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More general feedback on Conclave


Mr.Fluffins
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Hello everyone, after playing Conclave some more I would like to share additional feedback on Conclave and why I think it's not very popular.

This post does not talk about obviously bad things like weapons with PvE stats added in PvP, nor broken melee with 100% autoblock and one-shot slide attacks. Instead, I would like to talk about more baseline aspects of Conclave that are not very stellar. Let's begin.

1. Location of dedicated servers.

Now, Conclave does in fact have a dedicated server, the same one I have been connecting to all the time when I wasnt directly hosting (maybe there are more but I havent see one). FYI, I am playing in Europe region, with allowed latency up to 300 in PvE, in case it affects Conclave matchmaking.

The problem is that the ping from me to said server is around 250-300 ms. Anyone who has ever played a PvP game knows that in general, when your ping is higher than 100 it is already becoming rather difficult to play properly, and ping above 200 is barely playable, especially in a very fast paced PvP like Conclave. I got killed by melee attacks that landed meters away from me (while the other guy said that it was a direct hit), I managed to miss people shooting almost point blank or killing people while completely away from them. The delay is simply too much. Now, normal PvP games handle such problems by either:

  • offering more dedicated servers (not going to happen in Warframe),
  • offering an option to host yourself (questionable since it gives an advantage to the host, but at least provides an option for people close by to play without a crazy ping).

I can imagine that quite a few people who wanted to take Conclave seriously and were unlucky with their location relative to the dedicated server joined a few games, realized that the gameplay is rather wonky, decided to check their ping, saw something like 150-200 ms or worse, found no apparent option to manually host public matches and decided to quit it for good. And I wouldn't blame them.

Current solution that I know of revolves around actively seeking people from your region and hosting games yourself with said people. As you can imagine this is not a very good solution since it still gives an advantage to the host, plus it doesn't help the population of people for regular matchmaking. If everyone is sitting in his corner playing private games with their clan-mates\friends, then a normal person who just begins his journey in Conclave or just wants a quick game will be out of luck finding people and playing at reasonable latency.

2. Capture the Cephalon

At first I was confused as to why something straightforward like capture the flag is so unpopular. When I played it a bit, I realized that the developers made some... interesting choices when making their CTF mode.

"Interesting" choice number 1: Spawns are random. Usually, in a normal CTF, all teams have their designated zones in which they can spawn. But in Capture the Cephalon, you can spawn literally on top of the enemy flag... I think this problem is self-explanatory.

"Interesting" choice number 2: The enemy that is holding the flag is not visible on the map. Usually, CTF modes make flag carriers visible for everyone (enemies and teammates) so that a flag carrier couldn't just "sneak" back to his base and some combat action could happen around the flag carrier. But here this is not the case for whatever reason.

"Interesting" choice number 3: Flag carrier has full mobility and has access to his mobility abilities (like tidal surge by hydroid). Now here, not all games where I played CTF in limited flag carrier's mobility. However, it all comes down to the overall design of the level and the game. For example in Unreal Tournament the maps were usually bigger than Warframe maps and players were relatively slower (no crazy bullet jumps etc.). Optionally, all players but the flag carrier could use transporters (basically short distance teleporters) to traverse the map, so in some cases regular players would have an advantage in term of speed. Tribes Ascend also didn't limit the mobility of the flag carrier, but the flag itself was usually heavily guarded (so it required a team effort to even capture it in the first place), and due to the way the mobility worked in the game (you had to slide slopes to increase your speed and you had momentum) bringing the flag back was also not easy.

But nowhere have I seen a CTF mode with Warframe levels of mobility, short maps and no brakes on the flag carrier. In other games, all these systems existed so that capturing the flag would require team coordination, or the flag carrier being very good (and the opposition not so much). In Conclave, current CTF in my opinion is just an unfinished mess. For how long has it been in this state? Please let me know.

3. Team annihilation. 

Here I have a small complaint - your teammates are not visible on the minimap. Or rather, they are sometimes visible (with their warframe icon on the map), and sometimes not (and I have no idea why). Moreover, when they shoot, they become visible as a red arrow on the map as if they were an enemy.  Additionally, a friend of miine manage to see his own venari cat as an enemy on the map... Why? What is going on here? Why can't there be a clear indication for your teammates on the map in a team deathmatch? This is not rocket science guys.

4. All maps are suitable regardless of the number of players in a lobby

Now, this is less of an issue, and I clearly understand that this is not going to be fixed, but maps in Conclave vary in size quite much, and as you might imagine, playing 1v1 on a huge map or an 8 annihilation on a small map can be sub-optimal.

5. Lunaro and hosting

Things that I have noticed so far about Lunaro.

  • There are no dedicated servers (which was a blessing to me)
  • Only the host can launch the ball with a melee attack, clients can only turn it purple but cant move it most of the time (would like someone to confirm it)
  • The speed of the ball depends on ping? Usually I played lunaro with friends (since lunaro is basically empty), but once I managed to join a different host with ping around 70ms (not too bad). During that match, I noticed that I was launching the ball much further with the same throws I did previously for some reason (would like someone more experienced to clarify this)

Conclusion

I have seen people talk about broken weapons, melee and questionable ability balance quite often, but I have barely seen people touch up on more core issues with Conclave, which can make it rather unattractive for people who don't mind playing proper PvP modes and expect a certain baseline level of competency in terms of design (like NOT having RANDOM spawns in CTF).

For example, ping to dedicated servers alone is the reason I can't really properly play Conclave in public, unless I get lucky and someone close by (or myself) is a direct host. Even with obvious problems out of the way, Conclave still needs some extra polish for more people to consider it a viable PvP side-distraction.

 

 

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