The AOE damage fall off is much too aggressive.

[Poolboy]

I understand that DE doesn't want to unleash a wave of newly game breaking weapons with the removal of self damage, but they've gone from making some AoE weapons unworth using to making all of them unworth using. I would rather my Lenz and Zarr go back to being able to oneshot me than have them turned into single target weapons. This needs to changed ASAP. 

[8faiNt]

 

ahhhh... things get more valuable when you lose them, doesnt it?

Edited March 6, 2020 by 8faiNt

[Frostyinferno]

23 minutes ago, 8faiNt said:

 

ahhhh... things get more valuable when you lose them, doesnt it?

I mean, he's right though. The AOE nerf was way too heavy handed, especially against weapons that already were not "meta".

[WisdomOfTheWoods]

20 minutes ago, Poolboy said:

I understand that DE doesn't want to unleash a wave of newly game breaking weapons with the removal of self damage, but they've gone from making some AoE weapons unworth using to making all of them unworth using. I would rather my Lenz and Zarr go back to being able to oneshot me than have them turned into single target weapons. This needs to changed ASAP. 

Frankly, this. I would rather suffer self-damage AND stagger than have falloff damage actually start to become a mechanic in the game. Non-status AoEs have essentially been reduced to single-target with this crippling debuff to the aoe. This hit a gun like Kuva Chakkhurr especially hard, as its quirk and perk before the update was IN FACT a small AoE that did not have drawbacks in place of things like firerate, reload speed, and the fact it takes only sniper ammo.

The damage falloff as it is takes the distinct practicality out of nearly every AoE weapon, except the very few that can actually shrug it off. Not a 90%, not a 50%, just remove any debuff to the damage and instead use the vast other options:

• Mildier-scaling self damage combined with stagger/knockdown
• revert changes and just go back to old self damage. (and this time, try to poll for changes rather than forcing changes that a small handful of vocal forum-frequents claim "ought to be added")
• just have varying stagger effects that last longer the closer you are to the explosion
• new status procs that affect only the player instead of self damage?
• scale the self-damage way down, but raise the proc chance from self-damage for status types from the weapon.
• other ideas that involve not nerfing a weapon?

...Because that is essentially what as happened. AoE weapons got nerfed hard in a horribly botched bid to balance out removing self-damage.

[Poolboy]

10 minutes ago, Artimessheed said:

...Because that is essentially what as happened. AoE weapons got nerfed hard in a horribly botched bid to balance out removing self-damage.

Honestly, all they had to do was change self damage to a percentage of your health and it would have been fine. No more one-shotting yourself, and the weapons that do self damage still have an element of risk reward. Giving weapons that did not have self damage before what is essentially self damage throws balance all out of whack, without even considering the 90% falloff nerf.

[WisdomOfTheWoods]

The dumbest, most ironic thing, is that health-gating exists now. But it was added in the same update as the removal of self-damage... I am speechless at how poorly self-damage fixes were executed, only to leave us with a set of outright nerfed AoE weapons.

[(XBOX)GearsMatrix301]

8 hours ago, 8faiNt said:

 

ahhhh... things get more valuable when you lose them, doesnt it?

Ok, is the loss of other reacts a glitch or did they update the forums. And if they did update the forums where did they say they did.

[Traumtulpe]

48 minutes ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:

Ok, is the loss of other reacts a glitch or did they update the forums. And if they did update the forums where did they say they did.

It is intentional:

12 hours ago, [DE]Drew said:

Tenno, 

We have simplified the forum reactions to include only 'Like' (+1 Reputation). The previous reactions were essentially doing the same thing as a 'Like' by providing 1 Reputation. If you have a response that cannot be conveyed by an emoji, we encourage you to make a post explaining your opinion. Reactions are a good way to quickly show support, but posting your constructive thoughts is always appreciated. 

Thanks!

[BR31]

never asked for self -dmg to get removed, if they want to leave this huge falloff, 
at least  give us a mod , which enables self dmg and removes falloff. 
right now i just don't use my explosives weapons,
they were not the strongest things to begin with ,
a lot of them needed a buff ,
and just because of the bramma and just in case tonkor ,
they just nerfed all aoe weapons.
it's too much . 

[Borg1611]

I don't think there's any meaningful connection between self-damage and falloff. They added the falloff to many weapons that never had self-damage and that were never overpowered or popular. They just wanted to butcher all AoE damage and/or are just doing live beta testing to see how far they can nerf it before people riot. They already toned it down slightly today and will continue their live beta testing to see how much they feel they need to change it. I just hope they ditch the stagger on a lot of the weapons as well as it's completely unnecessary and just ruined a lot of weapons that weren't a problem. 

Edited March 6, 2020 by Borg1611

[ValloVN]

I really would recommend adding a point where damage falloff starts. About 2 meters example and then go lower from that point till max range of aoe. Certain weapons depend blast like Tonkor example. Right now u have to hit enemy near toes to deal max 99% of dmg, but where those toes start who knows. So u end up dealing only 80% of dmg but never damage that is written for a weapon. Also using Ogris, is doing maximum massive 7m self knockback at range of 10m, while aoe is 9.8m (used codex scanner for distance measure) which will cause u death if u do high lvl mission , get knock down and die from bullets since ur stuck in animation. Enemies dont get knocked away from getting hit by blast. Instead of knock down please bring back self damage with 90% of falloff against player. With new shield gate player wouldnt die from accidental shots anyway anymore i think, would be another use for Shield gate.

Wish u all best.

Edited March 6, 2020 by ValloVN

[Aryustailm]

Even "lowered to 40%" like on some weapons, it's still 40% too much: AoE weapons had their ability to hurt multiples already accounted for in their damage, ammo count/type, reload time and other mechanics. Claiming "it's good now because you have to know how to aim to get the most use out of them" is disingenuous, as they've gained nothing to incentivize more careful aiming whatsoever - only massive penalties against everything but the primary target *if* you hit it accurately.

And from my own experience the stagger's a bigger penalty and more annoying to deal with than the self-damage ever was. Self-damage was replaced by a worse penalty and AoE damage reduced substantially "to pay for it".

[CaffeineTanuki]

Not only have these AoE weapons been nerfed with this whole falloff thing, they've been straight ripped from the meta. Penta and Tonkor used to be very widely used weapons, regulars alongside Soma, Latron Prime, Paris Prime, and Boltor Prime (Rest in peace, Noobcannon). Now they're no more than wall decorations unless you have the forma and mods to get them semi-usable in late game.

[Littlelosttank]

Best I can think of to make the aim worth it and not destroy the AOE part, is the AOE part only triggers effectively on a direct hit. But..... such is not the case at all. 

[Drago55577]

9 hours ago, Littlelosttank said:

Best I can think of to make the aim worth it and not destroy the AOE part, is the AOE part only triggers effectively on a direct hit. But..... such is not the case at all. 

That would be terrible for a lot of weapons. Simulor and Corinth being prime examples. Zarr is another.

[Dr.Membrane]

Am 6.3.2020 um 06:57 schrieb 8faiNt:

 

ahhhh... things get more valuable when you lose them, doesnt it?

Wise words mate and for that reason i never wanted a removel of the selfdamage because i was afraid what DE will do next ... I thought that it was ok to have this self-killing element because it ment that you needet skill to use this kind of weapons. The damage reward was underwelming in contrast to the high risk but hey in WF it could allways be worse ... i also understand that it needet to be changed, just for the reason that it killed the game-flow. But isnt it funny that the community asked again for an small favor and *BOOM here is your 90% damage nerf xD. I mean like what the hell the most of this confetti guns not even have crit and AOE is its main purpose xD. My Ogris got fcked once more and i bet the riven dispo will also fell by the next "balance"... DE realy hates this rocketlauncher.