Warframe Revised: >100% Status Chance / Shotgun Megathread

[Robolaser]

Hi, i've read here and on reddit heated discussions about wether the Phantasma beams can each proc status individually and simultaneously, like a shotgun would, or not, like a beam weapon would instead. So i've recorded a short video of a test with the firerate lowered to 1 (instead of its base 12) using a riven and critical deceleration, for better clarity:

https://streamable.com/2ox6v

As you can see, the beams definitely don't proc separate statuses individually. The phantasma does indeed act like a regular beam weapon. All beams are merged into one, proccing 1 status effect at a time. Thus, it should not have received the same treatment as regular shotguns, and should have, at the very least, kept it's 37% status chances.

Edited March 24, 2020 by Robolaser

[Aadi880]

RIP build diversity.

Now, its nothing but viral against every faction, yes, including the infested.

Though, knowing you, you'd rather nerf viral instead of making any of the other status effects better.

 

[thurmack]

6 hours ago, Aadi880 said:

RIP build diversity.

Now, its nothing but viral against every faction, yes, including the infested.

Though, knowing you, you'd rather nerf viral instead of making any of the other status effects better.

 

Whether or not they improve other status effects they probably should nerf viral. You seem to agree it's overpowered, given that it even works well against Infested, so why would you object?

Frankly the same applies to the 100% shotgun status issue; they essentially fixed a bug that allowed players to make overpowered shotgun builds. This came to a head when they introduced stacking statuses for all status procs so the urgency to fix it ramped up.

Don't get me wrong, to some extent they left shotguns alone because the 100% jump compensated for a general weakness of the weapon type, and maybe they didn't do enough to balance shotguns so I think this feedback thread is important, but I don't get all the grumbling about nerfing content that needs to be nerfed. We want the game to be challenging, don't we?

[warmastercain]

Congrats de every shotgun is still useless without 100% per pellet only 1 benefited from this but it's still trash now buff exergis's cc and cd to 24% and 2.2x crit to save it 

[(PSN)Irmao2Vigilante]

hi @thurmack

I believe the majority of posts commenting about viral agree it needs nerf. Viral became too overpower.

[(PSN)Irmao2Vigilante]

9 hours ago, Robolaser said:

Hi, i've read here and on reddit heated discussions about wether the Phantasma beams can each proc status individually and simultaneously, like a shotgun would, or not, like a beam weapon would instead. So i've recorded a short video of a test with the firerate lowered to 1 (instead of its base 12) using a riven and critical deceleration, for better clarity:

https://streamable.com/2ox6v

As you can see, the beams definitely don't proc separate statuses individually. The phantasma does indeed act like a regular beam weapon. All beams are merged into one, proccing 1 status effect at a time. Thus, it should not have received the same treatment as regular shotguns, and should have, at the very least, kept it's 37% status chances.

I agree. Beam weapons had and have distinct dynamic, astilla as well therefore they should be treated differently

[SprinKah]

Make Blast procs knock down enemies again! Knockdowns should still be an option for loadouts. 

I understand that not a whole lot of people like knocking down and stunning enemies because of how annoying it is to kill with them

But we should still have it as an option in our loadout.

Blast before the status changes wasn't used very much as a manual combo, but it was a good crowd control bonus that came with many weapons, especially launchers.

Plus, it makes sense that Blast causes knock downs because...explosions.

Make it so that 1 Blast proc = accuracy loss, 2 blast procs = accuracy loss and AoE knockdown. Or something similar or just pretty ANYTHING more than what it offers...the accuracy decrease does pretty much barely anything. i'd say Impact is better than Blast right now. 

Without the knockdowns from Blast, many launcher weapons still do decent work but they feel rather underwhelming to use.

Edited March 24, 2020 by SprinKah

[Dragazer]

16 hours ago, Aadi880 said:

RIP build diversity.

Now, its nothing but viral against every faction, yes, including the infested.

Though, knowing you, you'd rather nerf viral instead of making any of the other status effects better.

All that needs to be done:

Corrosive 1st proc 45% armor removed, subsequent procs add 5% more capping at 90% armor removed at 10 stacks.

Gas give the DoT elemental mod scaling with heat and toxin mods and maybe give it back triple dip with faction mods.

[Hellmaker2004]

1 hour ago, Dragazer said:

All that needs to be done:

Corrosive 1st proc 45% armor removed, subsequent procs add 5% more capping at 90% armor removed at 10 stacks.

Gas give the DoT elemental mod scaling with heat and toxin mods and maybe give it back triple dip with faction mods.

I like the 45% on first proc. And the 5% after that Capping at 90%.

Makes it start of faster and have a higher cap, yet still limited to the 10 stacks, however.

I do not like it removing armor at the 10 stack.

Corrosive vs Ferrite deals +75% Damage and ignores 75% of their armor.
This means at 90% Armor reduced, with the Corrosive additional effect it will
VS Ferrite Armor Type
+75% Damage
Ignore up to a total of 97.5% Of the Targets Armor.

So they would have to have quite a bit of armor to counteract the +75% Damage.

It is a bit different vs the Alloy Armor Type, but Corrosive should not be the be all go all Element either, having it work like this could also promote teamwork.

Someone on the team apply Corrosive, removing up to 90% Of enemy Armor, then vs Alloy Armor a teammate with Radiation could shoot, dealing +75% Damage and ignoring a additional 75%, making it ignore up to a total of 97.5% of armor, or ignoring up to 98.75% If they also have Burning Status effect.

[(PSN)Krikenemp]

On 2020-03-15 at 5:18 PM, Andele3025 said:

And the point of my comment was, no, much lower base damage, average crit and average crit multi means it cant use HM. Or to be precise, it using HM is about as effective as using it on the phantasma with its 3%. Literally, phant gets better kill time with it viral crit modded setup than phage has with viral hm or corrosive hm on average. Not to mention that the phage was nerfed slightly harder because the nerf that happened was biased by pellet count (6* of phage vs 5 of phant) due to improper calc.

Tho to clear something up, im in general for fixing the unjust status nerfs compared to what was said (which 100% includes the phantasmas primary fire), its just the phage is 100% the wrong point of comparison as its only path to success is gutting its ammo economy into nothing to be barely average for the downsides.

I second this. Hunter Munitions is a waste on the Phage. Modding it for corrosive/heat gets miles more out of it because sure, you can proc slash statuses, but base damage is a huge source of the slash proc damage which means Phage HM slashes will be doing nothing. I even have a Riven that gives a ton of multishot and raw damage and my slashes still tickle WITH Viral procs buffing them. I feel like a lot of people think you can just slap HM on any crit weapon and get big slash damage out of it but that's not how it works.

[(PSN)MrNishi]

On 2020-03-05 at 9:36 AM, Mephane said:

The current impact procs are utterly terrible....

I agree here.

I would rather have Impact make lower enemy resistances 25% per proc up until stack of 4. Eventually allowing an immunity to become neutral. Would give impact a universal application even though IPS is now more Evelyn weighted.

For a weapon that is status friendly but mainly Impact like the Shaky; that would mean an enemy would become susceptible to any elemental damage from Shaky with each impact proc. (Basically increasing the effectiveness of other damage types.)

 

Or 

Impact procs could make that particular enemy that much more susceptible to status chance. Thus increasing the status chance on enemies with impact procs.

(No stagger, no knockdown...just faster killing on impact)

Edited March 26, 2020 by (PS4)MrNishi

[Wyrmius_Prime]

Base electricity damage is now a total gun ruiner. Electricity is a useless damage type which prevents modding for Viral + Heat, because you will always get Viral + Radiation. For example, the new gun Basmu is definitely hindered this.

Edited March 26, 2020 by Wyrmius_Prime

[(PSN)Scarletboy76292]

Puncture: not sure why this just reduces damage I feel like it should do another thing like disarm at 10 stacks. Ever been stabbed in the shoulder? Yeah makes things hard to hold.

Impact: Getting hit by a car makes you stagger pretty bad so I get it. 

Heat: great burns nice 

Shock: great sparky sparky aoe

Cold: should freeze for 10s at 10 stacks

Toxin: ok it is poison 

Gas: Should be combustible at 10 stacks with heat the AOE spreading proc would make it useful for interacting with explosions or fire causing a knock down. 

Corrosive: seems fine for stripping armor. 

Viral: is op right now but still should spread after nerf cause it is viral... 

Radiation: makes people crazy... Yep the history checks out.

Blast: Reduces accuracy I guess that is helpful. I really miss the knock down for finishers. 

Magnetic: Magnets near electronics make things stop working. At 10 stacks it should create an emp that disables robots and Sheilds.

Void: Should cause a random status effect at a random intensity. The void is strange and unpredictable. At 10 stacks they kneel and begg for death lol jk.

Where are the dark and light elements? 

Maybe this can be accessed as part of our allinment from the story quests. This is just a passable idea didn't think it through lol. 

Darkness: Causes target to act alerted but they can't see at 10 stacks causes them to run away. Large darkness cloud swirls around them making them scream. 

Light: Should cause 100% extra health orb drop on death of light damage. 10 stacks causes damage done to heal instead for 6s. Effective against companions and allies.

 

 

 

Edited March 27, 2020 by (PS4)Scarletboy76292

[Lokor-Kitsune]

    So, one of the consistent things I'm seeing brought up is Impact/Blast switch, which, if you're going to go by naming, the suggested changes by these other people here sounds about right.(To switch the names/effects basically) However, a question to those who are discussing the displeasure in a knockdown effect at all, has anyone put thought into using it as single "Hard-Target" Denial? I mean, think of it like this. You're outnumbered at a higher level, maybe where you've reached your threshold. In order to continue onward, you'd need to pick your targets wisely, and take out the largest threats. In using Blast(Pre-patch) or Impact(Post-patch) would it not serve a great purpose to temporarily remove said "Hard" or "Priority" targets from the field temporarily, so that another weapon/attack/ability could be used on other, less important targets? To remove his "Guns" from the field long enough to reduce enemy saturation and efficiently using your time and energy at said threshold? I've long used ground slam, stomp, blast damage effects, and blast on weapons, to remove these threats and focus differing targets based on priority level. Just food for thought.

-An example of this explanation and question would be knocking down a high level Heavy Gunner or Bombard, amidst a long, high level grind, where you've been surrounded.

[nooneyouknow13]

A 10 stack of impact needs to make the target open to Mercy regardless of current health for anything that isn't a boss.

[MacIntoc]

For viral, it should stay @2x damage (or /2 hp, like before) on first proc. But should spread to 1 mobs on second proc. Then 2 mobs on third,... making it viral.

[Flying_Scorpion]

I put a lot of work into this video and I hope DE sees it. Viral is still a bit OP. Heat is a bit OP as well. Viral even beats magnetic against level 100 corpus enemies. Here's the video

 

 

[KittySkin]

By the will of Thalos, buff status shotguns. Tigris prime have a miserable 11.3% status chance per peller. It works better agains high armored enemies with a crit build than it does with a status build or an hybrid build. Its just dumb. Either increase its critical chance to 20% to make it a better crit shotgun or buff its status chance to 30% to allow it to reach 100% status chance with 4 status chance mods. Its dumb than even sancti tigris gets higher base critical chance and end up proccing more status per shot despite having actually less pellets.

All status shotguns with some exceptions like the exergis or kuva kohm needs to either get 20% CC or at least 30% SC. I personally consider the tigris family shotguns better for a 20% CC buff because the "2 big barrels of get the f*uck off" concept while the boar family its way better suiter for a status chance buff because the high RoF and larger magazines.

Also, gas procs should scale off toxin+heat damage, not only from base damage since pure heat or pure toxin are WAY better than combined gas damage, and that its well. Not something really logic, you know?

[CopperBezel]

I noticed another case of blast being used as a shorthand for knockdown: Nova's Null Star augment Neutron Star. Releasing Neutron Star now causes enemies to take a single Blast proc for slightly reduced accuracy, as opposed to taking a knockdown that's going to be extended 4x by her slow. The main purpose of the augment is fixing her broken ability by making it recastable, but the only actively advantageous element is broken now.

Neutron Star should be changed to cause knockdown directly (or an Impact proc at the least) rather than keeping its Blast status effect. 

On 2020-03-30 at 11:37 PM, Flying_Scorpion said:

Heat is a bit OP as well.

Eh, it's very hard to treat Heat as OP when Viral and Corrosive exist. Heat is in a comfortable middle ground where it's not useless but not mandatory, and right now it's the only thing. Everything else is either Viral, Corrosive, or Slash that you actually build for (and Slash is very hard to build for now) or it's just kinda ... technically present. And Corrosive is a weaker Viral in all applications except for the damage type's armor ignore; the viral proc is strictly better even against armored enemies for all normal armor values, and while Corrosive can theoretically very slightly outpace Viral at the most extreme, it's never going to be meaningfully better. 

[Rogunz]

So are you just done with this? Almost every useful status effect was nerfed and armor was reduced so status weapons are weaker than before. The buffs to viral make crit/hybrid weapons stronger than ever and changes to how procs are generated mean they even have an easier time procing slash. My status shotguns aren't worth using because you kept the formula that made them bad instead of expanding the normal behavior they shared with every other weapon where 100% status would make every pellet proc.

 

If your goal was actually to make status weapons matter you really need to take another look at almost all of these changes instead of moving on to nerfing Gara.

 

[Flying_Scorpion]

It's nice that you guys are pushing for more consistency in status effects.

Gas caps out at 10x stacks

Electric and Toxin cap out at however many stacks you can apply within 6 seconds

Heat caps out at .... well....

 

[(XBOX)GearsMatrix301]

I have still yet to find how multiple status procs were supposed to help negate the status nerf to shotguns. Like what’s the point if only 2 shotguns are able to reach able 100% status to even take advantage of it?

[CopperBezel]

It's not the >100% status that would theoretically be helpful to shotguns, but the fact that all status effects stack. (The phrasing in the initial devstream explanation implied otherwise, which I think confused things.) Previously only Corrosive benefited from raw number of procs, which made shotguns good with that one particular status effect, now they have some benefit for all. It's all a tangle of course, since >100% status chance wouldn't itself be useful without the stacking procs, and also would have had to mean something slightly different for shotguns than for other weapons if the old, mechanically perverse SC calculation had been kept.

 

Edited April 5, 2020 by CopperBezel

[fgiveme]

Zarr shotgun mode didn't receive 3x status buff

[MacIntoc]

9 hours ago, CopperBezel said:

Previously only Corrosive benefited from raw number of procs, which made shotguns good with that one particular status effect

Half of the status benefited from raw number of procs : slash, fire, toxin, electricity, gaz and corrosive. Which made shotgun good with half of status effects.