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[DE]Rebecca

[PC] Mainline Post Launch Status: March 11 Update!

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Key pointers:
-Chroma needs his abilities to be addressed. I have a rework in mind that makes his 1 an exalted weapon and gives his 4 an alt-mode.
-Empyrean enemy armour scaling feels the same as it did pre-mainline. The only weapons that can kill them are melees.
-Moa default legs for Tenno Moa look weird.
-Shotguns are no longer effective in their designated purpose. Blindfiring a Bramma, or Kuva Ogris, in close range is more effective against Sortie-or-higher-level enemies than using Tigris Prime.
-Stats compared to their Mastery Rank for all weapons requires urgent reconsideration due to the sweeping damage changes.
-Ability selection button for controllers in Railjack configuration screen isn't rebind-able.

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Posted (edited)
10 minutes ago, Aadi880 said:

I actually like this lol xD

When you get to a decent level of skill in Conclave, the gating really starts hurting you. Not to mention, since headshots bypass gating, it makes the skill gap much bigger in an incredibly awkward way.

Edited by [DE]Saske
removed inappropriate phrase

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2 minutes ago, Frelus said:

Blast was trash, please keep it as it is now (hell, maybe buff its damage a little) and stop impact from knocking things down.

No it wasn't especially on aoe weapons, blast made most aoe weapons good CC 

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25 minutes ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

Hi all Tenno - we have just passed 24 hours post launch (only half of which are actual working hours, but all of which are playing hours ;)) and we have plans for a Hotfix today to address bugs and balance. You can expect that to land around 2 pm ET today on PC!

What may not be included (time permitting) but we do plan to address and review after more playtime:

- Launcher AOE
As indicated in the notes, we started conservative. We hope to have some tweaks in today’s Hotfix and will work toward that goal.
- Damage Types / Status Effects
Impact and Gas are under the closest review right now, expect changes to Impact to come first!
- Too easy vs. Too hard?
If you find yourself having conversations about difficulty, please link them here or let us know your reactions to this topic - we have seen it discussed! 
- General Review + Double Affinity Weekend
There was so much in this Mainline that it’s hard to encapsulate the Hotfix plans post launch, but hop on this weekend and enjoy Double Affinity as a way to level your gear faster! We will have more notes on our plans next week - we are reviewing everything! Just because it is not on this list does not mean we are not reviewing. 

Thanks all - Red Text will appear today, and we’ll be working away toward Hotfixes near and far!

Feedback Thread Reminder Links:

  Reveal hidden contents

Bug Report Megathread:

https://forums.warframe.com/topic/1171888-warframe-revised-bug-report-megathread-read-the-first-post/


General Megathreads: 
Shield Gating: https://forums.warframe.com/topic/1171898-warframe-revised-shield-gating-megathread/
Armor, Health & Shield Changes: https://forums.warframe.com/topic/1171894-warframe-revised-armor-health-shield-changes-megathread/
Arcane Changes: https://forums.warframe.com/topic/1171899-warframe-revised-arcane-changes-megathread/
100x Restore Blueprint: https://forums.warframe.com/topic/1171907-warframe-revised-100x-restore-blueprint-megathread/
Railjack Onboarding Changes: https://forums.warframe.com/topic/1171890-warframe-revised-railjack-onboarding-changes-megathread/
Infested Damage: https://forums.warframe.com/topic/1171896-warframe-revised-infested-damage-megathread/
AI Aimbot Change: https://forums.warframe.com/topic/1171897-warframe-revised-ai-aimbot-change-megathread/


Warframe and Weapon Megathreads:   
Removing Self-Damage / Stagger: https://forums.warframe.com/topic/1171900-warframe-revised-removing-self-damage-stagger-megathread/  
Titania Changes & Vauban Tweak: https://forums.warframe.com/topic/1171903-warframe-revised-titania-changes-vauban-tweak-megathread/  
Sentinel Mod Sharing: https://forums.warframe.com/topic/1171909-warframe-revised-sentinel-mod-sharing-megathread/
>100% Status Chance / Shotgun: https://forums.warframe.com/topic/1171911-warframe-revised-100-status-chance-shotgun-megathread/
Status Chance Mod Buff: https://forums.warframe.com/topic/1171912-warframe-revised-status-chance-mod-buff-megathread/


Art / UI Megathreads:
UI Quality of Life Changes: https://forums.warframe.com/topic/1171906-warframe-revised-ui-quality-of-life-changes-megathread/
Grenade Marker Changes: https://forums.warframe.com/topic/1171913-warframe-revised-grenade-marker-megathread/
HDR Visual: https://forums.warframe.com/topic/1171918-warframe-revised-hdr-visual-megathread/
Deferred Rendering: https://forums.warframe.com/topic/1171919-warframe-revised-deferred-rendering-megathread/


Mission Megathreads: 
 Kuva Lich Murmur Change & Fix: https://forums.warframe.com/topic/1171916-warframe-revised-kuva-lich-murmur-change-fix-megathread/
 Mission Reward Cleanup: https://forums.warframe.com/topic/1171905-warframe-revised-mission-reward-cleanup-megathread/
Excavation Scaling Changes: https://forums.warframe.com/topic/1171901-warframe-revised-excavation-scaling-megathread/


 

so far... the only 'launcher' that isn't unusable is the kuva bramma.... which isn't surprising since the bramma is nucking futs.

impact/gas are really bad atm... suggestion: impact adds 5% damage taken per proc and staggers.

gas ... little more tricky with how crazy viral is now which is also the difficulty issues... viral with slash builds now are so far beyond anything else you can currently build that difficulty in the game is an absolute joke.

we're currently doing almost 40 times the damage prior to the update. i've had hunter munitions slash bleeds ticking for 200k+ and we've gone from even a lvl 30 nox having an ability to survive to getting one hit at 200+

 

not to mention.... hildryn is currently unplayable... like full on not able to maintain shields getting 1 hit for the whole 5k while literally not being able to regen after shield gate has wore off. aegis nerf, and delay changes have made her excessively weak with still no >> REAL << shield damage mitigation and the only way to play her is almost exclusively support spamming 2nd ability.

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2 minutes ago, Koldraxon-732 said:


-Empyrean enemy armour scaling feels the same as it did pre-mainline. The only weapons that can kill them are melees.
 

Having done my tests with the new mechanics for a variety of weapons against the exo enemies, I must state you are exaggerating that only melee can reliably kill them. And that's having them at higher levels than they usually spawn at.

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vor 34 Minuten schrieb [DE]Rebecca:

As indicated in the notes, we started conservative.

This needs to stop. When the update drops we should be most excited about what has changed but this kills that completely. Let new stuff be powerful so we care about it.

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5 minutes ago, Koldraxon-732 said:

Key pointers:
-Chroma needs his abilities to be addressed. I have a rework in mind that makes his 1 an exalted weapon and gives his 4 an alt-mode.
-Empyrean enemy armour scaling feels the same as it did pre-mainline. The only weapons that can kill them are melees.
-Moa default legs for Tenno Moa look weird.
-Shotguns are no longer effective in their designated purpose. Blindfiring a Bramma, or Kuva Ogris, in close range is more effective against Sortie-or-higher-level enemies than using Tigris Prime.
-Stats compared to their Mastery Rank for all weapons requires urgent reconsideration due to the sweeping damage changes.
-Ability selection button for controllers in Railjack configuration screen isn't rebind-able.

agree. chroma needs something done so he's usable on lower end content, and not hyper squishy without max rank arcanes.

shotguns i think are very bugged... some of them have been at 300% status per pellet. i'm sure there's something to be addressed there.

unbelievably agree with increasing mastery rank requirements for weapons. there's in my opinion no reason to go above 16 due to rivens being the max of 16, and you can get lower mastery rank rivens. i honestly think kuva weapons should have a 18-20 requirement while overall rebalancing weapons from 1 to 18. i got to MR16 in about 2 months of playing and have no reason to continue getting mastery as the tests aren't hard, and genuinely makes zero difference if i'm 16 or 26.

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10 minutes ago, DonGheddo said:

The game is too easy !

Yes shieldgating is to strong weather that's because the enemies damage needs to be buffed I dont know, but if they did that I would have nothing against them buffing AOE weapons if that means that the enemies also kill us quicker 

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I may be in the minority, but I think the new knockdown recovery is awful. I was hoping I'd be able to use other frames than Nehza, Rhino and Atlas without feeling like a soccer ball in an elementary school playground at lunchtime, but no. Make it automatic, I shouldn't have to tap yet another key for my Space Ninja to get off his/her/it's back and start fighting again.

And for God's sakes, give those of us who hunt liches via mumurs (instead of guessing and stabbing) a break on the murmur collecting. Also it's an awful grind to get a 25% weapon to 60% when all you get is 25% weapons to upgrade it with. My last 4 kuva weapons have been all been in the 25-28 percent range. It seems like the low end is a wee bit over represented.

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Posted (edited)
38 minutes ago, Senguash said:

Thanks for a great update.

I love the fact that we've gotten rid of self damage, it's a good change.

But the removal of self damage along with the changes to scaling has lead to this.

IMO, that's way too much damage considering it's AoE and just how many things I could do to increase it.

I could use a buff frame, use an offensive arcane, debuff the enemies or use a good riven mod. 

I love the changes to status and enemy scaling, and the addition of shield gating because they create the potential for having challenging gameplay that doesn't feel frustrating or requires being trivialized entirely,

but if we can melt lvl 170's with minimal effort, and the game only presents us with lvl 0-100 enemies we're not there yet. 

You're using Simulacrum footage with enemy AI turned off as justification for the game being too easy?

You're a clown.

Edited by Dragazer
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33 minutes ago, Zelmen said:

Wish there was better information on when this was going to be. Was mentioned on Dev stream without date (as expected because... mainline), and then mentioned on prime time last night. Forum post only made this morning. Was going to try to get my hand on more weapons / frames or re-craft weapons due to changes. But, now the farm / craft time will take most of weekend unless I give into the pressure of getting plat to rush / buy from market.

Yeah, they rarely announce these kinds of things in advance. I think in this case it was meant for players who have to burn all their P* forma on changing elements/builds.
 

The mastery grind is slow and arduous. It’s best to farm plat slowly through vault runs/Prelate boss/etc. until you get afford a 30 day booster.

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I haven't had access to this update yet, but I do feel from what I've read that the status of impact and blast should be switched. I love taking my blast hammers and watching the enemies ragdoll.

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Literally trembling for this update to hit console. If arcane changes don’t get tweaked more before cert it’s gonna be my worst experience in Warframe. 

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3 minutes ago, 3rdpig said:

I may be in the minority, but I think the new knockdown recovery is awful. I was hoping I'd be able to use other frames than Nehza, Rhino and Atlas without feeling like a soccer ball in an elementary school playground at lunchtime, but no. Make it automatic, I shouldn't have to tap yet another key for my Space Ninja to get off his/her/it's back and start fighting again.

And for God's sakes, give those of us who hunt liches via mumurs (instead of guessing and stabbing) a break on the murmur collecting. Also it's an awful grind to get a 25% weapon to 60% when all you get is 25% weapons to upgrade it with. My last 4 kuva weapons have been all been in the 25-28 percent range. It seems like the low end is a wee bit over represented.

agree. i've used rhino more in the past few days than i have ever before. HATE the new stagger system.

lich grind in half would be nice, and some sort of way to focus in on a weapon you want a lich to spawn with because running cass 100 times is real S#&amp;&#036; design.

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I think the problem most feel in terms of difficulty is that the enemies we fight aren't engaging enough. If enemies had more variety with their behavior and attack patterns as well as defense patterns, difficulty would feel better.

A good example of enemy difficulty and player engagement is DOOM. Enemies in DOOM get higher stats as the difficulty increases, but the biggest change is in the behavior of the AI. The AI at the hardest difficulty know how to better counter attack the player and this encourages the player to think about different ways to engage the enemy. Right now, enemies in Warframe only increase in stats and nothing else.

If there is to be another Warframe Revised, Enemy AI needs to be on the top of the list for new changes/additions.

Info on DOOM and DOOM Eternal and how they approach enemy AI:

 

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1 minute ago, DariusMcSwag said:

I think the problem most feel in terms of difficulty is that the enemies we fight aren't engaging enough. If enemies had more variety with their behavior and attack patterns as well as defense patterns, difficulty would feel better.

A good example of enemy difficulty and player engagement is DOOM. Enemies in DOOM get higher stats as the difficulty increases, but the biggest change is in the behavior of the AI. The AI at the hardest difficulty know how to better counter attack the player and this encourages the player to think about different ways to engage the enemy. Right now, enemies in Warframe only increase in stats and nothing else.

If there is to be another Warframe Revised, Enemy AI needs to be on the top of the list for new changes/additions.

Info on DOOM and DOOM Eternal and how they approach enemy AI:

 

it's less about them being engaging, and more about how we need to have enemies be at like 500 before they're not instantly obliterated currently, and the damage they output compared to how excessively weak they are in terms of health is essentially both parties having 1 hp. when you can take a braton mk-1 into a sortie and murder things.... there's a clear issue.

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Why was self stagger added to many weapons which weren't stated? Why do Sonicor and Mutalist Quanta's orb explosion have it?

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Please cancel the coptering nerf . Thanks

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2 minutes ago, TheFoxing said:

it's less about them being engaging, and more about how we need to have enemies be at like 500 before they're not instantly obliterated currently, and the damage they output compared to how excessively weak they are in terms of health is essentially both parties having 1 hp. when you can take a braton mk-1 into a sortie and murder things.... there's a clear issue.

I think both are equally important. The ability to kill them with a MK1 Braton in sorties is due to their health stats and every single enemy running at you in a conga line, without bothering to get to cover or to flank you.

Plus enemy AI has been a weak spot in Warframe for a while now. Its due for a Revisit.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

- Launcher AOE
As indicated in the notes, we started conservative. We hope to have some tweaks in today’s Hotfix and will work toward that goal.

Conservative in what way? Because how this impacted launchers (or AoE weapons in general) varies widely from weapon to weapon. Pseudo launchers like the Chakkurr got completely destroyed by the radius changes, while weapons like the Tonkor are only slightly worse overall, or better at high levels due to the armor scaling changes. I only got my Bramma post patch, but some people are saying that it's actually universally better. I don't believe there's any set of global changes you can make that are going to get what you want.

1 hour ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

- Damage Types / Status Effects
Impact and Gas are under the closest review right now, expect changes to Impact to come first!

Corrosive also ain't doing so hot anymore. With that hard cap, the shotgun changes, the limited duration, etc etc, there's no reason to use it over something like Viral/Fire. Impact needs to do something completely different, as does puncture, to be useful within Warframe. And yeah, Gas is absolutely awful now. It really should just be reverted to the way it worked pre-patch.

1 hour ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

- Too easy vs. Too hard?

At the levels most of the game takes place at, nothing about the difficulty has really changed. It mostly pans out around the same place it did before. What's changed is what weapons and loadouts are competitive. Crit is the new god in most cases, with just enough status to get a couple procs. Or in some cases many procs, beam weapons are one class of weapon who's status builds came out on top in this patch. Unsurprising when you consider that their PPS has always been more comparable with pre-nerf 100% shotguns. So much for balance, huh?

I tried warning people about this. You spent two years buffing other weapons before you dropped this. You're going in two directions at once with balance and wildly overshooting your target.

The armor changes really aren't really noticeable unless you're longrunning endless or doing arbitrations. Past that how people will perceive difficulty is going to depend heavily on what they have equipped, and in a lot of cases it amounts to very little once you change elementals around or focus more heavily on crit.

1 hour ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

- General Review + Double Affinity Weekend
There was so much in this Mainline that it’s hard to encapsulate the Hotfix plans post launch, but hop on this weekend and enjoy Double Affinity as a way to level your gear faster! We will have more notes on our plans next week - we are reviewing everything! Just because it is not on this list does not mean we are not reviewing. 

Y'know you're giving people rope to hang themselves with, right? I'm just saying. People are leveling the new hotness and if that can change at the drop of a hotfix people are gonna get mad.

Edited by XaoGarrent
Wanted to make something a bit more critical, and drive my point home more clearly.

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Just now, DariusMcSwag said:

I think both are equally important. The ability to kill them with a MK1 Braton in sorties is due to their health stats and every single enemy running at you in a conga line, without bothering to get to cover or to flank you.

Plus enemy AI has been a weak spot in Warframe for a while now. Its due for a Revisit.

they do take cover.... they're just dead long before they can. 

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Question: Why you all change some stuffs that doesn't need to be change? Eg, ....Gas?

.. And in the name of consistent or balance, how come you all create another element which most players are solely using now?

 

What happened?!

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Posted (edited)

Impact proc is just bad. just let the knockdown stuff on blast proc as they do badonkabooms.
How about making something useful for impact proc highest cap like temporary disarm on firearm unit / stun on melee unit?

That Aside did you guys really test explosives weapon aside from kuva bramma and acceltra? the fall off really kills the performance unless you hit the enemy dead headshot for maximum epicenter. Kuva Bramma was helped by the amount of explosion in single shot it does, making status stacking pretty doable. Acceltra isnt as high in status but the spammy nature finds its path as well. But many other explosives are not the spammy type like those, and they suffer far mroe from the unwanted falloffs, as if 50% isnt bad enough for them, 90%? come on.

Edited by Xsoskeleton
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