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Armor 2.0, Thoughts On 1.0


greymalken
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Well, we've seen there is a damage overhaul inc. and there has been a bit of emphasis on discussion regarding armor. However, there is another imbalance present that seems it should be mentioned.

 

POISON:

 

On Tenno: Poison bypasses shields and does damage straight to health.

 

On Enemies: poison weapons (seem) upon use to have to chip away at enemy shield first. So while the poison IS armor ignore, it is NOT shield ignore (unlike when it is used on tenno).

 

Anyway, hadn't really seen that mentioned too much, so here's me bumping it.

 

 

Good Hunting, Tenno.

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Acrid would murder Jackel in 5 hits. I'm not even kidding.

In reference to what?

 

EDIT: Ah, yes, if they made player poison also shield bypass.

 

Would be preferable, imo, to have poison dmg vs. Tenno be shield first.

 

But really, all I pointed out in my post was the difference, not a preference for either... I imagine things will be very different with the armor/damage revamp. Just wanted to highlight another area (besides armor scaling) where the damage system is a bit lopsided.

 

Also, will be neat to see if we get any cold/anti shield weapons. we have fire, toxic, electric, and AP weapons, but no cold.

Edited by greymalken
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multi shot, hornet strike, fast hands, fire rate.

acrid for the win.

 

that said, this has nothing to do with armor, so the title needs fixing. poison is moreso an element than having to do with armor.

 

however, i would like to see some DOT mods (increase DOT dmg, increase DOT duration) for ogris, ignis, acrid, etc.

(since DE loves mods so damn much.. >.> )

 

besides, we're only in u10.. wait til u guys see the list when we hit U15...or 20 for that matter LOOL

( /vote for rollback to tree / grid system XD )

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Yeah that inconsistency bothers me a lot too.

Right now poison is very unoriginal as a damage type: it's essentially just another AP with it's own death animation, while the DoT is a quality of the weapon not of the damage.

I wish they would standardize and differentiate it: all poison is DoT, all poison ignores shields and armor, all poison isn't affected by weak spots, ect.

And poison shouldn't change how other elementals work, even if it's innate poison: other damages wouldn't pass through shields, wouldn't gain the DoT and would still be affected by weakspots.

With some appropriate balancing to the weapons that do innate poison and the addition of a poison mod.

however, i would like to see some DOT mods (increase DOT dmg, increase DOT duration) for ogris, ignis, acrid, etc.

(since DE loves mods so damn much.. >.> )

I think I heared/read somewhere that DE intends to make fire DoT with the damage update, but don't quote me on it Edited by CubedOobleck
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From what I recall, the main meat of armor 2.0 does is basically put Corrosive Projection stats into our AP mods. 

So everyone has a net reduction in damage.

 

Currently a max level Kunai with Hornet Strike and No return does 144 damage + 129 AP damage respectively.

That 129 value will no longer exist, since Kunai already ignores armor completely in 2.0.

That means instead of (144 + 129) x2 (barrel diff) like now, you now only deal 144 x 2.

 

In return for losing no return, you can use that free 7 slots, for whatever you want.... Maybe pistol mutation or trick mag ?

So in the end everyone will suffer a net loss in DPS but in return, bullet weapons like Vipers, Vastos suddenly become a LOT more viable since their bullets can reliably get through armor now.

 

 

But DE also plans to have crit rates to trigger elemental effects.

Since Kunai and Despair have crap for critical chance, that means they will lose against Twin Viper , Lex and Vastos in that area.

 

So yeah, the current kings will be gone and let's hail our new overlords :p

Edited by fatpig84
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Fire: Doesn't burn stuff over time

 

Ice: Only element besides poison with a reliable utility.

 

Electricity: Meant to be effective against Corpus. Doesn't stun shielded enemies. 75% of Corpus have shields or are shielded by Ospreys.

 

Poison: Effective on robots and the infested, even though poison is derived from said infested. Also no mods for it yet.

 

Armor Piercing: Can pierce armor that doesn't even exist or make armor ignoring weapon ignore armor even harder.

 

 

Those are my nitpicks with the elements, I know DE confirmed that they'll address some of them, but I would like to see elements be more than just straight damage buffs in the future.

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Fire: Doesn't burn stuff over time

 

Ice: Only element besides poison with a reliable utility.

 

Electricity: Meant to be effective against Corpus. Doesn't stun shielded enemies. 75% of Corpus have shields or are shielded by Ospreys.

 

Poison: Effective on robots and the infested, even though poison is derived from said infested. Also no mods for it yet.

 

Armor Piercing: Can pierce armor that doesn't even exist or make armor ignoring weapon ignore armor even harder.

 

 

Those are my nitpicks with the elements, I know DE confirmed that they'll address some of them, but I would like to see elements be more than just straight damage buffs in the future.

Personally I hope they remain mostly damage, if they gain too much utility who would ever use stun mods? (not that they are used much already) But the elementals could be a bit more differentiated between each other, mainly I think it would be nice if they lost some of their faction specific properties because it's really redundant with the bane mods now: fire could work well on any exposed/unarmored flesh and I think I read they intend to make it DoT, electricity could work well on rollers and grineer body modifications not just corpus, poison shouldn't interact with weak spots and should be DoT by default, ice is fine as you said, AP would be fine if it weren't for the armor scaling.

Edited by CubedOobleck
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Personally I hope they remain mostly damage, if they gain too much utility who would ever use stun mods?

 

Oh crud I forgot stun as an element! That's how bad that one is, it's not even memorable. Of course you could argue that electricity already has stun pinned down, if it was more reliable, you could probably just factor out stun mods entirely.

 

Also I agree that elements shouldn't be faction specific. I personally wouldn't mind some Borderlands logic behind elements, like fire for unarmored, poison for armored, electricity for shields, and ice is pretty much fine as is as a jack of all trades kind of element. I think AP is no longer going to count as bonus damage and instead convert a portion or your gun's damage to armor ignore, and stun would either need a serious buff to it's usefulness or just be removed entirely in favor of an electricity buff.

Edited by Paradoxbomb
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