Is there ANY possible alternative to making things fully Status Immune?

[DrivaMain]

Status immunity needs to go. Period.
 

This is the one reason why the meta revolves around the crit meta especially in World Bosses Fight. If you DE wants to have build diversity and lessening the meta restrictions you you must remove this barrier or apply status resistance instead.

[(XBOX)Erudite Prime]

16 hours ago, Aldain said:

Not as long as Viral and Slash exist.

What part of "reduced status effects" did you miss?

[Aldain]

14 minutes ago, (XB1)Erudite Prime said:

What part of "reduced status effects" did you miss?

Even if the effectiveness of Viral and Slash were reduced that doesn't change the fact that Viral can be reapplied and Slash can be stacked, even reducing the Viral effect to 25% health reduction is still a huge amount of health removed and halving the damage from Slash would just mean that more stacks need to be applied.

The reason why status immunity occurs is because a large number of weapons can reach 100% status application and stack/reapply status to the point of being permanent, even if the duration was reduced the uptime of status is still massive.

Several status effects are so strong that no matter how much you reduce their effectiveness they still will have dramatic effects on enemies, and as long as application of status effects are near effortless these powerful status effects wind up requiring status immunity.

Reducing something that scales infinitely doesn't change the fact that it will always have the same level of effectiveness regardless of the enemy in question.

[DrivaMain]

2 hours ago, Aldain said:

Even if the effectiveness of Viral and Slash were reduced that doesn't change the fact that Viral can be reapplied and Slash can be stacked, even reducing the Viral effect to 25% health reduction is still a huge amount of health removed and halving the damage from Slash would just mean that more stacks need to be applied.

The reason why status immunity occurs is because a large number of weapons can reach 100% status application and stack/reapply status to the point of being permanent, even if the duration was reduced the uptime of status is still massive.

Several status effects are so strong that no matter how much you reduce their effectiveness they still will have dramatic effects on enemies, and as long as application of status effects are near effortless these powerful status effects wind up requiring status immunity.

Reducing something that scales infinitely doesn't change the fact that it will always have the same level of effectiveness regardless of the enemy in question.

I guess part status immune might be a good compromise. Like some bosses have different immunity to some status (most bosses in other games already do this).

[kapn655321]

If boss or eximus enemies have 1 status that they are uniquely (mostly) immune to, then that would be acceptable.
Any immunity should have a way to negate or diminish that through some strategy or accuracy.
..If you're killing with something it's strong against, you're doing it for fun or out of desperation.

[Bakaguya-sama]

6 hours ago, Aldain said:

The reason why status immunity occurs is because a large number of weapons can reach 100% status application and stack/reapply status to the point of being permanent, even if the duration was reduced the uptime of status is still massive.

Oh nice wasnt even aware that something like this existed.  

I still dont understand why corrosive have unlimited duration to begin with. If Corrosive has limited duration then this would definitely be a viable solution (Reducing status duration on certain enemies I mean). 

6 hours ago, Aldain said:

The reason why status immunity occurs is because a large number of weapons can reach 100% status application and stack/reapply status to the point of being permanent, even if the duration was reduced the uptime of status is still massive.

Then the solution could be to that "Status Resistant enemies" has reduce status chance agaisnt them. Say a pellet shotgun has 100% status chance per pellet. When it hit these "Status Resistant" enemies the status chance for each pellet is reduced by half to 50% or something along that line. This prevent rapid pilling up of status effects or perma stunning enemies.  

As I said in the OP, I would rather have Status do anything, no matter how weak and neutered it is, over having Status doing nothing at all against a whole faction in the game.  

[Aadi880]

Make crit immune enemies.

[(XBOX)WolfKingLeo]

Just now, Aadi880 said:

Make crit immune enemies.

why?

[Aadi880]

28 minutes ago, (XB1)WolfKingLeo said:

why?

why not? 😛

There's status immune.

There's ability immune.

There's damage immune.

But crit immune is missing.

After that we need VOID immune!

Lots of immunes!

[(XBOX)WolfKingLeo]

1 hour ago, Aadi880 said:

why not? 😛

There's status immune.

There's ability immune.

There's damage immune.

But crit immune is missing.

After that we need VOID immune!

Lots of immunes!

So true

Edited January 7, 2020 by (XB1)WolfKingLeo

[Braneman]

On 2020-01-06 at 5:46 AM, Aldain said:

Not as long as Viral and Slash exist.

The issue with status, like several other things in Warframe, is that they are so powerful that they stand to trivialize everything they work on. Similar to how Mesa's 4 makes ability immunity a mandatory requirement for several things, despite the disparate impact that it can have on other Warframes that don't have the same comical deleting power.

Honestly I don't expect it will be long before we have Crit immune enemies, after the Wolf of Saturn Six showed his ugly face of massive armor, natural DR, immunity to basically everything but massive crits and a head that took LESS damage than the torso.

The number one sign of poor balance is how many exceptions to the rules you need to staple onto an enemy for them to not be considered a joke.

That doesn't mean they have to be immune to status effects, that means that they should be immune to viral procs and have a special thing that turns slash procs into a normal damage proc that doesn't ignore armor/other effects, done, that's the only change that needs to happen to at least make status weapons not entirely useless against these enemies. If they're already an exception they should be an exception in a smart way not such a brute force way. Then something like a weapon whose only use is proccing toxin damage has a use alongside crit weapons because it can do full damage again.

[Zectico]

Better yet let's give object health to Sentients so they can't take crits either _/s

[ImWithDerp]

Give all status types 3 possible effects (some of which can be identical if suitable), 1 for standard enemies, 1 for special enemies, 1 for warframes,

Bosses and enemies who are currently status immune are now considered 'special enemies', and all status immunities are removed. Status effects for special enemies are built with this in mind.

[Xzorn]

Yes, there's been a solution since 2014 before it became this much of a problem. To explain I'd have to tell a bit of a story.

Back when Damage 2.0 came out tons of things changed. Enemy level scaling, Enemy damage scaling, Enemy weak points, combined status effects, Armor scaling, Interaction of damage types against Armor and health types. Armor added to enemy weak points, mod changes among a other things.

Most of this was good outside head-armor but there was one glaring problem that was even brought up on an old Dev stream...
Enemy Damage Scaling

Since we were running around with 2-4k eHP but could still easily kill lvl 100+ enemies; Players resorted to mass CC lockdown methods in order to push those levels in the Void. Because Enemy damage scaling was never addressed; CC and invisibility were allowed to remain far too potent for years as result.

DE's response over time for this was to change most multiplicative damage sources to additive while also increasing new frame eHP values but giving them fairly limited CC. This resulted is the massive eHP gap you see today between frames but I supposed that still wasn't enough so they added Nullifiers and other Area Denial enemies to further limit the potency of CC. Since enemy scaling never worked correctly Warframe never produced any end-game type content after The Void/Damage 2.0

Since the game never developed end-game content DE then resorted to Immunity for both abilities and status effects in order to create artificial difficulty by essentially ignoring the rules of their own game. Creating so many exceptions to the rule where at this point there kinda aren't any. So now many play methods are dead or in dire shape, frames are in constant need of reworks when they previously worked fine and it's a total eHP + DPS meta. All because DE never fixed that one problem so many years ago.

TLTR: The Answer is Damage 3.0