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Build diversity


diaversai
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This was going to be a reply to the dev changes, but it got pretty long, so I'm making it it's own topic. Overall, I'm excited for the new mainline. I don't mind the changes to arcanes, and a bunch of QoL that was needed is getting added. That said, the devs talk a lot about diversity, but the view seems pretty narrow to to me. Like, there's too much focus on the analytics of what mod/arcane gets used, and Warframe to me feels pretty diverse for an entirely different reason, and that's that generally I use a different frame for each different mission type and a lot of them have weapons specific for the frame. As an example:

Spy - Ivara
Excavation/Survival - Nekros/Khora (I just like more power cells to drop)
Capture/sabotage - Whatever I'm on at the time
Exterminate - Volt/Saryn/Mesa/Equinox (depends on the nightwave/my mood/mob level)
Defense - Nova
Mobile defense - Nova/Limbo/Inaros (vazarin)
Disruption - Depends on which faction. 
Defection - Oberon
Assassination - Depending on the boss.
Rescue - whatever, depends on if it's a sortie rescue or not. Sorties in general, I tend to have a lot of variety.
Eidolons - Trinity
Profit taker - Chroma
Exploiter - Octavia
Index - Rhino

Is that every frame? No, of course not. Some frames, I just don't like the feel of. I don't understand Ash and Loki at all, for example. And others, I just haven't developed a need for, but I feel like my gameplay is pretty diverse, even if the specific mods aren't. Mods aren't really the thing that excites me about the game. It's the feel of the frame, and I don't care that most frames end up using Continuity, and you're using Serration on every primary. That's all set it and forget it, and I don't feel restricted because of that.

Honestly, the biggest things that impact my feel of the game are nullifiers, mobs that do lethal damage, and proc immune mobs.  And I'll go into a little detail about that before ending this rambling post. 

1. Nullifiers, particularly the melee nullifiers in disruption, just negate your frame. So, I don't tend to bring Rhino/Chroma to disruption or Saryn to arbitration. There's just too much stopping your frame from working for that to be worthwhile.
2. Lethal damage, particularly Kuva Liches. That throw in melee range one shots most frames. I think it got fixed, but when I died from that one shot, the Lich ran away, so mostly I just used Inaros for this HP pool. 
3. Proc immune mobs. Same thing as nullifiers except Chroma/Rhino tend to get used more here. Something like, the Wolf of Saturn Six was a good example. If you can't use powers on it, just pump damage as high as you can, and then call it a day. Preferably, while also being invincible. 

I don't even think any of these are bad for the game, except maybe proc immune mobs. They're pretty boring. I'd rather they have clever mechanics, but everything has a work around, and those work arounds ARE diversity, even if I'm using Vitality on every frame. (Which, I'm not)

tl;dr: Game modes are the biggest influence on diversity, and I don't think that the mods on your frame/weapons actually impact diversity at all.  

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1 hour ago, diaversai said:

Like, there's too much focus on the analytics of what mod/arcane gets used,

I completely disagree with you. Warframe has a massive playerbase, so using actual statistics to do your analysis should be the first thing that is considered to detect and resolve problems. Next thing to consider could be the perception of problems, which they get from forums, reddit, angry tickets, etc.

1 hour ago, diaversai said:

and that's that generally I use a different frame for each different mission type and ... [mission types + warframes]

I understand your feelings on the matter; you have preferences for certain frames, as do I and everyone else. Everyone can have a different opinion on whether or not frames are diverse or not, depending on the strength of some frames. If, for example, a frame gets released that does the same thing as 5 different frames but better, it might not affect you if you don't like the way it looks so you never play it. Meanwhile, everyone else is demanding buffs for the other frames only to be inevitably disapointed when DE does the easier (arguably sensible) choice of just nerfing that one frame.  

1 hour ago, diaversai said:

but I feel like my gameplay is pretty diverse, [but mods aren't]

You're comparing 2 different things that shouldn't be compared at the same time against each other. YOUR gameplay is subjective and can be true for you. Mods being diverse is not as subjective. Either you accept that the 8-16 viable mods per rifle/pistol, or 10-20 per warframe/melee weapon is diverse enough, or it is not.  Gameplay modes =/= statistical tinkering.

I'm not sure what you're getting at. You say DE is focusing too much on the data of mods / arcanes, say that you like frames and think they're diverse, then say that mods aren't diverse. If you think mods and arcanes aren't diverse enough, shouldn't you want DE to focus on them MORE to make them diverse? Is diversity even your goal to begin with? What exactly is the point you're trying to make? Are you trying to make a point at all or are you just rambling?

1 hour ago, diaversai said:

tl;dr: Game modes are the biggest influence on diversity,

If this is your final point then I guess yeah, the game decides how diverse the game wants to be. I feel like this is equivalent to you saying, "if you are able to do more things in the game, then you need different tools to do different things." I probably sound more condescending than I'm trying to be, and I'm sorry that this is just over text. I helped students write English essays in college so figuring out what people are trying to say can be tricky sometimes. Especially if English isn't their first language. Please help me understand if you were trying to say something different.

1 hour ago, diaversai said:

I don't think that the mods on your frame/weapons actually impact diversity at all.

Diversity of what? The game? Again are you saying mods aren't diverse? You can have a personal opinion, but I think they are generally diverse with literally hundreds if not a thousand+ total mods, . DE specifically describes diversity as having the [reasonable] option to choose different things to play the game. Arcanes were explicitly not diverse, most of them were useless and they sucked. If we're going back to your first point, are you saying DE shouldn't focus on them? 

Lets break that down a bit more simply: "Mods impact diversity", or, "mods don't impact diversity." How? Why? What is diversity to you? Is that good or bad either way? 

Edit: Your title is build diversity but it sounds like you're saying builds don't matter, only the game modes do. What?

Edited by doominator10
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