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Samerte

Excalibur umbra's 4th abiliy problem.

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Because of umbra's passive, which makes him act like an independant Warframe, whenever I go into operator mode (5th ability), I always have to recast exalted umbra blade (4th ability), which is a pain to deal with. It would make things easier and not frustrating if I didn't had to always recast his ability.

Edited by Samerte
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Well excal in general has a TON of problems: lack of damage, lack of survivability, no team support aside from blind. But yeah, thats another super annoying thing for excal umbra players. especialy if they're running a combo EB build.

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I especially agree on the lack of survivability, blind is the only thing that keeps me from dying everytime.

Edited by Samerte

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seeing as how we have Instant Switch now and that the Umbra Specter doesn't entirely seem to have Energy, i'd more than support that. the Specter can still do all of the things it already does now, without canceling Exalted Blade.
so it could just leave that alone, no need to make you have to Recast over and over again (even if canceling Exalted Blade doesn't cost you anything other than time, it's still annoying).

 

 

(Excalibur having a lack of Survivability? you're joking right, good Armor, being Melee themed Blocking is expected to be used...., the modern world of Adaptation and Arcanes, some panic CC incase things get really bad. Exacalibur can survive fine.
lack of Damage is also a bit funny, not a Radial Damage type of Warframe, not quick at Killing 40 Trash Units across the map, but is quick at Killing a group of anything directly in front.)

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Definitely agree with the sentiments of Umbra's 4 problem. 

Not only does it have to recast the ability, it also makes you lose all your combo counter even if you have drifting contact on it. A quick fix for it is to make Excalibur share the melee combo counter with his actual melee weapon combo counter.

The new way to use Excal's 4 is to treat it like a melee weapon and actually hit enemies with it and treat the beams or waves as a bonus. The problem is it doesn't scale well with enemy levels as it cannot equip mods like blood rush not only that you have to work around those Umbra polarities (No one is going to waste an umbra forma to reforma those polarities when it comes with it free). It can handle enemies well up to levels 250ish then it becomes tickle me elmo damage for Noxs. Your normal melee does better than his 4 in performance which ruins the purpose of an exalted weapon.

As for survival issues? I don't see any

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47 minutes ago, taiiat said:

being Melee themed Blocking is expected to be used

Meanwhile Baruuk, Valkyr, and Wukong who are all just as melee themed as Excal, giving 0 S#&$es about blocking. And yes, blocking aka not attacking, an excellent move in warframe. 

 

54 minutes ago, taiiat said:

Exacalibur can survive fine.

 

53 minutes ago, taiiat said:

lack of Damage is also a bit funny, not a Radial Damage type of Warframe, not quick at Killing 40 Trash Units across the map, but is quick at Killing a group of anything directly in front.)

Try taking Excal into a lvl 5 kuva lich. Even with spamming blind, adaptation, arcane guardian, etc, 1 stray bullet from a bombard = goodnight excal. Or god forbid you ever get grappled by the lich (who're status immune, giving a fat middle finger to chromatic blade). 

 

12 minutes ago, MadMattPrime said:

As for survival issues? I don't see any

'Lack of damage' in terms of the damage output is EB is severely under performing compared to many of the base weapons we have now. My fault for not being specific on that. 

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honestly umbra should just keep using exalted blade while in operator mode, Wukong has a whole synergy dedicated having the AI companion use his exalted weapon, no reason for umbra not to considering he used his exalted blade when he was without an operator

Edited by TKDancer

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3 hours ago, AlphaRyuuxx said:

Meanwhile Baruuk, Valkyr, and Wukong who are all just as melee themed as Excal, giving 0 S#&$es about blocking. And yes, blocking aka not attacking, an excellent move in warframe. 

Try taking Excal into a lvl 5 kuva lich. Even with spamming blind, adaptation, arcane guardian, etc, 1 stray bullet from a bombard = goodnight excal. Or god forbid you ever get grappled by the lich (who're status immune, giving a fat middle finger to chromatic blade). 

i play all of my Lich Missions with Saryn, and i don't die except when i get sniped by a Lv5 Lich with a Tonkor or Et Cetera. hard to see that Projectile coming so shrug.
Umbra has an easier time doing anything i'd be doing with Saryn, seeing as you get free Umbra Polarities and can CC Enemies much easier.
i may have higher Health, but that Health is not the cutting difference of unkillable vs DELET, otherwise any Warframe with any sort of defensive Ability would be invulnerable in Lich Missions, and obviously they are not.
Blocking is there either way. instead of the Blocking, when hitting with Exalted Blade you apply some CC with each hit.

Liches poop on Saryns' main source of Damage a fair amount too, shrug. if you haven't ever used Furious Javelin, start using that to help compensate for things. it's a pretty silly strong Damage Buff, after all.

getting Grappled by a Lich is a death sentence for most Warframes irregardless of EHP Stats, it's a cheating attack. we don't care about one, since its cheating.

3 hours ago, MadMattPrime said:

you have to work around those Umbra polarities (No one is going to waste an umbra forma to reforma those polarities when it comes with it free).

that's not really a big deal. while Pressure Point is 'eh' as a Mod now sure, even more Crit Chance is ok, and it's a Melee Weapon either way, adding an extra Polarity or two and mismatching a Mod on that Slot would still be fine anyways.

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1 hour ago, taiiat said:

i play all of my Lich Missions with Saryn, and i don't die except when i get sniped by a Lv5 Lich with a Tonkor or Et Cetera. hard to see that Projectile coming so shrug.
Umbra has an easier time doing anything i'd be doing with Saryn, seeing as you get free Umbra Polarities and can CC Enemies much easier.

First off, having umbral polarities is completely irrelevant, it doesn't affect performance at all. The only thing it DOES affect is the modding process. Having those innate polarities doesn't give umbra some sort of boost, it just makes it easier to mod him. Also seeing as we should have around 3 umbral forma, and you saying you always play saryn, it's safe to assume that you've at least put one if not two umbral forma in her, so innate polarities is irrelevant. 

Second Excal's cc is completely irrelevant when compared to saryn's raw aoe damage. Excal's blind is blocked by terrain and his EB can only kill whats in front of him not to mention the waves travel so slow that you can bullet jump past them, even if its through walls its still whatever is technically in front of him. Saryn on the other hand completely ignores this and her nuke aoe completely bypasses walls, being able to spread viral and corrosive on GRINEER enemies effectively being able to map clear with little difficulty. You don't need cc when you can just wipe out any room your in.

1 hour ago, taiiat said:

i may have higher Health, but that Health is not the cutting difference of unkillable vs DELET, otherwise any Warframe with any sort of defensive Ability would be invulnerable in Lich Missions, and obviously they are not.

You seem to also forget that you have molt. Which not only draws away enemy fire but completely removes all status effects from you. Not to mention you also have it's augment to heal you. Also with saryn's map nuke, things shouldn't even BE hitting you.

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15 minutes ago, AlphaRyuuxx said:

Second Excal's cc is completely irrelevant when compared to saryn's raw aoe damage. 

You seem to also forget that you have molt. Which not only draws away enemy fire but completely removes all status effects from you. Not to mention you also have it's augment to heal you. Also with saryn's map nuke, things shouldn't even BE hitting you.

trying to AFKFarm with Saryn in most Missions is a waste of time. you neither need to Kill most of those Enemies, nor are most currently able to Damage you since they're in other rooms.

Molt reduces the amount that i get shot, but so does Blind and Blind is even more effective at that.
everyone can Heal via all sorts of different methods, that i have a method that is an Augment is insignificant with there being so many ways to Heal.

as always, Mods and other Equipment independent items are where most of our strength comes from as Players - you can Equip these Mods/Arcanes/whatever onto just about anything.

Edited by taiiat
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7 hours ago, taiiat said:

trying to AFKFarm with Saryn in most Missions is a waste of time. you neither need to Kill most of those Enemies, nor are most currently able to Damage you since they're in other rooms.

.Well why are you trying to afk on saryn instead of.. idk PLAYING THE GAME?

Yes you have to kill enemies, thats how you play an assortment of mission types in the game we call warframe. 

Okay? Why does it matter if enemies are able to damage you because their in the other rooms? Saryn literally has multiroom clear potential.

 

7 hours ago, taiiat said:

Molt reduces the amount that i get shot, but so does Blind and Blind is even more effective at that.
everyone can Heal via all sorts of different methods, that i have a method that is an Augment is insignificant with there being so many ways to Heal.

You're missing the point here. The point is that saryn has a tool that functions similar to that of blind, stopping or redirecting enemy fire, while also being able to map clear. Molt redirects fire, removes status effects, heals her with the augment, and can be used to stack spores adding even more damage. 

Yes you can equip arcanes to help patch these problems. But arcanes should NEVER be the sole reason for one's frames survivability. 

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15 hours ago, AlphaRyuuxx said:

Try taking Excal into a lvl 5 kuva lich. Even with spamming blind, adaptation, arcane guardian, etc, 1 stray bullet from a bombard = goodnight excal. Or god forbid you ever get grappled by the lich (who're status immune, giving a fat middle finger to chromatic blade). 

 

Really? I have no problems running level 5 lich runs with my Excaliburn Umbra with the my build at all, you really need to tweak your excalibur better. The only way I've died so far is by guessing the wrong Parazon Sequence and this is my sh1tty build 
https://imgur.com/a/C0Qdann
https://imgur.com/a/bc7P0P1

Add double magnus elevate for overkill on your operator if needed too.

He's pretty bulky and survivable up to enemy levels of 350.

Excal's 4 is supposed to be used like a proper melee weapon that you equipped in your melee slot. IF You're intending to SWOOSH SWOOSH your way through a level 5 lich mission, you're using him wrong. The days of SWOOSH SWOOSH is over. The only problem now is that your ordinary melee weapon does better that his 4.

 

15 hours ago, AlphaRyuuxx said:

'Lack of damage' in terms of the damage output is EB is severely under performing compared to many of the base weapons we have now. My fault for not being specific on that. 

Slap a life strike, do a jump heavy attack: Poof problem solved. Day to day mission EB still does fine if you USE it like and ordinary melee weapon. If you are doing endurance runs EB falls off after enemies reach 200+ levels but it does become a decent armor stripper. "Lack of damage" and "Survivability"  are 2 separate things but I do agree that the damage is lacking compared to last time and that Exalted Blade cannot make use of the "God" tier melee mods like "Bloodrush" and etc.

 

11 hours ago, taiiat said:

that's not really a big deal. while Pressure Point is 'eh' as a Mod now sure, even more Crit Chance is ok, and it's a Melee Weapon either way, adding an extra Polarity or two and mismatching a Mod on that Slot would still be fine anyways.

It is a big deal, Umbra forma is a rare resource (3 IN TOTAL) as off this current update besides the GAME is ever constantly updating unless you can guarantee me that the game will stop updating at this update and that will be no longer and changes to the mods/stats or UMBRA forma would be sold on the marketplace in the near future. No one expected the Sacrificial steel buff WHO knows expect [DE] staff that these mods might be BUFFED or NERFED in the near future besides its still premature to forma over them as its still MELEE 2.999999999999.  I rather play it safe and keep BOTH umbra polarities and forma over the other slots, UMBRA forma exist today but it may not exist tomorrow or in the future as it maybe replaced by something else in the near future such as Universal slot forma. Plus there are certain builds that I cannot try on EB due to the UMBRA slots due to potential changes in the near future.

Edited by MadMattPrime

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3 hours ago, AlphaRyuuxx said:

Well why are you trying to afk on saryn instead of.. idk PLAYING THE GAME?

 

You're missing the point here. The point is that saryn has a tool that functions similar to that of blind, stopping or redirecting enemy fire, while also being able to map clear. Molt redirects fire, removes status effects, heals her with the augment

Yes you can equip arcanes to help patch these problems. But arcanes should NEVER be the sole reason for one's frames survivability. 

you're the one that suggested that you should try to AFKFarm with Saryn by waiting for Spores to Kill stuff in normal Missions, not me.
that's just wasting time in most Missions, as i said. 

yes, Molt can distract Enemies. Blind is dramatically more effective at this.

Liches are literally endgame content(even if it is really dull content), i think it's pretty normal to expect Players to have all of their 'Mod Slots' to be filled, no matter what shape those Mod Slots are. so that means Mods, Arcanes, Focus, Amps, you name it. plus experience.

3 hours ago, AlphaRyuuxx said:

and can be used to stack spores adding even more damage. 

i think you've just accidentally shown your hand. using Molt as a makeshift totem was removed from the game 18 months ago.

1 hour ago, MadMattPrime said:

Really? I have no problems running level 5 lich runs with my Excaliburn Umbra with the my build at all

oof, this man literally has more EHP than i do with my Saryn, and neither of us are dying constantly.

 

 

1 hour ago, MadMattPrime said:

I rather play it safe and keep BOTH umbra polarities and forma over the other slots

but that's exactly what i said to do. 

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3 hours ago, taiiat said:

you're the one that suggested that you should try to AFKFarm with Saryn by waiting for Spores to Kill stuff in normal Missions, not me.
that's just wasting time in most Missions, as i said. 

when did i ever suggest afk'ing missions? I said:

7 hours ago, AlphaRyuuxx said:

Second Excal's cc is completely irrelevant when compared to saryn's raw aoe damage. 

You seem to also forget that you have molt. Which not only draws away enemy fire but completely removes all status effects from you. Not to mention you also have it's augment to heal you. Also with saryn's map nuke, things shouldn't even BE hitting you.

and you responded with :

15 hours ago, taiiat said:

trying to AFKFarm with Saryn in most Missions is a waste of time. you neither need to Kill most of those Enemies, nor are most currently able to Damage you since they're in other rooms.

Nice try putting words in my mouth. 

4 hours ago, taiiat said:

oof, this man literally has more EHP than i do with my Saryn, and neither of us are dying constantly.

Wow its like saryn can map clear, making it so enemies rarely ever hit you, and if by some miracle they do survive and shoot at you, you have molt. 

4 hours ago, taiiat said:

yes, Molt can distract Enemies. Blind is dramatically more effective at this.

Yes but blind is all excal has. Sure I can blind whatever is in range, given they aren't behind terrain, but once again saryn can literally clear multiple rooms at once and as i stated already but by some god given chance a couple enemies DO survive, you have yet ANOTHER tool to redirect/stop damage. 

4 hours ago, taiiat said:

i think you've just accidentally shown your hand. using Molt as a makeshift totem was removed from the game 18 months ago.

Okay, even if it has been removed, doesn't change anything previously stated, just that the ability has 1 less thing out of the 3 that it does. 

Idk why you're trying to argue as if saryn's somehow worse than excal or just trying to downplay saryn's power or something else, maybe it's cause you're scared off the pablo's nerf hammer or something and are trying to stay under the radar in case someone at DE reads through the forums and sees this

 

5 hours ago, MadMattPrime said:

survivable up to enemy levels of 350.

Maybe if you're spamming blind yeah

5 hours ago, MadMattPrime said:

The only problem now is that your ordinary melee weapon does better that his 4.

okay, so why are we even bothering with EB anymore? Almost any regular melee outclasses it now, especially if we have to use EB as an actual sword now. This things taking an ability slot and drains energy. Using something like the nikana prime is just 100% better and instead of having to run life strike EB, (which 1. is much more inconvenient to use, 2. eats ur combo which you need to make EB even comparable to base weapons. Even with zenuirk's inner might, thats half ur combo gone, and while you could put in focus energy, your just losing damage that EB doesn't even have that much off), and even then, Nikana prime also has amalgam daikyu target aquired giving it innate life steal with 0 downsides. 

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22 hours ago, Samerte said:

Because of umbra's passive, which makes him act like an independant Warframe, whenever I go into operator mode (5th ability), I always have to recast exalted umbra blade (4th ability), which is a pain to deal with. It would make things easier and not frustrating if I didn't had to always recast his ability.

I believe that is because the regular Excal specter doesn't use EB either.

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22 hours ago, Samerte said:

Because of umbra's passive, which makes him act like an independant Warframe, whenever I go into operator mode (5th ability), I always have to recast exalted umbra blade (4th ability), which is a pain to deal with. It would make things easier and not frustrating if I didn't had to always recast his ability.

Excalibur Umbra was supposed to be better than Excalibur Prime; but there are companion mechanics left untouched for other tasks. Wukong has a effective combat A I and Khora has a Kavat that can rotate commands, similar to the wheel that Vaughan and Wisp has for their ability slot.

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5 minutes ago, AlphaRyuuxx said:

Idk why you're trying to argue as if saryn's somehow worse than excal

eats ur combo which you need to make EB even comparable to base weapons.

that didn't seem like the subject, seemed be leaning more towards "Excalibur is basically the worst Warframe in the game and almost unusable" or something like that.
just a Warframe that excels more vs the hardened Priority Targets than to the droves of Trash Units

it's not even worth trying to make use of the Hit Counter, you'd have to use full Gladiator Set to get anything useful, and even then you're still starting from 15% so you'd get 100% at 12x/220 and that's really not much for the number of Mod slots.
essentially, the Hit Counter is no longer useful for Excalibur. leaves room for taking advantage of other Mods/Mechanics instead, since losing Hit Counter benefits is no longer something to be worried about.
but again, if you weren't using Furious Javelin in the past (you should have been), then add that in and get a pretty dramatic Damage Buff from that instead.

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25 minutes ago, taiiat said:

it's not even worth trying to make use of the Hit Counter, you'd have to use full Gladiator Set to get anything useful, and even then you're still starting from 15% so you'd get 100% at 12x/220 and that's really not much for the number of Mod slots.

you only need 4 glad mods to reach 114% cc at 12x (assuming ur runninng sac steel). 102% cc at 8x. 3 of those mods you can put on a helios's weapon and only 1 of those has to go on excal. But still, even with furious javelin, better off using literally anything other than EB. 

Edited by AlphaRyuuxx

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7 hours ago, taiiat said:
8 hours ago, MadMattPrime said:

I rather play it safe and keep BOTH umbra polarities and forma over the other slots

 

That is now what you said, having those UMBRA forma without having to waste and UMBRA forma to reforma them in future update is actually quite limiting even if you forma the other slots. 

This is my theory build for consistency and spam melee key lazy.
https://imgur.com/a/kv0V10d

If you try this you won't have enough capacity without having to remove an umbra slot.

 

2 hours ago, AlphaRyuuxx said:

okay, so why are we even bothering with EB anymore? Almost any regular melee outclasses it now, especially if we have to use EB as an actual sword now. This things taking an ability slot and drains energy. Using something like the nikana prime is just 100% better and instead of having to run life strike EB, (which 1. is much more inconvenient to use, 2. eats ur combo which you need to make EB even comparable to base weapons. Even with zenuirk's inner might, thats half ur combo gone, and while you could put in focus energy, your just losing damage that EB doesn't even have that much off), and even then, Nikana prime also has amalgam daikyu target aquired giving it innate life steal with 0 downsides. 

Have an extra weapon that can be used for armor strip.
Dump mods like Life strike and healing return on it for emergencies without sacrificing DPS/an extra element on your primary melee weapon.

I swear to god you're just playing excal and thinking pressing 4 too win.

2 hours ago, AlphaRyuuxx said:

okay, so why are we even bothering with EB anymore? Almost any regular melee outclasses it now, especially if we have to use EB as an actual sword now. This things taking an ability slot and drains energy. Using something like the nikana prime is just 100% better and instead of having to run life strike EB, (which 1. is much more inconvenient to use, 2. eats ur combo which you need to make EB even comparable to base weapons. Even with zenuirk's inner might, thats half ur combo gone, and while you could put in focus energy, your just losing damage that EB doesn't even have that much off), and even then, Nikana prime also has amalgam daikyu target aquired giving it innate life steal with 0 downsides. 

Nope, Spamming 1 and 3 due to his other augments and 5 making use of my operator wisely. You do know that Excal's 1 adds your combo counter and makes you invincible during that period and is a useful gap closer for normal melee. There are other ways which are mostly memes but excal can function still without having to spam 2 all the time.

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16 minutes ago, MadMattPrime said:

Have an extra weapon that can be used for armor strip.
Dump mods like Life strike and healing return on it for emergencies without sacrificing DPS/an extra element on your primary melee weapon.

If I want a weapon to armor strip, I'll use something that doesn't eat my energy, ignis/amprex. 

 

17 minutes ago, MadMattPrime said:

Dump mods like Life strike and healing return on it for emergencies without sacrificing DPS/an extra element on your primary melee weapon.

And I can also dump life strike/healing return on any other melee weapon and it'll still out perform EB.  

 

18 minutes ago, MadMattPrime said:

I swear to god you're just playing excal and thinking pressing 4 too win.

Because that's all he can do if even? His 1, sure gives i-frames granted if it actually works for once and locks onto targets that are actually in front of you, and with how slow it is, if I want to build combo (including its augment) i'll just actually melee them with EB. His 2 is his only good ability. His 3 for damage is actually a joke and it's cc is outclassed by blind, and its augment while decent you can't fit anywhere in his build, unless you take out chromatic blade, and in that case that gives even less reason to use EB and to just use a better regular weapon. So yeah using 4 right now is all excal can do, and even that's debatable. Best thing would to just run any other melee with healing return/life strike plus furious javelin and just say screw it to EB. 

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I'm not bothered by this anymore thanks to Exalted Blade becoming pretty much useless.

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8 hours ago, AlphaRyuuxx said:

If I want a weapon to armor strip, I'll use something that doesn't eat my energy, ignis/amprex. 

 

Provided that you have a riven for those weapon which involves platinum or spending hours in kuva, abritrations and etc getting the right roll for them not to mention the constant disposition changes. Not to mention not everyone has those rivens.

Running all 4 60/60 mods causes a problem and struggle of RNG for procs.

EB doesn't need that much invested and is a way more Cheaper alternative as Umbra is free and excal is free as a starter. All it needs is the augment,180% strength and changing colour. Its a 100% consistent armor strip for minimal investment and doesn't require RNG to get involved.

8 hours ago, AlphaRyuuxx said:

And I can also dump life strike/healing return on any other melee weapon and it'll still out perform EB.  

Condition Overload 

Bloodrush

Weeping wounds

Attack speed mod of choice/ preference

Thats already 4 slots.

Element 1

Element 2

Thats already 6 slots in total

Combo time extension mod if you're not running naramon or whatever that school was or swift momentum as an aura which is a meh aura as corrosive projection is better for dps. Most people run zenurik for that sweet free energy.

Thats already 7 slot leaving you with 1 Flexibility spot where you either add more damage or a convience mod. You lose DPS if you take convience. So i call you out as a liar that you don't lose dps.

8 hours ago, AlphaRyuuxx said:

Because that's all he can do if even? His 1, sure gives i-frames granted if it actually works for once and locks onto targets that are actually in front of you, and with how slow it is, if I want to build combo (including its augment) i'll just actually melee them with EB. His 2 is his only good ability. His 3 for damage is actually a joke and it's cc is outclassed by blind, and its augment while decent you can't fit anywhere in his build, unless you take out chromatic blade, and in that case that gives even less reason to use EB and to just use a better regular weapon. So yeah using 4 right now is all excal can do, and even that's debatable. Best thing would to just run any other melee with healing return/life strike plus furious javelin and just say screw it to EB

Really? You think excal can only press 4 and win. In all honesty as an Excal main, his 4 is just a bonus! Remember super jump? Was that press 4 to win?

While I agree that EB isn't as good as the previous update, THIS IS STILL melee 2.99999999 update and is still not the final version of melee yet. 

His 1 can be used for quick escapes to get a breather which is useful and cheap. It can be used as a dps and defensive skill. Its not that slow compared to other skills which NEED natural talent.

His 2 is broken that I agree.

His 3 is useful with the augment in staggering mobs and taking out higher priority targets first with that extra bonus damage.

Excal's kit is decent even without his 4 as off now. It boils down to timings and how you use him.

Just because his 4 doesn't show big numbers any more doesn't mean it doesn't have other purposes or the entire frame is ruined when the other skills can still make up for it.

Edited by MadMattPrime
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7 hours ago, MadMattPrime said:

Provided that you have a riven for those weapon which involves platinum or spending hours in kuva, abritrations and etc getting the right roll for them not to mention the constant disposition changes. Not to mention not everyone has those rivens.

Uhhh... no. You don't need a riven for the ignis or the amprex to have them perform spectacularly. And even then they have the lowest possible riven dispo, ignis at .55 and amprex at .7. So it's not like those rivens are dramatically increasing those rivens' performance like say the vanilla kohm. 

7 hours ago, MadMattPrime said:

Condition Overload 

Bloodrush

Weeping wounds

Attack speed mod of choice/ preference

Thats already 4 slots.

Element 1

Element 2

Thats already 6 slots in total

Combo time extension mod if you're not running naramon or whatever that school was or swift momentum as an aura which is a meh aura as corrosive projection is better for dps. Most people run zenurik for that sweet free energy.

Thats already 7 slot leaving you with 1 Flexibility spot where you either add more damage or a convience mod. You lose DPS if you take convience. So i call you out as a liar that you don't lose dps.

Nikana prime: Condition overload, bloodrush, primed reach, berserker, two elementals, organ shatter, then drifting contact.

First, yes naramon's power spike exists negating the need for drifting contact. so you can use healing return/life strike. Yes maybe you can min max your damage and put in another elemental or weeping wounds in the drifting contact spot, but even with 7 mods the nikana prime STILL outdamages EB. 

 

7 hours ago, MadMattPrime said:

Really? You think excal can only press 4 and win. In all honesty as an Excal main, his 4 is just a bonus! Remember super jump? Was that press 4 to win?

No? because super jump was on his 3 you goon. Excal's old 4 was javelin, which was giga broken because it didn't require line of sight and didn't have a target limit. And back then YES. HE WAS A PRESS 4 TO WIN. IT'S WHY HE WAS THE NUMBER ONE PICK ON DRACO, and he's still press 4 to win cause his other abilities don't DO anything.

 

7 hours ago, MadMattPrime said:

His 1 can be used for quick escapes to get a breather which is useful and cheap. It can be used as a dps and defensive skill. Its not that slow compared to other skills which NEED natural talent.

I mean if you want a breather and defensive skill there's a fancy little thing that you can do by pressing 5 and then holding down control. Which also gives dps considering umbra's ai uses your modded weapons. And like i said earlier, slash dash as dps is extremely niche, its still incredibly slow and its lock on never works the way you think it'll work. 

 

7 hours ago, MadMattPrime said:

His 3 is useful with the augment in staggering mobs and taking out higher priority targets first with that extra bonus damage.

Yes I agree that his 3 augment is useful, especially with EB under performing, provides a nice boost to actually good weapons. 

Not sure why on earth you would want to stagger mobs instead of his pressing 2, and opening them up to finisher damage. 

7 hours ago, MadMattPrime said:

taking out higher priority targets first with that extra bonus damage.

What on earth are you talking about?

7 hours ago, MadMattPrime said:

Just because his 4 doesn't show big numbers any more doesn't mean it doesn't have other purposes or the entire frame is ruined when the other skills can still make up for it.

Yes it does! It doesn't have ANY purpose now. its armor strip is beaten by other guns that don't cost energy and debateably have just as good if not better aoe, It's damage is beaten by other melee weapons. His other skills CANNOT make up for this. Slash dash's dps is irrelevant, i frames are nice but we have operators, blind is still good, javelins damage is completely irrelevant and the only reason you may even consider even pressing this ability would be for the augment. 

 

7 hours ago, MadMattPrime said:

Excal's kit is decent even without his 4 as off now.

..................................idk even what to say to this. This is just blatantly incorrect. If you were to take away his EB, and take a look at JUST his 1 2 and 3, Excal would literally be nothing, his abilities don't do ANY damage, they offer no benefits (excluding augments, but that's literally the job of augments) aside from i frames and mobility (but even thats covered by operator). If he just had those three abilities the ONLY thing that people would even look at would be his 2 and jesus and even then operators can open enemies up to finishers too or use magus lockdown, or you could just play inaros. 

 

7 hours ago, MadMattPrime said:

It boils down to timings and how you use him.

The timing of what? Spamming blind and his 1 for i frames cause excal gets dumpstered by higher level enemies?

Edited by AlphaRyuuxx

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21 minutes ago, AlphaRyuuxx said:

Uhhh... no. You don't need a riven for the ignis or the amprex to have them perform spectacularly. And even then they have the lowest possible riven dispo, ignis at .55 and amprex at .7. So it's not like those rivens are dramatically increasing those rivens' performance like say the vanilla kohm. 

AMPREX and IGNIS WRAITH can't reach fooking 100% chance without a riven even with all 60/60 mods. THEY STILL DEPEND on RNG PROCS while Chromatic BLADE doesn't require any RNG involvement. Which is better? Having to struggle with RNG procs or having a 100% status proc which EB provides with minimal investments.

27 minutes ago, AlphaRyuuxx said:

Nikana prime: Condition overload, bloodrush, primed reach, berserker, two elementals, organ shatter, then drifting contact.

First, yes naramon's power spike exists negating the need for drifting contact. so you can use healing return/life strike. Yes maybe you can min max your damage and put in another elemental or weeping wounds in the drifting contact spot, but even with 7 mods the nikana prime STILL outdamages EB. 

You still sacrifice DPS as you have to run Naramon instead of Madurai for that increase in damage. Seriously what is your problem? I have never said that EB had NO PROBLEMS, I do agree its weak but ITS NOT entirely POINTLESS or USELESS which you are trying to make it out to be.
 

29 minutes ago, AlphaRyuuxx said:

No? because super jump was on his 3 you goon. Excal's old 4 was javelin, which was giga broken because it didn't require line of sight and didn't have a target limit. And back then YES. HE WAS A PRESS 4 TO WIN. IT'S WHY HE WAS THE NUMBER ONE PICK ON DRACO, and he's still press 4 to win cause his other abilities don't DO anything.

 

My bad I forgot

30 minutes ago, AlphaRyuuxx said:

What on earth are you talking about?

 

More like are your smoking that hindered your abilities to read?
https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Furious_Javelin
X% extra damage from that augment to melee can be used to take out higher priority targets such as NOX, Bombards and Gunners or did you forget that those exist?

 

1 hour ago, AlphaRyuuxx said:

Yes it does! It doesn't have ANY purpose now. its armor strip is beaten by other guns that don't cost energy and debateably have just as good if not better aoe, It's damage is beaten by other melee weapons. His other skills CANNOT make up for this. Slash dash's dps is irrelevant, i frames are nice but we have operators, blind is still good, javelins damage is completely irrelevant and the only reason you may even consider even pressing this ability would be for the augment. 

The problem with GUNS is IPS and Status procs are dependent ON RNG while his 4 SKIPS the ENTIRE RNG process with a bloody augment. Yes damage is beaten by ordinary melee weapons I have even stated but it is not entirely useless. His 4 can still be used as a Lifestrike/Healing return stick without ruining DPS as you can add more damage mods or elements into your melee weapon further more it can be used to boost Condition overload's damage for your Ordinary melee due to the guaranteed status proc caused by chromatic blade. Your can run madurai as a school for the biggest value in DPS. 

SLASH DASH doesn't need to be used as a DPS skill for the Iframes to work and unlike operators slash dash can increase the melee combo counter. For new players who don't have operators this ability is useful if they know how to abuse it.

Blind is opens enemies to finishers and has a long time attached to it.

Javelin's damage is not completely irrelevant as it can clear low level mobs and the augment is pretty decent if you can hit a room of enemies. 

Can these 3 skills get sh1t done? 100% absolutely on a right build.

 

1 hour ago, AlphaRyuuxx said:

..................................idk even what to say to this. This is just blatantly incorrect. If you were to take away his EB, and take a look at JUST his 1 2 and 3, Excal would literally be nothing, his abilities don't do ANY damage, they offer no benefits (excluding augments, but that's literally the job of augments) aside from i frames and mobility (but even thats covered by operator). If he just had those three abilities the ONLY thing that people would even look at would be his 2 and jesus and even then operators can open enemies up to finishers too or use magus lockdown, or you could just play inaros. 

Really? Nothing? That is totally untrue. When pressing 1 and 3 numbers appear that is still damage, small numbers but still damage is damage. His 2 doesn't need arcanes or switching into operator to open enemies to finisher not to mention that it has a decent duration to it.

2 hours ago, AlphaRyuuxx said:

The timing of what? Spamming blind and his 1 for i frames cause excal gets dumpstered by higher level enemies?

A built solely around his 3 augment is really dependent on timings for the biggest value of % damage as well as in taking into consideration your combo counter. Dumpstered by higher level enemies? If you mean level 1000 enemies without using any gimmicks obviously any frame will get blown to pieces. Excalibur can handle enemies up to 300 quite fine.

You're also forgetting something Excalibur is the only frame given to players for FREE Twice (if you pick him as a starter). He doesn't need expensive mods to work and all his augments are someone useful.

I DIDN'T say his 4 had no problems. I'm saying his 4 ain't useless as you think it is.

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On 2019-12-10 at 4:18 PM, AlphaRyuuxx said:

Well excal in general has a TON of problems: lack of damage, lack of survivability, no team support aside from blind. But yeah, thats another super annoying thing for excal umbra players. especialy if they're running a combo EB build.

1000 armor 1400 health, instantaneous CC, scaling 4 with decent crit and one of the only weapons that doesn't need a stance to get instant CO procs.

The hell are you even talking about.

Calibro's 3 is hot garbage and that's about the only legit complaint other than re-casting you have to leverage.

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