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Story events- bring them back as single player missions.


Sweeney
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I know this isn't the first thread of it's kind, but I haven't seen anyone say anything about it in a hot min- least of all the devs- so I'm just gonna remind everyone that this problem exists and how utterly and completely ridiculous it is.

Locking away sections of the game's lore and story into one time events has to be the MOST LUDICROUS decision in the history of "AAA games", and DE, I love you, I shower you with my money despite being a broke ass ho, but JFC what in the name of all that is good on this Earth were you thinking?

You know the biggest culprits of this, if you've been around long enough. Tubemen of Regor. Shadow Debt. And so on.

Sometimes these events come back briefly, but not in their entirety. The Acolytes will return, but there's no mention of Alad V or protecting him and how that tied into TSD.

Seriously, just have it all come back in solo mission form. Put the story back in order. It's a jumbled mess without them.

If fixing the story of the game as it stands now isn't part of the "New player experience" rework, it should be. And you should let us start the story over and experience it proper, if we want to.

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They have said in the past it would require rebuilding everything about them basically due to how much the game has changed since they were an event, and that they aren't interested in putting time into it. 

I keep supporting and bringing up to tern them into Levarian entries and using that as a way to bring the lore back into the game for everyone.

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1 hour ago, yarl5000 said:

They have said in the past it would require rebuilding everything about them basically due to how much the game has changed since they were an event, and that they aren't interested in putting time into it. 

I keep supporting and bringing up to tern them into Levarian entries and using that as a way to bring the lore back into the game for everyone.

Levarian being used to tell the story of Warframe. Good idea. More realistic than Codex updates.

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12 hours ago, yarl5000 said:

They have said in the past it would require rebuilding everything about them basically due to how much the game has changed since they were an event, and that they aren't interested in putting time into it. 

I keep supporting and bringing up to tern them into Levarian entries and using that as a way to bring the lore back into the game for everyone.

I love DE, but also, sometimes I hate them.

Not gonna put the time into it? Into what? FiXING your game? It's their own fault. I don't even develop games, and even I could have foreseen the obvious consequences of limited time story events and how that would impact new players and even players who joined years ago but still after the event.

Ridiculous.

11 hours ago, Grey_Star_Rival_Defender said:

Levarian being used to tell the story of Warframe. Good idea. More realistic than Codex updates.

Levarian also needs to be...more present? More obvious? More...you know?

I did not even know it was added after coming back from my hiatus.

On a completely separate sidenote, Grendel's "Eat the Rich, no LITERALLY!" backstory is exactly the kind of thing that makes me love DE, more than I could ever hate them for their occasionally bad decision making skills.

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3 hours ago, Sweeney said:

I love DE, but also, sometimes I hate them.

Not gonna put the time into it? Into what? FiXING your game? It's their own fault. I don't even develop games, and even I could have foreseen the obvious consequences of limited time story events and how that would impact new players and even players who joined years ago but still after the event.

Ridiculous.

Levarian also needs to be...more present? More obvious? More...you know?

I did not even know it was added after coming back from my hiatus.

On a completely separate sidenote, Grendel's "Eat the Rich, no LITERALLY!" backstory is exactly the kind of thing that makes me love DE, more than I could ever hate them for their occasionally bad decision making skills.

I mean I don't think they ever planned on those events breaking in the future but rather they just didn't make sure they would still work and didn't realize where the lore would go and such.  Plus from what I understand some of the impact of the events were more on the community side conversations in like forums. 

 

Edit: Good news they made Levarian more noticeable in the codex now. 

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One way or another they HAVE to fix the mess they have made with the starchart lore.

It provides one of the worst new player experiences as the player becomes absolutely lost on what to do, but also why they should care at all. Large chunks of lore being missing and contradicting itself with twisted timelines is just a cherry on the top.

Mind you I was one of those players. First time I tried warframe was in 2016. Got immediately lost on what to do or why I should be doing anything (lorewise) so I just gave up. It wasn't  until my friend insisted me to try out and Fortuna got me interested at 2018 did I have the nerve to try it out again.

Even now, its horrendous how much the lore is messy and scattered. And not in a good way like Darksouls. If DE wants the game to get to the next level and bring more new players, they need to address this problem seriously.

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The problem with some of the events is that it wouldn't really be possible to bring them back as a "single player" experience without completely re-writing and making them entirely new events.

I mean think of the Gradivus dilemma which introduced Ruk and Alad V where the player base determined the winner by which side won the most node invasions.  New players wouldn't be able to make an impact in the outcome...so how would that entire thing be framed?  It would essentially need to be completely re-written to make sense.
Further the actual "lore" and "story" that was in game was minimal and barebones to the extreme.  A large part of that event had threads back and forth between Ruk and Alad and their underlings (while involving some actual player interaction on the froums) that had a lot more of the lore and story of the event and their general personalities.  Those are all lost pretty much...so how would they make their way into the game?
The actual "in game" lore and story was "You're choosing a side to work for, listen to them congratulate and insult you in a few snippets of ingame voice clips without ever talking about what is happening or what is at stake!" all of the actual "lore" and "story" was place outside of the game.

How would a player be able to actually experience that event?  Especially since so much of it was player base focused with its interactions and all of the interaction, story, and everything else was communicated outside of the game?
Hek if you were a player back then that didn't spend a lot of time on the forums you would get nothing out of the event other than "Oh a new game mode?  and if you do 100 full invasions (5 missions each) you get a new gun?  Ok...who are these people insulting me and congratulating me?  Why am I working with Ruk or Alad or care about them?"  Nothing was communicated in game about the lore and story of the event.

Hek, the ghoul purge has more in game lore and story to it than the gradivus dilemma had.

Its not just as simple as going "Ok, you can play this..." its a "Lets do a full and complete rewrite of the event so that you can actually get the story and what is happening in game instead of via the forums"

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22 hours ago, yarl5000 said:

I mean I don't think they ever planned on those events breaking in the future but rather they just didn't make sure they would still work and didn't realize where the lore would go and such.

 

Edit: Good news they made Levarian more noticeable in the codex now. 

Whether they planned on it or not, it's broken and needs to be fixed.

Good about the Levarian though.

21 hours ago, Shaburanigud said:

One way or another they HAVE to fix the mess they have made with the starchart lore.

It provides one of the worst new player experiences as the player becomes absolutely lost on what to do, but also why they should care at all. Large chunks of lore being missing and contradicting itself with twisted timelines is just a cherry on the top.

Mind you I was one of those players. First time I tried warframe was in 2016. Got immediately lost on what to do or why I should be doing anything (lorewise) so I just gave up. It wasn't  until my friend insisted me to try out and Fortuna got me interested at 2018 did I have the nerve to try it out again.

Even now, its horrendous how much the lore is messy and scattered. And not in a good way like Darksouls. If DE wants the game to get to the next level and bring more new players, they need to address this problem seriously.

Absolutely yes.

One way or another.

20 hours ago, Tsukinoki said:

The problem with some of the events is that it wouldn't really be possible to bring them back as a "single player" experience without completely re-writing and making them entirely new events.

I mean think of the Gradivus dilemma which introduced Ruk and Alad V where the player base determined the winner by which side won the most node invasions.  New players wouldn't be able to make an impact in the outcome...so how would that entire thing be framed?  It would essentially need to be completely re-written to make sense.
Further the actual "lore" and "story" that was in game was minimal and barebones to the extreme.  A large part of that event had threads back and forth between Ruk and Alad and their underlings (while involving some actual player interaction on the froums) that had a lot more of the lore and story of the event and their general personalities.  Those are all lost pretty much...so how would they make their way into the game?
The actual "in game" lore and story was "You're choosing a side to work for, listen to them congratulate and insult you in a few snippets of ingame voice clips without ever talking about what is happening or what is at stake!" all of the actual "lore" and "story" was place outside of the game.

How would a player be able to actually experience that event?  Especially since so much of it was player base focused with its interactions and all of the interaction, story, and everything else was communicated outside of the game?
Hek if you were a player back then that didn't spend a lot of time on the forums you would get nothing out of the event other than "Oh a new game mode?  and if you do 100 full invasions (5 missions each) you get a new gun?  Ok...who are these people insulting me and congratulating me?  Why am I working with Ruk or Alad or care about them?"  Nothing was communicated in game about the lore and story of the event.

Hek, the ghoul purge has more in game lore and story to it than the gradivus dilemma had.

Its not just as simple as going "Ok, you can play this..." its a "Lets do a full and complete rewrite of the event so that you can actually get the story and what is happening in game instead of via the forums"

Yes. Full and complete rewrite/remake ingame.

If that's what's necessary to fix the mess they've created of the story and lore, then they need to do it.

They cannot just leave things as they are presently.

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1 hour ago, Sweeney said:

Whether they planned on it or not, it's broken and needs to be fixed.

Good about the Levarian though.

DE has said they won't do that.  They could spend days on the best case end to remake and fix them up to work with all the new game parts and put them out, in exchange the people working on it (and it would be multi departmental) can't be working on fixing bugs or making newer content.  And they wouldn't do much for the game lore since from what I understand more of the impact was from what was happening on the forums, youtube channels, reddit, etc. Gradvius apparently had long debates on which side, and then there were long debates about saving alad or not, and whole strategy threads on which relays to save and which to let die. Plus I think trying to fit them into the current story wouldn't really work. However presenting them as a history piece with just some items loaded into a void with a voice over would take much less time to add, and the lore can be added with extra depth. They could even skip the Plex card for the event entries. 

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I'm still on hiatus till the new lore isn't locked behind a time and resource wall, then a grind wall, then another sporadic timed event. Was super stoked for a new lore drop but then they put in the veil in RJ. Laverian is just a waste of resource as well. I really do miss the story and lore for frames being behind an actual experience instead of a museum, 

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20 hours ago, yarl5000 said:

DE has said they won't do that.  They could spend days on the best case end to remake and fix them up to work with all the new game parts and put them out, in exchange the people working on it (and it would be multi departmental) can't be working on fixing bugs or making newer content.  And they wouldn't do much for the game lore since from what I understand more of the impact was from what was happening on the forums, youtube channels, reddit, etc. Gradvius apparently had long debates on which side, and then there were long debates about saving alad or not, and whole strategy threads on which relays to save and which to let die. Plus I think trying to fit them into the current story wouldn't really work. However presenting them as a history piece with just some items loaded into a void with a voice over would take much less time to add, and the lore can be added with extra depth. They could even skip the Plex card for the event entries. 

All of this has already been said.

But to all of that I say- you can't leave a broken thing broken.

You just straight up can't. It's literally not an option.

Some way or another, they're gonna have to find a way to make it all work.

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2 hours ago, Sweeney said:

All of this has already been said.

But to all of that I say- you can't leave a broken thing broken.

You just straight up can't. It's literally not an option.

Some way or another, they're gonna have to find a way to make it all work.

More so since DE wants the users to take their lore seriously.

If it was like LoL or Overwatch that lore is just there to spice things up but not the main content, then its fine to mostly overlook it.
But clearly seeing Tennocon and the contents that has been following since the Second dream, they do want us to take their lore seriously.

And if they want us to take it seriously, then they have to be sure that newcomers take the story seriously from the very beginning.
Thus returning to our problem. The tutorial and starchart must be fixed to include past major events and properly introduce a coherent storyline leading up to the second dream.

I personally would like it if it went this way.
Mercury: Tutorial and very basic introduction to who you are, the tenno, and struggling against the Grineer while also hinting what kind of faction they are.
Venus: Basic introduction to the Corpus, telling you that the Grineer is not alone, and show you how they differ.
Earth: Proper introduction to the Grineer with Vay Hek, our first big bad guy. Also earth would be a great place to start hinting the fall of the Orokin and show you are in a future SF scenario where our civilization once thrived through out the solar system and then have fallen.
Mars: Deeper understanding to the Grineer, the horrors they do (Like the stuff that happened in Inaros' questline). Great place to introduce Steel meridian as the resistance.
Phobos: Introduction to the Infested, and how they originated from the Orokin, showing that they weren't that good people either.
Jupiter: Alad V kidnaps a fellow tenno, giving a direct reason for our faction to fight against the Corpus. Also deeper understanding of the Corpus such as the board and etc. Great place to introduce the Perrin Sequence.
Saturn: Deeper drama with Steel meridian as Cressa tal used to work for Sargus Ruk
etc. etc.

and so on and so forth. Along the way we may have to revisit some planets, but I think by adding simple questlines and dialogues introducing past events would spice the starchart for new players much more easily. 
Its the starchart, it doesn't have to be deep as the main quests we have now, but it would be great to give purpose to the new player and slowly introduce the world and past events that lead towards the main quests that happen after the "Second dream". So that once the new player reaches the "Second dream" they feel admired focuses on the story rather than be confused and start having to read the goddamn wiki every 5 mins.

I hope they take this seriously.
Since they are redoing the tutorial, I hope they eventually fix all of it.

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On 2020-03-07 at 7:57 AM, Shaburanigud said:

More so since DE wants the users to take their lore seriously.

If it was like LoL or Overwatch that lore is just there to spice things up but not the main content, then its fine to mostly overlook it.
But clearly seeing Tennocon and the contents that has been following since the Second dream, they do want us to take their lore seriously.

And if they want us to take it seriously, then they have to be sure that newcomers take the story seriously from the very beginning.
Thus returning to our problem. The tutorial and starchart must be fixed to include past major events and properly introduce a coherent storyline leading up to the second dream.

I personally would like it if it went this way.
Mercury: Tutorial and very basic introduction to who you are, the tenno, and struggling against the Grineer while also hinting what kind of faction they are.
Venus: Basic introduction to the Corpus, telling you that the Grineer is not alone, and show you how they differ.
Earth: Proper introduction to the Grineer with Vay Hek, our first big bad guy. Also earth would be a great place to start hinting the fall of the Orokin and show you are in a future SF scenario where our civilization once thrived through out the solar system and then have fallen.
Mars: Deeper understanding to the Grineer, the horrors they do (Like the stuff that happened in Inaros' questline). Great place to introduce Steel meridian as the resistance.
Phobos: Introduction to the Infested, and how they originated from the Orokin, showing that they weren't that good people either.
Jupiter: Alad V kidnaps a fellow tenno, giving a direct reason for our faction to fight against the Corpus. Also deeper understanding of the Corpus such as the board and etc. Great place to introduce the Perrin Sequence.
Saturn: Deeper drama with Steel meridian as Cressa tal used to work for Sargus Ruk
etc. etc.

and so on and so forth. Along the way we may have to revisit some planets, but I think by adding simple questlines and dialogues introducing past events would spice the starchart for new players much more easily. 
Its the starchart, it doesn't have to be deep as the main quests we have now, but it would be great to give purpose to the new player and slowly introduce the world and past events that lead towards the main quests that happen after the "Second dream". So that once the new player reaches the "Second dream" they feel admired focuses on the story rather than be confused and start having to read the goddamn wiki every 5 mins.

I hope they take this seriously.
Since they are redoing the tutorial, I hope they eventually fix all of it.

It's really such a shame too.

I'm a crackhead for Warframe's story and cinematics.

More than new Warframes and weapons and accessories, I'm here for that juicy lore.

I grinded LIKE HELL to get my Railjack in time for Scarlet Spear. I still need to get my Paracesis built though.
 

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On 2020-03-04 at 4:54 PM, yarl5000 said:

They have said in the past it would require rebuilding everything about them basically due to how much the game has changed since they were an event, and that they aren't interested in putting time into it. 

They have almost 400 employees, I'm pretty sure it wouldn't be that hard. Also, what exactly would have to be rebuilt? Most of the old events were just introductions to new mission types which are now a part of the game.

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5 hours ago, (PS4)FastestKnight said:

After the next wave of UI updates, such as Endmission results, they should update the Codex and make Levarian more prominent, because is such a cool and well received concept that I fear they will forget about it like the other 70% stuff of this game.

Good news once consoles get the most recent patch (the refreshe one) they did that Lavarian is pulled out to be its own tab in the codex. 

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