[Feedback] We need a chance to mercy them.

[NightmareT12]

13 hours ago, EinheriarJudith said:

i didnt. people did in fact complain about being stuck in animation. i did as well and im glad its gone. when they added this garbage with old blood i cringed.

Honestly, we're talking about being stuck in a cutscene about killing 20 enemies one after the other VS a single one that is optional. It ain't a good compairision.

[Steel_Rook]

10 hours ago, Joezone619 said:

if you ask me, i think getting rid of the back breaking animations entirely was a mistake, it doesn't feel like there is a consequence for getting the parazon code wrong. by all means, good riddance, didn't like it. but having there being NOTHING to replace it? i think we need something in its place.

Why would there need to be consequences for a literal blind guess? By all means, reuse the Lich execution animations on people who've actually fallen in combat similar to how the Grustrag Three can block revival on downed players. That's fair enough. But what's the benefit to killing people for circumstances quite literally outside our control? That's neither challenge nor appropriate theme. At best it's ludonarrative dissonance, at worst it's a rushed system. There's a reason that particular aspect of the system met with such overwhelmingly negative response.

 

18 hours ago, Goldbar_ said:

I really like the execution animations and mods such as [Hit and Run] and [Out of Sight]. But I've noticed that it's difficult to conduct mercy in normal missions other than murmur farming. So here's the deal. Let us down them when the Parazon mark is on. Just like thralls! However, someone can't be bothered to mercy them. Then my thought says let them die in 2~3 seconds after downed! I hope Dev accept this idea so I can play Warframe happily.

Agreed. That's what The Surge uses, and I find it works pretty well there. Once an enemy becomes eligible for execution, that enemy can't be killed with damage with the next 2-3 seconds. However, said enemy will just straight-up die on its own after that point if not executed. It's supposed to be a "mercy kill," so being able to finish enemies rather than letting them bleed out and die makes thematic sense, as well. Worse come to worst, it leaves the occasional enemy standing for a couple of extra seconds.

While we're on the subject, can we PLEASE make the Mercy Kill camera lock optional? I find it distracting and disorientating for my view to whip around wildly, and preanimated takedowns "fit" games a little better when they leave players in control of the camera. This is a video game and not a movie. We don't need mandatory close-ups on the action.

[Educated_Beast]

As long as it is rare, I do not want horses of enemies waiting for us to mercy kill.  I also do not want my parazon mods to be nerfed because now I can mercy kill indefinitely and no longer need to mod for energy.

 

Edited February 6, 2020 by Educated_Beast

[Zirion_Bk]

Just my two cents, but I wouldn't really like it if enemies were essentially unkillable for a few seconds, since if the enemy is an Energy Leech Eximus (Butchers, crawlers, runners as some examples of parazon-able enemies) or some other type that I would like dead yesterday it would mean they would have a random chance of being unkillable unless I get up close and personal. In that time Energy Leeches Eximi can take 15 or so energy, other types of Eximi can continue to buff their allies (Toxic eximi as an example) or nullifiers could even have their bubble come back if you didn't destroy the drone for it.

Unless the enemy is considered dead (I.e auras getting cancelled, bubbles being removed etc.) so that they're not buffing their allies in those invulnerable seconds I cannot see the suggested system not getting annoying when it starts messing with players, like the "Hold E to Heavy Attack" issues did. 

Edit: Had a random thought, an option could be to make it opt-in via the mercy parazon mods. If you equip any mercy mod to your parazon enemies who get a mark could go down for a few seconds, but without a mercy mod equipped they wouldn't. How's that sound?

Edited February 6, 2020 by Zirion_Bk
Random thought

[xRufus7x]

18 hours ago, (PS4)demishock said:

Seconding this. It would be super excessive to have it on every enemy all the time, IMO, but having it as a finisher option on certain beefier enemy types (bombards, ancients, nullifiers, etc.) could make it pretty satisfying. We definitely need to strike some kind of balance between "every enemy gets a death animation that slows combat to a crawl" and "this cool thing barely ever happens".

Either that, or maybe since the parazon is essentially its own little melee weapon, it could be tied into the new melee system somehow? Since you have to be in striking distance to pull off a mercy/finisher anyway, maybe have it trigger at certain milestones on the combo counter or something?

Finishers already have special animations and are opt in so it really wouldn't change much from the current finisher system other then giving finishers the benefits of the new mods if the finisher was fatal.

15 hours ago, EinheriarJudith said:

doom popularized it, destiny 2 picked it up, then warframe picked it up. id rather it just go away. this is a loot shooter, not cutscene simulator.

funny how people complained about being stuck in animation with old bladestorm and now want to return to that.

Bladestorm's animation period was way longer. Mercy kills are better compared to the Covert Lethality builds that existed for various frames that could open to finishers before CL got nerfed.

[(NSW)Hermy]

vor 26 Minuten schrieb xRufus7x:

Finishers already have special animations and are opt in so it really wouldn't change much from the current finisher system other then giving finishers the benefits of the new mods if the finisher was fatal.

Bladestorm's animation period was way longer. Mercy kills are better compared to the Covert Lethality builds that existed for various frames that could open to finishers before CL got nerfed.

Finishers where in Warframe years before Destiny...

The Parazon is just a new way to do them...

BUT apart from that, what about my IDEA for SPECIFIC MODS that allow the use of the Parazon for EVERY FINISHER under certain CONDITIONS.

Like only if no alarms/ not noticed. It would feel like Assassin's Creed to play missions that way. (maybe named shadow assassin)

Or only on specific Enemies like Nox when they are below 30% health. (Maybe named cleanse heavy grineer or cleanse eximus)

And then it grants an advantage like invisibility for a few seconds or slower enemies etc.

Edited February 6, 2020 by (NSW)Hermy

[Hyohakusha]

Absolutely not. You don't need to change the way the entire game works and add 2-3 second onto the kill time for every enemy just to facillitate the use of a handful of mediocre to useless mods. With everything else going on in the game right now I can't believe this is being considered. Make a straw poll, talk about it on a Dev Stream, you'll see how few people would actually want this.

[IgnisDraconis4316]

7 minutes ago, Hyohakusha said:

Absolutely not. You don't need to change the way the entire game works and add 2-3 second onto the kill time for every enemy just to facillitate the use of a handful of mediocre to useless mods. With everything else going on in the game right now I can't believe this is being considered. Make a straw poll, talk about it on a Dev Stream, you'll see how few people would actually want this.

Dude Rebb said it was a common talked about topic earlier in the thread. If you don’t like it just say so. But earlier in the thread Rebb said they are showing this to be a popular topic.

Not all of us like to blaze through a mission in less than five seconds. Some like to enjoy their time and the badass moments.

[5H4DE]

How about being able to replace normal weapon stealth finishers with Parazon ones? Make them proper one-shot on normal enemies and half-shots to Heavy units.

[(XBOX)DarkForceLegend]

20 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

This is very common feedback that will change the pace of lethality to a degree, but I am super interested to compile a consensus on this!

I'm not a fan of the mercy system outside of ending thralls, and I'm not a big fan of it there either. It just seems too clunky to even use. If your shooting an enemy and you happen to see the mark, you then have to run up and "mercy" them. It does slow down combat. With melee its a bit different, your close but your swinging away and then have to stop to mercy. Most of the time you can't stop in time, and if you did it would again slow down combat. Doesn't even get used in what you would think it would be the ideal mission type, stealth mission types.

My thoughts on how to fix this would be to remove the whole HP threshold. When you kill an enemy there is a random chance it can be mercied. When an enemy's HP reaches 0 it drops its loot, but the enemy is still staggering similar in fashion to your opponent on Mortal Kombat finishers for a second. This will allow people to kill things and move on if they wish. Now that the foundation is established, give the Parazon a range to be activated. Meaning that you can be... say... 10m from the target and you latch onto your enemy and it can go either way, be it pull you to them or have the enemy pulled towards you (the player). This will help alleviate the problem with interacting with potential mercy targets while engaging in ranged combat. Sure it's not 50m away, but I feel it's a good compromise. Lastly, allow the parazon to be used for finishers and stealth finishers. I don't see any problems with this, I thought this was how it was going to be in the first place...

I feel this solves many issues, and makes using it rewarding instead of a hassle. For those who wish to use it during active combat, its nice, quick and flashy, and gives out bonuses when used. If the decision is to have the player move towards the enemy, then it can also be used as a bonus "move to that area". If people don't wish to use it, and to move on they are not penalized by enticing players to deal with a "downed" enemy. They can snag there loot and move on, everyone is happy! For those who only use it or would potentially use it for stealth missions and such can be rewarded for utilizing the Parazon. I mean really, why would anyone stab an enemy down to any health threshold only to mercy them? It makes no sense whatsoever. Its a stealth mission for crying out loud, you don't stabby stabby and then go ok let me finish you, "shhh don't cry out." 😂

[xRufus7x]

1 hour ago, (NSW)Hermy said:

Finishers where in Warframe years before Destiny...

The Parazon is just a new way to do them...

I know. That is the point I was making.

1 hour ago, (NSW)Hermy said:

Like only if no alarms/ not noticed. It would feel like Assassin's Creed to play missions that way. (maybe named shadow assassin)

Or only on specific Enemies like Nox when they are below 30% health. (Maybe named cleanse heavy grineer or cleanse eximus)

And then it grants an advantage like invisibility for a few seconds or slower enemies etc.

If you make the conditions too subjective they will just go on the pile of unused mods because no one will bother to meet the specific criteria when just playing normally is more advantageous. The pros have to outweigh the cons for them to be practical.

[Joezone619]

5 hours ago, Steel_Rook said:

Why would there need to be consequences for a literal blind guess?

it just feels empty, maybe they should have it so you need to have 1 or 2 of the mods unlocked before the execution animations play for getting parazon wrong, by then the lich would've realized "S#&$ they actually ARE a threat" and decided to end you instead of just walk away peacefully laughing for winning the battle. it doesn't feel like theres any threat.

 

personally i think the lich should stay in missing after you fail to parazon it until you either overpower it (KD 3x) or finish the mission and run. they're goal is to KILL you, not make you waste 1 or 2 revives, i think they should stay until all revives are used. they're you "rival", your "advesary".

while im on the subject of "feeling threatening"... why dont they ever show up anywhere else? you have to go and do a kuva lich mission, to allow them to show up, why dont they just show up in normal mission from time to time like stalker? or the sydicates? if they're goal is to hunt you down, why arn't they? why do you need to go find them, just for the game to consider them to have hunted you?

[Hyohakusha]

4 hours ago, IgnisDraconis4316 said:

Dude Rebb said it was a common talked about topic earlier in the thread.

DE changed the way Ivara Prime's invis looks because of one thread with six posts. Only a  fraction of the player base even comes here. It's not indicative of the majority of players.

4 hours ago, IgnisDraconis4316 said:

Not all of us like to blaze through a mission in less than five seconds. Some like to enjoy their time and the badass moments.

And as is, we're already free to go as fast or as slow as we like.

Let's look at the mercy mods.
Blood for Ammo. A free reload. Whoop de doo.
Blood for Energy/ Life. A single energy or health orb. We have plenty of ways to gain more health or energy than that already.
Hit and Run. You go faster for a bit. Plenty of ways to do that too.
Out of Sight. A blind. The only decent one since it's effectively an extra ability. If it was usable consistently, it would get nerfed into the dirt.

None of those are worth trading for something that would make every mission take longer. Now DE would love that, cause it looks good on quarterly reports to have longer engagement times. But it would be annoying af to have to deal with, especially with boarding parties on RJ or anything high level in general where you can't just wipe an enemy in one hit. That's a lot more than "changing the pace of lethality to a degree". That's changing the pace of the entire game for the worse.

All that needs to be done is to increase the threshold for when the option to finisher becomes available. 15%-20% would be fine. You want to finisher them, cool, you want to just kill them, cool. None of this down-on-one-knee and they're invincible crap. That's already annoying enough to have to do 180 times just take out a single, and obviously I don't want that downed state to bleed into the rest of the game.
 

[Steel_Rook]

7 hours ago, Zirion_Bk said:

Unless the enemy is considered dead (I.e auras getting cancelled, bubbles being removed etc.) so that they're not buffing their allies in those invulnerable seconds I cannot see the suggested system not getting annoying when it starts messing with players, like the "Hold E to Heavy Attack" issues did. 

That's a fair point. As I recall, any of the "dead, now interact with them" enemies like Capture targets, Fugitives, Emmisaries and Thralls aren't actually "dead" until you interact with them. I don't know if their abilities shut down, but they don't contribute to kill counters until executed and don't contribute to "Kill X with Y damage" at all because Parazon executions don't seem to use any of the standard damage types, and I'm not convinced they "do damage" at all. So that's a mechanics issue which would definitely need to be addressed, and good thinking bringing that up. Hadn't thought of that one.

 

7 hours ago, Hyohakusha said:

Absolutely not. You don't need to change the way the entire game works and add 2-3 second onto the kill time for every enemy just to facillitate the use of a handful of mediocre to useless mods.

Unless I'm missing part of the conversation, I don't think the main thrust of the suggestion was to have this happen to "every enemy." You didn't include a quote so I'm guessing at what you're replying to, though. The Mercy Kill marker is already fairly rare even when you're not one-shotting enemies. That hardly seems common enough to cause a significant issue, though edge cases like the above may still persist that I haven't thought of.

 

3 hours ago, Joezone619 said:

it just feels empty, maybe they should have it so you need to have 1 or 2 of the mods unlocked before the execution animations play for getting parazon wrong, by then the lich would've realized "S#&$ they actually ARE a threat" and decided to end you instead of just walk away peacefully laughing for winning the battle. it doesn't feel like theres any threat.

Maybe I'm just slow, but I still don't get it - why does there need to be anything at all on a failed Parazon sequence? You fail to kill the Lich and they level up. Sure, I could go for a more bombastic effect so it's easier to tell whether I had the right Requiem mod, but something as simple as a loud laugh or some other kind of sound effect would suffice. Why would penalising an incorrect blind guess ever be seen as good design? Why would killing us in a cutscene despite having won the fight hands-down ever be seen as a good design? All this does is make people apprehensive to try and Parazon their Lich, making the Murmur farm that much longer.

Far as I'm concerned, people should have incentive to fight their Lich as much as possible. Penalising players who don't know the sequence just makes players leery of trying their luck. I've been jumping on my Lich's sword since the start, and I can usually get ~50 Murmurs from just that, not to mention occasionally guessing entire Requiem mods or at least eliminating multiple options for when I learn all three mods. I don't see the thematic or design benefit from putting disincentive on executing the Lich. If my Lich is supposed to be a threat to me, make them a threat in combat not cutscenes.

[IgnisDraconis4316]

12 hours ago, Hyohakusha said:

DE changed the way Ivara Prime's invis looks because of one thread with six posts. Only a  fraction of the player base even comes here. It's not indicative of the majority of players.

And as is, we're already free to go as fast or as slow as we like.

Let's look at the mercy mods.
Blood for Ammo. A free reload. Whoop de doo.
Blood for Energy/ Life. A single energy or health orb. We have plenty of ways to gain more health or energy than that already.
Hit and Run. You go faster for a bit. Plenty of ways to do that too.
Out of Sight. A blind. The only decent one since it's effectively an extra ability. If it was usable consistently, it would get nerfed into the dirt.

None of those are worth trading for something that would make every mission take longer. Now DE would love that, cause it looks good on quarterly reports to have longer engagement times. But it would be annoying af to have to deal with, especially with boarding parties on RJ or anything high level in general where you can't just wipe an enemy in one hit. That's a lot more than "changing the pace of lethality to a degree". That's changing the pace of the entire game for the worse.

All that needs to be done is to increase the threshold for when the option to finisher becomes available. 15%-20% would be fine. You want to finisher them, cool, you want to just kill them, cool. None of this down-on-one-knee and they're invincible crap. That's already annoying enough to have to do 180 times just take out a single, and obviously I don't want that downed state to bleed into the rest of the game.
 

So because you believe only a fraction of the playerbase comes to the forums we should dismiss them out of context? Because you can see all the feedback on all Social Media and communications to see if it is a big thing or not? Seriously?

I also don't get this idea where you think you will be forced into mercy kills. Too many in this community say that DE is forcing one to do something. If you don't like that aspect of the game do something else. I didn't play arbitrations until the last major revamp they did because I couldn't stand the grind for a 1% chance at a reward. But once they fixed it I came back. If you don't like it you don't have to participate. And it isn't like every enemy has to be mercy killed. We are talking about 1-5 enemies in a mission. The only modes that it would seem like more is with Endless Modes (which are my favorite mission types). Also as they go along they are sure to add more mods for the Parazon and improve it. You are not looking to the future.

And I have never seen a mercy kill come up on a RJ mission. Where are you getting some of this stuff from? I very rarely see mercy options in most mainstream missions unless your kuva thrall hunting and if your doing that then you know you have to do it so why not make it more rewarding. 

"All that needs to be done is to increase the threshold for when the option to finisher becomes available. 15%-20% would be fine." No it wouldn't be fine because in Warframe we are not ninjas in space but GODS. You can wipe an enemy off the field in one shot. If they fall to their knees and you have already moved on then after a few seconds they would die if they implemented it that way. And how are you gonna notice when it sounds like your a person that doesn't stay in a mission for longer than 5 minutes. 

WOW!!! What an exaggeration. Really you have had the icon for mercy kills show up 180 times in a single quick exterminate mission? At most I have seen 3 in a 20 minute Survival run. And how exactly would the downstate of waiting to be stabbed bleed into the rest of the game when you at most have between 8 to 10 times to pull it off in an average Long mission? 

 

To me it just seems like you hate the Lich, parazon, Mercy kill aspect altogether. And if you do ok that is fine. But some of us like the aspect of the game. Some of us want the monotony of "blaze through and finish it in a second" to end. People like me that have been playing for 6 years want something to break the cycle and make it more interesting. Not keep it the same for sake of efficiency which is what you seem to be getting at. I play a game for fun. Not for loot, efficiency, overwhelming bonuses, etc. And the parazon offers that cool fun aspect I am looking for. I like seeing my BA warframe kick an enemy in the back of the knee and stabbing them. It reminds me of Mass Effect and Omni-Blading someone. A game like this needs to be enjoyed and you need to take your time. It isn't a race but a marathon with lots to do. Now the grind of the thrall hunting has me a little..... worried...... but I haven't done a lich yet. He is just there asking for it one day. But for the rest of the game I would like to have a badass moment to go, "THATS WHAT IT FEEL LIKE!!!"

[IgnisDraconis4316]

9 hours ago, Steel_Rook said:

That's a fair point. As I recall, any of the "dead, now interact with them" enemies like Capture targets, Fugitives, Emmisaries and Thralls aren't actually "dead" until you interact with them. I don't know if their abilities shut down, but they don't contribute to kill counters until executed and don't contribute to "Kill X with Y damage" at all because Parazon executions don't seem to use any of the standard damage types, and I'm not convinced they "do damage" at all. So that's a mechanics issue which would definitely need to be addressed, and good thinking bringing that up. Hadn't thought of that one.

 

Unless I'm missing part of the conversation, I don't think the main thrust of the suggestion was to have this happen to "every enemy." You didn't include a quote so I'm guessing at what you're replying to, though. The Mercy Kill marker is already fairly rare even when you're not one-shotting enemies. That hardly seems common enough to cause a significant issue, though edge cases like the above may still persist that I haven't thought of.

 

Maybe I'm just slow, but I still don't get it - why does there need to be anything at all on a failed Parazon sequence? You fail to kill the Lich and they level up. Sure, I could go for a more bombastic effect so it's easier to tell whether I had the right Requiem mod, but something as simple as a loud laugh or some other kind of sound effect would suffice. Why would penalising an incorrect blind guess ever be seen as good design? Why would killing us in a cutscene despite having won the fight hands-down ever be seen as a good design? All this does is make people apprehensive to try and Parazon their Lich, making the Murmur farm that much longer.

Far as I'm concerned, people should have incentive to fight their Lich as much as possible. Penalising players who don't know the sequence just makes players leery of trying their luck. I've been jumping on my Lich's sword since the start, and I can usually get ~50 Murmurs from just that, not to mention occasionally guessing entire Requiem mods or at least eliminating multiple options for when I learn all three mods. I don't see the thematic or design benefit from putting disincentive on executing the Lich. If my Lich is supposed to be a threat to me, make them a threat in combat not cutscenes.

@Steel_Rook I agree that that mechanic would need to be addressed. Cause I'm not a fan of a Disruptor still draining my energy when I'm driving a Pike through his head.

Thank you for stating the OP original idea and mine. It is like super rare.... unless your lich hunting..... and from what I have seen that grind needs to be lessened. I haven't even taken on my lich yet cause I feel the grind for the weapons seems...... excessive. But I hate that I see the Mercy symbol and then I can't even stab them before someone kills them and races to the end.

I think the issue is that some players want a challenge (I do) and a lich provides that. Others want to get the rewards but they feel it is too hard while also demanding that some things be exclusive to a game mode to make you play the game and want to play the game. I really want the Kuva weapons and I'll be starting to farm toward enslaving my lich today. But I want them to be a challenge and worth the grind to do. I want a reward that I can't get elsewhere. That is why I love the Eidolons cause I can play it casually and still make some progress toward my full sheet of Arcanes.

[Goldbar_]

On 2020-02-05 at 3:54 PM, [DE]Rebecca said:

This is very common feedback that will change the pace of lethality to a degree, but I am super interested to compile a consensus on this!

Wow... I didn't know this would be a hot topic. And I'm surprised many people think I'm making a suggestion for letting us mercy every single enemy.

Nope. That's not. I don't want it to happen neither. It will be a huge waste of time. Have you guys ever noticed how rare the Parazon mark is? It never shows up on every enemy.

It has fairly fair chance to happen so we don't have to worry about it.

 

And thanks for additional idea! Those downed enemies should be counted as dead so they won't delay mission progress in such as defense.

Also they should drop items as soon as they're downed. Like I said someone can't be bothered to mercy them. Let them pass through with their loots.

Additionally, Increasing execution speed would make it perfect! We are ninjas and we have to execute enemies as fast as we can!

Edited February 7, 2020 by Goldbar_

[Exodess]

What if we could tag enemies to trigger Mercy?

Not sure if someone already suggested that, but I think that would resolve the issue with both parties, while giving us some control over what's going to get the trigger.

[Hyohakusha]

Everything in ( ) was added after I got to this little gem.

12 hours ago, IgnisDraconis4316 said:

Now the grind of the thrall hunting has me a little..... worried...... but I haven't done a lich yet

 

12 hours ago, IgnisDraconis4316 said:

So because you believe only a fraction of the playerbase comes to the forums we should dismiss them out of context? Because you can see all the feedback on all Social Media and communications to see if it is a big thing or not? Seriously?

No, I know that the lich system is the most unpopular thing ever added to the game because of DE's poll. Nice strawman at the end there too. (You've never run a lich mission and you're talking about context. What about the context for your own feedback?)

10 hours ago, IgnisDraconis4316 said:

I also don't get this idea where you think you will be forced into mercy kills. Too many in this community say that DE is forcing one to do something. If you don't like that aspect of the game do something else. I didn't play arbitrations until the last major revamp they did because I couldn't stand the grind for a 1% chance at a reward. But once they fixed it I came back. If you don't like it you don't have to participate. And it isn't like every enemy has to be mercy killed. We are talking about 1-5 enemies in a mission. The only modes that it would seem like more is with Endless Modes (which are my favorite mission types). Also as they go along they are sure to add more mods for the Parazon and improve it. You are not looking to the future.

An enemy that's downed on one knee in a lich mission stays like that. Arbitration is its own mode. The entire rest of the game is the entire rest of the game. Also, you don't know how it would be implemented anyway. That's why this thread exists. And you can see into the future? Cool. (Since you've never run a lich mission, you don't understand that yes, you are forced to finisher the thralls. And it's more than 1-5 enemies a mission.)

10 hours ago, IgnisDraconis4316 said:

And I have never seen a mercy kill come up on a RJ mission. Where are you getting some of this stuff from? I very rarely see mercy options in most mainstream missions unless your kuva thrall hunting and if your doing that then you know you have to do it so why not make it more rewarding. 

I'm getting it from actually playing the game? It's actually quite common in the Veil since the enemies there have so much HP and Armor, which means it easier to trigger the mercy threshold. (Again, you've never run a lich mission. You say it's not like we're forced to do the finishers in one paragraph, in the next, "you know you have to do it".)

10 hours ago, IgnisDraconis4316 said:

"All that needs to be done is to increase the threshold for when the option to finisher becomes available. 15%-20% would be fine." No it wouldn't be fine because in Warframe we are not ninjas in space but GODS. You can wipe an enemy off the field in one shot. If they fall to their knees and you have already moved on then after a few seconds they would die if they implemented it that way. And how are you gonna notice when it sounds like your a person that doesn't stay in a mission for longer than 5 minutes. 

Again, you don't know how it would be implemented. You've got 1936 hours in game. I'm looking at your profile right now. I've got 3802. If I want to stay in a Kuva Survival for an hour, I can. If I want to run Cassini in a minute and a half to farm Kuva larva, I can. For someone who's talking about how different people have different play styles, it sure seems to be Narrow Minded to try and make a play style choice come off as an insult. Which is why I said the threshold to trigger a mercy prompt should be increased. (You use running missions in 5 minutes as an accusation, then dismiss a suggestion that would let people do whatever they want by claiming that we're gods that one shot everything.)

10 hours ago, IgnisDraconis4316 said:

WOW!!! What an exaggeration. Really you have had the icon for mercy kills show up 180 times in a single quick exterminate mission? At most I have seen 3 in a 20 minute Survival run. And how exactly would the downstate of waiting to be stabbed bleed into the rest of the game when you at most have between 8 to 10 times to pull it off in an average Long mission? 

Yeah, I'm not the one exaggerating here. You need to relax and not take a post on the internet so seriously. Hitting the thrall cap in an exterminate mission on a lich node takes an average of 10-15 minutes. The average pub exterminate takes maybe 5 minutes. Say the downed state gets added to every mission type. In captures and rescues, downed enemies will be completely ignored and add nothing to the game. Exterminate will take longer and annoy people. Defense will take even longer than it already does and annoy people even more. It's not an issue in Survival and Mobile Defense, but again, as I already pointed out, the parazon mercy mods are useless. Also, 20 minutes isn't even close to a long mission, and long runs aren't popular anymore. You'll burn 20 in recruiting chat just looking for people who will actually stay longer than an hour in a Kuva Survival, Disruption or Arbitration. (See the line I boldfaced below.)

11 hours ago, IgnisDraconis4316 said:

To me it just seems like you hate the Lich, parazon, Mercy kill aspect altogether.

Yeah, me and everyone else who responded to the poll obviously aren't happy with the state of the lich system, though I do like the hacking parazon mods, and don't see the need to flip out on people over it like you are. (And yet you've never actually gone after a lich.)

11 hours ago, IgnisDraconis4316 said:

Some of us want the monotony of "blaze through and finish it in a second" to end. People like me that have been playing for 6 years want something to break the cycle and make it more interesting. Not keep it the same for sake of efficiency which is what you seem to be getting at. I play a game for fun. Not for loot, efficiency, overwhelming bonuses, etc. And the parazon offers that cool fun aspect I am looking for. I like seeing my BA warframe kick an enemy in the back of the knee and stabbing them. It reminds me of Mass Effect and Omni-Blading someone. A game like this needs to be enjoyed and you need to take your time. It isn't a race but a marathon with lots to do.

All of this is subjective based on your own opinions and assumptions. (Because you haven't gone after a lich.)

11 hours ago, IgnisDraconis4316 said:

Now the grind of the thrall hunting has me a little..... worried...... but I haven't done a lich yet.

 Oh my god, now I get why the number 180 jumped out at you. That's why you don't understand any of the points I raised. You have no idea what you're asking for because you've never actually done it. How can you argue for a system to get tacked on to the rest of the game when you've never even engaged with the system in the first place? It takes 180 thralls worth of murmurs to reveal the three requiem mods you need to take out the lich. That's for one lich. Go take out 30+ liches, see all of the finisher animations 5,400+ times, see how much fun you have, how enjoyable it is to spend 10-15 minutes in every type of mission you do just to get one lich done in less than four hours. After you've done that, come back and make an informed post of your feedback on the system, instead of flipping out on people over something you haven even tried. This is exactly why DE needs to be careful of what feedback they listen to.

[AriaSTG]

More chances to do Parazon kills? Maybe. What Benefits should the player get once executed? IF it refills the WIP Devil's Trigger that was shown back as part 2 of Melee 3.0. I do not mind at all, of course the normally kills refills em but doing this fills more of that I Am Angry Tank. Heals?Energy? already got a mod for that, a bit small except energy when Arcane Energise proc itself.

The animations is fine, just the fact players screen is locked to that area only, its a bit restricting. Would you kindly allow the players to have the option to turn that off? What I meant by off is allow free Third Camera movement while still doing the animations. This allow players to determine their next plan on cleaning the floor.

If this were to abused for its Invincibility Frames, I suggest adding some sort of Shockwave that knocks down nearby enemies OR Maximum Damage Reduction as player heals with some sort of Heal over Time Parazon mod after executing

Just a general idea on how this iconic Creed weapon would work but of course anyone can improved it to be better. 🙂

[IgnisDraconis4316]

19 hours ago, Hyohakusha said:

Everything in ( ) was added after I got to this little gem.

 

No, I know that the lich system is the most unpopular thing ever added to the game because of DE's poll. Nice strawman at the end there too. (You've never run a lich mission and you're talking about context. What about the context for your own feedback?)

An enemy that's downed on one knee in a lich mission stays like that. Arbitration is its own mode. The entire rest of the game is the entire rest of the game. Also, you don't know how it would be implemented anyway. That's why this thread exists. And you can see into the future? Cool. (Since you've never run a lich mission, you don't understand that yes, you are forced to finisher the thralls. And it's more than 1-5 enemies a mission.)

I'm getting it from actually playing the game? It's actually quite common in the Veil since the enemies there have so much HP and Armor, which means it easier to trigger the mercy threshold. (Again, you've never run a lich mission. You say it's not like we're forced to do the finishers in one paragraph, in the next, "you know you have to do it".)

Again, you don't know how it would be implemented. You've got 1936 hours in game. I'm looking at your profile right now. I've got 3802. If I want to stay in a Kuva Survival for an hour, I can. If I want to run Cassini in a minute and a half to farm Kuva larva, I can. For someone who's talking about how different people have different play styles, it sure seems to be Narrow Minded to try and make a play style choice come off as an insult. Which is why I said the threshold to trigger a mercy prompt should be increased. (You use running missions in 5 minutes as an accusation, then dismiss a suggestion that would let people do whatever they want by claiming that we're gods that one shot everything.)

Yeah, I'm not the one exaggerating here. You need to relax and not take a post on the internet so seriously. Hitting the thrall cap in an exterminate mission on a lich node takes an average of 10-15 minutes. The average pub exterminate takes maybe 5 minutes. Say the downed state gets added to every mission type. In captures and rescues, downed enemies will be completely ignored and add nothing to the game. Exterminate will take longer and annoy people. Defense will take even longer than it already does and annoy people even more. It's not an issue in Survival and Mobile Defense, but again, as I already pointed out, the parazon mercy mods are useless. Also, 20 minutes isn't even close to a long mission, and long runs aren't popular anymore. You'll burn 20 in recruiting chat just looking for people who will actually stay longer than an hour in a Kuva Survival, Disruption or Arbitration. (See the line I boldfaced below.)

Yeah, me and everyone else who responded to the poll obviously aren't happy with the state of the lich system, though I do like the hacking parazon mods, and don't see the need to flip out on people over it like you are. (And yet you've never actually gone after a lich.)

All of this is subjective based on your own opinions and assumptions. (Because you haven't gone after a lich.)

 Oh my god, now I get why the number 180 jumped out at you. That's why you don't understand any of the points I raised. You have no idea what you're asking for because you've never actually done it. How can you argue for a system to get tacked on to the rest of the game when you've never even engaged with the system in the first place? It takes 180 thralls worth of murmurs to reveal the three requiem mods you need to take out the lich. That's for one lich. Go take out 30+ liches, see all of the finisher animations 5,400+ times, see how much fun you have, how enjoyable it is to spend 10-15 minutes in every type of mission you do just to get one lich done in less than four hours. After you've done that, come back and make an informed post of your feedback on the system, instead of flipping out on people over something you haven even tried. This is exactly why DE needs to be careful of what feedback they listen to.

The OP of this thread is not talking about thralls. Good grief you need to read. He was talking about other missions with the mercy killing. And that is what my feedback is based on which I do have ample experience with cause they show up in non lich missions. Before you attack someone maybe read the feedback as it is INTENDED for the thread that it is intended for. 

This isn't a thread about Lich hunting. Or fixing Lich Hunting.

As for my hours in game that doesn't mean S#&$. I had to have my account deleted and start over because of a glitch that DE caused that was irreparable. Again check your facts. Just cause someone has many hours doesn't make them an expert. Also I am giving feedback on the part that I have had experience with. That is why I said what I said. 

And just in case you can't read this is what the OP said, "But I've noticed that it's difficult to conduct mercy in ****normal missions****** other than murmur farming."

So why don't you get off my back, put your feedback for liches in the right spot and stop acting so elitist?

[IgnisDraconis4316]

On 2020-02-05 at 1:06 PM, Goldbar_ said:

I really like the execution animations and mods such as [Hit and Run] and [Out of Sight].

But I've noticed that it's difficult to conduct mercy in normal missions other than murmur farming.

So here's the deal. Let us down them when the Parazon mark is on. Just like thralls!

However, someone can't be bothered to mercy them. Then my thought says let them die in 2~3 seconds after downed!

I hope Dev accept this idea so I can play Warframe happily.

Just to clarify @Goldbar_ is talking about mercy killing in normal missions not lich/thrall hunts.

I have no idea where all these lich hunt and parazoning every enemy in every mission feeback is coming from.

Normal missions is the key!

[IgnisDraconis4316]

 @Goldbar_ There is another reason to allow mercy kills to be more effective in normal missions. A friend and I were discussing this with a partner. Liches can only be accessed after The War Within right? If you allowed Goldbar's suggestion to happen then it could be a mini-introduction to new players for Lich hunting. 

It would help them get acclimated to using the mercy mechanic and then once the Kuva Thrall grind begins they would already be acclimated and understand the mechanic. 

For veterans being able to skip them after a few seconds would be appealing. But his suggestion would have some merits for new and veteran players alike. 

[ArcKnight9202]

I don't know if this was suggested or not but it could give incentive to some lesser-liked status procs like Blast or Impact. Obviously don't turn it into a Covert Lethality type of thing but it should open up some mercy options in the right scenarios.

 

[WMan22]

Honestly, Parazon should always consistently open an enemy to be finisher'd to death at 30% threshold no matter how much health they have, but should not stop them in their place to kneel like a lich thrall does, they should die when you shoot or slice them to death as it is now. Finishers keep the pace of combat going in another looter shooter I've been playing, and that game does 30% health threshold.

Why 30% and not 40%? Because Garuda does it at 40%. So basically the basis for this idea at that threshold has already proven itself to not be overpowered.

Edited February 23, 2020 by WMan22