DE broke Railjack more(PS4)

[(PSN)Sgt_Buttscratch]

On PS4 we didn’t get the same empyrean as PC, not only did we receive the buggy, laggy update but we not given avionics trade, 1 month later we still don’t. Shedu is bugged, engineering 10 is broke, if you’re not host 90% of stuff don’t work. Garuda’s claws don’t work... list is huge

A few days ago we got a hot fix, which broke ship spawns, we get Crewships spawning 16km away, only 50% of fighters will spawn, trickle spawns of 2-4 fighters at a time etc etc. how did you manage to break it more DE?

Can we please have an actual hot fix, a month of trash. This is not good enough. You have dropped the ball big time.

[(PSN)crashteddy03]

In the most recent livestreams DE acknowledged that there was a lot of stuff that needed fixing, however most of it touches code that needs to be sent to cert rather than just being hotfixed. Rather than send multiple builds to cert the plan was to wait for a new content drop which is coming up for the PC version and include that in the next console build sent to cert for all consoles along with all of the fixes to date. I'm hanging out for it too because the changes are massive compared to what we have now.

I understand DE trying to release Railjack as a surprise just before Christmas. Could it have been better? Yes. Did the timing of it make it worse because all the devs were on holiday? Yes. Has it stopped me from trying to play it and have fun regardless of the bugs? Absolutely not!

[(PSN)FriendSharkey]

I gutted through and opened all the nodes and managed to snag some good MKIII parts for my ship, a void hole, and reactors for the pending update by playing random pubs. Oh yeah it's a mess when you get more than two players on a rail jack...but, I haven't stopped farming titanium on the first mission while solo...

It takes a while for the consoles to get it, so I figure we'll get the update soon, or they are waiting so they can attach some Tennogen skins and or the Ivara Deluxe... 

[(PSN)smb-twisted]

I stopped playing it ages back. Just forget it exists for a month or so, you'll be better off for it. 

DE releases big update to drive up numbers of players and all it does is put existing people off playing at all. Bad times

[(PSN)robotwars7]

2 hours ago, (PS4)FriendSharkey said:

It takes a while for the consoles to get it, so I figure we'll get the update soon, or they are waiting so they can attach some Tennogen skins and or the Ivara Deluxe... 

I definitely want more Tennogen, feels like years since our last lot. that's not the reason it's being delayed though: it's being delayed because DE want to push another content update for PC, which is most likely going to bring in Nightwave Season 3: the Glass Maker. Nightwave has to launch simultaneously on all platforms, so until Nightwave is out the door, we get nothing.

I just hope that DE learned their lesson not to rush an update out before taking their holiday break. if it's not gonna be out in time, just leave it; take your holidays, come back refreshed and pick up where you left off. we can wait more easily and calm knowing that we will get the finished article in one go. I've played a bit of railjack on and off, and my ship is relatively ready for the Veil, but I'll feel much better when we get the fixes we so desperately need.

[(PSN)Tactless_Ninja]

A friend of mine stopped playing after he stopped getting intrinsics and was locked out of the veil as a result.

I stopped because no one is playing and I'm not going alone. Not with how crappy dojo t3 equipment is in that area. And every mission is "kill 100 zippy ships and hack 20 tanky bois then do third thing" which is a slog when the game decides to not let you leave or even get credit for your effort when it's all done. 

[(PSN)Sgt_Buttscratch]

5 hours ago, (PS4)crashteddy03 said:

In the most recent livestreams DE acknowledged that there was a lot of stuff that needed fixing, however most of it touches code that needs to be sent to cert rather than just being hotfixed. Rather than send multiple builds to cert the plan was to wait for a new content drop which is coming up for the PC version and include that in the next console build sent to cert for all consoles along with all of the fixes to date. I'm hanging out for it too because the changes are massive compared to what we have now.

I understand DE trying to release Railjack as a surprise just before Christmas. Could it have been better? Yes. Did the timing of it make it worse because all the devs were on holiday? Yes. Has it stopped me from trying to play it and have fun regardless of the bugs? Absolutely not!

This is the worst way to deal with it, hold and release it with new bugs...new content. We’re missing actual content which was and is there for others, can’t even trade my friend a mun vortex(he has baaad luck). 

We need bug fixes ASAP, not after pc gets its 100th hotfix and new content. The new content is not needed, we have Lich and Railjack to fix.

[Kaotyke]

DE has not put any update on consoles since mid-December

OP: DE has broke Railjack more with an update a few days ago.

How the hell?

[(PSN)Sgt_Buttscratch]

3 minutes ago, Kaotyke said:

DE has not put any update on consoles since mid-December

OP: DE has broke Railjack more with an update a few days ago.

How the hell?

They hot fixed it on friday, I never said update, read.

Edited January 28, 2020 by (PS4)covan2306

[Kaotyke]

20 minutes ago, (PS4)covan2306 said:

They hot fixed it on friday, I never said update, read.

And there are no patch notes in the forums.

And a hotfix  IS an update.

[(PSN)Sgt_Buttscratch]

13 minutes ago, Kaotyke said:

And there are no patch notes in the forums.

And a hotfix  IS an update.

No notes on forums.....yes there is. I went and found it within 30 seconds.

On PS4 hotfixes are very small that are applied when the game loads. An update goes through Sony’s lame system, and are usually a decent size. I did tag the title with (PS4)...for a reason.

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

5 hours ago, (PS4)crashteddy03 said:

In the most recent livestreams DE acknowledged that there was a lot of stuff that needed fixing, however most of it touches code that needs to be sent to cert rather than just being hotfixed. Rather than send multiple builds to cert the plan was to wait for a new content drop which is coming up for the PC version and include that in the next console build sent to cert for all consoles along with all of the fixes to date. I'm hanging out for it too because the changes are massive compared to what we have now.

I understand DE trying to release Railjack as a surprise just before Christmas. Could it have been better? Yes. Did the timing of it make it worse because all the devs were on holiday? Yes. Has it stopped me from trying to play it and have fun regardless of the bugs? Absolutely not!

Well said. 

[(PSN)Hiero_Glyph]

9 hours ago, (PS4)crashteddy03 said:

In the most recent livestreams DE acknowledged that there was a lot of stuff that needed fixing, however most of it touches code that needs to be sent to cert rather than just being hotfixed. Rather than send multiple builds to cert the plan was to wait for a new content drop which is coming up for the PC version and include that in the next console build sent to cert for all consoles along with all of the fixes to date. I'm hanging out for it too because the changes are massive compared to what we have now.

I understand DE trying to release Railjack as a surprise just before Christmas. Could it have been better? Yes. Did the timing of it make it worse because all the devs were on holiday? Yes. Has it stopped me from trying to play it and have fun regardless of the bugs? Absolutely not!

Fun is subjective; lack of support for 6 weeks is factual.

[(PSN)Sgt_Buttscratch]

1 hour ago, (PS4)Hiero_Glyph said:

Fun is subjective; lack of support for 6 weeks is factual.

Exactly, Void trader has offered more quality since empyrean released 

[(PSN)sweatshawp]

8 hours ago, (PS4)robotwars7 said:

I just hope that DE learned their lesson not to rush an update

They never do 

[(PSN)Agent_CHAR]

13 hours ago, (PS4)crashteddy03 said:

Rather than send multiple builds to cert the plan was to wait for a new content drop which is coming up for the PC version and include that in the next console build sent to cert for all consoles along with all of the fixes to date.

We all know what the plan is.  That doesn't make it a GOOD plan.

This is a case where DE needed to suck it up and submit two builds to cert instead of one.  Consider this, we're waiting for a PC release that still hasn't happened.  IF, and I stress if, that gets pushed out this week then console is looking at another week for the PC version to get hot fixed.  Another week to port the code to console.  Another week for cert.  Minimum.   No updates in a span of 60+ days from 12/18 to ~2/18.

If any one of those parts of the timeline get delayed?  This sucks and there isn't any way to sugar coat that fact.  Not even the U14 fiasco of delay was this bad.

[zehne]

I mean, I hate to be the bearer of bad news...

But DE has stated that first and foremost Warframe is a PC game.  For those on other platforms, you're always going to have a backseat.  Throw in the certs that the other platforms require and you're looking at alot of reasons why your experience in game might be sub-optimal.  Yes there probably could of been more testing before the initial launch, but is it better to have no update vs one that is buggy?

A very easy solution DE could implement is to push ALL major updates/launches on other platforms back 1-2months so that all the major bugs are found/fixed on PC before sending to console.  Would you like that?  When developing there is no way to catch all the bugs.  That leaves 2 options: Launch it early as is (debugged as best you can) or delay.  Considering the nature of the program in question, the best way to find bugs quickly is to let millions of users find them.  Like it or not, users (consumers) are always going to be a good source of bug discovery.

If people always complain about buggy launches the solution is going to require later deployment, even to say, a much later deployment.

Since the console launches are further gated by certs, the best way to push it out to console fastest w/o bugs would be to launch early on PC (buggy) and wait for bug fixes before launching on console.  But that means the PC version is likely to be worse at launch.  So there is give and take.

Since we're talking about the discovery of bugs too, the optimal point to launch isn't known exactly (except in hindsight).  So DE can only really take a stab in the dark on whether something is ready for launch or not.  That decision is obviously effected by many variables.  The only thing we do know is that DE thought it was time to launch and so they did.  We can (and often do) give them feedback on their decisions and maybe that'll factor into making better choices in the future. 

As we all know though, you can't please everyone.

[(PSN)Sgt_Buttscratch]

1 hour ago, zehne said:

I mean, I hate to be the bearer of bad news...

But DE has stated that first and foremost Warframe is a PC game.  For those on other platforms, you're always going to have a backseat.  Throw in the certs that the other platforms require and you're looking at alot of reasons why your experience in game might be sub-optimal.  Yes there probably could of been more testing before the initial launch, but is it better to have no update vs one that is buggy?

A very easy solution DE could implement is to push ALL major updates/launches on other platforms back 1-2months so that all the major bugs are found/fixed on PC before sending to console.  Would you like that?  When developing there is no way to catch all the bugs.  That leaves 2 options: Launch it early as is (debugged as best you can) or delay.  Considering the nature of the program in question, the best way to find bugs quickly is to let millions of users find them.  Like it or not, users (consumers) are always going to be a good source of bug discovery.

If people always complain about buggy launches the solution is going to require later deployment, even to say, a much later deployment.

Since the console launches are further gated by certs, the best way to push it out to console fastest w/o bugs would be to launch early on PC (buggy) and wait for bug fixes before launching on console.  But that means the PC version is likely to be worse at launch.  So there is give and take.

Since we're talking about the discovery of bugs too, the optimal point to launch isn't known exactly (except in hindsight).  So DE can only really take a stab in the dark on whether something is ready for launch or not.  That decision is obviously effected by many variables.  The only thing we do know is that DE thought it was time to launch and so they did.  We can (and often do) give them feedback on their decisions and maybe that'll factor into making better choices in the future. 

As we all know though, you can't please everyone.

If they had let me on a PS4 test server before release within minutes I’d have a list and a half. No way Empyrean was tested, not a chance. 

As for separation in time across platforms, that has to be brought inline before the end of the year. So far we started the year within a week of each other and it’s lookin like the 1-2 month gap will be here regardless of update release times.

 

not one good reason has been given for shunning consoles, they pose on interviews claiming to be for the fans, up on game awards acting big. Now in 2020 they are trying to mimic Bethesda, warframe 76. No updates, no real hot fix. Only support we’ve seen is the new $29.99 Empyrean support pack. 

 

Edited January 29, 2020 by (PS4)covan2306

[(PSN)Agent_CHAR]

1 hour ago, zehne said:

But DE has stated that first and foremost Warframe is a PC game.  For those on other platforms, you're always going to have a backseat.  Throw in the certs that the other platforms require and you're looking at alot of reasons why your experience in game might be sub-optimal.  Yes there probably could of been more testing before the initial launch, but is it better to have no update vs one that is buggy?

Again, repeating what the general state of the world we live in serves no purpose here.  Console players know how the system works and in the normal course of events we are fine with that. 

When something ATYPICAL happens we're going to talk about it and express frustration with it.

PC 27.0.5 shipped 12/17

PC 27.0.6 shipped 12/18

  * Asteroids now drop multiple Resources! Alongside other Resources, this significantly increase Titanium gains
  * Pennant and Quellor Blueprints are now shared pickups
  * You can now trade Avionics
  * Points of Interest and Crewships that launch Ramsleds will now only do so 4 times

PC 27.0.7 shipped 12/19

PC 27.0.8 shipped 12/20

  * Significantly increased the amount of Common Resources awarded by the End of Mission Rewards
  * Fixed Non-Elite Exo Fighters unable to spawn in Veil Proxima
  * Fixed Gyre Elites not dropping Avionics

PC 27.0.9 shipped 1/9

  * Halved Fighter Armor
  * All Battle Avionics are now potential drops from Elite fighters in Deep Space
  * Also, with new permanent markers on Avionics
  * Weapon & Proc Adjustments
  * Doubled the chance of obtaining Wreckage from End of Mission Rewards

PC 27.0.10 shipped 1/10

PC 27.0.11 shipped 1/16

  * The Great Reactor Buffings

PC 27.0.12 shipped 1/23

 

First, note that console got 27.0.5 on 12/18.  JUST ONE DAY AFTER PC.  Clearly if DE wants to rush something out the door into our hands they can.

Second, you can't tell me that in that sequence of PC updates there wasn't a good spot to spin off a build to console.  My opinion is that I should be playing on 27.0.10 right now with all of those very important changes and fixes that I've picked out of the full release notes.

[(PSN)sweatshawp]

48 minutes ago, (PS4)covan2306 said:

but is it better to have no update vs one that is buggy?

Yes yes it is. A less buggy update would be a more enjoyable update and I'd rather wait longer.for a finished product then getting what we got for liches rj and fortuna 

[(PSN)Herrwann69]

Il y a 3 heures, zehne a dit :

I mean, I hate to be the bearer of bad news...

But DE has stated that first and foremost Warframe is a PC game.  For those on other platforms, you're always going to have a backseat.  Throw in the certs that the other platforms require and you're looking at alot of reasons why your experience in game might be sub-optimal.  Yes there probably could of been more testing before the initial launch, but is it better to have no update vs one that is buggy?

A very easy solution DE could implement is to push ALL major updates/launches on other platforms back 1-2months so that all the major bugs are found/fixed on PC before sending to console.  Would you like that?  When developing there is no way to catch all the bugs.  That leaves 2 options: Launch it early as is (debugged as best you can) or delay.  Considering the nature of the program in question, the best way to find bugs quickly is to let millions of users find them.  Like it or not, users (consumers) are always going to be a good source of bug discovery.

If people always complain about buggy launches the solution is going to require later deployment, even to say, a much later deployment.

Since the console launches are further gated by certs, the best way to push it out to console fastest w/o bugs would be to launch early on PC (buggy) and wait for bug fixes before launching on console.  But that means the PC version is likely to be worse at launch.  So there is give and take.

Since we're talking about the discovery of bugs too, the optimal point to launch isn't known exactly (except in hindsight).  So DE can only really take a stab in the dark on whether something is ready for launch or not.  That decision is obviously effected by many variables.  The only thing we do know is that DE thought it was time to launch and so they did.  We can (and often do) give them feedback on their decisions and maybe that'll factor into making better choices in the future. 

As we all know though, you can't please everyone.

The problem is DE releasing awful updates, nothing else. No company should send something in the state of Railjack to their customers, it's a proof that they don't respect us as customers as long as they can make their big announcement hype.

And many other games don't have troubles with releasing updates on the same timing on pc and consoles. DE are not doing it because they don't want to do their part that's all.

[(PSN)TheLastPillar]

PS4 player here; I just straight up refuse to play railjack. It's incredibly unbalanced, the farm to get halfway decent stuff is atrocious, and it has more bugs than one of those giant termite mounds. I avoided Fortuna for months for the same reason; I didn't even reach rank 2 with Solaris United until the Profit Taker fight was a month old. No one wants to hear this, but we all collectively just need to stop playing railjack altogether. If DE can see how much of a disaster railjack has been through the number of players who have a railjack yet are not using it, they may realize just how much attention it needs...either that or railjack becomes the next Lunaro. For now though, I'm gonna leave Saturn, Veil, and all that hidden story stuff for later.

In all honesty, the idea of railjack seems like a lot of fun. It has good bones and has the potential to give Warframe a big boost the same way that PoE did back in 2017. I remember when all the big YouTubers and Twitch streamers all decided to give Warframe a shot around that time and almost every single one of them was ranting and raving about how good it was. It was the reason I started playing. That hype died off, and now almost none of them even mention Warframe anymore, but Destiny and Diablo are still being talked about all the time. Why? Because they have content that brings players back, raids and god tier loot. I think DE gave railjack parts random rolls to mimic the models of those other games, and I empathize with their struggle to give veterans something to work for the same way their competitors do, but they have to find a different way.

[zehne]

On 2020-01-28 at 5:11 PM, (PS4)sweatshawp said:

Yes yes it is. A less buggy update would be a more enjoyable update and I'd rather wait longer.for a finished product then getting what we got for liches rj and fortuna 

This is somewhat the point of my post.

DE did something, released content that wasn't finished/tested, right before the holiday.  For PC, they were able to put in some fixes really needed fixes prior to going away.  However they couldn't do the same for consoles.  Because of which there has been relatively bad backlash.

So while DE probably weighed the pros & cons for releasing when they did, hindsight is 20/20.  So in the future they may just look at this and say: CON, the players won't like it, lets wait a bit until we can provide quick support/test more first.

The other part of my post was that DE might not be structured in a way to facilitate  PC vs Console considerations.  Since DE started PC and pushes PC and has consoles as an after thought it may very well be the case that alot of their internal communication is one way: built on PC = release, then pushed to console.  To that point, maybe with player feedback someone inside DE might start proactively questioning the state of console release/viability so that future problems like this are alleviated.

Complaints are an alarm/indicator.  They are good for when you don't know about something.  When you do know about something already, alarms are just annoying.

Questions/specific criticisms, conditions that led to a problem, etc., those are good for finding specific issues and problem solving.

i.e.

Spoiler

On 2020-01-27 at 8:42 PM, (PS4)covan2306 said:

On PS4 we didn’t get the same empyrean as PC, not only did we receive the buggy, laggy update but we not given avionics trade, 1 month later we still don’t. Shedu is bugged, engineering 10 is broke, if you’re not host 90% of stuff don’t work. Garuda’s claws don’t work... list is huge

A few days ago we got a hot fix, which broke ship spawns, we get Crewships spawning 16km away, only 50% of fighters will spawn, trickle spawns of 2-4 fighters at a time etc etc. how did you manage to break it more DE?

Can we please have an actual hot fix, a month of trash. This is not good enough. You have dropped the ball big time.

Is a mixture of complaint/criticism.  There are specific things listed but it comes across as harsh and may not be well received by anyone in DE.  They already know about this(this is by no means the first thread/post about it) and are more likely to just ignore it because of the harshness. 

Spoiler

On 2020-01-28 at 5:11 PM, (PS4)sweatshawp said:

Yes yes it is. A less buggy update would be a more enjoyable update and I'd rather wait longer.for a finished product then getting what we got for liches rj and fortuna 

Is pure criticism.  It's rather neutral in tone and is easily read/received.

If I were working on anything and I got feedback similarly to these two posts, i would most likely make changes/respond positively to the second.  To the first, i'd probably only begrudgingly respond to if I was required to. 

[(PSN)sweatshawp]

6 minutes ago, zehne said:

This is somewhat the point of my post.

DE did something, released content that wasn't finished/tested, right before the holiday.  For PC, they were able to put in some fixes really needed fixes prior to going away.  However they couldn't do the same for consoles.  Because of which there has been relatively bad backlash.

So while DE probably weighed the pros & cons for releasing when they did, hindsight is 20/20.  So in the future they may just look at this and say: CON, the players won't like it, lets wait a bit until we can provide quick support/test more first.

The other part of my post was that DE might not be structured in a way to facilitate  PC vs Console considerations.  Since DE started PC and pushes PC and has consoles as an after thought it may very well be the case that alot of their internal communication is one way: built on PC = release, then pushed to console.  To that point, maybe with player feedback someone inside DE might start proactively questioning the state of console release/viability so that future problems like this are alleviated.

Complaints are an alarm/indicator.  They are good for when you don't know about something.  When you do know about something already, alarms are just annoying.

Questions/specific criticisms, conditions that led to a problem, etc., those are good for finding specific issues and problem solving.

i.e.

  Hide contents

Is a mixture of complaint/criticism.  There are specific things listed but it comes across as harsh and may not be well received by anyone in DE.  They already know about this(this is by no means the first thread/post about it) and are more likely to just ignore it because of the harshness. 

  Hide contents

Is pure criticism.  It's rather neutral in tone and is easily read/received.

If I were working on anything and I got feedback similarly to these two posts, i would most likely make changes/respond positively to the second.  To the first, i'd probably only begrudgingly respond to if I was required to. 

In hindsight I don't play warframe anymore after these two updates and alot of stuff boiling up. I don't enjoy the model of the game anymore and how I feel that console players are seen as an afterthought. I don't like that there isn't any balance in the game currently and DE admitted it. At the same time while I am for balance I don't like the constant changes to things over the years I've gotten accustomed to due to lack of care to balance with DE. I'm tired of waiting for endgame or longevity in terms of gamplay and I'm tired of trying to support DE when it's clear that they seem not to care

[(XBOX)Skippy575]

6 minutes ago, (PS4)sweatshawp said:

In hindsight I don't play warframe anymore after these two updates and alot of stuff boiling up. I don't enjoy the model of the game anymore and how I feel that console players are seen as an afterthought.

We've always been an afterthought, that's not new at all.