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Elemental Mods And Rainbow Builds


Morcant
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It's no great secret that the most effective mod build for any weapon, regardless of its properties, is the classic "rainbow" build. Slap every single element on. No reason not to, right? They all add damage, even if one is resisted. Worst-case scenario, your electric mod gets nullified against Infested. Sure, there are variants, but almost every build out there is this + something else. The rare exception might be certain crit builds.

I propose that this situation is the "mod stacking" of modern Warframe. Those who have been around for a while remember the mod system in place prior to Update 7. In brief, you could place duplicate mods on an item to directly stack the effects. In addition, a skill tree on each item was available, which boosted stats on each item independently of mods. It led to such ridiculous power creep that the devs wiped all mods in Update 7 and overhauled the system, eliminating the skill trees and, until recently, dual-stat mods.

The way I see it, rainbow builds have no drawback, no downside, no choice to be made. You either use it, or you willingly cripple yourself. I'm all about having choices, so this concerns me. From DE's perspective, why is it desirable for players to stack 300%+ additional damage on a weapon?

The system as-is produces great results if you simply want the absolute maximum damage possible. The recent release of the Galatine suggests that base damage on weapons will only increase from here on, exacerbating the issue with rainbow builds. With Armor 2.0 currently under discussion/development, now might be a good time to talk about alternatives.

Option 1: Lock elemental mods as "duplicates." Simply put, the UI would not permit more than one element socketed into a weapon at a time. This has the benefit of being easy to implement, but it seems like a band-aid to me. While it would serve the purpose of forcing more careful elemental selection, it would not provide any drawbacks.

Option 2: Modify the way elemental mods behave. The idea here is to make elemental choice meaningful, and to that end I suggest applying the chosen element to base damage, in addition to a base damage bonus. This means if you choose poorly, your damage from that weapon can be mitigated entirely. While counterintuitive, this is a good thing; it gives you responsibility and rewards you for planning ahead and going into a mission prepared. Such is only the case at very high level play currently, where you need to overcome the massive armor scaling.

To preempt an obvious response, I'm well aware that currently, AP would be the element of choice. However as mentioned, Armor 2.0 is currently underway, and I have some hope that AP will not be as critically important past level 40 going into the future.

I'm also aware that this would result in a significant reduction in damage output across the board; like I said, it's pretty much the default mod build. I wouldn't have brought it up unless Armor 2.0 was currently being worked on, when potentially the entire damage system is being looked at anyway. This would be a change which requires that scale of work to implement successfully.

That's all I have for now. I'm open to comments, other ideas, agreement, disagreement.

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I do not disagree. Would make picking gear for missions and team composition a little more important.

Yeeah i would agree with you here, but the majority of players are selfish and dont cooperate with their teams, so that wouldnt work out as planned unless you are lucky enough to have a group of friends who play too.

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Currently for Rainbow Builds... that's only really a "Go to" Build for most Bullet type weps or Blade Type weps, yeah it's good for damage but... honestly considering the recent large amount of Crit Build Weps and considering Crit Builds are superior to a rainbow build if you add only 1 or 2 Elements I can't see the reason for a complete overhaul on the way they work, DE kinda noticed this I think and this is why they're starting to add more variety to the weps, like giving things more than 2.5% Crit Rate... but this has also caused things like the Galatine to appear and 1 shot everything... so I guess it's Double Edged.

 

I mean... when building a Despair, 4/8 Slots are filled with, No Return, Lethal Torrent, Barrel Diffusion, and Hornet Strike, after that most would most likly add a Ice Storm mod, than would come the elementals, but just with those 4-5 Mods added BEFORE the Elementals you're already doing INSANE amounts of damage and the Elementals only add on minor damage in the long term, the only Elemental that's seriously worth it for all situations is Ice just due to all around usefulness, Fires good... for infested and Electric is honestly just questionable to me, it's good at times and horrible at others.

 

As for if this was to release? I remember seeing a revamped mod system someone suggested that would make the mods customize certain parts of the wep, I feel this could fit there as one of the suggestions was to make a specific section set for an Elemental Mod, and AP could be put under "Wep Magazine" Category instead of being put into the Elemental Category which would fix the AP vs Elemental Problem that this would cause, again though, I don't see the reason to do this now.

 

I'd just wait and see what Armor 2.0 brings to the table as that's when we REALLY want to start making suggestions on everything like this as it will bring quite the change to the way the game works most likly so we'll just have to wait and see.

Edited by EinRyu
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I think a better solution is to add more mods worth using besides elemental mods. See crit builds; there isn't room for a full rainbow build after specing a crit build. With mods like Thunderbolt and that mod to increase the AOE of the Ogris and Torid, and more mods like those in future, eventually we might have enough mods worth using that rainbow builds aren't the go to for every weapon.

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  • 1 month later...

First of all rainbow builds are not the way to go. I really don't feel like elaborating but learn each factions weakness and stack those. Corpus aside the other factions armor scales down the damage of elements aside from AP.

Second of all in damage 2.0 if you have more than one elemental mod it will combine into a new element instead of stacking. I.E Fire and Ice would create blast damage.

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You're late to the party, change is already underway.

DE solution is to violently rewrite the damage system and give each enemy in each faction different defense. High armor with low health, high shield with low health, high health with low shield, etc. And equipping more than one element in your weapon will result in new element with new utility effect (fire+ice=blast, for example).

So, you will need weapons with different effect to deal with different enemy within each faction. Rainbow build will no longer exist. AP will be effective against certain enemy.

Good concept, now waiting for DE to adjust it.

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I agree that DE's concept is good, I wrote this a bit before they made the elemental combinations known. I'm glad they expanded the scope of the armor overhaul to include damage in general and found a more creative solution to rainbow builds. It's very promising, and I'm eager to see how it feels in practice.

 

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