB1)SixGunLove said:

tenor.gif

 

Edited by (XB1)SixGunLove
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