April 2020 Riven Disposition Updates & PC Trading PSA

[(PSN)gingernija999]

DE why do you hate fun? and please release just one update that isn't broken just one. ss is terrible right now on console i feel sorry for the game tes... PC players that had to put up with what it was like before. I love warframe but dam you guys make it hard to love sometimes

[(PSN)Mini-Boss_lBRl]

Seriously, DE. Stop messing around with rivens.

It's time consuming, takes a lot of resource (Kuva) just to find an acceptable roll or a god roll for a riven. That is, when you have the luck to find the riven for the weapon that you want or if you spent a lot of plat to buy one.

It's depressing how you guys "balance" things.

[Doraz_]

btw , where are the twin secondary class of weapons ???

[(XBOX)h0tsh0t2]

So many players will bail on the game because of the time you wasted on stupid nerfs instead of working on decent content. Joke's on you...

[HammerremmaH]

This is bad. 

[-Kittens-]

On 2020-04-09 at 8:02 AM, [DE]Connor said:

 

Kogake Prime: 1.46->1.4

Are you kidding?

[.Unforgotten.]

Hi folks,

I am here to offer some constructive criticism to DE. The recent changes to rivens are not exactly amazing, and as usual, we all are feeling overwhelmed by the fact that DE keeps nerfing the weapons that are overpowered. So in all honesty only 2 things need to be done to prevent such levels of retarded disappointment.

1. Remove Riven Limit Capacity.
2. Convert literally all rivens back to Disposition 1 and leave it at that.

Some Explanation for Point #2.

Balancing is not to be done with mods, but more so with the weapons base stats. If that is too much of a trouble for the Developers, then kindly do not release weapons unless you have tested the weapons with literally every mod combo available and god-roll rivens yourself on your Dev builds. I am pretty sure, some testers are given access to the Dev build every now and then, have them test it. Get the reports for EVERY possible outcome, or use an AI to view the highest weapon stats/combos/damage etc.
If you can make time and effort to view statistics of which weapons are powerful, then you can definitely make time and effort to make such needed changes prior to releasing your weapons, preventing them from being overpowered from the start. 
Allowing for Disposition to be 1 for every weapon without needing to change it in the future will allow players not to feel overwhelmed because of nerfs, since nerfs would not be focused on rivens. Essentially, if the weapons are tested properly prior to release, then there would be no need for nerfing them in the first place, let alone having to change riven dispositions. Having all riven dispositions at 1 would allow the same amount of stats to be achievable on the Rivens themselves, regardless of the weapon, thereby, the selection of weapons being dependent on a players taste and play-style.
It is high time that this nerf hammer for everything needs to stop. If something cannot be released without predicting all possible outcomes, that just means bad Quality Control on the Developers end. (For players even trying to defend DE, don't do it. It is a Developers job to ensure the code works, and that's why they have Dev builds where a selected number of Quality Test players - who should be paid for testing if an AI program is not in DE's budget - should report all possible outcomes on all possible factions/builds/strategies etc).

Make your life as easy as ours without having the community feel pushed back every time because of the changes you keep making to your own ecosystem.

TEST BEFORE RELEASE, NOT AFTER, THAT IS THE ESSENCE OF AGILE DEVELOPMENT AND QUALITY CONTROL.

Sincerely,
.Unforgotten.

[(PSN)Reinbach_3rd]

48 minutes ago, .Unforgotten. said:

Remove Riven Limit Capacity.

I suspect that they would need to make rivens a lot less random in order to do that to reduce the potential storage space required.

[.Unforgotten.]

11 minutes ago, (PS4)Reinbach_3rd said:

I suspect that they would need to make rivens a lot less random in order to do that to reduce the potential storage space required.

The problem is, all rivens take up a slot inside riven capacity. Either split the capacity to be individual 120 for each type of riven (shotgun/rifle/secondary/melee) or they have to remove capacity altogether. This is a frustrating subject and I usually tend to stay away from dev bashing, but it's high time that DE started looking into core mechanics/functionalities.

[(PSN)Reinbach_3rd]

11 minutes ago, .Unforgotten. said:

The problem is, all rivens take up a slot inside riven capacity. Either split the capacity to be individual 120 for each type of riven (shotgun/rifle/secondary/melee) or they have to remove capacity altogether. This is a frustrating subject and I usually tend to stay away from dev bashing, but it's high time that DE started looking into core mechanics/functionalities.

If there's only one problem with rivens; it's not that, it's their existence.

[.Unforgotten.]

2 minutes ago, (PS4)Reinbach_3rd said:

If there's only one problem with rivens; it's not that, it's their existence.

Well, I can most certainly guarantee that the Devs won't remove it. I totally agree with you, but its an evil they will NEVER remove from the game. So as long as this evil exists, why not just make it work in a way that is not crucifying the player-base?

[ThatIsWeed]

u nearly nerfed 20 of my weapons .... so sad :C i am not happy about this update...

[(PSN)Reinbach_3rd]

17 minutes ago, .Unforgotten. said:

Well, I can most certainly guarantee that the Devs won't remove it. I totally agree with you, but its an evil they will NEVER remove from the game. So as long as this evil exists, why not just make it work in a way that is not crucifying the player-base?

Giving all weapons the same disposition rather defeats the purpose of adding rivens to the game in the first place and if anything, would only make the issue of people chasing the best rivens for the best weapons even worse. I could only get behind such a measure if the disposition was set a lot lower than 1, thereby rendering all rivens equally worthless.

If they aren't going to remove rivens then making it so that only veiled can be traded would be a good start.

[.Unforgotten.]

16 minutes ago, (PS4)Reinbach_3rd said:

Giving all weapons the same disposition rather defeats the purpose of adding rivens to the game in the first place and if anything, would only make the issue of people chasing the best rivens for the best weapons even worse. I could only get behind such a measure if the disposition was set a lot lower than 1, thereby rendering all rivens equally worthless.

If they aren't going to remove rivens then making it so that only veiled can be traded would be a good start.

It's again something that DE won't do. Starting off at 1 and leaving it there will allow both sides to win. Players who want a niche setup with rivens can live with a basic boost without going over the top with the weapons. While those who don't wish to use it can go on about without having to worry about it.

But at the same time it won't hurt the players who invest time and effort into rolling rivens and not completely destroy the market either. It's a balance between the two. To be honest, its the weapons that need tinkering and not the rivens. If my suggestion is looked into that is. Otherwise, it will always be a sh1t-show with riven/no-riven setup because it's the stupid weapons out-performing and rivens taking them even further, a good example would be rubico, redeemer, bramma, nukor, etc (the list will keep going on).

[(PSN)Reinbach_3rd]

27 minutes ago, .Unforgotten. said:

It's again something that DE won't do. Starting off at 1 and leaving it there will allow both sides to win. Players who want a niche setup with rivens can live with a basic boost without going over the top with the weapons. While those who don't wish to use it can go on about without having to worry about it.

But at the same time it won't hurt the players who invest time and effort into rolling rivens and not completely destroy the market either. It's a balance between the two. To be honest, its the weapons that need tinkering and not the rivens. If my suggestion is looked into that is. Otherwise, it will always be a sh1t-show with riven/no-riven setup because it's the stupid weapons out-performing and rivens taking them even further, a good example would be rubico, redeemer, bramma, nukor, etc (the list will keep going on).

No, it won't allow both sides to win. Riven snake oil salesmen would win because the meta weapon rivens they are holding would get buffed and everyone who realises that rivens were a mistake would lose because the market for them would get bigger.

[SpookzNGlory]

Do you not see how toxic the Riven disposition changes are? 

Not only does it spit in the face of the effort,the grind, or money people have spent it also serves no purpose. Dose a dispo of 1 vs 5 suddenly make up for a weapon having no range? Or terrible base damage? Did nerfing a gun like the Arca Plasmor suddenly mean people weren't using it? It's not like it is too tier damage, it looks cool you get it pretty early and it's fun to use but top tier damage it isn't. 

One thing that puzzles me you say it's based on usage but is that on usage of weapons with rivens equipped or with just usage in general? That's quite a distinction are our rivens being effected by players who don't invest in them? 

Also weapon usage isn't just about damage it's lots of things. When when countless YouTubers make videos on the dokrham a weapon you can get really early and is really fun so lots of people use jt. You have things like skins, tennogen skins all stuff you actually make money off of contribute to a weapons popularity taake the Tatsu a mediocre weapon at best but add it as first of it's type to game billed as space ninjas add a brilliant stance and some beautiful tennogen skins and low and behold it's popular, it doesn't suddenly make it top tier it just makes it popular.

 

Its arrogant of you to think that every weapon you make is actually worth playing and penalizing a small portion of us every few months to push that notion is ridiculous.

[Doc-Orange]

As always. DE forces us to grind for a good weapon and then nerf it.

DE is on the Dark Side

[Zinnfolie]

What the game needs at this point (as some may have said before, perhaps) is taking out the rivens and adding a system that gives the players a chance to upgrade certain weapons of their choice with special items/challenges/processes, like augmenting the base damage, cc, cd, sc, etc., stablishing a limit for such modifications depending on the weapon (like getting the stats up to an extra 10-20% from the base stat) and nuking the rivens so there's no more tears for those who shed tears for a system they already know well how it works.

With that said, there's also a lot of little things they should have focused on before that last update/hotfix, like, you know, a certain weapon that not even a riven can fix due to bugs:

 

[(PSN)grayhyh]

the riven dispo changes werent even amazing,some weapons got tiny buffs and overused weps got a bit of a major dispo nerf,not sure if its affects me much since i use rivens for less used weps that are actually a bit of an hidden gem rn after the mainline update but like ... rivens are supposed to make less used/bad weps more fun and useful,instead people still use dumb no brain S#&$ like ignis wraith and poopy plasmor

[GunRaptor9000]

DE, this system is terrible, as it bait and switches players.

Further, the 120 limit makes me less interested in playing because I can't collect more.

While rivens are a cool concept, you disincentivize players with the limits and constant changes...which are usually large over-reactive nerfs or faux buffs to make it look like dispo changes aren't just "nerf what players are enjoying" season.

[Luxpluff]

I've said this back in 2016, when The War Within came out, I'll say it again: Rivens are a huge mistake.

The problem with Rivens is that the whole system is built on a false premise: trying to balance weapons so they all become usable and/or popular. That is never going to happen, because if weapon A is better than B, then obviously A will be more popular; and if you try and make B stronger than A (e. g. via Rivens), then people will abandon A in favor of B. It is an unending cycle that makes no sense whatsoever (why should all weapons perform similarly in the first place?).

[RiceHat_]

This is why I hate rivens, the farm for kuva, over priced market because it's "GOD ROLL" and this, freakin nerfs just because it's too popular. Just remove rivens if you keep nerfing because it popular. People break backs for kuva for a good riven roll and then bam! nerf!

[SpookzNGlory]

Can I just add a quick question you had previously mentioned you wouldn't nerf Kohm rivens what made you change your mind? And by change your mind I mean lie openly to your players?

[Zinnfolie]

On 2020-04-09 at 8:02 AM, [DE]Connor said:

In the past, we stated that shotguns relying on Rivens to reach 100% status chance (like the Kohm and Detron) would have their dispositions "locked", as a small decrease could cause a major loss in power. Since status chance on shotguns received systemic changes in the Warframe Revised update, the previously stated restrictions on these Rivens no longer apply.

 

50 minutes ago, SpookzNGlory said:

Can I just add a quick question you had previously mentioned you wouldn't nerf Kohm rivens what made you change your mind? And by change your mind I mean lie openly to your players?

There's your answer, 3 days earlier. Please read the text.

[Prime_Reckoner]

On 2020-04-09 at 6:44 PM, WarriorSoundwave said:

This is getting on my nerves.

You Nerf Tipedo, the one Weapon I feel like I can actually main aside from Scoliac (which is trash and I doubt anyone else is using, so why didn't it get buffed?).

Baza Prime? Nerfed. And yet it's already underwhelming and needs all the dispo it can get. Not to mention that the prime isn't much better than the base.

Ninkondi Prime, one of my favorite melees before melee 3.0, is now trash and then to top it off you nerf it's riven disposition.

There are nerfs to weapons that just don't even make sense. You are aware that sometimes players use weapons because they're actually FUN or just have good base stats? Continuously nerfing rivens for weapons like Fulmin and Rubico when we are going to keep using them anyways? You just gonna keep going until they hit 0.01 dispo? It probably won't change their usage stats much so I don't get what you're trying to balance. 

And someone tell me what the hell the point of having a Prime is if it's going to be the same or weaker than it's standard counterpart with rivens? 

All these changes are just stupid and all they do is piss the player base off. Why not keep all riven dispos the same and buff all the underperforming weapons like Stug? Heck Stug would need at least a 6/5 to be usable.

This is why I don't ever buy rivens for anything. I'm paranoid of the nerfs to my favorite melee weapons. 

I'm probably gonna get a lot of flak from the community for being so negative but DE needs to know how I feel.

 

Trust me, you won't get any flak. DEfenders are still there, but they are hiding right now. Even they can't defend this garbage system. And let me tell you, rivens are the worst type of system I have seen in any videogame ever. In 20 years, I have not seen a more absurd system than rivens. Ever in my life.