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[DE]Rebecca

2020’s First Mainline: Review, Revise, Refresh: Part 2!

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>Arcanes will require 21 Arcanes to reach the new Max Rank of 5

oh cool, spend another 1400p to max out grace, for less benefit than the previous rank 3 gave. 

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You may want to be very selective with what weapons have what types of damage. I don't wanna be ragdolling enemies with nearly every automatic weapon. It makes it harder to aim. 

To that end, shouldn't blast be more extreme than impact? 

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1 minute ago, _Connor said:

>Arcanes will require 21 Arcanes to reach the new Max Rank of 5

oh cool, spend another 1400p to max out grace, for less benefit than the previous rank 3 gave. 

1. Arcane prices won't stay the same. Grace rank 3 is already much lower than it used to be, sitting at about 800p on warframe's market site. Also, the whole point was to shuffle up what arcanes are used and relied upon, so it's to be expected that they'd nerf Grace and Energize. Bummer, but that's the reality. DE nerfs based upon popularity.

2. The event for squad-link will also lower arcane prices even further. I imagine Grace will make its way down into the 500p area, if not lower.

I'm a bit confused why it takes 21 and not 20, but I guess its to stop people from just combining their two rank 3s and calling it a day.

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Posted (edited)

About the Impact damage status: I see you devs struggling to provide something interesting for it (knockdown or ragdoll? meh :/) , so here are my suggestions:

1) Impact status could disorient: enemy hit will falter randomly for 6s, sometimes trying to melee hit around him/her as if s/he was trying to repel an invisible enemy

2) If the enemy receive a second Impact while disoriented: he could fall asleep (knocked out) for Xseconds (duration similar to other statuses secondary effects)

3) If an enemy is knocked out (or asleep through any other mean (warframe abilities, for example)), receiving another Impact status will disarm them. If they already are (or have no fire-weapon), their sleep time is refreshed.

 

This way, Impact will be a duration based status like all the rest, and will bring interesting perks & value for our tactics & builds.

 

On the same line, Blast damage could deafen enemies, then (stacking status) panic them and force them to seek for a cover for X seconds, and then make them avoid the area of explosion for X seconds (in fear of being bombarded again).

 

I also thought about something for Magnetic status stack: at second Magnetic status, the enemy could be magnetized and attract bullets on a short area around him/her (including her/his own): this way, Magnetic will be much more of an asset, outside the Corpus faction.

 

Instead of being Toxin based only, Gas could spread elemental statuses in the area of effect (if any enemy has an active status, it's spread to all others in the cloud). If a second Gas status occurs to a target that was in a Cloud in the last 6 seconds, it could create a lasting cloud (for X seconds) of damage ticks, depending on the major elemental damage type of the first Tenno attack passing through it, (or Toxin if there is none/can't be determined).

 

Edit: oh and it would be great to split the effects of Fire Status, cause right now it's 3-status-in-1: DoT, panic, armor reduction. It's overpowered compared to many other statuses.

/ideas.

Edited by Yaerion
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I assume we are getting about 30 formas and 1 month affinity booster since this update will destroy years of work on builds for both Warframes and weapons.

Can we just remove impact from the game? Most annoying damage type and now you want to make it a ragdoll...

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Overall, great changes from the previous dev workshop post. I'm excited to play Titania with shield gating and an armor buff, and even more excited for her prime version (which should have slightly more armor and health)

I'm a little nervous about the status effects, and want to add mine to the list of voices about the difference of impact vs. blast. I think a concussion effect is a more fitting thing for impact - for instance, in real life, if I hit someone on the head with a stick ... they're not going to fly away, they're going to drop their head and have a terrible concussion. So open up enemies to finishers and cause them to be (mostly) stationary for 5sec? 10sec? Then move that ragdoll effect to blast, where it makes more sense and will create more spectacular meme videos of blasting enemies into outer space using 200% status or some other ridiculous BS.

But please, at least, reconsider impact causing the ragdoll effect. That's not going to be fun at all with automatic weapons, and those are some of my fav.

As far as the other changes, I'm gonna wait for the update to drop, play with it, and then offer my feedback.

Thanks again DE for putting in the work to make an awesome game 😄

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Posted (edited)
11 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

Passively removing 100% of an enemy's defenses is not an interesting choice

WRONG!!! It completely changes what damage and status types you go for and can alter the weapons, tactics, and frames you choose to use entirely. It is the definition of interesting. What's NOT interesting is cheesing the whole game while you do the same missions over and over in a ridiculous grind that is disproportional to the actual content. But... It's still better than playing most grindy games imo. 

Edited by (XB1)Architect Prime

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2 minutes ago, Evhel said:

I assume we are getting about 30 formas and 1 month affinity booster since this update will destroy years of work on builds for both Warframes and weapons.

Can we just remove impact from the game? Most annoying damage type and now you want to make it a ragdoll...

When they redid Wukong, Ember, and Vauban, it was 3 forma and I think a weekend affinity booster.

So take the 30 or whatever Warframes X 3 forma X 2 days of booster.

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Posted (edited)

@[DE]Rebecca Will Aegis still trigger shield recharge for its duration? 

It was a hidden perk of the old version and it's not clear if its carrying over to the new version.

It would be odd (and clusmy) for an effect that activates on hits (Aegis) to modify an effect that activates after avoiding hits (shield recharge).

Edited by schilds

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11 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

Warframe Armor Buffs

I can understand not given a buff to frames like Rhino or Frost giving how there abilities work. But why no armor buff to Excalibur when even Inaros got one?

 

11 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

Arcane Guardian

15% chance for +900 Armor for 20s

Glade to see a change made to Guardian, don't get the 15% nerf over 20% tho.

You mention Guardian and Energize but no Aegis, so that one is dead I guest. 

 

 

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So to compensate for shield gating protecting you from your Lenz or Bramma errors, AoE weapons now have stagger instead of self damage.

... AND their actual ability to deal damage in an area (particularly critical for things like a Bramma, Zarr, Zakti, etc etc where it's a bunch of very small AoEs that will now all deal 10% of what they used to) has all but been eliminated to also pay for it. Many weapons had their balance from doing full damage to multiple targets, as against just one they could be underwhelming.

So why exactly would someone use an area weapon when in the time you kill one guy and tickle the two standing five feet from him, you could have killed all three AND reloaded your Rubico?

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i feel rhino prime also should get an armor buff from 275 to 300/350

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Puncture, electric, cold, (possible) impact, all still crap Procs. 
if your damage type isn't worth building for its not worth having.

more puncture doesn't make them deal less dmg, its not getting a increase or anything. Puncture, Cold and (possibly)impact sucks!.
Cold, still doesn't solid freeze people. WHY!. 

electric's proc is so bad. its this pissy little puff of dmg that does basically nothing. its a crap dmg type with a crap Proc. 

the rest is good, but Puncture suuucks.STILL!.
here is how you fix. puncture procs,Fill up a bar. the More puncture modifiers you have (mods) their % increases the rate at which it fills the bar. when you fill the bar, the target takes 5-8% True damage. 
MPGA!

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10 hours ago, IgnisDraconis4316 said:

For all the idiots complaining about Impact Procs. 

Unless you are using mainly impact weapons or have 300% to 400% status on your weapons that deal mostly Impact you will not notice it. 

And everyone is basing their "FACTS" on how the game is currently. Wait till it comes out as these changes are massive in scope and may not be as bad as you think.

 

Entitled Video Gamers and their whiny attitudes. "We want the game to change cause it sucks." Game changes. "Why the hell did you change it we don't want the game to change."

Either you want the game to grow or you want it to die. MAKE. UP. YOUR. MIND. 

 

Devs are listening but they don't listen to all the 30 some odd gamers that whine like a 4 year old.

Whining gamer whines about whining gamers. This gud meme. Much laugh.

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I'll play wait and see on the new status effects but it is looking like Viral may be the new king. 

I'm kind of bummed by some of the frames left off of the armor buff list. I can understand Valkyr and Atlas not being there (both frames need reworks and buffs but not necessarily in base armor) but I would have liked to see Wukong/Prime, Nidus, and Rhino Prime on the list. 

Anyway, thanks for the hard work DE. I'm excited to try the new changes out tomorrow. 

 

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Posted (edited)
11 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

AOE weapons are receiving a 90% Radial Damage Falloff from central impact. This means on the very outer section of the explosion Radius 10% of the Damage will be dealt.

So you're turning every AoE weapon into a worse Opticor with chip damage outside of ground zero? Then what's the point? We might as well stick to melee weapons with Primed Reach that 

a) don't use ammo

b) benefit from Combo Counter

c) don't stagger us on use

d) deal more damage

 

I mean, we already have a useless melee arcane, remember? It's called Exodia Force, it has a useful-sounding description but turns out, it's so bad that it being or not being there doesn't even register, because well, it has a devastating falloff radius and deals negligible damage. AoE weapons were useless because of unimpressive damage AND a risk of death at every step. Then Kuva Bramma came and we obtained a weapon powerful enough to consider using it despite the risk. Now you're about to nerf every single AoE weapon into oblivion, because why would we use a weapon that can only deal full damage to enemies clustered inside a Vortex or Larva if we can just melee them instead?

 Again and again I feel like asking "Do you guys even play your own game?". And no, god_mode_on devbuild doesn't count. 

Edited by Reifnir
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11 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

Impact

Repeat single-target Impact Status Effects will escalate the efficacy of the Impact Status (from Stagger to full Ragdoll).
EDIT: We are reviewing how Ragdoll feels and may change pending feedback. EXPECT AN UPDATE TODAY ON THIS NOTE! EDIT 2: No more Ragdoll!

this is honestly the reason why i doubt challenging difficulty will ever be a fun thing for me. if something like ragdoll has to go away because people are upset about the target moving when it gets hit by melee or firearm then what does that say if they add a very mobile enemy for challenging content.

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10 hours ago, OperatorPrime said:

the popularity of AoE weapons might even drop with this. Maybe there's details I'm missing or something you guys haven't outlined yet, which hopefully I am

Probably what DE wants...until they release the next AOE weapon and wonder why people don't like it. 

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12 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

In the original Dev Workshop, we said:

As a result of this overall systemic change, Weapons with Stagger will be getting approximately a 20% buff in Damage, with any weapons with AOE receiving a 50% Radial Damage Falloff from central impact. 

This is no longer accurate after continued testing. What we are doing now is:

No damage buffs have been added, but any weapons with AOE are receiving ~20% increase in Radius. Additionally, AOE weapons are receiving a 90% Radial Damage Falloff from central impact. This means on the very outer section of the explosion Radius 10% of the Damage will be dealt.

So basically, this defeats the appeal of AoE weapons. Thanks for playing.

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DE, can you put a function to toggle Open or Close for some syandanas? (like Sari Syandana) It would be nice I guess. 

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Let's see if I understand correctly:

What we have at the moment:

-90% of the arcana are not used, because they are useless or situational.
-90% of the mods are not used, for the same reasons.


What I see after tomorrow's update:

-90% of the arcana will not be used, because they are useless or situational.
-90% of the mods will not be used, for the same reasons and also, because the update forgot them, as always.

Congratulations DE, keep up the good work.:thumbup:

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12 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

Why: The inclusion of enhanced or different stacking of Duplicate Status Effects is one to refresh the appeal of Status. Our long-term goal with this change is to build upon this series of changes to allow Status to impact bigger threats like Liches and Eidolons and not just have blanket Immunity.

YES. All this change is great for the game can't wait to get my hands on it!

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10 hours ago, IgnisDraconis4316 said:

For all the idiots complaining about Impact Procs. 

Unless you are using mainly impact weapons or have 300% to 400% status on your weapons that deal mostly Impact you will not notice it. 

And everyone is basing their "FACTS" on how the game is currently. Wait till it comes out as these changes are massive in scope and may not be as bad as you think.

 

Entitled Video Gamers and their whiny attitudes. "We want the game to change cause it sucks." Game changes. "Why the hell did you change it we don't want the game to change."

Either you want the game to grow or you want it to die. MAKE. UP. YOUR. MIND. 

 

Devs are listening but they don't listen to all the 30 some odd gamers that whine like a 4 year old.

This is my tenora, a puncture based rifle with a relatively low status chance of 16% at base and yet it still proc imp like a champ! Do you even understand wtf are you saying?
 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=upcKlzfBZ7o

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Honestly, the main issue I had with the update before was thinking Arcane Energize wouldn't work with channeling frames, so I'm much relieved at this update.

Thanks DE!  Hopefully the rest of this update goes well.

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