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Archguns ruins the fun and coop in Empyrean


niete
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For me, although I use archwing, I return immediately when the catastrophic failure alert is poped while I am close to the railjack. Else you just face the consequence.

That said, requires to have at least two Tennos in the railjack is too painful. That's one of the reason to keep railjack out of combat.

Edited by DroopingPuppy
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vor einer Stunde schrieb TheGildedOni:

It's not an Amesha problem. The Amesha isn't OP. The other archwings are underpowered. Considering how you're basically one-shotted by fighters, the archwings need a buff to be comparable to fighters. For a long time, I and others have asked for Tenno fighters, and every time, you all responded to us by saying "archwings are our fighters." Now that we have enemy fighters, you all don't want archwings to actually match them. Do you want archwings to be our fighters or not? Either the archwings should be buffed so that they can take on the fighters or we need new Tenno fighters.

Tenno fighters sound like a cool idea. With that said, I don't think I'd want all archwings to be buffed to a point where they can kill everything as easily as the railjack, because - why even use a railjack at all then?

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2 hours ago, niete said:

Most of the time, people would just go out of the ship with their amesha and cyngas and the pilot would be left to do all the railjack works (driving,repairing,forging) that it makes you unmotivated to play. I understand them for doing that since it is way more efficient than using the side turrets. I suggest buffing the turrets to outperform the archguns especially cyngas.

You are blaming the players for using the optimal set up available to them instead of blaming the guys who made subpar equipment available to the players.

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27 minutes ago, Berserkerkitten said:

Tenno fighters sound like a cool idea. With that said, I don't think I'd want all archwings to be buffed to a point where they can kill everything as easily as the railjack, because - why even use a railjack at all then?

Railjacks would still be more powerful. And if they added in more ship types, then the focus of the Railjacks could be taking on those ships (which would give DE a reason to buff Railjack guns).

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They need to do two things in order to fix this mess of cooperative content:

1) Buff certain aspects of the Railjack or nerf enemies, i mean, it is a large size ship for god's sake, and a simple kamikaze tryhard fighter shooting upfront already beats a 1k shield in 2 seconds, so basically shields are non-existant, same goes when you compare the amount of damage a crew ship can do with homing projectiles. While you are there, sitting like a dumbfeck shooting apoc/pulsar/carcinnox and whatever proj. dealing so little damage to the point it looks like you're healing the enemy.

Also, any form of damage received is a straight punch to the Omni tool resource, and thus, to the amount of resources acquired, which is the main reason i just go straight into an asteroid and park it in there till mission end (and why i got so mad when some random pub squad takes it away from there).

2) Make more consistent improvements to the mods/wreck weapons, some mods don't make any difference at all stat-wise, and the RNG in weapon stats aswell, some of them are not worth it compared to the ones being in research from the Dojo clan, in terms of the amount of materials required.

 

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3 hours ago, Kaotyke said:

If the ship has good guns that outperform the Cyngas and Archwing, I see everyone in the turrets.

I agree, My RJ has a particle ram, MKII load outs and i do much better than with an AW. I think the AW/AG combo is good if you don't currently have a Rail Jack

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3 hours ago, niete said:

Most of the time, people would just go out of the ship with their amesha and cyngas and the pilot would be left to do all the railjack works (driving,repairing,forging) that it makes you unmotivated to play. I understand them for doing that since it is way more efficient than using the side turrets. I suggest buffing the turrets to outperform the archguns especially cyngas.

Yea it is better to just Park the Railjack in some distant spot and go ham murdering stuff until you lvled up the ship enough.

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3 hours ago, SordidDreams said:

IMO everything about the new game mode is awesome except the ship itself. If you just park the ship far away from the action and treat it as archwing 2.0, it's incredibly fun.

That's rank 10, which requires over 1,000 intrinsics points in total to reach. Good luck.

with effort you can do this in a week or two probably. almost rank 8 pilot and I have been playing casually. rank ten will be done by mid January probably.

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3 hours ago, niete said:

Oh please do tell what gun outperforms a cyngas with max strength wisp speed buff

Lavan/Vidar Carcinnox side turrets and Lavan/Vidar Carcinnox or Zetki Cryo for pilot along with proper shields and avionics to buff them further. No point leaving the ship after that except for material farming and clearing away missions/crewships, the role which the last guy fills.

The need for repairs happens once in a bluemoon when you have a good RJ in Veil.

Never ever use Apoc, especially not a Zetki one.

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4 hours ago, niete said:

Most of the time, people would just go out of the ship with their amesha and cyngas and the pilot would be left to do all the railjack works (driving,repairing,forging) that it makes you unmotivated to play. I understand them for doing that since it is way more efficient than using the side turrets. I suggest buffing the turrets to outperform the archguns especially cyngas.

Ship upgrades are currently too expensive. So peoples turrets aren't great. Early missions can be outshined by archwings. 

Once they sort out loot acquisition, the prices won't seem so punishing and more ships will upgrade. 

I'm currently fond of the bug that lets me use my regular gun in archwing. It seems very common to reproduce. This may also contribute to the over abundance of archwings because you can 1 shot fighters with ease. 

 

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2 hours ago, Vit0Corleone said:

It feels super weak when you're starting.

But with a proper build, you can easily out damage archguns, not to mention your Railjack is essentially unkillable.

Currently I play solo on the hardest Veil nodes almost entirely from inside my RJ, only using slingshot to hop on archwing and destroy Crew Ships or completing objectives, using omni tool to get back ( basically choice of archwing/archgun becomes irrelevant ).

Yeah that’s the problem. You shouldn’t feel weak at the start. It should be pretty balanced at the start, but it’s not. It’s like being thrown into a level 40 mission with no mods equipped. That’s needs to change. They also need to do something about Dirac not dropping because Dirac is not dropping.

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If I hop in a pub and host has trash tier guns it's:

Sling Shot > Kill > Recall > Repeat until the mission is over.

I'm not going to beat my head against a wall because host is running MK 0's on Saturn or Zektis without a Polar Coil. 

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Honestly, I love playing interceptor. AW with a gun is my preferred playstyle in RJ. My RJ weapons do more damage than my cyngas. My RJ is pretty pimped out. Doesn't matter, i like to intercept because that's what's fun for me. Sorry if my fun is ruining yours, but i really hope that doesnt result in a nerf for my fun. I get the job done and I'm not telling you how to play.

Edited by Skaleek
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I've been seeing less people use AW for veil last couple days, almost always two people using the RJ guns, so I'm the only one using my AW to get crew ships and slow everything for the gunners while killing what they aren't. Although it makes sense, before people were at Veil with stock ships that would need to be repaired every minute, and now many are at MK3s with ships that never need repairs.

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8 hours ago, niete said:

I have a zetki apoc mk3 with zetki hyperstrike and predator on the side turrets it is definitely strong but overheats way too quickly and the projectiles are slow.

Its a reason why I swore off the Zetki.

They are great Burst weapons, but the Lavan and the Vidar just feel much better when it comes to sustained damage (and more procs)..

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I don't think most of the numbers on archguns are likely to be the issue; their damage numbers got gimped pretty hard. What sounds like is the "problem" is that DE, in very classic DE fashion, introduced a new set of status effects... only for one of them to turn out to be blatantly, massively stronger than all of the other ones! And some of the archguns can be built to spam that status like crazy, like the popular Cyngas.

if the space status end up getting rebalanced/fixed, status archgun effectiveness might just drop like a rock.

Edited by OvisCaedo
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5 hours ago, Anthraxicus said:

You are blaming the players for using the optimal set up available to them instead of blaming the guys who made subpar equipment available to the players.

Looking at it from the wrong angle.  For those individuals that formaed their archwing equipment, of course it's going to outmatch freshly welded relics of the ancient past.  For fresher players, the Railjack turrets are still probably preferable?

The hardest component with starting railjacks are the crewships.  Early fighters are junk, barely qualifying as target practice, it's the crewships with their homing missiles that tear fresh railjacks apart and taking them on solo is dicey.  Fighters only seem good at eating up shields, but that's hardly anything to write home about.

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To be honest i play railjack for fun and i honestly dont care that status ag's are the power house and railjack guns are even better. And certain battle skills are compareable to saryn in certain situations and amesha is the king. 

My friends i play with dont care as well. We do what we want, for most missions i did odonata prime with ratataata imperator vandal as i honestly love the dogfights with a gun working like this, they do them and we make it work. 

In now way we do anything the glorious efficient way, nor fastest possible, nor the most rewarding.. We concentrate on having fun and do what we like and we never failed a mission (aside from the bugged ones ofc) .

We did veil missions in the starter railjack and we dont park the railjack 20km from the action. Our beast is always there were the action is.. sometimes when we park it just under the laser platform cy is getting a panic overload, but we always make it work so he kinda gets used to his new irresponsible pink rhino with butterfly wings crew. 

All that means.. its easy.. Maybe in pugs its different.. Idk, never tried that, but i think that there is too much concetration in wf on what is best for this, for that, when i am asked by someone what to take on a mission the answer is always.. do you and have fun. This works best. 

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