Removal Of Self Damage

[GPrime96]

28 minutes ago, (XB1)EternalDrk Mako said:

for the 99.9% of players this is HUGE, why ? cause weapons we would otherwise NEVER touch at high levels , can now be used for play and utilize for actual "FUN" and or "functional/tactics" for builds and not worry about blowing themselves up and doing near nothing to enemies and feeling revulsion for those types.

FTFY

[HealingMind]

My condolences to people that farm Eidolons and like the 2% of people that use Chroma outside of Eidolons. It was a rough change for them all, but at the end of the day, Chroma was almost guaranteed a fall from grace at some point. He's always been a buff with legs that shoots bosses, with not much else he can do, and this indirect nerf really shows how little Chroma can really stand on his own 2 feet.

Now, Chroma's in a peculiar position. He CAN get a rework, but it's highly likely Vex Armor, as it works in the game, will get very heavily nerfed during it, if not outright replaced, meaning the big reason everyone picked him will be gone, possibly pushing him further into obscurity. But if he never gets looked at, his job security is now threatened by everyone's favorite frame, Rhino, and he risks also falling into the same pit. I pray, at the very least, a good warframe comes out the other end of this process, but it's not likely the one that does eventually emerge will be the Chroma everyone knows and uses for Bossing.

Besides that, I really like this change, while there are weapons in which self damage is justifiable for the power it has, so many more vastly underperform, and have been even before power creep really started taking off. The reward for the risk you take was simply not enough to justify using due to pretty much every gun people commonly used having a much greater reward for much less, or virtually no risk to the user, so the self-damaging aspect of certain weapons just seemed completely random, like if the Gaze head drained 1HP per second of use or something. You can work around the downside, but that doesn't make it any less random on the lion's share of self-damaging weapons in the game.

[Ham_Grenabe]

There wasn't much risk or reward to self-damage weapons; it's removal hardly seems worth more than a passing "Oh."

[Aldain]

1 hour ago, Ham_Grenabe said:

There wasn't much risk or reward to self-damage weapons; it's removal hardly seems worth more than a passing "Oh."

Especially when several Warframes could drop an energy pizza, press 4 and do the same thing through walls (depending on the frame).

[8faiNt]

2 minutes ago, Aldain said:

Especially when several Warframes could drop an energy pizza, press 4 and do the same thing through walls (depending on the frame).

well... you just dropped a bomb.

[844448]

15 hours ago, (PS4)beams20 said:

Taking self damage out well just result in everyone running Kuva bramma ruining game play. No weapon has it damage so why use anything else as it has no down side now

There's still some downside where you will be thrown away like a ragdoll if you're too close so enjoy being thrown away while others killing them

[TheLexiConArtist]

10 hours ago, TheLexiConArtist said:

I'm going to throw more numbers out here. Forgive me if I missed something while scanning the list but it's illustrative of the point regardless.

Net gain for removing self damage:
  8 / 242 (~3.3%) completely dumb-firing explosives become no challenge to use.
12 / 242 (~4.9%) triggered / delayed / distance-arming explosives become even more trivial. _{(I think it's 12? Counting things like the Zhuge Prime and from what I vaguely recall, the Corinth alt fire having arm-distance self-damage.)}

Less than 10% of the primary+secondary weapons in the game get any sort of benefit. Less than 4% were 'unforgiving' to begin with.

Net gain for keeping self damage:
8 / 8 (100%) of high-risk weapons keep their high-risk playstyle for players who wish to engage with it.
12 / 12 (100%) of mid-risk, more forgiving weapons keep their middle-ground playstyle for players who like a little spice with a safety net.
222/242 (91.7%) of weapons without associated personal risk stay available for players who DO NOT like putting themselves at risk.

 

Why should greed for <10% of the available weapons remove 100% of the risky player's gameplay?

[ZhouDraconis]

Half the fun of some weapons is the fact you have to be mindful, and you are living on a razor's edge of death... so no way.

[Danielw8]

Everyone saying chroma is meta because eidolon hunts, and the actual meta of eidolon hunts is volt + redeemer, for newbie hunters or people with 5k caps

Newbie: Requires less formas, easy to play solo/randoms

Pros: You are almost no wasting pads in the entire run, one shooting everything playing with volt+redeemer

Chroma is the best warframe for profit taker, but in profit taker you are not using self damage weapons, you not need that, not worth to use

Im sure chroma will be reworked soon (TM) , because like i said at this moment every single chroma in this game just use 3º ability, and only 3º ability, maybe sometimes 2º so for fun

 

 

[AzureTerra]

meta's come and go on player whims.

[MPonder]

I'm seeing some hicocrisy on this topic, Chroma is not the one that trivialize content in Warframe, and trivializing content is what most people do in Warframe,

[-ViperStrike-]

On 2020-02-28 at 4:41 PM, 8faiNt said:

It will ruin chroma's gameplay on eidolon hunt.

It is great for casual gameplay.

Do you like it?

discuss...

That made it look like the problem is so mono-dimensional, when It will ruin difficulty too, it will ruin the challenge (the little we have left) it will ruin the logic of overpowered explosive weapons. That's multidimensional problem.

[(XBOX)EternalDrk Mako]

23 hours ago, GPrime96 said:

FTFY

naw i wouldnt touch it at any level if it kills me 

[(XBOX)EternalDrk Mako]

23 hours ago, 8faiNt said:

If they're taking away something I expect them to replace that very thing. AKA rework for chroma.

this isnt about replacing the role of chroma in eidolon, DPS is already the most changable role. the thing that bothers me and many chroma players is that it is not reliable to trust enemy hit to get your buff.

He was already asked for rework for many times. This is their chance to rework Chroma to be better.

sure he will get a fix just like the other # of frames waiting for an overhal , rework, touchup

see it in 2 week or 4 years timespan 

[Fluiid]

Removal of self damage is really bad. Using those weapons before required some awareness in game and no chill farmer could use it. but now they made it just an ez weapon to use just like the rest of the weapons. I believe with removing the self damage they will remove an amount of focus while u had playing. You have to be more alarming when using with self damage i believe removing it will remove the fun out of playing with this weapons. It will be easier for beginners for sure but for old players i believe it will be less fun to make kuva bramma as safe as paris when shooting.😶

[Nesodos]

9 hours ago, Fluiid said:

Removal of self damage is really bad. Using those weapons before required some awareness in game and no chill farmer could use it. but now they made it just an ez weapon to use just like the rest of the weapons. I believe with removing the self damage they will remove an amount of focus while u had playing. You have to be more alarming when using with self damage i believe removing it will remove the fun out of playing with this weapons. It will be easier for beginners for sure but for old players i believe it will be less fun to make kuva bramma as safe as paris when shooting.😶

Old players tend to do endgame stuff.

A single knockback from a close range explosion will expose you long enough to get downed when facing endgame enemies.

[Straifey]

I WANT MY LENZ SELF DESTRUCTING BACK HOW AM I SUPPOSED TO GET BETTER WITH THE LENZ IF I CAN'T KILL MY SELF, like come on self damage/suicide made it more fun for me just change 99% self damage resistance and make it 100% percent so i can one shot myself as long as it's not equipped 

[DSAUSAGE]

2020/3/1 AM1点51分 , (XB1)EternalDrk Mako 说:

for the 99.9% of players this is HUGE, why ? cause weapons we would otherwise NEVER touch , can now be used for play and utilize for actual "FUN" and or "functional/tactics" for builds and not worry about blowing themselves up and doing near nothing to enemies and feeling revulsion for those types. its a huge change up and even provides us with a back flip exit strategy to get away from enemies that are close

yes, yes

huge fall off and stagger all days are very fun

and Primed Surefooted is tactics, sure it is.

[RFaul]

It was a terrible move at least to me. Even weapons that did not do self damage gained the the stagger drawback like Staticor. For now the only one worth the trouble is Bramma, as if it wasn't getting enough player attention before the change. Sad.

[(PSN)Kakurine2]

Just let stuff smack you around as chroma rather then cheesing vex armor with self damage.

Its not game breaking. I would rather have the stagger then my gun blowing me up because of random bs.

[Acos]

Sometimes the Chroma has to shoot the Eidolon twice now, so he's completely ruined. 

*EDIT- I don't, on paper, disagree with removing self damage. What I wasn't expecting & what really VEXES me is that they added stagger to weapons that weren't really designed with them in mind for seemingly no reason. 

Edited April 14, 2020 by Acos

[(PSN)Kakurine2]

6 minutes ago, Acos said:

Sometimes the Chroma has to shoot the Eidolon twice now, so he's completely ruined. 

*EDIT- I don't, on paper, disagree with removing self damage. What I wasn't expecting & what really VEXES me is that they added stagger to weapons that weren't really designed with them in mind for seemingly no reason. 

That i agree adding stagger to things that didn't have self damage before was dum.

But some weapons not blowing up in my face or not cheesing chroma is s welcome change in my book.

[UltraMex]

Funny enough, with the removal of self damage, i use Chroma and Rhino more often now due to Chroma/Rhino damage boost and Rhino ability to prevent stagger.

[(XBOX)EternalDrk Mako]

13 hours ago, DSAUSAGE said:

yes, yes

huge fall off and stagger all days are very fun

and Primed Surefooted is tactics, sure it is.

nice nekro?

also never said to use suicidal tactics and point blank fire your explosive weapon 🙄also, you dont need surefooted if you understand your explosives range and behavior? 

dosnt take much to figure out you shouldnt fire an explosive close to yourself 🙃 especially since you know it causes stagger, like putting hand in fire, just dont do it?  

honestly I never had any issues myself, ive even been using them to dodge and move out of incoming attacks at will, but I guess im more adaptable?