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JackHargreav

I don't like the sentients (Edited)

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3 minutes ago, Eklectus said:

Name another weapon that resets/bypasses Sentient resistance.

Viable =/= most effective. 

If you are at a stage where you face Sentients regularly you need some FOCUS. 

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3 minutes ago, 0_The_F00l said:

Viable =/= most effective. 

If you are at a stage where you face Sentients regularly you need some FOCUS. 

That's exactly the point being discussed in the thread. When you have an exterminate mission to destroy over 100 sentients, or you're in a survival mission where killing enemies fast is key to surviving, weapons that force you to jump out of operator mode multiple times just to take down one target are not "viable" and, what you call focus is the thing people are against - being forced to use the single frame + weapon loadout that actually deals with adaptation quickly.

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7 minutes ago, Eklectus said:

That's exactly the point being discussed in the thread. When you have an exterminate mission to destroy over 100 sentients, or you're in a survival mission where killing enemies fast is key to surviving, weapons that force you to jump out of operator mode multiple times just to take down one target are not "viable" and, what you call focus is the thing people are against - being forced to use the single frame + weapon loadout that actually deals with adaptation quickly.

So you just want everything to be easy without any effort, why even have levels and variety then?

Well I am sorry, but I would rather have some difficulty if it is supposed to be difficult content behind weeks of grind. 

The sentient ship alerts was/is just a teaser of things to come.

And when I said focus you clearly missed the implication of using the operator, and not just the shedu/umbra /paracesis which are definitely effective but not mandatory to kill them. 

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They also do ridiculous amounts of damage, i wouldn't doubt if it was the highest in the entire game. If you've ever fought one on a kuva lich mission in Lua you'll know the pain

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Even if you don't like them, same as me but we still have do deal with them and hopefully new updates upcoming will give them more interested in fighting us. Its quite annoying when I tried to kill them like chasing some kids over the back yard.😒

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23 minutes ago, 0_The_F00l said:

So you just want everything to be easy without any effort, why even have levels and variety then?

Why hello there, strawman. Nice to see you.

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44 minutes ago, Eklectus said:

Name another weapon that resets/bypasses Sentient resistance.

Sure, if you name 1 that ignores regular armor.

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2 minutes ago, Corvid said:

Why hello there, strawman. Nice to see you.

Hello there, I believe you have mistaken me for someone else, could describe who you are looking for so I may direct you to them? 

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5 minutes ago, SpringRocker said:

Sure, if you name 1 that ignores regular armor.

Anything with slash damage focus. Or Crit + HunMun.

33 minutes ago, 0_The_F00l said:

So you just want everything to be easy without any effort, why even have levels and variety then?

Well I am sorry, but I would rather have some difficulty if it is supposed to be difficult content behind weeks of grind. 

The sentient ship alerts was/is just a teaser of things to come.

And when I said focus you clearly missed the implication of using the operator, and not just the shedu/umbra /paracesis which are definitely effective but not mandatory to kill them. 

No, I want the effort to be rewarding. The hitbox, for example, can actually provide some difficulty if you're not using an AoE/Arca Plasmor-esque weapon. Having an extra layer of bulletsponge is not difficulty. Coupled with the fact that Warframe grind was always about rinsing the same mission, over and over again until a low percentage drop pops, rather than completing an actual challenge, and the extra time taken per mission just adds to the tedium, not enjoyment.

And you clearly missed the mention of going into operator mode multiple times to take down one enemy being an annoyance when you decided to reiterate on that point.

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11 minutes ago, 0_The_F00l said:

Hello there, I believe you have mistaken me for someone else, could describe who you are looking for so I may direct you to them? 

No no, I have the right person. You were, after all, putting words into @Eklectus' mouth and claiming they were saying something that they weren't.

Not wanting enemies to be overly spongey with awkward hurtboxes =/= wanting everything to be a cakewalk.

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12 minutes ago, Eklectus said:

Anything with slash damage focus. Or Crit + HunMun.

In the same vein, anything that deals multiple damage types.

Really, guy. only 2 weapon viable against sentient? You're really reaching for it now.

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1 minute ago, SpringRocker said:

In the same vein, anything that deals multiple damage types.

Really, guy. only 2 weapon viable against sentient? You're really reaching for it now.

You mean multiple damage types that the sentient will adapt to at the same time? Or multiple damage types on different weapons, where using the operator would be faster/more efficient than switching between them each time?

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4 minutes ago, SpringRocker said:

In the same vein, anything that deals multiple damage types.

Really, guy. only 2 weapon viable against sentient? You're really reaching for it now.

Depends on the Sentients level.

A lvl 30 sentient is easy, no problem. A lvl 90 sentient? That's a different story. 

Against those It's a lot more efficient to use the Paracesis with excal Umbra.

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I don't like the sentients much either, and they don't like me so I kill them. It just works like that. 

They're a bit harder to hit and it takes knowing the timing of when to shoot them, but that makes it a bit more interesting at least. 

 

Also stacking damage types makes quick work of them. Impact, slash, puncture, heat, magnetic, and cold or blast is what I usually run against them and they can't adapt to all of the damage types before they die. 

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11 minutes ago, Eklectus said:

You mean multiple damage types that the sentient will adapt to at the same time? Or multiple damage types on different weapons, where using the operator would be faster/more efficient than switching between them each time?

Either one.

Makes more sense than your claim about weapons that ignore armor when I asked if there were any.

Just because you think there's only 2 weapons that work against sentients doesn't make it true. Any weapon is fine against them.

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It's really not that bad. This forum has a lot of people that act like they cant do basic stuff.

I'm at 800 hrs and I have zero complaints about dispatching any faction of enemy.

Try a different amp, try a different focus school. Try a different arcane. Try a different frame. Geezus it's not that hard.

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8 minutes ago, SpringRocker said:

Either one.

Makes more sense than your claim about weapons that ignore armor when I asked if there were any.

Just because you think there's only 2 weapons that work against sentients doesn't make it true. Any weapon is fine against them.

As mentioned above, that might be viable in the Lua/Jupiter Sentient encounters. The Railjack Sentients are significantly more jacked up.

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1 hour ago, Kalvorax said:

I do understand it. DE has NEVER thought to look at how enemy design is messing up enjoyment for players in the past.

It was one reason I quit playing the First Division game, as it had spongy af enemies and got tiring quite quickly....warframe is sadly going the same route to me.

Hitscan Weapons, Homing Projectiles, identical silhouettes... 

The annoying part is that several newer enemies actually do fix things like this - plains Bombards are much better than regular ones, all the Amalgam enemies have much different silhouettes whilst still being solid enough to not be a pain to shoot. Hell, even with the Sentients, Mimics and Symbalysts have that whole laser sweep gimmick that offers potential for more involved dodging if you want it. DE knows how to do a bunch of good things individually, they just cant seem to wrap their heads around doing all of them at once...

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38 minutes ago, Eklectus said:

.No, I want the effort to be rewarding. The hitbox, for example, can actually provide some difficulty if you're not using an AoE/Arca Plasmor-esque weapon. Having an extra layer of bulletsponge is not difficulty. Coupled with the fact that Warframe grind was always about rinsing the same mission, over and over again until a low percentage drop pops, rather than completing an actual challenge, and the extra time taken per mission just adds to the tedium, not enjoyment.

We are in agreement, partially for the unfun grind  ,

and since the Sentients have adaptations and health gates, aoe weapons are not very effective either.

The grind does indeed get unrewarding after a certain point, where it's just better to go Meta, if you are farming for specific drops. Having a limited time to finish the mission is the greater reason why an "optimum build load mandatory" is considered (eidolons are a prime example), 

But after the introduction of the exotics trade goods, I have hope that will no longer be the case. 

 

42 minutes ago, Eklectus said:

.And you clearly missed the mention of going into operator mode multiple times to take down one enemy being an annoyance when you decided to reiterate on that point.

Although I would argue you would need to go into the OP mode maybe 2 times,per group of sentients( if you don't have a diverse elemental loadout) I did miss that point I think. My apologies. 

But I stand on my original statement Just because there is an optimum way does not mean other ways are not viable. 

There were Sentients before there was paracesis, umbra and shedu, and players still managed to kill them. 

 

43 minutes ago, Corvid said:

No no, I have the right person. You were, after all, putting words into @Eklectus' mouth and claiming they were saying something that they weren't.

I asked a question, the person to whom the question was posed clarified it.

If I had said something along the lines of "it's cause of people like you that we can't get challenging content as you want everything to be a easy with your existing playstyles " it would indeed have been a strawman to burn on. 

If someone says there is no viable way than an optimum loadout then the said person either does not wish to put the effort for changing his existing playstyle or only wishes to run the Meta to minimize the time taken for completion and maximizing chances of rewards. 

The person has stated his leaning towards the later and I will continue the discussion with that understanding with said person seperately. 

55 minutes ago, Corvid said:

Not wanting enemies to be overly spongey with awkward hurtboxes =/= wanting everything to be a cakewalk.

I did not really mention anything about sponges in my earlier comments. But about viability of loadouts. Hence why I believe you have the wrong person for making a strawman claim. 

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21 minutes ago, Eklectus said:

As mentioned above, that might be viable in the Lua/Jupiter Sentient encounters. The Railjack Sentients are significantly more jacked up.

Guess what? Same method.

Just because you can't breeze past them doesn't mean a weapon isn't viable. It's not like you're trying to drop an Eidolon's shields down with an Arca... Or does that also need a nerf because you need to use operator?

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4 hours ago, 3rdpig said:

If you think they're the most annoying enemies in video game history then either you're exaggerating wildly, or you haven't played many video games.

I don't even have to look further than Warframe for an example. I'd like you to meet my lich with the Tonkor who could one shot entire teams while hopping around like a demented bunny rabbit, dropping grenades like turds, occasionally turning invisible and constantly dropping insults that belong in Bollywood gangster movies.

I am interested to know more about the insults dropped by Bollywood gangster movies

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4 minutes ago, SpringRocker said:

Guess what? Same method.

Just because you can't breeze past them doesn't mean a weapon isn't viable. It's not like you're trying to drop an Eidolon's shields down with an Arca... Or does that also need a nerf because you need to use operator?

Why, yes, my issue is with the fact that I need to use the operator, not because, in this case, every enemy in a "standard" mission is kitted out with an ability that requires an extra step to chew through the EHP, needlessly extending the duration of the mission. I will reiterate. Sentients worked in the past because they were, essentially, miniboss enemies. Here, they suddenly become grunts, but retain the same feature that's intended to make a player pause and pay a single unit more attention than the rest of the horde. 

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