the Tragedy of Nyx

[(PSN)horridhal]

6 minutes ago, TheGrimCorsair said:

He has 1 power, maybe 2 if you're feelin' like being flashy. His 1 and 4 are laughing stocks and rightly so. His passive would work much better integrated into his kit rather than a decision made at the fashion frame screen.

Not every ability needs to clear a room.  His 2 and 3 are in a great place and those two abilities make him a meta for boss/eidolon/orb.

What you don’t seem to realize is that any pass on his kit by DE is going to affect those two abilities.  Or that his 4 also provides a mobility boost.

Edited January 3, 2020 by (PS4)horridhal

[Tuli_Donitsi]

Since ability 1 doesn't let Mind Controlled targets kill anything (Because how armor and health scales and often bad AI) making them basically Thralls or Nekros Undead. I would prefer small buffs like this:

Ability 1: Upon activation mind control main target and also 1/2/3/4 others near the target. (Doesn't scale with ability Strenght)

Ability 2: I have no idea for this one. Able to throw bolts like before latest rework but max armor reduction is 30% (Scales with ability Strenght and you can now throw bolts many times until energy runs out)

Ability 3: Affected enemies ignore players or deal 30% (scales with Strenght) less damage to players

Ability 4: One second invincibility after deactivation so that you get that one second to roll and explosion does what Ember's old Fire Ring ability did and also push enemies away. (Right now you take damage the very microsecond bubble explodes)

Edited January 3, 2020 by Tulipunahapero

[vegetosayajin]

On 2020-01-02 at 4:28 PM, LoneWolveYT said:

Mag,  Hildryn just aren't viable in the current meta. 

Well, get them out of your foundry at least before speaking gibberish. Hell, I can buy you a Mag if you can't take down the sergeant (he is tough, I know).

[Howtoshootgun]

23 hours ago, Anthraxicus said:

It is better than her previous passive, which worked against her other abilities

ugggghh

[Cloud]

To whoever ask me which frame he/she should get, I always answer they are all good, just choose the one you like most! Just a thing... there are only 2 exception: Nyx and Zephyr.

They are totally irrelevant and outdated and seem to be forgotten by everybody, including DE. Don't even waste the resources and time to craft them.

[Hexsing]

2 hours ago, Cloud said:

To whoever ask me which frame he/she should get, I always answer they are all good, just choose the one you like most! Just a thing... there are only 2 exception: Nyx and Zephyr.

They are totally irrelevant and outdated and seem to be forgotten by everybody, including DE. Don't even waste the resources and time to craft them.

Wait.  Zephyr?  Zephyr Prime is really solid.  She brings a lot to the table.  I can for example use her 1 with the Lenz and hover taking out mass amounts of defense enemies before they pose an issue.  I can do the same with the Phatasma and also the Staticore.  

Zephyrs 2 is silly. But it does make the funnel clouds better and bigger.  Otherwise this is her worst ability.  

Her 3 is a great shield.  I have a good range on it and I can protect teams and squads and the Augment is great.  

Her 4 has a lot of potential with the Augment when used properly.  I can reliably strip armor or even spread status.  Zephyr feels good. 

.....

But as a long time Nyx player.  She does need love.  There are so many threads on this topic.  So I assume DE is quite aware of her antiquated functionality.  

.....

Zephyr should not be lumped in with Nyx.  Im not even the biggest fan of Zephyr. I don't main her.  But she is enjoyable to play had has a lot of strategic options that other frames lack. 

[ArkThanatos]

10 hours ago, Vyra said:

I agree, when you got all other frames, Nyx feels useless compared to the others.
Everything Nyx can do, the others can do better.

My Tips for DE:
Mind Control: make the controlled really controllable, just like VENARI ! ( also remove duration and make it a toggle/ basically make Mind control similar to Venari)
Psychic Bolts: Give them Lethal damage, enemies should commit suicide/dmg themselves...
Chaos: remove the S#&$ty "hologram", let enemies hurt themselves, heal Nyx and her allies, scream in agony, kneel before the Goddess!!!
Absorb: Okay to me.

 

something you are missing here and many people are is making Nyx deal dmg on anything but absorb is going to start removing who she is. even absorb works of enemy damage. she never should be the actual source of damage.

her mind control should function like Celestial Twin AI wise. just rambo the S#&$ out of the enemy.
her PB needs a better slow (the current one is crap, base slow should be 70% not 30%. i didn't even realise it had a slow the slows that useless).
Chaos would function far better with the update i suggested. especially with the augment change. 
finally Absorb would be useful. atm it has 1/2 the range of mags 2nd ability and far far weaker + massive energy drain.

current stat of nyx can be summed up like this. She has no Quality build. you can't make a build that benefits all abilities so they all have viability to them. 
your 4th drains more when you have more power strength. so that means power strengths costing your energy,  plus now you need range,
range is good for her 3rd as well but her 4th still needs more range, you need at least 3 range mods. Oh thats 3 mods slots taken up. an now you have 12m range. 
and now you need flow + stream line. 5 mods. CP in aura ..6 . 2 mods spaces left. well lets buff that 1st and 2nd ability with strength... 8  mods with augur secretes and intensify. ok so coaction drift, enemy radar, power drift... doesnt matter. you only have exilus left. 

building for her kit doesn't work that build ^^ might sound like it works till you remember she needs duration and some defensive mods as she is as squishy as and will die if as much as a potato farts in her direction. so you cant build for her 4th (functionally) without killing your quality. 


So how do you fix this, take my rework idea put it into practice, make it so she  can have a quality build. make her damage come from the enemies themselves. make it more functional. (something i may not have been clear on an should go an clear up).

but nyx should never be a DPS frame. that is like making mesa a support. 
DPS can come in many ways. Nyx is utility DPS. she uses the opponents to deal the damage to themselves. the only damage she should be dealing is with a Melee weapon OR guns. 

[ArkThanatos]

2 hours ago, Hexsing said:

Wait.  Zephyr?  Zephyr Prime is really solid.  She brings a lot to the table.  I can for example use her 1 with the Lenz and hover taking out mass amounts of defense enemies before they pose an issue.  I can do the same with the Phatasma and also the Staticore.  

Zephyrs 2 is silly. But it does make the funnel clouds better and bigger.  Otherwise this is her worst ability.  

Her 3 is a great shield.  I have a good range on it and I can protect teams and squads and the Augment is great.  

Her 4 has a lot of potential with the Augment when used properly.  I can reliably strip armor or even spread status.  Zephyr feels good. 

.....

But as a long time Nyx player.  She does need love.  There are so many threads on this topic.  So I assume DE is quite aware of her antiquated functionality.  

.....

Zephyr should not be lumped in with Nyx.  Im not even the biggest fan of Zephyr. I don't main her.  But she is enjoyable to play had has a lot of strategic options that other frames lack. 

I call BullS#&$ on DE knowing about Nyx. simply because they are too busy giving excal another skin and jerking his statue off. 
IF DE gave half as much of a S#&$ for the rest of the frames as they do for Excal. 1 we wouldn't have frames like nyx in sheer states of neglect. 2 all frames would have decent augments... 3 we would actually have a nice assortment of skins for all frames... still waiting on a rev and hildryn skin. and augments...oh an does anyone else remember Harrow needs some love because he has to fight 2 lots of enemies at the same time... his team AND the Enemy units....

zephyr needs some love, but her 3 is stupidly amazing. i really like zephy! infact i like the non meta frames, i  main rev because he is a better Nyx. 


It would be great if DE would actually listen. something they have started to not do over the past few yrs. 

[Nezeloonian]

Zephyr is great. She maybe cannot be so popular or in some meta, but she's consistent and pretty fun specially in open world fortuna or plains. By the way, if someone think she needs changes for better, that's no problem at all. 

[GPrime96]

On 2020-01-02 at 8:38 AM, ArkThanatos said:

 Garuda is more a funny support DPS type brawler

Mag is all about her gun and 2. she has one of the best kits in the game, and she excels in murderising groupd of enemies.

^^Support/DPS type of Frame is pretty accurate to Garuda and can DPS and CC as long as she want since like Garuda, can scale really well. Weapons do matter more for Mag though since not all of them work well for her.

Until a Nullifier wreck her day

Edited January 4, 2020 by GPrime96

[Cloud]

6 hours ago, Hexsing said:

Wait.  Zephyr?  Zephyr Prime is really solid.  She brings a lot to the table.  I can for example use her 1 with the Lenz and hover taking out mass amounts of defense enemies before they pose an issue.  I can do the same with the Phatasma and also the Staticore.  

Zephyrs 2 is silly. But it does make the funnel clouds better and bigger.  Otherwise this is her worst ability.  

Her 3 is a great shield.  I have a good range on it and I can protect teams and squads and the Augment is great.  

Her 4 has a lot of potential with the Augment when used properly.  I can reliably strip armor or even spread status.  Zephyr feels good. 

.....

But as a long time Nyx player.  She does need love.  There are so many threads on this topic.  So I assume DE is quite aware of her antiquated functionality.  

.....

Zephyr should not be lumped in with Nyx.  Im not even the biggest fan of Zephyr. I don't main her.  But she is enjoyable to play had has a lot of strategic options that other frames lack. 

Her 1 is just a jump with energy cost, or as alternative a very clunky gauss 1st.

Her 2 is a bad joke

Her 3 and her augment was the only reason she was ever picked at all by anyone

Her 4 is just a visual mess with marginal utility, which can be done better by far with other frames.

 

In the end if you see at what she does really put on the table, it's just the 3rd skill, which however suffer in comparison to other defensive skills, since she redirectd only projectiles and suffers to lasers, aoe/splash damage and melee. Add to this, the fact that she's one if not the worst frame for armor possible. 

[KroneVanguard]

On 2020-01-02 at 3:12 PM, (PS4)robotwars7 said:

I'll be honest, I totally forgot Nyx even existed

Why should Nyx players and Devs consider what you write then?

I hate people who complain about Nyx and not even play her. If you don't like her, just don't play her. I don't like more than half of the characters but I don't come here whining for them to be changed. 😒

[Vyra]

14 minutes ago, KroneVanguard said:

Why should Nyx players and Devs consider what you write then?

I hate people who complain about Nyx and not even play her. If you don't like her, just don't play her. I don't like more than half of the characters but I don't come here whining for them to be changed. 😒

I played her mainly back then... before her psychic bolts got nerfed...

[Ikserdok]

18 minutes ago, KroneVanguard said:

Why should Nyx players and Devs consider what you write then?

I hate people who complain about Nyx and not even play her. If you don't like her, just don't play her. I don't like more than half of the characters but I don't come here whining for them to be changed. 😒

why you immediately assume this?

after this post of robotwars I can also see like he liked to play nyx before when she was usefull but not today, in current state (of game), so he even forgot she exist after longer time when game started evovling in way where nyx got very outdated without any updates to her while releasing more useful and more useful frames

so its not that hard to forget for even existence of some frames if they are really outdated for now and we have many other brilliant frames doing everything much better, efficient so this is also time waste to even think about those old outdated frames

[0_The_F00l]

I liked reading the OP, 

My own suggestion is to make her 1 a mix between invisibility, disarm and decoy. 

Whenever you use mind control, you will appear as one of them to the enemies and you will never get their aggro similar to being invisible. Anyone that damages the enemy has a chance to get disarmed. 

This will be only until mind control lasts or you shoot an enemy (only that enemy will get aggro) . 

Her 2 transferring to others on death should have been part of the base changes I believe. 

Her 3 is kinda fine as is, 

Her 4 needs better drain calculations, and a means to focus all that damage. 

[(PSN)Hooligonzo]

I picked up Nyx again for a Lich Hunt (wanted that Radiation damage and a shot at the Ephemera) and she's still fun, but could use some love.

Mostly I would like it if she had more heads.  She doesn't have many good ones and a lot of the newer heads have this gradient blending thing going on that just looks bad every time it's used.

Anyway, yeah.  More Nyx love would be rad.  Frankly I think we should be able to plug an Umbra Forma into her and have her go autonomous like Excalibur Umbra.

[KroneVanguard]

10 hours ago, Ikserdok said:

why you immediately assume this?

I don't trust DE anymore. Too many changes which I don't like. They don't improve characters anymore, they completely change them 'cause they don't know how to fix or up to date what they have done in the past. ... Ember. I had a lot of fun with her and now I stopped playing with her. I have 23/26% gameplay with Nyx and now you want her to be changed. No. I don't give a 💩 about other Warframes doing everything much better. Should I play the ones you play?! You should play your brilliant ones and leave Nyx to who actually like her. There are 50+ characters... 😒

[ArkThanatos]

11 hours ago, KroneVanguard said:

Why should Nyx players and Devs consider what you write then?

I hate people who complain about Nyx and not even play her. If you don't like her, just don't play her. I don't like more than half of the characters but I don't come here whining for them to be changed. 😒

 this is why i actually picked her up, she is also the reason i main rev. rev just does it better. 
i think the changes i suggested would bring her back up to speed. keep her true to herself

 

49 minutes ago, KroneVanguard said:

I don't trust DE anymore. Too many changes which I don't like. They don't improve characters anymore, they completely change them 'cause they don't know how to fix or up to date what they have done in the past. ... Ember. I had a lot of fun with her and now I stopped playing with her. I have 23/26% gameplay with Nyx and now you want her to be changed. No. I don't give a 💩 about other Warframes doing everything much better. Should I play the ones you play?! You should play your brilliant ones and leave Nyx to who actually like her. There are 50+ characters... 😒

i see alot of people making their own suggestions, but any that change her current play style in order of DPS or sometihng she is not. i dont care for. 
All of Nyx's damage should come from the enemy. not nyx (unless its her melee or guns).
i dont want to see her becoming invis, or things like that. my whole thing was update her in a way that makes her nearly exactly the same. just with more fluid gameplay. 

i dont want no DPS nyx, or invis. I want a nyx that uses her opponents damage against themselves. 
just make her kit Functional.  
Phybolt should be what it is. just a functioning slow (30% can piss off.. should be 70-90%) and it doesn't ever need to deal damage.
the idea of my "rework" is to work her Reuse her kit, a few new things to make it better.  

1st ability, MC - minions dont have invunrability. remove that so they can have a explosion on death. 
2nd needs a augment that isn't Chaos v1.01 this is the stupidest augment ever, makes her 2nd the same as her 3rd on a really small scale. just.. this shows how much of a S#&$ they didn't give for nyx.
3rd buffing passive makes her survivability scale with unit density, augment means ability is stronger and allows for more damage to be taken by the enemies. 
4th. yeah its only a 8s ability, no drain thou. more range, better damage transfer. new augment that would let it do just that bit more. specially if you went 3 an 4 augment. 

the whole point was to make it so her 3rds still that ability you use. in conjunction with the rest. she would be able to have a quality build rather than atm where if you cant really build for everything. you need to nearly only build for her 4th to make it work an then you dont get to use your kit and you have no defence. 
i dont want her playstyle to change, but my idea should let her builds be more smooth and allow for a quality build. 

all i want is her utility to be functional. i love her game play style. it just needs a tune up.

in mechanic terms, Im taking my care in for a service and tune up. new filters, belts, fluids, leads and sparks, bit of time on the dino. i better not  pick up my ride and it has a whole new engine gearbox and suspension when i get it back! 
 

[Toppien]

On 2020-01-02 at 7:53 AM, ArkThanatos said:

snip

zephyr: get behind the line

[ArkThanatos]

1 hour ago, Toppien said:

zephyr: get behind the line

she needs work sure, but she at least has a more functional kit ATM. its not great. but it is more functional. nyx just beats her out on need or a tune up

[ArcKnight9202]

With Nyx's last revisit, she went from my favorite frame to play most of the time, to dumpster fire I don't play anymore for any reason. I moved to Khora, with basically the same weapons, and do just as well. It's not the same style but the results are similar if not better.

OP is spot on with the comparison to Enthrall. Enthrall is basically Mind Control and Chaos rolled into one ability. Mesmer Skin is also a much better variant of Assimilate and doesn't require any augments. It even stuns the enemies that hit you! Especially for solo play, he's hands down the superior pick.

 

As for other things: Psychic Bolts sucks and the stats to make it work conflict with her other abilities(typically). I do not see any merit to this ability beyond early-game leveling. As I mentioned, I went to Khora and do just as well if not better with the same loadout. Armor is meaningless when you can ignore it or remove it with status or just totally brute force it with our ridiculously overpowered weapons. You have to get to some absurd levels where you have to worry about it. Even then you can still go around it.

Shields don't matter a great majority of the time. And debuffing Infested was super easy when it gave a radiation proc. Ancients slurped that right up!

Could this be useful given some sort of Armor rework? Sure, potentially. Until then, scrap it and replace it with something else.

 

The passive is absolute crap. At low levels, it offers no value because the enemies will never kill you with any amount of damage. At high levels, only a single shot has to hit you to kill you. How anyone can think "Chance to not be hit by gunfire" is superior to "Chance to eliminate gunfire permanently" is beyond my understanding. You can really see the difference in how much extra gunfire you take when Chaos is actively affecting enemies.

 

Did they fix the nerf to Chaos that restricts it to only a single cast?

 

Absorb can be scrapped entirely and replaced with something that isn't the worst ability in the game. Assimilate can go with it.

If DE wants suggestions and improvements, there's a lot of feedback on the site. I'm not going to bother listing the hundreds of ideas people have given. There are some really good ones out there, though.

[(XBOX)Cram Duahcim]

Should be renamed "The tragedy of Zephyr"

Only frame in the game right now that you can say is honestly useless. 

[ArkThanatos]

9 hours ago, (XB1)Cram Duahcim said:

Should be renamed "The tragedy of Zephyr"

Only frame in the game right now that you can say is honestly useless. 

you mean one of the best defence frames, with decent CC and can traverse the open worlds faster than anyone else......
she is atm just a bit more useful than nyx, i play both, zephyr can at least survive high level content, Nyx can not. 

 

 

9 hours ago, ArcKnight9202 said:

The passive is absolute crap. At low levels, it offers no value because the enemies will never kill you with any amount of damage. At high levels, only a single shot has to hit you to kill you. How anyone can think "Chance to not be hit by gunfire" is superior to "Chance to eliminate gunfire permanently" is beyond my understanding. You can really see the difference in how much extra gunfire you take when Chaos is actively affecting enemies.

 

Did they fix the nerf to Chaos that restricts it to only a single cast?

 

Absorb can be scrapped entirely and replaced with something that isn't the worst ability in the game. Assimilate can go with it.

If DE wants suggestions and improvements, there's a lot of feedback on the site. I'm not going to bother listing the hundreds of ideas people have given. There are some really good ones out there, though.

IF Evasion was made to be like Baruuks 1st ability then its fine. but this accuracy thing is stupid, just make it a chance of not getting hit. that is a more reliable function.

the whole reason for how i said to rework her 4th would give it dmg.  shorter duration but 2x the absorption rate of Mags 2 which is one of the strongest abilities in game. 
also added more range and no drain. it would work. specially with 2 modes. 

chaos is fixed. 

she really does need a fix. 
DE needs to actually listen. 

oh an PB does work, i think what would make it better is if (thinking of it now) if it had a damage modifier to it,so targets receive more damage from IPS.

so in theory with that added into the mix, how i would have it function would be 
minions aren't invulnerable  so
with my rework idea you would go .
cast PB, MC targets, cast chaos, let them kill the minions triggering detonation, repeat and add then add 4. you could clear a room rather quickly. 
MC death detonation would dmg near by enemies, hopefully also trigger a cascade. 

atm warframe NEEDS  shield gating. If not giving it to warframes. then i had an idea to solve issues like this.
give Prime frames an intrinsic system. with perks, modifications, stat changes (increasing base stats by small % amounts) 
have it so you can have shield gating. a natural vaccuum. etc, things to constantly upgrade infinitely with small %'s this would make Primes special. allow for squishy to develop survivability. add cool perks. and a progression system of meaning + means they could start bringing in more higher level content and this is where frames could seperate. Base frames for general starchart But high level content\endgame can be geared more for Primes. giving them a purpose other then looking better. (primes are suppose to be penicle of power... that 25Hp really isn't saying pennicle of power if im honest

[SirTobe]

51 minutes ago, ArkThanatos said:

.. zephyr can at least survive high level content, Nyx can not. 

Yes she can. I play high level content with her all the time. Sorties, Arbies, and Veil, no problem. With Primed Flow, Quick Thinking, Adaptation, and Absorb Assimilate in your build you got a lot of survivability. You just have to look out for those OP grenades and energy leechers, as with every other frame except Rhino and Inaros. 

[texrei]

31 minutes ago, SirTobe said:

Yes she can. I play high level content with her all the time. Sorties, Arbies, and Veil, no problem. With Primed Flow, Quick Thinking, Adaptation, and Absorb Assimilate in your build you got a lot of survivability. You just have to look out for those OP grenades and energy leechers, as with every other frame except Rhino and Inaros. 

And tons of energy supplies, right?