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The devs arcane "diversity" problem


(PSN)piroburst1
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This is not hard.  I do not understand why the devs make this harder than it is.  If you want players to use a variety of arcanes GIVE US A REASON TO DO SO.  Nerfing "top end" arcanes will not make anyone use "low end" arcanes.  I'm not just going to randomly throw arcane pulse on my builds now.  Case and point, arcane nullifer.  Who was running arcane nullifer before eidolons?  We had 0 reason to use it and then all of the sudden it because super viable because important content made use of it.  WE NEED A VARIETY OF CONTENT TO USE A VARIETY OF MODS/ARCANES.  This does not just apply to arcanes, it applies to everything in the game from weapons to focus schools to archwings.   

 

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1 minute ago, trst said:

Arcanes are being buffed, stacking is being nerfed.

And if an arcane needed to be stacked to be useful then the issue is with the arcane itself.

The meta arcane are actually being nerfed. While the stats are going to be higher, they added cool downs on some. 

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This is not hard.  I do not understand why the devs make this harder than it is.  If you want players to use a variety of arcanes GIVE US A REASON TO DO SO.  Nerfing "top end" arcanes will not make anyone use "low end" arcanes.  I'm not just going to randomly throw arcane pulse on my builds now.  Case and point, arcane nullifer.  Who was running arcane nullifer before eidolons?  We had 0 reason to use it and then all of the sudden it because super viable because important content made use of it.  WE NEED A VARIETY OF CONTENT TO USE A VARIETY OF MODS/ARCANES.  This does not just apply to arcanes, it applies to everything in the game from weapons to focus schools to archwings. 

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20 minutes ago, trst said:

Arcanes are being buffed, stacking is being nerfed.

And if an arcane needed to be stacked to be useful then the issue is with the arcane itself.

I mentioned nothing about what particulars they are doing.  I'm speaking only to the reason they gave which is trying to somehow create more use of less used arcanes.  

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Joke's on you, I use arcane warmth on my looter limbo because corpus maps have gotten exploding ice cryo barrels,and having an 80% chance not to get hit by a proc while spamming cataclysm does help out with the mission time. All they need is make nullifier block non proc ancient disruptor attacks(and the attacks of infested who are buffed by its aura). No need to add content that absolutely requires any individual piece of gear. It just needs to be convenient enough to use, or inconvenient enough not to use.

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16 minutes ago, (PS4)piroburst1 said:

This is not hard.  I do not understand why the devs make this harder than it is.  If you want players to use a variety of arcanes GIVE US A REASON TO DO SO.  Nerfing "top end" arcanes will not make anyone use "low end" arcanes. 

K first of all chill yer anus, Its a multi layer issue, we got arcanes that are complete garbo, arcanes that are basically the auto-picks cause the cover the most important things, just like why its a norm to use the raw damage mod, the multi shot mod and 2 elemental mods on all but the most savvy of niche builds for particular content). Not to mention the fact that everyone has gotten used to running infinite energy & immortality builds that they are spoiled by it.

In all honesty, they had 2 ways that could of been the deep end. Either force us to have a OFFENSIVE and a DEFENSIVE slots for the 2 arcanes so we cant stack grace & energize, Grace & Guardian, etc. etc. etc. you get the point. This would force us to stick to one of those mods and the other for a damage arcane, which as you basically stated: We needed low-end mods to actually be worth a damn.

The OTHER way would of been them just giving us 3 slots to utterly break the thing alone, with maybe stacking the first one on top so we got offensive, defensive and utility. With stuff like Guardian and grace in defensive, energize in utility and stuff like momentum and acceleration and similar arcanes that `boost DPS` for that slot.

Either way, D.E. decided to take the safe approach by removing stacking but give us the option to still equip 2 arcanes but we can go up to 1.5x higher then what value it currently has, which pretty much makes certain arcanes even more busted. People can say double Arcane Grace means your invincible but unless your running something like a Valkyr level of armor, i will gladly take Grace+Guardian on my frames that do not need energize to enjoy the easy study setup on even semi-squish frames.

Plus before you start biotching about it, Wait for the god damn full stats to be revealed(especially the cooldown), if its 3~5 seconds then its going to matter sheet for things like grace, where the new max rank version should of jumped up quite a bit more extra regen up to nearly half a warframe`s max health. Which if these CDes are short enough, they likely will not matter if the duration of said arcanes is much longer then the cooldowns, especially for ones like Grace & Guardian.

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I'm not just going to randomly throw arcane pulse on my builds now.  Case and point, arcane nullifer.  Who was running arcane nullifer before eidolons? 

The status resist arcanes were useful picks for sortie with certain modifier bonuses, but lets be honest, SORTIE barely served as a reason to use them when we had frames who can straight up give status immunity like Oberon in the old days and for the savy ones, Titania just blessing people wth immunity.

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We had 0 reason to use it and then all of the sudden it because super viable because important content made use of it.  WE NEED A VARIETY OF CONTENT TO USE A VARIETY OF MODS/ARCANES.  This does not just apply to arcanes, it applies to everything in the game from weapons to focus schools to archwings. 

Same could be said that a culling needs to occur on alot of mods and arcanes that are 100% never going to be used unless the can be put in the exilus slot. Which self-damage weapons just got freed from cautious shot for more flight momentum mods instead. Well it would certainly help if some more `offensive` arcanes had more useful ones like procing multi shot off of reload, giving faster reload speed on other gun types then just sniper rifles on crits or status procs, plus some more unique kinds for the warframes. Since a good deal of the new ones like healing to your pet when you do a thing is kind of redundant when it should be when your pet does damage it has a high proc chance to give you OVER-SHIELDS based on the damage it dealt.

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Screw Itzal blink, just make the grapple better so it can be used more like a spiderman swing where you can end it instantly to use its momentum for propellant. Though i certainly would like intrinstics to affect normal gameplay and the blink cd intrinstic to get buffed a bit more, to maybe 40% C.D.R.

Edited by Avienas
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Just now, Midas said:

You ever heard of balancing.

Is arcane pulse going on your builds? arcane resistance maybe?  The point is because of the nature of arcanes no matter how much a low used arcane is "buffed" it will still not see use because the effect that it triggers is not applicable.  Again this is not a post about what specifically they are doing to arcanes it is about the underlying reason that they gave for the changes.

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1 minute ago, (PS4)piroburst1 said:

Is arcane pulse going on your builds? arcane resistance maybe?  The point is because of the nature of arcanes no matter how much a low used arcane is "buffed" it will still not see use because the effect that it triggers is not applicable.  Again this is not a post about what specifically they are doing to arcanes it is about the underlying reason that they gave for the changes.

Right now the problem is it is tier based, those arcanes are for younger players via nightwave etc.. We need reforms towards arcane as a whole.

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7 minutes ago, AuroraSonicBoom said:

Joke's on you, I use arcane warmth on my looter limbo because corpus maps have gotten exploding ice cryo barrels,and having an 80% chance not to get hit by a proc while spamming cataclysm does help out with the mission time. All they need is make nullifier block non proc ancient disruptor attacks(and the attacks of infested who are buffed by its aura). No need to add content that absolutely requires any individual piece of gear. It just needs to be convenient enough to use, or inconvenient enough not to use.

What your saying is such a none factor it's almost not worth mentioning.  I commend you on finding an interesting use case that fits your playstyle.  However on a macro scale it's not being used and the majority of players just bypass barrels to the point that it makes arcane warmth show as a statistically unused arcane.

Edited by (PS4)piroburst1
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Having those 80% chance to resist arcanes going to 100% at level 5 is a great buff which reduces the need to double stack those. In the cases where you ran 2 different arcanes, they should both now be 50% better so it's a buff there.

The real negatives are the cooldowns they forced in for some of them along with you not being able to double up anymore.

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Certain arcanes like Nullifier doing their job with only one slot is something I can dig, nerfing energize proc, well, Zenurik still rules, finally a reason to equip anti-radiation arcanes on sorties if they can stop 100% radiation hazards for example, barrier, grace and all of those have a very small % of activation so I see no reason to nerf them, in fact shield gating can make them quite powerful for squishy frames with high shields.

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3 hours ago, (PS4)piroburst1 said:

Who was running arcane nullifer before eidolons?  We had 0 reason to use it and then all of the sudden it because super viable because important content made use of it.  

Me. I use arcane nullifier on loki/limbo for grineer spy and all the other frames for general gameplay. 

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