Why an auction house/market won't work

[(PSN)sweatshawp]

19 minutes ago, 0_The_F00l said:

Not gonna quote indvidually as there a lot that is speckled across what 

I am not suggesting ducats as fee, not sure where you got that from. 

My preference is a scaling % of plat  that goes into the sink thereby countering part of the inflation. Recently released / vaulted relics and Primes have a higher percentage, mods have a low one, Baro items /weapons have a slightly higher one, this is already in game as credit tax. 

As to the friend of yours that farmed 1600p for the cosmetic bundle, I would suggest he find a job instead. 

Harsh perhaps, but I honestly don't care about how much it will affect your fashion frame , as a matter of fact, I would like it if traded plat cannot be used for purchasing cosmetics - its my opinion and need not be actually implemented or affect this discussion, just want to make it clear that cosmetic plats will not be effective for convincing me, it is the one of the few plat sinks in the game to control inflation. 

Also can you tell me the amount of hours he spent to get all that and the time it took to sell all of it? If we are talking about convenience of getting plat, we need to know if he would have been better off doing a part time job for a few hours instead of spending time "working" on a game. 

The market items that "need plat" would be the slots, maybe forma and potatoes if not stocked. 

You either grind the game to get them or you pay to skip the grind.

Its odd that you used limbo as an example, he actually has a relatively interesting quest to get the parts. 

I haven't played eve, so I do not know how good or bad it is from the auction house perspective. 

I do get the other side of the argument "the same quantity of plat will be harder to acquire " this is partially true, but again the game is warframe, not plat trader simulator, the objective of my suggestion is to make it easier for players to get stuff they need, not for players to show off their trading skills. 

As to my "pushiness" I do not mind if someone disagrees with what I think, two people can have differing opinions. 

But presenting your opinions as if they were facts while treating others like idiots is something I greatly dislike. 

Especially when based purely on assumptions. 

Using ductats as a tax would be a fee to the player. 

 

Describe to me how you would effectively balance items just outside of release date then because there are many outliars towards such 

Ahh I can still predict the threads. We all work full time and get paid very well as well as have lives outside of such. As for telling someone to find a job ID suggest you learn how economics work but that'd be quite rude. And I'm not trying to be rude here im trying to be understanding.

Then how is it fair to  any player who wants to spend earned Plat on ff now how will you compensate such and bought plat can't be just invalidated as traded plat because at the end of the day someone used money to purchase it. You can't lock someone else from using it to any use they want to because they traded for it. Do you realize how ignorant you sound. "Controlling Inflammation by locking out a major monitzation point of plat" if you have to remove aspects like this for your system to work it indeed is worse then our current system. A compromise is a compromise but telling a player he can't spend previous virtual currency on what was able to before because "sorry bud our new system balanced player transactions. You can spend $4.99 on a separate purchase though lol" this locks out ftp players from something that they could once access as well. You're saying that just because I don't want to spend money I should be seen as inferior cosmetically even outside of prime access and tennogen on pc. It very well effects our discussion because this is something from the market that can be purchased with Plat. And again market prices don't change. You being ignorant and ignoring a major part of what Plat is used for dosent make it any less true or you're idea any better. If you have to go as far as remove a huge chunk of monitzation how do you expect DE to make it up for in profits.

Back when me and him played and enjoyed the game Wed spend 2-3 hours a day in trade chat but it's also about optimization. Upon prime drop he always had his syndicates ready and he'd try to farm a set of the new frame that day to which he'd mostly do to maximize profit so on prime drops Wed spend 6-8 hours a day on wf. Regardless saying "get a life" holds no weight because what we choose to do in our free time holds no weight or should not matter. I take the term get a life as "I can't play the game as much or I believe  that people who spend more time playing the game than me have no lives and they should feel bad for doing something they enjoy" 

If we're being frank the game doesnt need Plat. You'd be better off removing time saving from the game to focus on replability and Core loop and full on monetizing cosmetics and because generally speaking more people spend money on cosmetic based items then anything. 

Limbo has a prime a fairly recent prime as well.

It is warframe and if you've seen my arguments on many other threads you'd know that I don't care how players play. If they take pride in trading so be it. Do those players come to your house and force you to buy Plat with a soma prime up to your head? Not at all. Trying to say the game should and only be played as this and this is what the game is isn't a viable argument. Because warframe the devs don't even know what this game is.

 

Also nobody presented this as facts in all my arguments I've stated that these are my assumptions and me stances against an AH I didn't say this is the law of the land rather then why I don't believe  it would be successful 

[(PSN)sweatshawp]

Just now, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

Skip it. Eve Online's economic system is one where stuff can degrade and be lost for various reasons. 

It's such a fundamental part of how things work that people sell insurance policies to other players. There are valid reasons to want to own multiple copies of your items, if you are able to afford them. 

Warframe doesn't have that sort of recurring demand. We don't use up, break or need to replace the vast majority of items we can own. 

What works well for Eve, won't work well for us. 

Reading more into the economy I found that out but thank you so much bro. And also thank you for the last few words. Assuming one games economy would work for us is hilarious 

[TearsOfTomorrow]

1 hour ago, Yamazuki said:

Common mods/prime sets are already under 10 plat. Braton Prime set is under 10 plat, Hunter Adrenaline can already be bought for 1 plat.

"Low end" players have no access to making plat, because the highest plat items are extremely rare mods, some of which are tied to events (weeping wounds) or being around for the right baro (some primed mods), arcanes that are tied to content they wouldn't even be able to farm, and rivens for specific weapons, or dumping a billion Kuva to get good rivens.

Yes, exactly. This is the issue here: that people talk like an auction system would magically solve these issues, while in fact it's the opposite. A system in which pricing is determined by how many people bid for something would only make things worse: why? Because nobody is going to bid for a Braton Prime or a Hunter Adrenalin, so those things would need to start from prices even lower than the current ones in order to be noticed at all, and then they would stay low because nobody is bidding. Meanwhile, Arcane Energize/rivens/whatever would start from the already insane prices they currently have, and then go EVEN HIGHER because guess what? That's what bidding means.

So the people who want an auction house as an improvement on the current system are wrong, because an auction house is literally the current system (when you count in warframe.market) but with a bigger gap between low-end and high-end stuff. And people who want an auction house to stop the "riven mafia" are wrong because, even admitting that such a thing exists at all, introducing auctions would only make it stronger, simply because auctions would provide this "mafia" a convenient excuse to make rivens cost even more.

And this is without even mentioning the fact that this game is so bloody easy any weapon modded in any way could easily take care of 90% of the enemies, and any "meta" weapon with a half-decent corrosive build can handle the remaining 10%, so rivens aren't even NEEDED to do content right now. Meaning, if you get "scammed" by someone who has you pay 2k plat for a riven, I frankly blame you for paying that kind of cash at all: just don't buy rivens people, that solves the problem at the root.

All this to say, 2/3 of the arguments made in favor of an auction house are invalid: this is not an opinion, this is a fact anyone who's ever so much as read the first ten pages of a university economy book could easily understand. I frankly am tired of people talking about topics such as economy, medicine, engineering, game design, and going "there is freedom of speech, I have my opinion you have yours": opinions are NOT equal in fields such as these, and there can be no "discussion among peers". I have a degree in this stuff, so people who don't can AT MOST hope to learn something from what I have to say: their ignorance and misinformation is NOT on par with my years of study. People who believe otherwise are the reason why measles has reappeared in the USA after almost a century. 

Thus, the only argument people in favor of an auction house really have is "I don't want to sit there staring at the trade chat all day". Which is a terribile argument because the laziness of a few should not be the basis of a decision that will affect many. Besides, again, there is always the option of not buying stuff you almost certainly don't need in order to do content, so really, this is the EIGHTH topic about this stupid idea, and as far as I'm concerned that's 8 too many.

And to address the quoted post's point about the preservation of a healthy economy not being the real reason why DE refuses to introduce this kind of system: of course not. The real reason is that DE don't want to create a system where fandom people can prosper and profit off their IP. Rather, they want to create a system where THEY, and only they, prosper and profit off their IP, even at the cost of inconveniencing traders... And honestly? They have any right to do just that: these are people who work their asses off, day in and day out, for the sake of making this IP into a compelling product, they give their blood for the product, so of course they want to make money off it. They DESERVE to make money off it.

What has Billy Rivenseller ever done to deserve anything at all? So the way I see it, all DE are doing is protecting their bottom line. As they should.

Edited January 31, 2020 by TearsOfTomorrow

[0_The_F00l]

7 minutes ago, (PS4)sweatshawp said:

Using ductats as a tax would be a fee to the player. 

 

Describe to me how you would effectively balance items just outside of release date then because there are many outliars towards such 

PLATINUM , not ducats , they are even spelled differently , why do you keep coming to this?

Items that are still in PA: 40% tax, if i want to get 100p for something i will need to put it in the AH for 140p

Items from Baro: 25% tax, if i wanna get 50p i will need to place it for 63p

non PA items : 20% tax,, if i wanna get 100p i will need to charge 120p

Mods: 10% Tax., if i wanna get 10p i will charge 11p

Attempting to set price of items such that tax<1 p, "Sorry , the value needs to be more than X"

Values are just an example , tax could very well be 5% to 50%.

15 minutes ago, (PS4)sweatshawp said:

Ahh I can still predict the threads. We all work full time and get paid very well as well as have lives outside of such. As for telling someone to find a job ID suggest you learn how economics work but that'd be quite rude. And I'm not trying to be rude here im trying to be understanding.

Your problem , not mine. Economics would work the same irrespective of you getting a job or not, what you wanna talk about is employment opportunities being scarce i believe, in which case, again, playing a video game is probably not the best means of spending your time.But Its your life , i don't particularly care how you spend it. But i will not shed a tear cause you cant farm that cosmetic that became harder to acquire cause of the plat prices of trade able items being lower.

21 minutes ago, (PS4)sweatshawp said:

Then how is it fair to  any player who wants to spend earned Plat on ff now how will you compensate such and bought plat can't be just invalidated as traded plat because at the end of the day someone used money to purchase it. You can't lock someone else from using it to any use they want to because they traded for it. Do you realize how ignorant you sound. "Controlling Inflammation by locking out a major monitzation point of plat" if you have to remove aspects like this for your system to work it indeed is worse then our current system. A compromise is a compromise but telling a player he can't spend previous virtual currency on what was able to before because "sorry bud our new system balanced player transactions. You can spend $4.99 on a separate purchase though lol" this locks out ftp players from something that they could once access as well. You're saying that just because I don't want to spend money I should be seen as inferior cosmetically even outside of prime access and tennogen on pc. It very well effects our discussion because this is something from the market that can be purchased with Plat. And again market prices don't change. You being ignorant and ignoring a major part of what Plat is used for dosent make it any less true or you're idea any better. If you have to go as far as remove a huge chunk of monitzation how do you expect DE to make it up for in profits.

As i said seperate from the current discussion and my own views, not directly related to the AH discussion though you are free to start a topic titled "Should cosmetics only be bought with purchased plat and not traded plat" and i would be happy to continue this there. This view of mine would stay irrespective of AH being applied or not. I might sound like an elitist #*!%er that hates fashion frames , but ignorant is not the word , maybe check up the term , you seem to be throwing it around a lot.

30 minutes ago, (PS4)sweatshawp said:

Back when me and him played and enjoyed the game Wed spend 2-3 hours a day in trade chat but it's also about optimization. Upon prime drop he always had his syndicates ready and he'd try to farm a set of the new frame that day to which he'd mostly do to maximize profit so on prime drops Wed spend 6-8 hours a day on wf. Regardless saying "get a life" holds no weight because what we choose to do in our free time holds no weight or should not matter. I take the term get a life as "I can't play the game as much or I believe  that people who spend more time playing the game than me have no lives and they should feel bad for doing something they enjoy"

You are free to do what you want in your own time , don't expect other to agree with you just cause you have found a convenient niche that is threatened cause of changes suggested. Which again seems to be the problem - threatened plat acquisition methods as the main reason for disliking the AH

37 minutes ago, (PS4)sweatshawp said:

If we're being frank the game doesnt need Plat. You'd be better off removing time saving from the game to focus on replability and Core loop and full on monetizing cosmetics and because generally speaking more people spend money on cosmetic based items then anything. 

Limbo has a prime a fairly recent prime as well.

It is warframe and if you've seen my arguments on many other threads you'd know that I don't care how players play. If they take pride in trading so be it. Do those players come to your house and force you to buy Plat with a soma prime up to your head? Not at all. Trying to say the game should and only be played as this and this is what the game is isn't a viable argument. Because warframe the devs don't even know what this game is.

.Agreed, the game does need a better core gameplay loop and less "plat grind to get the latest stuff" at a higher priority than changes to trade.

If you were talking about limbo prime , then your argument doesnt make sense, wouldnt the Limbo parts be 1p by your own admission of prices being low ? and so you would be left with more plat for the other things like rushing and forma and potatoes? Its either still gonna have a high value or its gonna be super cheap which one is it?

43 minutes ago, (PS4)sweatshawp said:

Also nobody presented this as facts in all my arguments I've stated that these are my assumptions and me stances against an AH I didn't say this is the law of the land rather then why I don't believe  it would be successful 

i wasnt talking about you when i said the part about presenting opinions and facts , you have been fairly clear and polite in the discussion. though you do have a tendency to use the word 'ignorant' a lot.

[TearsOfTomorrow]

5 minutes ago, 0_The_F00l said:

PLATINUM , not ducats , they are even spelled differently , why do you keep coming to this?

Not going to butt in on the specifics of the argument between the two of you, partly because I believe you're both wrong and partly because I've already said my piece... But as far as this question is concerned, I think that person is confusing you with the one who made this post, which as you can see does mention Ducats.

Edited January 31, 2020 by TearsOfTomorrow

[0_The_F00l]

Just now, TearsOfTomorrow said:

Not going to butt in on the specifics of the argument between the two of you, partly because I believe you're both wrong and partly because I've already said my piece... But as far as this question is concerned, I think that person is confusing you with the one who made this post, which as you can see does mention Ducats.

Ah , right that makes sense and should clarify why it kept coming up here,

 

You have said your piece about the topic and we will agree to disagree, But i would suggest not to include Real life credentials (irrespective of being true or not) as a means to shoot down a discussion, there is really no way to ascertain the truth and sharing private info on the internet is never a good idea.

[TearsOfTomorrow]

1 minute ago, 0_The_F00l said:

sharing private info on the internet is never a good idea.

Meh, I'm terminally ill. Which means that I have to work from home using Facebook and Discord to keep in touch with my colleagues, and that I have to rely on the sanitary system of my country, which is almost completely handled via internet. As such, my personal info already is all over the place, it really can't get any worse than this lol.

[0_The_F00l]

1 minute ago, TearsOfTomorrow said:

Meh, I'm terminally ill. Which means that I have to work from home using Facebook and Discord to keep in touch with my colleagues, and that I have to rely on the sanitary system of my country, which is almost completely handled via internet. As such, my personal info already is all over the place, it really can't get any worse than this lol.

Somebody could hack into the sanitation control and give you a really S#&amp;&#036;ty day 😛

 

[TearsOfTomorrow]

1 minute ago, 0_The_F00l said:

Somebody could hack into the sanitation control and give you a really S#&amp;&#036;ty day 😛

 

I guess? Well anyway, while I find such debate to be MUCH more interesting than the eighth topic about an auction house, it's still a fact that continuing this conversation would be rude to OP and the other posters. So let's stop now.

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

1 hour ago, TearsOfTomorrow said:

All this to say, 2/3 of the arguments made in favor of an auction house are invalid: this is not an opinion, this is a fact anyone who's ever so much as read the first ten pages of a university economy book could easily understand. I frankly am tired of people talking about topics such as economy, medicine, engineering, game design, and going "there is freedom of speech, I have my opinion you have yours": opinions are NOT equal in fields such as these, and there can be no "discussion among peers". I have a degree in this stuff, so people who don't can AT MOST hope to learn something from what I have to say: their ignorance and misinformation is NOT on par with my years of study. People who believe otherwise are the reason why measles has reappeared in the USA after almost a century. 

You might not believe it, but they had one supporter in particular who claimed that he had studied such things. Just couldn't wrap his head around the fact that we've got potentially infinite supply and highly finite demand for most items in this game, and that without a complete overhaul to create recurring demand it wouldn't ever change. Pretty sure that they are owed a refund for their education. 

When I provided links help explain Tragedy of the Commons, they tried to brush off the work of a Nobel Prize winner as "liberal nonsense" if memory serves. 🙄

2 hours ago, TearsOfTomorrow said:

Thus, the only argument people in favor of an auction house really have is "I don't want to sit there staring at the trade chat all day". Which is a terribile argument because the laziness of a few should not be the basis of a decision that will affect many. Besides, again, there is always the option of not buying stuff you almost certainly don't need in order to do content, so really, this is the EIGHTH topic about this stupid idea, and as far as I'm concerned that's 8 too many.

Worse. It seems to be based on the fundamental ability to figure out what a fair price for the item would be. A lot of the time it's because they're trying to sell prime junk for exorbitant prices, or insisting that the asking price for an item in high demand, be slashed beyond reason. 

Where I'm from that's called a "lack of common sense". 

2 hours ago, (PS4)sweatshawp said:

Reading more into the economy I found that out but thank you so much bro. And also thank you for the last few words. Assuming one games economy would work for us is hilarious 

No worries, Tenno. 

[Chappie]

2 hours ago, 0_The_F00l said:

PLATINUM , not ducats , they are even spelled differently , why do you keep coming to this?

Items that are still in PA: 40% tax, if i want to get 100p for something i will need to put it in the AH for 140p

Items from Baro: 25% tax, if i wanna get 50p i will need to place it for 63p

non PA items : 20% tax,, if i wanna get 100p i will need to charge 120p

Mods: 10% Tax., if i wanna get 10p i will charge 11p

Attempting to set price of items such that tax<1 p, "Sorry , the value needs to be more than X"

Values are just an example , tax could very well be 5% to 50%.

If you don't think the outrage would not be bigger than the size of this galaxy if DE effectively in put if real $ tax on trading you are delusional.   Maybe you like the idea of nickle and dime people...maybe you should go work for the airlines, cell phone companies and any other "service model".    Maybe you have just gotten used to be treated like a ATM...but any sane person would be resisting it left right and center.  

[moondog548]

Why not just the exact functionality of warframe.market inside the game?  Just something to see all listings for items in one place (filtering online/offline people) and an easy way to contact the person to conduct a normal trade.

i.e. trade chat with less of the completely unnecessary inconveniences.

[(XBOX)The Neko Otaku]

2 hours ago, 0_The_F00l said:

PLATINUM , not ducats , they are even spelled differently , why do you keep coming to this?

Items that are still in PA: 40% tax, if i want to get 100p for something i will need to put it in the AH for 140p

Items from Baro: 25% tax, if i wanna get 50p i will need to place it for 63p

non PA items : 20% tax,, if i wanna get 100p i will need to charge 120p

Mods: 10% Tax., if i wanna get 10p i will charge 11p

Attempting to set price of items such that tax<1 p, "Sorry , the value needs to be more than X"

Values are just an example , tax could very well be 5% to 50%.

*horrific flashbacks to airmech arena's auction house*

A tax is terrible idea that ea would come up with. Everyone now has to jack up the price to high levels to get the full amount they want cause they lose out on their original price cause of a stupid tax just no god no.

[SordidDreams]

10 hours ago, (PS4)sweatshawp said:

Provide an example of how introducing ah in warframes current State would help stabilize  the economy and the 4 different economies across all platforms. Third party sites like warframe market and riven sites along with discords are mainly used by the pc crowd and  don't Hold much weight outside those who use it. they haven't made such a huge impact as you think as effectively more people don't use these sites then do and prefer actual Ingame chat then going to a third party site to do such

 

As I've stated the trade chat is fine as is and thats not the mindset of me but therese nothing wrong with it. To trade you have to be actively wanting to trade for the most part 

Look at mods, for example. The prices of all but the rarest of them have bottomed out. Why? Because too many people are selling them and undercutting each other. How do you get fewer people to sell them? Introduce a limit on how many items you can put up for sale. Warframe.market has no such limit, so you can list as much of your stuff to sell as you want. If you could only list a limited number of items for sale at a time, you'd naturally choose the most expensive ones you have, leading to a decreased supply of common mods and rising prices. DE has no way to do that at this time, because warframe.market is a third-party site they have no control over.

As I've stated "it's fine as it is" is not a valid argument in this kind of discussion. It's not fine, and even if it were, DE is not the kind of company to leave things alone just because they're fine.

[Voltage]

48 minutes ago, SordidDreams said:

Look at mods, for example. The prices of all but the rarest of them have bottomed out. Why? Because too many people are selling them and undercutting each other. How do you get fewer people to sell them? Introduce a limit on how many items you can put up for sale. Warframe.market has no such limit, so you can list as much of your stuff to sell as you want. If you could only list a limited number of items for sale at a time, you'd naturally choose the most expensive ones you have, leading to a decreased supply of common mods and rising prices. DE has no way to do that at this time, because warframe.market is a third-party site they have no control over.

There is a limit to your listings on Warframe.market, and this limit can be increased by donating to the website through Patreon.

[Marmelade]

5 часов назад, (PS4)guzmantt1977 сказал:

Skip it. Eve Online's economic system is one where stuff can degrade and be lost for various reasons. 

It's such a fundamental part of how things work that people sell insurance policies to other players. There are valid reasons to want to own multiple copies of your items, if you are able to afford them. 

Warframe doesn't have that sort of recurring demand. We don't use up, break or need to replace the vast majority of items we can own. 

What works well for Eve, won't work well for us. 

 

Also don't forget they have full time hired full fledged Economist with phd monitoring economics there.

Edited January 31, 2020 by Marmelade

[SordidDreams]

28 minutes ago, Voltage said:

There is a limit to your listings on Warframe.market, and this limit can be increased by donating to the website through Patreon.

Well it must be very large, since I haven't run into it yet and I used to sell quite a lot of stuff.

[(PSN)sweatshawp]

1 hour ago, SordidDreams said:

Look at mods, for example. The prices of all but the rarest of them have bottomed out. Why? Because too many people are selling them and undercutting each other. How do you get fewer people to sell them? Introduce a limit on how many items you can put up for sale. Warframe.market has no such limit, so you can list as much of your stuff to sell as you want. If you could only list a limited number of items for sale at a time, you'd naturally choose the most expensive ones you have, leading to a decreased supply of common mods and rising prices. DE has no way to do that at this time, because warframe.market is a third-party site they have no control over.

 

Warframe.market has a limit. And again isn't used by the vast majority of the community as you think. 

Also 

1 hour ago, SordidDreams said:

As I've stated "it's fine as it is" is not a valid argument in this kind of discussion. It's not fine, and even if it were, DE is not the kind of company to leave things alone just because they're fine

Have you seen my other arguments about why it isn't viable not just on this thread but other post??

[(PSN)sweatshawp]

3 minutes ago, SordidDreams said:

Well it must be very large, since I haven't run into it yet and I used to sell quite a lot of stuff.

https://www.patreon.com/42Bytes

Only 100 orders 

Edited January 31, 2020 by (PS4)sweatshawp

[SordidDreams]

6 minutes ago, (PS4)sweatshawp said:

Warframe.market has a limit. And again isn't used by the vast majority of the community as you think. 

So I'm told, I haven't run into it yet. Clearly the limit is very large, far too large to serve as an effective supply throttle.

7 minutes ago, (PS4)sweatshawp said:

Have you seen my other arguments about why it isn't viable not just on this thread but other post??

I don't know, I don't remember who said what in these discussions. It's all the same old tired arguments over and over, it all blurs together. The only stand-out is Guzmantt, because he's exceptionally obnoxious and trolly.

[(PSN)sweatshawp]

28 minutes ago, SordidDreams said:

So I'm told, I haven't run into it yet. Clearly the limit is very large, far too large to serve as an effective supply throttle.

I don't know, I don't remember who said what in these discussions. It's all the same old tired arguments over and over, it all blurs together. The only stand-out is Guzmantt, because he's exceptionally obnoxious and trolly.

It's only 100 orders m8

[SordidDreams]

Just now, (PS4)sweatshawp said:

It's only 100 orders m8

Only? The daily trade limit the game itself imposes is equal to your MR. 100 orders is a lot, far too much to effectively throttle item supply.

[(PSN)sweatshawp]

21 minutes ago, SordidDreams said:

Only? The daily trade limit the game itself imposes is equal to your MR. 100 orders is a lot, far too much to effectively throttle item supply.

In the past year in game before I stopped playing I can say I've amassed way over 100 trades 

[Leyers_of_facade]

The reason why I would not support an AH is because no matter how good it sounds on paper, it would almost surely fail practically in wf. For the purpose of simplification, rivens would be excluded until the last section.

Case 1: The lack of a restriction (ie, full open auction house) would cause prices to plummet to the point that everything is worth nearly nothing as an item sold by player A is no different to one sold by player B. This meant that the only difference between the 2 players is the price. This would lead to an excessively significant increase in supply and under constant demand, the only way to sell your items would be to price-war, hence everything becomes useless. "Trash primes" is a good example of this happening even under our current trading model. 

Case 2: The opposite, an excessively restrictive auction house, would cause prices to skyrocket (eg: every player, perhaps even limited by other things such as MR, and can only list 1 item). In this case, we have excessively reduce supply while maintaining supply, which in turn will push equilibrium prices up. 

DE's goal is obvious to maximize their benefits for the relevant stakeholders. Be it in tangible or intangibles. Case 1 would lead to a significant drop in revenue as the same amount of platinum will get you more things, hence, less people buying plat. While case 2 might increase revenue in the short term, a case where everything is expensive, is likely going to drive players away and give DE/WF the reputation similar to EA style games as being a pay to win game.

----

"So long we figure out a balance between the 2" 

Well, first of all, good luck figuring what will work. Both the supply and demand of items in different ranges are very different, hence, any arbitrary restriction on listing cap is almost surely not going to solve the issue. Second, any listing capacity related methodology will be subject to the issue of polarized price listing. People are almost certainly going to list the "more valuable items" in favor of cheaper ones. There is no problem on this on its own, however if your goal is to figure out a way to balance things out and not try to plummet / skyrocket prices of certain items, this would certainly pose as a challenge. Adding in percentiles, progression, and cyclical patterns in player base (which has significant influence in supply and demand), the calculations on the restrictions is going to be absolutely horrible for anyone unfortunate to be tasked with the job. In fact I would say that there is a very high probability that a constant solution would and could not exist (as judging from the information we have, we likely have significantly more equations to satisfy than variables DE can adjust). While a constantly evolving "solution", could probably adjust for the case of cyclical patterns, reducing the issue slightly, it is likely not in DE's benefit to implement such a methodology due to costs.

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So what about rivens?

Well, due to their prices and quasi-uniqueness, they are a lot more different than most of the other tradeable items. Adding rivens to the equations above would only make things even worse.  Although considering their "uniqueness" and the fact that while they are really nice to have, they are not "necessary". It could be the case that a riven-only auction house could work if implemented carefully.

An auction house on normal items has a very high chance of failing, which upon so, would cause severe consequences. While the current trading system is flawed, an auction house is not the solution. Just because you are out of water doesn't mean that bleach should be considered as a drink to quench your thirst. 

 

Edited January 31, 2020 by Leyers_of_facade
typo

[Tinklzs]

8 hours ago, (PS4)sweatshawp said:

I like your explanation 

I do too.

 

Furthermore, those who only trade via in-game (trade chat) and don't utilize tools made by the community warframe.market , riven.market etc. I can understand why'd they be so miserable.

Warframe.market is an auction house, but you just need to deliver the item yourself.  It's the only thing keeping some stuff above the 'poverty' line that some prime sets and mods have fallen into. An auction house isn't the answer - and will never be.  

DE could take steps to show players in-game those trading websites, via the in-game market. Then it opens in-game and you can trade there (no alt-tabbing required). Would be nice. 

I can't lie, the convenience of an AH would be nice, but the consequence of everything except rare stuff being worthless, no thanks.