2020’s First Mainline: Review, Revise, Refresh: Part 2!

[daktfi]

Never saw the Corrosive Projection as faction-specific aura (yup, the Grineers are the faction that relies on armor the most, but they're not the only ones that use it). 

Otherwise - very welcomed explanations, and reasoning for changes sound solid. Well, my gut feeling tells me, rofling, that there WILL be more adjustment and fixes, as re-balancing almost entire damage-vs-defense thing cannot be that easy, but general line "do everything in simple, understandable and similar fashion" is just great.

Thanks! Still hoping for update coming soon... 😉 

[Derethevil]

Okay now i am damn sure at least, that you guys hate dragons.
Why don't you delete Chroma right away if you hate him so much?

So the undying Inaros can get a Armor buff, because he isn't undying enough, making him even more tankier but Chroma, after getting nerf, after nerf, after nerf can't?
Damn hypocrits. 

And if you buff them because of the Arcane changes. Chroma is affected as well from those. Not only your precious Inaros.

[TARINunit9]

17 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

Viral	New Status Effect entirely: enhanced Damage! First Viral Status Effect deals 100% additional Health damage, subsequent Viral Status add +25% for a total of 325% (capped). Note: Before Viral would halve a target’s health pool and simply refresh the duration. Now it deals 2x Damage to Health, and can scale up to 4.5x Damage on repeat Status Effects.

I'm a little confused as what this means, I'd like to make sure. Does this mean that the bullet itself deals 325% damage? (analogous to a critical hit) Or does it apply a temporary debuff to the target causing them to suffer a 325% damage multiplier?

If the former, is there a "reset timer", until the Viral benefit drops from 325% back to 100%? Or will it stay at 325% until the target dies? I ask because the target could be a Tenno; enemies can sometimes have Viral damage

[TARINunit9]

27 minutes ago, FinessedAgain said:

So what about the Kuva Bramma?

 

Bramma gets the same self-damage changes as the Ogris, Talons, Castanas, etc. from last week's thread

[shadyadie]

14 hours ago, ntyd1s said:

Does "Void Dash Radius" means travel distance? That'd be pretty interesting! o_O"

Mind Sprint in Naramon increases void dash speed ie. the distance, so radius implies the area of effect round the operator. I'm thinking it'll most likely effect the area of Executing Dash, Protective Dash etc.

[(XBOX)Anxious Chammy]

So our MAXED Arcanes are not getting compensated? Even after all the work we did to acquire them? And for some the platinum spent?.... Instead we are FORCED "LED" to do some event to get Arcanes to MAX that we already MAXED? Or am I missing something?

[Solemarc]

It might've been brought up already, but would it be too hard to instead of only show X amount of slash procs over y time. Why not instead only show the total slash damage over y time, so instead of a bunch of slash procs we just see one number a second that is the total slash damage for that second?

[Nevieth]

45 minutes ago, FinessedAgain said:

So what about the Kuva Bramma?

 

That section of weapons were only explosive weapons WITHOUT self-damage implemented. Kuva Bramma as it stands has self-damage, and is one of the main culprits for DE finally making the change. I don't mean to sound rude, but please read next time. The answer to your question was literally in the first sentence of what you quoted.

[(PSN)TONI__RIBEIRO]

2 hours ago, (XB1)Anxious Chammy said:

So our MAXED Arcanes are not getting compensated? Even after all the work we did to acquire them? And for some the platinum spent?.... Instead we are FORCED "LED" to do some event to get Arcanes to MAX that we already MAXED? Or am I missing something?

No, you're  not. 

[Skillzzpro]

This is absurd. These new arcane changes isn't what feels like 1.5 its still 1 arcane at max ranked which you will now have to buy or grind 11 more of to get about the same results of. yes some few arcanes have been buffed by a bit. but for most its either a nerf being like 0.8 as they are now or with a cooldown which we dont know how long will last which worries me. or they are as they once were but now you gotta grind a heck alot more. this smells nasty. like you dont think the grind for these arcanes isn't already long boring and tedious. then atleast up the chances of getting the rare ones. and why is it 11 more for 2 ranks when 10 is for 3 ranks? it should be more like 15 in total for 5 ranks what is wrong with your maths? arghh

[Urlan]

1 hour ago, Buddhakingpen said:

PLEASE LOOK AT HYDROID. With the incoming shield gating , combined with his already low built in damage outside of puddle, and the corrosive changes, this is nerfing an already weak frame into the ground. Even something as simple as counting the knockdowns on his tempest barrage as the new blast procs will go a long way. 

If his augments were innate to the abilities it might not be a bad but I agree this status 2.5 revisit does sound like it will hurt his usage even more.

[TheLexiConArtist]

2 minutes ago, Skillzzpro said:

This is absurd. These new arcane changes isn't what feels like 1.5 its still 1 arcane at max ranked which you will now have to buy or grind 11 more of to get about the same results of. yes some few arcanes have been buffed by a bit. but for most its either a nerf being like 0.8 as they are now or with a cooldown which we dont know how long will last which worries me. or they are as they once were but now you gotta grind a heck alot more. this smells nasty. like you dont think the grind for these arcanes isn't already long boring and tedious. then atleast up the chances of getting the rare ones. and why is it 11 more for 2 ranks when 10 is for 3 ranks? it should be more like 15 in total for 5 ranks what is wrong with your maths? arghh

Each rank-up takes 1 more arcane than the previous.

1+2+3+4 = 10

1+2+3+4+5+6 = 21

What's wrong with your maths?

[spicyframe420]

30 minutes ago, Derethevil said:

Okay now i am damn sure at least, that you guys hate dragons.

Noone hate chroma, people talking about chroma being boring single use frame and ask for rework. 

[Nevieth]

10 minutes ago, (XB1)Anxious Chammy said:

So our MAXED Arcanes are not getting compensated? Even after all the work we did to acquire them? And for some the platinum spent?.... Instead we are FORCED "LED" to do some event to get Arcanes to MAX that we already MAXED? Or am I missing something?

1) You're not losing your Arcanes, so why the heck would you be compensated for it? Your Arcanes are still Rank 3, there is just now a further upgrade path to Rank 5. Do you have to upgrade to it? No. You probably won't even feel an issue with this change if you didn't dual-stack Rank 3 Arcanes.

2) Do you think DE should compensate people for their purchases of disposition 3/5 rivens when those rivens inevitably are nerfed to a lower disposition? No, that's absurd. This game is ever evolving. Again, you're not losing any Arcanes, you're only losing the ability to dual-stack them. You can still use 1.5x the power of Rank 3's and have 2 different types of 1.5x strength Arcanes. Now you don't need x2 Guardians without any healing, now you can have 1.5x healing and 1.5x armor. I see this change as a good thing as long as the Arcane changes at Rank 5 are somewhat similar to what the 1.5x strength would be of dual-stacking.

3) Also who is forcing you to do an event? DE isn't. Just do Eidolons. Just buy the Arcanes for platinum... they'll be cheaper than normal since other people will be doing the events for you. Or just do the event, but be warned, you might enjoy it.

I don't get these super reactionary responses. Unless you were doing some weird double-Grace or double-Energize, you shouldn't have much of an issue with these changes. Your Rank 3 Arcanes will still be there, and their Rank 3 stats will probably resemble what they are now, give or take a small percentage of stats. (only a small group of Arcanes are actually being nerfed wholesale.)

 

[Mayonaiser]

I like how people keep saying that corrosive is getting a huge nerf since the strip is capped at 80%, completely ingoring the fact that enemy armor scaling is also getting balanced with it.

As for viral, i suppose it is a nerf if you run a high lvl mission, but then again warframe doesnt really do high lvl mission so ehh whatever.

Also why is my favorite frame that is [insert frame name] is not getting an armor buff? Well, maybe because that frame doesnt need an armor buff. take nidus for example, he doesnt need one because his stack and passive take care of that for him, your fault for being bad at playing him

 

[Mayonaiser]

1 hour ago, jonni_2 said:

why is Valkyr not getting an armor buff, every warframe nowadays can casually get 1000 armor, making her obsolete
pretty sure DE forgot she exists at this point

I want you to take a look at her base armor value, and you tell me if that is enough or not, maybe if youre actually moving you wont get killed so easily playing her

[Sohaya-]

1 hour ago, FinessedAgain said:

So what about the Kuva Bramma?

 

Already has self damage so will automatically be adjusted.

I'm just worried about the Shedu's AoE falloff at this point. Are the weapons that just got the stagger getting the falloff? If yes: there goes the main appeal of playing those weapons over the Amprex or Ignis or a melee. Shedu in particular relies heavily on the AoE's damage to compete, otherwise it's sort of garbage. If not, good.

[HoloShaii]

Sad to see that the warframe community is so quick to have an uninformed opinion ready. People saying: "Now explosive weapons are gutted", "Now Chroma is worthless", "Why would you give zephyr more armor hurdurrr".

1. Explosive weapons now finally work like they're supposed to, and they even got a 20% radius buff.
2. Chroma's current playstyle was cheap, there are many other ways to build up his vex armor.
3. The entire armor scaling amounts have changed, and the 15 armor values were from the old old system, 100 base armor for the squishiest frames makes some of the less played frames more worth playing again.

Wait for the update to release, play it, and then form your opinion, like any intelligent person would do.

[Sylonus]

3 hours ago, Sleepers said:

 

This is a NERF to a sub-type of primary that isn't popular already. More radial damage the closer it detonates to you = more radial dmg and more severe the stagger - the further the detonation the less damage from point of impact. The whole point of launcher/explosives was that they were high risk, high reward - This update will make them high risk low reward because you'll be dead by the time you come out of your stun-lock anyway, Self damage is NOTHING compared to the nerf that launchers are going to receive. I hope everyone who whined about self-dmg is happy because I am f**kn pissed.

I mostly agreed with you up until the last sentence, I'm really tired of hearing it, it's the equivalent of complaining to your landlord about your air conditioning is making too much noise and you can't sleep, so the landlord replaces it with a desk fan, and then your roommate saying it's the your fault that you're hot now. We just wanted our A/C fixed, nobody wanted this other change that makes things worse for everyone.

The problem with launchers the way they are now, is they're mostly high, unpredictable risk, for no reward. (At least no reward beyond other competitive meta weapons without this drawback.)

After this patch, all AOE weapons will be low risk (but not 0), but actively worse compared to other meta weapons, so, actual loss instead of reward.

[TheLexiConArtist]

1 minute ago, Sylonus said:

I mostly agreed with you up until the last sentence, I'm really tired of hearing it, it's the equivalent of complaining to your landlord about your air conditioning is making too much noise and you can't sleep, so the landlord replaces it with a desk fan, and then your roommate saying it's the your fault that you're hot now. We just wanted our A/C fixed, nobody wanted this other change that makes things worse for everyone.

The problem with launchers the way they are now, is they're mostly high, unpredictable risk, for no reward. (At least no reward beyond other competitive meta weapons without this drawback.)

After this patch, all AOE weapons will be low risk (but not 0), but actively worse compared to other meta weapons, so, actual loss instead of reward.

Except it was never unpredictable by itself, people are just making bad judgement calls and not capable of possessing enough testicular fortitude to admit they made a mistake.

Allied collision is the primary argument for 'unpredictability' and that's not caused by self-damage, self-damage is just a symptom of having your buddies/dog/idiot AI eating projectiles otherwise aimed perfectly well.

Also they're ~8% of weapons within the primary + secondary categories. So it really wasn't hurting anyone not to use them if they weren't into that.

[(XBOX)Quinn David O]

18 hours ago, Arkhenbarn said:

Some Warframes didn't receive buffs in your post (Rhino Prime, Exca, etc.) ; is this intended ? It's mostly because Rhino (and Prime) is supposed to be the "tank" but has somewhat "meh, not so tank" armor values. Just my 2 cents.

Also the high end arcane tanker build is getting hit hard without double stacking so this seems like a low key nerf to our iron-clad chubby unicorn

[eboomer]

2 hours ago, Vitalis_Inamorta said:

Oh, and infested armor can be removed.  Want to know how?  Swing your melee weapon in its general vicinity.  Yes, really, it comes from the mutalist swarm moas' swarms that you can disperse with melee attacks.  Also, Sharpened Claws exists, and it works on pretty much everything.

...

I never used Catchmoon on much of anything.  I actually made a crit one just to stick it in peoples' faces with the name "Nube Kanon".  I honestly didn't see the majority of people at my MR using them even before the range/falloff nerf.  It's just that you'd notice the one in ten or so because it's big and bright and kills fairly surprising things sometimes.  The damage wasn't really out of line even though the AoE was a bit much, the really out of line thing was that every last new, hard to kill enemy that DE introduced around that time was immune to statuses--and weak to radiation.  Hellooooo Catchmoon!

The ancients are actually the ones that are hard to kill, and they have their own armor.  Lockdown doesn't do much to them, without a LOT of armor stripping, which they are HEAVILY nerfing in this update.

And regarding the Catchmoon, you entirely missed my point.  You were saying something to the effect that DE just nerfs things because they're popular.  I was trying to explain why they do tend to nerf that which is popular.  Which Catchmoon absolutely was, contrary to your comment.  Did you not see the infamous spreadsheet DE showed explaining why they nerfed it?

[TheLexiConArtist]

1 minute ago, eboomer said:

The ancients are actually the ones that are hard to kill, and they have their own armor.  Lockdown doesn't do much to them, without a LOT of armor stripping, which they are HEAVILY nerfing in this update.

Nope, they have Fossilized Health. Infestation armour is exclusive to boss/miniboss units and the buff provided by Swarm Moas.

Ancients are hard to kill because Ancient Healers have a stupid mechanic (or possibly bug) where they heal for every damage event on units in their radius. Lockdown would hit a Healer for one tick, while the hits on every surrounding unit would then heal the difference back up immediately.

Lockdown might also count as an 'ability' and be subject to the 90% reduction from Disruptors, haven't checked.

[(XBOX)Erudite Prime]

18 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

dditionally, AOE weapons are receiving a 90% Radial Damage Falloff from central impact. This means on the very outer section of the explosion Radius 10% of the Damage will be dealt.

porque
 

26 minutes ago, HallowedFlux said:

. Explosive weapons now finally work like they're supposed to, and they even got a 20% radius buff.

There is no way that you can actually believe this. What do you mean "work like they're supposed to"? Killing things is what they're supposed to do, and now they're going to have a much harder time doing that. That 20% radius buff is absolutely worthless since they're only going to be dealing 20%-10% damage at that point. 

[HoloShaii]

2 minutes ago, (XB1)Erudite Prime said:

There is no way that you can actually believe this. What do you mean "work like they're supposed to"? Killing things is what they're supposed to do, and now they're going to have a much harder time doing that. That 20% radius buff is absolutely worthless since they're only going to be dealing 20%-10% damage at that point. 

Work like explosives work, the point of impact is where most damage is done. It makes no sense for explosive weapons to do the exact same damage at every distance from the center, and then suddenly no damage outside that range.
Also honestly for a lot of content in the game 10% damage is still going to nuke some enemies into the sky.