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(PC) Empyrean: Railjack Matchmaking Feedback Megathread

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On 2019-12-13 at 12:36 AM, Oreades said:

 

Do I really need to sit through a loading screen just to skip a cinematic just to sit through an additional loading screen just to start a new mission? Can we not just like, have a convenient user interface? 

 

Edit: OK watching this mornings/todays Livestream you can apparently either fast travel to your Railjack directly from your Orbiter or use some McGuffin at the back of your ship to launch to your Railjack from your Orbiter. The actual transition time there is not horrible. 

But I'm still left scratching my head as to why I'm needing to do that when I've already told the game I want to play a Railjack Mission. If a player clicks "Play Railjack" and no Railjack group is currently available, moving to your Railjack and starting the mission is kinda implicit. 

I mean unless this is some sort of really roundabout "I don't want to host Railjack, like EVER" solution?

Silly gamer the loading times is the gameplay...ha ha ha. Talk about missing the point! No serious though I've found myself every where I don't choose to be.

And I keep experiencing not being able to dismount off the pilot and gunner seat?

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I actually like that matchmaking to find someone else's game is separated from you starting your own and wish that was possible for all mission types so people who didn't want to host had that ability in any kind of mission. 

The main issue with finding another game is it searches for at most 1-2 seconds (often it just instantly fails) then gives you an error message saying there are no open squads (even if there's like 20+ open squads shown when you mouse over the node). It should simply sit there searching until you find a game or you cancel it. At least wait up to a minute or something if you're trying to avoid afk players searching for games, but certainly much longer than it currently does. 

I also think you should add a game browser menu that shows all active games with open spots with filters to look for certain kinds of games or games in specific areas (for both RJ and just all other mission types). You could also expand on this later and allow you to add specific requirements to each player slot to enter the game. For example a RJ mission could add intrinsic requirements to each slot to enter the game to get a variety of players with higher intrinsics in each category. A fissure mission could add a relic requirement to easily create a game where everyone has the same relic. You'd be able to see these requirements in the browser and even filter/search for games with that requirement to more easily find what you're looking for. It'd basically be a more streamlined and modern version of forming pick up groups in chat with random people. 

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Railjack game mode is too sensitive to latency!

We need way more client sided hitreg and interactions. As a PvE game this should be alright to do.

We can play with people from all over the world, lag is unavoidable to some extent. No reason to let it interfere with gunners, skills, or even cause enemy rubber banding! This also needs to apply to the game at large.

up to 600~ ping should be the aim to still be playable for most things, to account the natural latency from across the world groups.

We also need the ability to use other RJ, not only the host's. Like using the console that does nothing in the middle, to call the RJ of a squad member.

 

 

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Yes, the latency and sudden lag spikes are abysmal lately (seemingly much worse and more frequent after the patch, too).

 

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Now you force us into squad gameplay (or at least want us to play as organized squad) add a matchmaking ui:

Host : yes/no

I am/I seach: pilot/gunner/boarder/engineer

ty

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Need to be able to join a host with a friend or two that isn't a full squad. Sometimes you have yourself and a friend that want to play, but don't have a railjack yet, or unmodded and don't want to host due to internets (Aussie net) and sick of hearing the americans complaining about lag... the same lag we usualy just put up with.

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I wouldnt want to host now that if i host, im unsure if there will be other players joining. As railjack is designed for 4 players, if you are the host and nobody joins your session, you would be in deep trouble. This is a fundamental problem when the party is not able to be filled, especially there are so many nodes and the player base is spread thin.

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Anything above 100 ping causes several bugs like not being able to enter turrets, infinite death loops, stuck into a grey area, item loss, stuck doors, weapons that lose mods, vacuum stops working, unable to see models of a lot of stuff and infinite loading.

Please test your game in simulated 100+ ping situations instead of only testing at 0 ping, connected straight to the game server machine.

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Several times when hosting (or having a friend host) a public Railjack squad, we've noticed people just join and... afk. They pick a spot and just idle. One person pretended to be stuck when I called him out, then, embarrassed by the callout, started playing again. Sometimes you can admonish them into helping the mission they joined! Other times, it's clear they've just alt-tabbed or went off somewhere else. I haven't reported these players because their actions don't really fit in any of the categories, but it would be nice if some action was taken against them or it was possible to report them specifically for that behavior.

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The Anomaly in the veil has turned public matchmaking into a system of abandonment.  So many public players joining in on anomaly missions will beeline straight for the anomaly, focusing 100% on finding the red and yellow containers therein for their precious, precious rare drops.  If they find something they like, they'll stay.  If they don't find the extremely rare ephemera or forma drops, they'll instaquit, and then others may quit shortly thereafter by assuming that if one person leaves, then their rare, timegated, double-RNG drops aren't here and there's no reason not to quit and re-join as fast as they can for another shot.

This is particularly hair-tearing if the host does this to a group without warning, and frankly given that missions quickly become unwinnable from all the joining/leaving/host migrations, it has turned the anomaly into a painfully selfish, un-warframe-like experience.  Some of my clanmates have alt-f4'd in a fury from being host-migrated into an unwinnable state after finding a less-rare drop they wanted, and have sworn to only play with other clanmates from now on.  Maybe this will be less of an agony when 1P railjack is possible, but for now it's absolutely destroying the public matchmaking experience.

Part of me feels as though this would be assuaged if the ephemera/umbral forma were part of the end-of-mission drop tables, but that would spark outrage from those who behave this way, with their argument that this is a nerf to their current chances.  I feel the best solution would to have the anomaly simply migrate around the veil, always present somewhere for the finding so that there isn't this timegate pressure to cycle and abandon as quickly as possible.  If that's your plan for when the New War begins in full, great!  But for now, it is not great.

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I was this many days old when someone told me that the RJ matchmaker keeps searching for games even after the didn't find a game popup comes up, unless you click it away. That's a good thing, but I do think the UI needs to be cleaner as I would guess many assume it stops searching when they get that popup and needlessly re-click many times the way I've been doing this entire time. 

edit: Unfortunately it turns out this isn't true in my experience. Sometimes it works, but only if a game pops almost immediately after the error pops up. If you just leave it indefinitely it does NOT find games much past that point :(

They definitely should change it so it continues to search for longer though. 

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Instead of having to manually check every mission in each proxima for an open squad, a 'join any open squad in this proxima' function would be nice.

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Likely mentioned by others but:

  • Joined in missions where even the mission is nearly complete: Don't mind a reward from the rotation, but if it's something like the Sentient Anomaly or the Grineer Captains/Commanders with the Quellor/Pennant already completed by the time we load in, it feels insulting to load in at a time like that. We should not be able to join groups who has manage to complete at least one side objective and/or half of the Fighters and/or Crewships are destroyed.
  • Lack of Voting For Navigation: While people can agree to another mission through chat, there are people who refuse to chat about where they want to go next. The Host or cilents can force others into another mission or the Dry Dock without a census if they wanted. I had times where the Host would ask if they want to go for another run, only for a cilent to force everyone back to Dry Dock without telling anyone else.

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Since Empyrean, one thing has become more important for me personally:

IF I ignore a user, I do not want to be matched with this user again.

There ARE trolls in this game who join random Railjacks, waste all the missiles, flux and dome shots, refine during missions - or wait for a chance to get into the pilot seat and stear the ship into a shipkiller platform....or simply stand there AFK and leech.

I have put several of those guys on ignore, but in at least 3 instances, I got matched with them again.

Believe it or not, I once even joined an AFK captain, who was clearly afk leeching in the pilot seat and let everyone else do the work for him. After we actually finished the mission, he was still afk and didn´t start the next mission or fly back to the dojo, we all had to abort. After I ignored this guy (recent players list ftw..) I actually joined this dude again later that day, and he was afk leeching again.

If there is no "punishment" for bad behaviour, you eventually punish the wrong people.

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For the love of God pls allow us to stay in a cue like in conclave so I don't have to break my mouse clicking on a node for 10m trying to get a squad for it. Let me cue and leave it there while I go craft ciphers  and just ask if ready after find a squad for me. 

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On 2020-01-23 at 3:37 AM, IamLoco said:

Since Empyrean, one thing has become more important for me personally:

IF I ignore a user, I do not want to be matched with this user again.

There ARE trolls in this game who join random Railjacks, waste all the missiles, flux and dome shots, refine during missions - or wait for a chance to get into the pilot seat and stear the ship into a shipkiller platform....or simply stand there AFK and leech.

I have put several of those guys on ignore, but in at least 3 instances, I got matched with them again.

Believe it or not, I once even joined an AFK captain, who was clearly afk leeching in the pilot seat and let everyone else do the work for him. After we actually finished the mission, he was still afk and didn´t start the next mission or fly back to the dojo, we all had to abort. After I ignored this guy (recent players list ftw..) I actually joined this dude again later that day, and he was afk leeching again.

If there is no "punishment" for bad behaviour, you eventually punish the wrong people.

And you got nothing for all ur work cuz railjack has no individual extraction like def or survival. Even intrinsics are lost which is bullhonky cus any other game mode you keep xp. 

 

I have been in the same boat. Host afk litterally just sitting in the ship or they won't leave for 30 cuz  they have to pickup every resource or they go into galleon and do the same and won't leave and it won't update either till every one leaves it even tho Capt is dead. .. Smdh. 

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On 2020-01-21 at 7:12 PM, Duality52 said:

Likely mentioned by others but:

  • Joined in missions where even the mission is nearly complete: Don't mind a reward from the rotation, but if it's something like the Sentient Anomaly or the Grineer Captains/Commanders with the Quellor/Pennant already completed by the time we load in, it feels insulting to load in at a time like that. We should not be able to join groups who has manage to complete at least one side objective and/or half of the Fighters and/or Crewships are destroyed.
  • Lack of Voting For Navigation: While people can agree to another mission through chat, there are people who refuse to chat about where they want to go next. The Host or cilents can force others into another mission or the Dry Dock without a census if they wanted. I had times where the Host would ask if they want to go for another run, only for a cilent to force everyone back to Dry Dock without telling anyone else.

No it's hard enough to get in a mission as it is there's almost never agroup. Or it's like 2 guys only in the group.  In stead it should be like if it's 80per cent done don't allow joining. 

Also you actually have to dd to get rewards and any mission abort even if you get the mission success window will take ur rewards even intrinsics. What they need is a button for extraction after success that give you the option to leave. Like maybe stay for resource farm but when done you hot esc and there is the option to leave. 

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1. Railjack is great, best content in WF in a long time.

2. Please allow ship owners to turn toggle on/off crew member use of missiles, flux powers, refinement (until all objective completion) and the cannon. MANY newb/noob/bad/troll players will simply spam these things wastefully otherwise, creating a pain for the captain and other crew in harder missions.

3. Vote a firm "NO" on any kind of vote kick. It will be abused more than used correctly.

4. Make the Intrinsic level requirement for Veil "7" across the board instead of only one school. It is very apparent that many ... "players" level up one intrinsic school to 7 quickly then come into the veil a total liability to the team looking for a carry and free higher loot. ALSO make completing every other node in railjack prior a requirement precedent to veil matchmaking.

5. There are many bugs in respect to team formation, hopefully they are being worked out. It would be nice to have an option to wait for a complete team before starting the mission.

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Navigation console lockout for everyone except the host on Railjack would be greatly appreciated.  It's frustrating when some random player who joined your squad cuts short your search for a rare container.

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10 hours ago, N64Gamefreak said:

Navigation console lockout for everyone except the host on Railjack would be greatly appreciated.  It's frustrating when some random player who joined your squad cuts short your search for a rare container.

Please ohgodno.  For a while, only the host could use navigation anyway.  We had a mission everyone had to abort because the host was dead (incompetent Archwinging) and none of us could use nav.

Also, all missions need to be set up such that we are not immediately attacked upon loading in.  Give time for additional people to join the squad before the action starts.  Some missions are like this, some are not.  I tried hosting a Saturn Proxima mission and almost failed before a second squad member joined and loaded in.  Once there was a second player, it became fairly easy to keep up.

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56 minutes ago, (PS4)Entropy512 said:

Please ohgodno.  For a while, only the host could use navigation anyway.  We had a mission everyone had to abort because the host was dead (incompetent Archwinging) and none of us could use nav.

Sorry bout that, but the mode is way too easy to troll now otherwise. Host migration could unlock the nav and other lock out settings but if railjack is going to work, this has got to happen. In order for railjack to be viable, there -must- be toggle lockout settings on the navigation, the rockets, cannon, refining, flux usage, and instant ejection from the slingshot after X seconds. Otherwise it will be DOA due to trolling. There is limited trolling opportunity in much of WF, but railjack is the exception. This is a critical fix/add.

For example, just now had some clown insta burn all the flux during a crucial part of the mission. Have seen "refine trolling" many times, as well as rocket/cannon trolling and people just sitting in the slingshot and won't get out. Have also seen nav trolling before loot can be collected. Moreover, when the trolls don't engi the ship, it gets full of boarders and pilot has to leave chair to fix, the troll should -not- be allowed to get in the pilot seat. Once in, there is currently no way to get them out. 

Finally, with respect to railjack missions, ship owners should be able to "ignore" players with no chance of those players appearing in pug railjack missions on their ship.

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On 2020-01-13 at 9:37 AM, ElKayJae said:

I wouldnt want to host now that if i host, im unsure if there will be other players joining. As railjack is designed for 4 players, if you are the host and nobody joins your session, you would be in deep trouble. This is a fundamental problem when the party is not able to be filled, especially there are so many nodes and the player base is spread thin.

Once you get your ship solidly modded, it's easy to solo. It just takes patience, which 90% of the players do not have. They want to rush in, rush through, rush on to the next without bothering to take into consideration that they are leaving valuable drops behind. Nor do they care if they're screwing the rest of the squad. 

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We really need some form of control as hosts. It wasn't a problem before, but now I'm getting 1 malicious c*nt every 2-3 runs ruining it for everyone. That guy that...

Sits in the artillery or slingshot? Check.

Jumps on the pilot seat the minute you step away. Check.

Down the flux like an alcoholic at an open bar. Double check.

Refines every chance he gets like some hobo starving for resources. Hell yes.

To rub salt on the bloody wound, this dude usually hijacks navigation forcing everyone to put up with his stench longer.

No doubt such controls could also be used by said malicious c*nt, but think about it, which is likelier. Malicious c*nts building a ship just to troll? Or hot-joining for that?

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1st. Host should have control to allow crew to use navigation, the refine option, and certain abilities. That's been mentioned above I'm sure. Navigation was given to everyone because trolls would sit on it and not let anyone use it. But on the other hand, now players who join my crew will navigate us before we are ready (ie 20+ mods left to pick up and derelicts to run through) or will jump us to a new mission when we (and I, the host/pilot) want to go back to the dry dock. I think it worked better under host control but it would be even better if players could leave mission without having to abort completely.

2nd. When I am in my dojo, and the sentient anomaly shows up, the icon will not appear and access to that mission will not appear until I travel somewhere else then select navigation again. This is an issue throughout warframe, but it's especially annoying here. The dojo has many quirks like this where access to the rest of the game differs, ie kuva lich parazon screen, navigation, and potential traders spawning in your railjack so you can't invite them to trade even once they are in your actual dojo, etc...

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My feedback:

Finding a squad is really, REALLY, REAAAAALLY hard.

1. Too few people playing.

2. Why the game can't just keep insisting until it finds?

3. Why I can't just click somewhere I want to join any squad? Most RJ missions are almost identical, it doesn't matter to me what one I end in, as long I get a squad, having to click all of them one at the time is silly!

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