2020’s First Mainline: Review, Revise, Refresh.

[veryhighcholesterol]

Good changes. Now about the RJ salvage costs....

[CanOfCraig]

my only real worry with arcane changes is for having multiples.
can I not feed my double built one into my bigger one, or are we just punishing pople for have ever double stacking to begin with in this update.
Some clarification on this would be appreciated

 

also I don't agree that putting an event in the game that gives us an alternate way to farm arcanes is a fix, maybe some slight alterations could be made before things get shipped.

[Cyro_Valithum]

     I Love a lot of these changes including the rebalanced arcane system, thank you all so very much for your work. Double arcanes being a thing was the main reason I used 2 of the same arcane and nothing else but the other reason is accessiblity.      Eidolons are a fine way of getting them for a lot of people but for a lot of others it's annoying and not worth the bother especially if you prefer to play or farm solo.

     I'd really love use a wider variety and play around with them if there were other ways to get them that weren't on a timer every couple of hours. 

     Like arbitrations or their vender or late rotations on high level missions like disruption or caches in high level sabotage or liches maybe could be good  addtional ways. Otherwise I'll probably pick two arcanes and buy them in trade chat and never change them out like I did before this. Cause eidolon farming is the most annoying and unfun activity for me and my friends don't care for it either. But either way I love the game and will keep playing for years to come like I have been.

Edited February 29, 2020 by Cyro_the_Dragon
Making it more readable.

[XaoGarrent]

I am looking forward to almost nothing in this patch, and dreading a large amount of these changes.

Hmm. Most of my friends have left the game over the past 3-6 months. Maybe it's time I started considering joining them.

[HevnPrime]

Using chroma for eidolon is going to be hard when self damage is removed

[doominator10]

If Grendel ends up not being able to eat grenades like napalm butter I'm going to be PISSED.

Edited February 29, 2020 by doominator10
PISSED I TELL YOU!

[WeaselBoy]

14 minutes ago, CanOfCraig said:

my only real worry with arcane changes is for having multiples.
can I not feed my double built one into my bigger one, or are we just punishing pople for have ever double stacking to begin with in this update.
Some clarification on this would be appreciated

 

also I don't agree that putting an event in the game that gives us an alternate way to farm arcanes is a fix, maybe some slight alterations could be made before things get shipped.

On the Devstream, although they didn't go over it, there was a new "Distill Arcane" button which will break it down and let you recombine 2 maxxed arcanes.

[KagaNerdy]

Chroma is dead now after the self-dmg removal lul
Chroma Rework arises later
 

at least the R5 Arcane farm is already being made up by Scarlet Spear

[Damocles]

ARCANE NERFS

The arcane nerfs are WAY TOO SEVERE. The fact you can no longer stack 2 sets is already a nerf because we're effectively losing 25% of maximizing something we want. Despite DE's desire to encourage diversity, this is ENFORCING DIVERSITY. At first I thought this means I can put in Grace and Energize, but after reading the changes, they just mean Energize will no longer restore energy while channeling, which is the only reason people use it. The cooldown is just insult to injury. Grace cannot be reprocced isnt a big nerf, but it already loses 25% potential healing when it was double stacked, and that guaranteed window of not healing. Usually I get healed for 6 seconds after hiding, but now I might potentially get 0 seconds of healing by the time I get out of danger. Lastly Aegis might as well be deleted from the game if it becomes that 1 stat nobody mods for.

If Energize has duration and has cooldown, this means I CANNOT USE ENERGIZE WITH CHANNELING FRAMES, and DO NOT PICK UP ENERGY ORBS DURING COOLDOWN
Grace does not refresh means GRACE WILL NOW ENCOURAGE ME TO HIDE ON PROCC TO HEAL AND ATTACK WHEN EXPIRED or permanently play Rhino
Aegis is now shield recharge... whatever, aegis was niche anyways

WHAT ARCANES SHOULD BE

1. The no double stacking, and rank 5 arcanes was a good idea. 1.5 times effectiveness means we're trading 25% of what we used to have for new combination builds.
2. Don't add the nerfs to LEGENDARY arcanes if you dont intend to reduce its rarity while increasing its cost to maximize.
3. Absolutely do not buff and nerf different things in the same patch. Making last place competitive and first place non-competitive means no competition
4. Move weapon related arcanes to the actual weapons themselves. Having a warframe modded with arcanes for shotguns really ties frames to certain guns, and that's the opposite of what you want. Kit guns used to be the best pistols because you get the same gun as any gun, a single riven fits many combinations, and a free arcane slot which can be used to get infinite ammo or bonus damage. Other weapons can't compete when certain weapons have an arcane advantage and some do not
5. EITHER WAY, YOU NEED TO COMPLETELY AND FAIRLY REWORK THE ENTIRE ARCANE SYSTEM because 2 nerfs do not make a buff

SHOTGUN NERFS, (you did exactly what you said you didn't want)

If you're tripling the status chance, but dividing by the number of pellets, then why are you buffing status? Take a look at the Strun wraith which has 10 base pellets. After the change, it will have 3 times status, but divided by 10 pellets. This means it went from 100% status per pellet to probably 30% status-per-pellet b/c a 100% prior status-per-pellet chance is now 300% with the buff, but divided by 10 to 30%. That is to say, You've now made the shotgun go from 100%→100% to that broken 99%→30% which YOU DIDN'T WANT IN THE FIRST PLACE.

STRUN WRAITH (40% base) old 100%→100% vs new 744%→74.4%

(assuming all status mods currently possible are used) Fully modding strun wraith with all status mods Motus Setup+Nano Applicator+Shotgun Savvy (90%)+60/60*4 = 520%. Thats 248%*3 = 744% UI status, now divide by 10 pellets for 74.4% per pellet status. I'm using more status mods, and getting less status chance.

CORINTH (12% base) old 67.2%→17% vs new 223.2%→37.2%

(assuming all status mods currently possible are used) Motus Setup+Nano Applicator+Shotgun Savy (30%)+60/60*4 = 460%. That's 67.2% UI status chance and 1-(1-0.672)^(1/6) = 17% status chance per pellet. Now taking the new system into account Motus Setup+Nano Applicator+Shotgun Savy (90%)+60/60*4 = 520%. That's 74.4*3 = 223.2% UI status and 37.2% per pellet status

Also, how does Kohm work? 3 times status but divided by 4 pellets is still an overall status-per-pellet nerf. But, then at full spool, we see 3 times status, but divided by 12, which is just unrecoverable. From what was shown on stream, Corinth has 6% status per pellet. It currently has 12% UI status chance, which makes sense when you multiply by 3 and divide by 6 pellets, it makes sense that it shows 6% per pellet. What you've introduced is now a preference for single pellet shotguns (slugs) and that pretty much means a sniper rifles, which isn't known for effective status weapons. You've added a layer of obscurity because status chance ≠ per pellet status chance ≠ actual status chance

WHAT SHOTGUNS SHOULD BE

1. Whatever we see in the UI as of now, should already be the status-per-pellet already. No need to add a useless 3x multiplier if it divides by a pellet count we can neither see, control, nor benefit from.

 

 

[PlanckZero]

DE do you seriously not know how people use status resist arcanes? Unless the wiki has been wrong for years no one in their right mind needs to use two max ranked Arcane Healing to reach status immunity because that would cost them 20 arcanes for a pointless 160% resist when all they needed to do in the first place was slap together a rank 1 and rank 2 to reach 100% resist for just 9 arcanes. If you insist on handling arcanes with a "one size fits all" band aid like this then you're seriously going to #*!% over a lot of people and force them to farm 11 arcanes per status just to reach where they were before the update.

[-TSA-warramssie]

...

 

Dont touch existing arcanes - want to bring in new ones - be our guest !

 

Dont remove self damage and stop babysitting us... people who are too unimaginative to jump into their operator after their Kuva Bramma shot to avoid being blown up, cant be helped, dont punish the rest or the skillfull Tennos.

 

Think and then rethink again about what you are doing, but dont fool us, we know you too long and too well.

[master_of_destiny]

So, there's a lot of potential here.  I'm not holding my breath, but you're finally at least paying lip service to stuff we've requested for years and the comments we made about costs being too high for new players is being addressed.

 

That being said, there are two bits here that I have problems with immediately.  

1) Level 5 arcanes.  You've got three current arcanes that drop at 5% from Eidolon fights.  After 166 Hydrolyst captures and 52 kills (yeah, sometimes the game decides having 4+ lures just isn't enough) I still don't have enough arcanes to max everything to level 3 (even with multiple NIghtwave drops).  You're about to move this to level 5, and let's review the math; 1-level 0, 3-level 1, 6-level 2, 10-level 3, 15-level 4, 21-level 5.  That's following your current pattern of the next level requiring previous+one more than the lest level, and is absolute crap. 

If you are going to pull this you'd better dissolve all of our level 3 arcanes with a script and change the equation, if not I don't think this will be a well accepted change. It's especially apparent that you are penalizing anyone who doesn't already have 2 of each arcance fully maxed out.

I'd suggest each rank requiring 2 more.  This would be 1-0, 3-1, 5-2, 7-3, 9-4, 11-5.  You add in all of the nerfs you've discussed, and the slightly better effects will balance out against the additional required arcane.  I'm going to lose multiple fully ranked arcanes no matter what, so the Scarlet Spear rewards better not be another Infested Boil garbage fest where after the initial event it comes back every 6ish months to justify the otherwise painful grind.

 

2) The reward for building a railjack and being part of the 1.1% of people who dealt with the grind is worth 2 instant repair drones.  What?  You're killing me here.  After three weeks the feedback from railjack was all about the bizarro economy, lack of participation, and the veterans (as you put it) hating exactly how broken this was.  The reward for being your pre-alpha testers is less than 100 platinum worth of instant repair drones, that is only viable if you grind hard enough to get an RNG drop worth repairing.

Exactly whom looked at this idea, and thought this was OK.  It's like flying an airline, missing a connection because the airline delayed your flight, and getting a voucher for $20 off a $80 hotel room because they stranded you in the connecting city.  That is to say, complete and utter crap.  

 

 

If you can say the level 5 arcanes aren't going to make grinding out arcanes garbage all over again, and the railjack's going to get something similar to valence transfer so we can grind past garbage RNG, then I can wait on the rest of it and offer you the benefit of doubt.  Right now though, you've spent a quarter releasing absolute garbage updates and telling us that it's a statistical minority who are angry until your own partners are in revolt.  That's not a great look for a company, and it's severely damaged any good will the past three years have built.  

Your self-styled competition is Fortnite and Bethesda.  You've spent the last 6 months doing crap that mirrors Bethesda, and releasing updates which hope to have been half baked.  You've tried to be Fortnite, and Nightwave has demonstrated you simply aren't willing to invest that kind of energy into constant content delivery.  It's really time to stop giving us half answers you think we'll like, because our good will and acceptance of them at face value is disappearing because you've proven we can't trust you.  

I'm not going to plead with you to course correct.  At this point it'll only take another few months of this to bring you back to where you were before PoE.  If you have spent all of these years to get nowhere...fine.  DE will be remembered as the people who made Battlefront with mobile style cosmetic transactions and the stability of Warcraft III Reforged.  That's a pretty sad look.

Edited February 29, 2020 by master_of_destiny
Did the math wrong, rectifying.

[vaisso]

Don't do unnecessary nerf even though the game is losing people.

[XaoGarrent]

10 minutes ago, Descent-of-Damocles said:

ARCANE NERFS

The arcane nerfs are WAY TOO SEVERE. The fact you can no longer stack 2 sets is already a nerf because we're effectively losing 25% of maximizing something we want. Despite DE's desire to encourage diversity, this is ENFORCING DIVERSITY. At first I thought this means I can put in Grace and Energize, but after reading the changes, they just mean Energize will no longer restore energy while channeling, which is the only reason people use it. The cooldown is just insult to injury. Grace cannot be reprocced isnt a big nerf, but it already loses 25% potential healing when it was double stacked, and that guaranteed window of not healing. Usually I get healed for 6 seconds after hiding, but now I might potentially get 0 seconds of healing by the time I get out of danger. Lastly Aegis might as well be deleted from the game if it becomes that 1 stat nobody mods for.

If Energize has duration and has cooldown, this means I CANNOT USE ENERGIZE WITH CHANNELING FRAMES, and DO NOT PICK UP ENERGY ORBS DURING COOLDOWN
Grace does not refresh means GRACE WILL NOW ENCOURAGE ME TO HIDE ON PROCC TO HEAL AND ATTACK WHEN EXPIRED or permanently play Rhino
Aegis is now shield recharge... whatever, aegis was niche anyways

WHAT ARCANES SHOULD BE

1. The no double stacking, and rank 5 arcanes was a good idea. 1.5 times effectiveness means we're trading 25% of what we used to have for new combination builds.
2. Don't add the nerfs to LEGENDARY arcanes if you dont intend to reduce its rarity while increasing its cost to maximize.
3. Absolutely do not buff and nerf different things in the same patch. Making last place competitive and first place non-competitive means no competition
4. Move weapon related arcanes to the actual weapons themselves. Having a warframe modded with arcanes for shotguns really ties frames to certain guns, and that's the opposite of what you want. Kit guns used to be the best pistols because you get the same gun as any gun, a single riven fits many combinations, and a free arcane slot which can be used to get infinite ammo or bonus damage. Other weapons can't compete when certain weapons have an arcane advantage and some do not
5. EITHER WAY, YOU NEED TO COMPLETELY AND FAIRLY REWORK THE ENTIRE ARCANE SYSTEM because 2 nerfs do not make a buff

SHOTGUN NERFS, (you did exactly what you said you didn't want)

If you're tripling the status chance, but dividing by the number of pellets, then why are you buffing status? Take a look at the Strun wraith which has 10 base pellets. After the change, it will have 3 times status, but divided by 10 pellets. This means it went from 100% status per pellet to probably 30% status-per-pellet b/c a 100% prior status-per-pellet chance is now 300% with the buff, but divided by 10 to 30%. That is to say, You've now made the shotgun go from 100%→100% to that broken 99%→30% which YOU DIDN'T WANT IN THE FIRST PLACE.

STRUN WRAITH (40% base) old 100%→100% vs new 744%→74.4%

(assuming all status mods currently possible are used) Fully modding strun wraith with all status mods Motus Setup+Nano Applicator+Shotgun Savvy (90%)+60/60*4 = 520%. Thats 248%*3 = 744% UI status, now divide by 10 pellets for 74.4% per pellet status. I'm using more status mods, and getting less status chance.

CORINTH (12% base) old 67.2%→17% vs new 223.2%→37.2%

(assuming all status mods currently possible are used) Motus Setup+Nano Applicator+Shotgun Savy (30%)+60/60*4 = 460%. That's 67.2% UI status chance and 1-(1-0.672)^(1/6) = 17% status chance per pellet. Now taking the new system into account Motus Setup+Nano Applicator+Shotgun Savy (90%)+60/60*4 = 520%. That's 74.4*3 = 223.2% UI status and 37.2% per pellet status

Also, how does Kohm work? 3 times status but divided by 4 pellets is still an overall status-per-pellet nerf. But, then at full spool, we see 3 times status, but divided by 12, which is just unrecoverable. From what was shown on stream, Corinth has 6% status per pellet. It currently has 12% UI status chance, which makes sense when you multiply by 3 and divide by 6 pellets, it makes sense that it shows 6% per pellet. What you've introduced is now a preference for single pellet shotguns (slugs) and that pretty much means a sniper rifles, which isn't known for effective status weapons. You've added a layer of obscurity because status chance ≠ per pellet status chance ≠ actual status chance

WHAT SHOTGUNS SHOULD BE

1. Whatever we see in the UI as of now, should already be the status-per-pellet already. No need to add a useless 3x multiplier if it divides by a pellet count we can neither see, control, nor benefit from.

 

 

At least someone sees what a dumpster fire this is.

This is a trojan horse patch, people. They want you to focus on the scaling and self damage while they go around nerfing everything the players love but the devs do not. This patch will NOT be good for the "long term health" of the game.

[(XBOX)HollowCube987]

Enemy shield gates are a good idea because they can be bypassed with well placed shots. However, I have the request that only special units gain shields. There are regular shields, and proto shields. Seeing as proto shields are stronger and more advanced, shield gates should be given to enemies that own proto shields, instead of every corpus enemy.

[Haenohalanodien]

Quote

Excavation missions have had the same property since launch: all Excavators have 500 Shield, 2500 Health no matter the mission level. As of our coming PC mainline update, both Health and Shields will scale following the same formula as Mobile Defense Terminals. Shield Regeneration of Excavators will be a percent of health vs. flat value to deal with scaling shields. 

Soo, did they fire [DE]Glen? 🤔

[login0false]

7 часов назад, Voltage сказал:

Multiple intermissions in a row with different rewards would be more enjoyable than half a year of the same intermission while waiting for a story from Nora Night.

Except for those who take frequent breaks from Warframe or just don't play consistently. Rather than starting a new Intermission every so often, I'd rather have them appended to the existing ones to allow players to catch up - or, even better, allow multiple Intermissions to run so players can choose which one to work towards.

[(PSN)Briginds]

I think the arcane changes are ridiculous. Considering many players invested platinum to buy these sets only to have 1 of each viable and nerfed at that ? The cooldown on energize is downright robbery and energy starving. Now for players to keep up energy costs, they have to construct hundreds to thousands of energy pads. 

 

If you're gonna nerf energize, add a higher capacity for energy pads in the gear wheel. That's just plain ridiculous. You're essentially aiming to ruin energy hungry builds. No one runs efficiency with energize due to the waste of a slot that's involved. 

 

Alot of players will be incredibly displeased due to this, and I for one am part of the displeased players. As for the other cooldowns, that's a slap to the face for people who spent hours of grinding 2 sets of specific arcanes to perfect their builds. Very illogical move on the arcane nerfs. If you're gonna nerf arcanes and remove dual, the least you can do is forget remove the cooldown before it procs again. 

 

As for everything else, shotguns included, I can't say I'm unhappy about it other than corpus no longer getting one shot by us, that doesn't make sense to me. 

 

[tigerbeatsdragon]

2 Clarification questions about shotguns:

1. Is status over 200 percent going to do anything? if the OVERALL status of the strun wraith is tripled like stated above it will be able to reach over 400 percent status. Will this still be a double proc? or is this going to become a quadruple proc much like a red crit being better than an orange crit (as far as i know there is also another red crit level above the first which can only really be feasably reached by harrow (ie dread with full harrow buff =325 percent crit on head shots) which would be the equivalent of a quadruple proc at 400 percent status).

2. Is double proccing determined by overall status or status per pellet? If it is determined by status per pellet most shotguns wont get anywhere near 100 percent unless its the exergis resulting in MASSIVE nerfs.

[o1517]

Hi all. While the news sounds good(it is) This player is slower, playing at my pace, 63 % of solar system in over a year, all planets open, void and derelicts. Yes I know some people do it in 40 days. But play mostly solo and do try all events, don't always finish them but try. I do have large solo dojo and built railjack (6 million credits, bought sold and traded for) at great cost and hours,RNG mostly solo. Also am not hesitant to purchase or trade necessary mods and equipment if it will help me do mission. Read a lot and you tube, steep learning curve. Please DE remember some of us are heavily into game, balance is good, progress is good. Still learning all that crit and status and stuff. Thanks for everything. from fellow tenno. 🙂

[(PSN)willitical]

 arcane detox and resistance is the same thing, and electric resistance isn't on here, is this a error? hopefully one of those was supposed to be electric resistance, that kuva defense is a nightmare for those afraid of electric shocks, "this is a shocking experience" 

[Rad_CRAZY_MAN]

I worry that the squad link will be less than stellar at launch. Who will be on the ground if everyone and their grandma is on the RJ running the event?

[Daxidol]

Arcane Energize
On Rank 5: On Energy Pickup
60% chance to replenish Energy to nearby Allies
Added duration and Cooldown added (cannot re-trigger while active).

Please DON'T have the duration on it (will stop it working for channeling skills?), if it can't activate on channeling it'll kill its use for something like Titania. Honestly, Energize is the only thing that makes my Titania usable and you're specifically saying you want more people to play her.

The cooldown is fine, just needs to be able to work while in Razorwing.

Edited February 29, 2020 by Daxidol

[(PSN)willitical]

2 minutes ago, Daxidol said:

Arcane Energize
On Rank 5: On Energy Pickup
60% chance to replenish Energy to nearby Allies
Added duration and Cooldown added (cannot re-trigger while active).

Please DON'T have the duration on it (will stop it working for channeling skills), if it can't activate on channeling it'll kill its use for something like Titania. Honestly, Energize is the only thing that makes my Titania usable and you're specifically saying you want more people to play her.

The cooldown is fine, just needs to be able to work while in Razorwing.

channeld abilities in general needs energize to be effective, it should definitely work differently on warframes with said abilities so they can consistently give energy, maybe reduce cooldown with those active so it can work properly, if not energize will be guarbage and the ppl will not be happy 

[RyAn0099]

Where is the "Nightwave intermission deadline announced"