The Nukers are stealing my kills : matchmaking solution instead of nerf ?

[MacIntoc]

2 hours ago, Dark_RRiderr said:

If you ban nukers, you loose one half of the games playerbase.

You can't know that. They may be simply very loud.

Moreover, isn't it better to be avoided by a few players than a definitive ban of our stuff ? Because for now, it's it happen : after a nerf, a stuff is a shadow of what it was. In the end, there is no real difference with a ban (we keep the skin ?).

 

2 hours ago, Dark_RRiderr said:

just by now suddenly people got nothing better to do and suddenly after all this years so many start complaining about something that was part of the game for so long?

Is not so recent. We've got Tonkor, Simulor, Ash ult, Telos Boltace,... many years ago (before the Plains).

 

2 hours ago, Dark_RRiderr said:

What you do right now is, forcing other players to play the game the way YOU like, because if you havent thought about it... that is what you right now do with suggestion to just get rid of it because YOU dont like it (and yes of course others as well but still, you and others with that opinion vs the ones enjoying it and you force them to play the way of just 1 group)

In what way ?
We just won't see anymore players that don't make kills event if they would want to. What it's changing for us ? I don't see.
But for them, they can make kill again and shouldn't complaint anymore that a stuff prevent them to make kill and it need a nerf.

In case you hadn't figured it out, i'm part of thoses who don't want to see stuff nerfed because somes complains they prevent them to make kill. I'm one of those who's turning Warframe in a hallway simulator. And since it's not technically possible to automatically prevent being on a squad with people who don't want to play a hallway simulator, I'm trying to find a solution to allow players to be identified as not wanting to play a hallway simulator.
And no, playing solo or lose time to build a squad is not a solution since we have still complains and nerf.

 

2 hours ago, str4dlin said:

Someone could be leveling a Loki and expects someone can help him with the afinity sharing and finds a guy with a pistol. Are they going then to blame Loki because he is not doing real help?

Same as now. I don't see your point.

 

2 hours ago, str4dlin said:

The concept of the game is what it is. And I would like to see people here arguing about nuke frames playing versus high tier mobs. Have they ever try to build or go simulator? Have they ever played versus high level mobs? Have they ever play index rounds to get the challenge?

When you discover Volt 4th skill can kill mobs level 20 but it is not done for DPS, Saryn can't kill mobs after a mid-tier range and it is done for armor decreasing or equinox is more a support when you find yourself playing versus adult NPCs.

Probably then they will return the forum to say "Oh, S#&$! it is imposible! You have to nerf the mobs".

Always the same questions always the same answers.

And alway the same probleme : that lead to nerf. You can stop repeating yourself whenever you want.

 

Edited May 20, 2020 by MacIntoc

[(PSN)CodyXSavageX]

If you don’t want people nuking through everything there should be content that forces you and your team to play smarter by actually protecting yourself, the objective and ccing enemies

This way they don’t overwhelm you if your entire team cannot defend themselves or the objective under constant fire instead of trying to make fodder enemies not fodder in a fodder mission for people trying to get stronger to kill something harder than a fodder enemy 

Edited May 20, 2020 by (PS4)CodyXSavageX

[(XBOX)Calliber]

....this has to be a bait topic it's so ludicrous. 

[(XBOX)TooMad]

LOL! If I could I'd give you a gold star, everybody-wins-trophy, and ice cream (no sprinkles). Good job! pats on head

[MacIntoc]

4 hours ago, (XB1)Calliber said:

....this has to be a bait topic it's so ludicrous. 

 

3 minutes ago, (XB1)TooMad said:

LOL! If I could I'd give you a gold star, everybody-wins-trophy, and ice cream (no sprinkles). Good job! pats on head

Yeah... that's the problem with bait title. You'll get view but you can't have certitude on the quality of the content that can be generate.

[Alvengerz]

On 2020-05-19 at 5:50 PM, str4dlin said:

Matchmaking solution 1: Go Solo

I think this is the only solution to op's problem because even friends and clanmates will still able to "steal" the kills and make op salty again lol

[IceColdHawk]

Legends have it that using non trash weapons or decent modded frames can help immensely in getting kills even with a saryn in ESO.

Im just kidding about the legend part by the way. It actually does help a lot. But don't limit matchmaking. It will only make people unable to find squads. That's not a solution. 

[TheNeonGod]

If you can't get used to people killing mobs for you, well too bad. You will have to get used to it eventually. Well I rather complete the mission as fast as I can and get a good endless run score also the least damage taken or deaths, than getting the most kills. Well the solution is to go faster, be more strategic, and aim better, or do a mission solo were no one steal your kills. You might wanna watch out for a Titania shooting up and kill mobs so fast in your squad. Some people complain in a relic extermination run when we all have 10 reactants and cry  volt to stop when we supposed to complete the mission as quickly as possible.

[Kaadu]

Affinity is shared, so I'm not sure what the problem is?
Also when levelling up a gun you don't want to use, it's more effective to have allies kill things.

As a group you are usually meant to be killing as many enemies as possible, so just contribute however you can and don't worry about the kill count.

[dota_Icarus]

Since the rewards are shared, it doesn't matter if some nukers are doing 90% of the dmg. You will get the same.

Sure the game doesn't make that much fun if smb is deleting everything and let you stand around, but if you want to have more fun, use more optimal gears to achieve that.

[(PSN)palebluelight]

I’ve been a proponent of skill based matchmaking but for the playerbase’s size I don’t think that’s realistic. Noobs with all noobs would make the game appear overly hard and there would be no example of what can be achieved with a warframe. 

On 2020-05-19 at 5:45 AM, MacIntoc said:

Hi,

I'm tired of this war between people who use stuff with a high kps (kps == kill per second) and those who don't. Saryn, Mesa, Ignis, Kuva Bramma, ... there is no shortage of examples of people who complain about not killing because they can't use or don't want to use the stuff for and instead moan to make these stuffs to be nerf up to the marrow.

So, why not give the players the choice to choose the stuf they want or don't want to go in squad with ? A simple list of the existing stuff with a checkbox telling the public matchmaking not to put them in a squad using one of the checked stuff (unless player itself use one of the checked stuff, of course). If they don't encounter theses stuffs, they should make kill again and stop to complain about "OP" stuff that prevent them to kill ?

No ?

 

[MacIntoc]

On 2020-05-21 at 7:31 PM, dota_Icarus said:

use more optimal gears to achieve that.

Like all the "must have" that always ends up being nerfed ? ^^'

[MacIntoc]

On 2020-05-21 at 7:31 PM, dota_Icarus said:

Sure the game doesn't make that much fun if smb is deleting everything and let you stand around

Yep, it's precisely the problem, in the end.

 

On 2020-05-21 at 7:31 PM, dota_Icarus said:

but if you want to have more fun, use more optimal gears to achieve that.

Like all the "must have" that always ends up being nerfed ?  ^^'

[Tokens210]

altho he was being fairly rude about it i understand what the 1 guy was saying

equinox gets alot of hate recently for being a "nuker"

and hes actually not, go into any mission solo with no rivened or non "meta" weapons, by time you generate enough to "nuke" anything your going to be out of energy and almost dead, then that nuke blows and you end up dead cause there was more enemies or nulls or whatever and you need to re build the power

better yet go into a missions with a full group thats not running meta stuff with enemies level 80+, they wipe the floor with your equinox

the problem is he can absorb all damage team mates deal pretty much instantly, and people are running weapons that land like 100-300k a hit, guess what equinox maim is now got 100-300k damage stored

on any planet up till like pluto, neptune or somewhere around there 100-300k will kill everything, even on those places 300k+ can probably wipe

 

the problem is with how much he can absorb in a single hit, which is why i said they dont even need to do anything except adjust how much he gets from single hits, but only when in a group

 

 

mesa REQUIRES line of sight to peacemaker anything, smoke effects this ability and so does enemies taking cover, so if we didnt have enemies standing in huge groups in a small area of a big map, if they actually split up and took cover this would be less of an issue

 

saryn i dont even know lol, havent played with her a crazy amount so i cant judge anything with her

 

banshee, whatever changes they made to banshee, since i last played did a good job to balance her cause while on low levels she can still AoE a pretty decent chunk, it now costs her alot of energy to make it do enough damage to kill them all very quickly (where she used to be more of a quake for 3 rounds almost straight, energy pad, quake for 3 rounds , etc)  but again her quake against later enemies more of a CC and barely damages them anymore, highest damage i can get my banshee quake without totally killing efficiency is i think 582 damage a second (with augment it can be increased the closer an enemy is but your range shrinks and cost goes up), thats is literally nothing compared to someone running around with a gun dropping 100k+ every time they shoot

 

i mean for the dear lords sake just look at poor ember, probably one of thee most sought after prime characters a few years ago, had the same issue, her World on Fire was able to wipe out enemies on low level content but on later content it actually was just a CC ability really, it could not kill them

yet ppl complained so much that now her change was to add a power that pretty much does the same thing but requires you to keep spinning or retargeting the same area etc etc, as a result, ive been playing the game again for maybe almost 2 months now, ive only seen 1 ember in any of my games, and 1 standing around cetus, 2 spotted in a single month from a character you used to see 1 per game lol

 

 

and before the responses like oh well just build them this way or that way, those are meta or cheese builds, it doesnt matter how many things get changed ppl will always find ways to make those builds anyway so it doesnt matter in this discussion

 

also keep in mind that the whole star chart up until the planets like pluto, and neptune and such are, atleast to older players "tutorial" planets, atleast back in the day they were super easy to blow thru then you hit a wall at the last few, this of course excludes any boss fights or reworked areas as DE currently seems to be attempting to fix our enemy issue atleast to some extent

Edited May 23, 2020 by Tokens210

[FireSegment]

how about instead of "i don't want to play with ...", we have:

- "join matches already in progress" toggle

- have some countdown (like 3-5s) before forcing player to a squad already in mission so they see what their teammate using.

 - have "leave squad" button available during that countdown so they can leave, before loading into mission.

 

[xXx_D0MINAT0R_xXx]

Solo is still a thing right?

[Aesthier]

On 2020-05-19 at 3:45 AM, MacIntoc said:

The Nukers are stealing my kills : matchmaking solution ?

The current matchmaking solution is to simply not use the public function of the grouping tool and use the friends, invite only, or solo functions instead.

If players continue to refuse to use the tools they already have at their disposal DE could simply remove the public and invite functions from the grouping tool and upgrade the friends function to only allow people into your group if they are on your friends list.

Thus if player 1 gets butt hurt over player 2 not playing according to the desires of the first then all player 1 has to do is take player 2 off their friends list and never play with them again.

This would reduce the amount of "nerf this" complaints in the forums giving the Developers time to focus on more important things like content rather than idiotic requests based in selfishness and envy.

If that doesn't work they can just remove the grouping function altogether.

 

~Simplified solutions to idiotic issues.

[(PSN)chris1pat8twins]

26 minutes ago, Aesthier said:

The current matchmaking solution is to simply not use the public function of the grouping tool and use the friends, invite only, or solo functions instead.

If players continue to refuse to use the tools they already have at their disposal DE could simply remove the public and invite functions from the grouping tool and upgrade the friends function to only allow people into your group if they are on your friends list.

Thus if player 1 gets butt hurt over player 2 not playing according to the desires of the first then all player 1 has to do is take player 2 off their friends list and never play with them again.

This would reduce the amount of "nerf this" complaints in the forums giving the Developers time to focus on more important things like content rather than idiotic requests based in selfishness and envy.

If that doesn't work they can just remove the grouping function altogether.

 

~Simplified solutions to idiotic issues.

That would be like CoD players complaining about shotgun users and demand that Treyarch or Activision remove shotguns.
 

They act like they are the only ones who had to go through missions with veteran players. Feel useless before gaining all the other frames. Before learning how the game works. 
 

Each frame has a use/purpose and some of them is nuking the entire map of weaker enemies. The stupidity of the whole complaint is that they won’t think the same when it comes to high level enemies. 
 

You don’t see or hear “nukers” demanding that ability resistance/immune enemies be removed because they interfere with their nuking. 
 

Simple solution would be for DE to make more enemies who are resistant to abilities. Kind of like how the Demolists can cancel abilities while also being more resistant to some. 
 

But the whole “nerf this for everybody else so that I can(and everybody else be forced to) play the game my way” demands is extremely selfish not to mention childish. 

[Aesthier]

2 minutes ago, (PS4)chris1pat8twins said:

But the whole “nerf this for everybody else so that I can(and everybody else be forced to) play the game my way” demands is extremely selfish not to mention childish. 

I agree wholeheartedly!

Which is why I posted what I did.

If players want to continually make childish demands then perhaps we should meet them with childish solutions to give them pause before making such requests again.

Edited May 23, 2020 by Aesthier

[MacIntoc]

@Aesthier

Except that don't work. The only solution that work for now, is "nerf this" or "nerf that". We still have the futur nerf of Bramma and Saryn for exemple. And don't it seem better to allow players to say that they don't want to play with me instead of to allow them to nerf the stuff i like to play with ?

 

12 hours ago, (PS4)chris1pat8twins said:

Simple solution would be for DE to make more enemies who are resistant to abilities. Kind of like how the Demolists can cancel abilities while also being more resistant to some. 

Yeah... like they did with Sentients ?? We have already a lot of mobs that can ignore or cancel some or all abilities (without counting bosses). But i don't think that making most of enemies ignoring Warframe is a good idea in a game named Warframe. Warframes are powerful thanks to there's abilities. Moreover, that doesn't change somethings for weapons.

[(PSN)FriendSharkey]

Well first off my Kuva Tonkor can keep pace with the Kuva Bramma and two, those weapons...well God bless De for putting something in that can sorta present an illusion of keeping up with an Ember who's doing everything they can to keep in front of you...but, that's Warframe since year one...

 

So here's what you do...if you get a bunch of nuke frames just hogging the kills, you go scavenge mode... Listen you are in those missions to make life better for you and your gaming experience..and all those materials are gonna come in handy, especially if you're building a dojo...

I used to get mad like everyone else, but now I just simply don't care..my kill count could populate Europe with Grineer, so if an Ember or a Saryn shows up I just lope along and hit every crate and resource while finding the sculptures...because they have to wait for me to show up at extraction or run down the clock...and in that time I'm making sure that the next time something shows up that I have to build...well no worries...done on the first go thanks to over eager Saryn and all the other Nukers.

Edited May 24, 2020 by (PS4)FriendSharkey

[Tokens210]

2 hours ago, MacIntoc said:

@Aesthier

Except that don't work. The only solution that work for now, is "nerf this" or "nerf that". We still have the futur nerf of Bramma and Saryn for exemple. And don't it seem better to allow players to say that they don't want to play with me instead of to allow them to nerf the stuff i like to play with ?

 

Yeah... like they did with Sentients ?? We have already a lot of mobs that can ignore or cancel some or all abilities (without counting bosses). But i don't think that making most of enemies ignoring Warframe is a good idea in a game named Warframe. Warframes are powerful thanks to there's abilities. Moreover, that doesn't change somethings for weapons.

sentients like mimics and such are affected by warframe abilities, ive slow them with nova or freeze them with rhino, they just arnt effected anywhere near as long and sometimes just ignore it which heavy troops can do with cc effects sometimes, theyll "walk it off" if you will well before the other enemies

their resistance it to all elements and is part of their lore

they were created for mining and gathering resources, as such they were given the ability to instantly adapt to any environmental hazards such as cold or radiation, so they could go places their creators could not, void damage is still very harmful to them being sentients

[MacIntoc]

@Tokens210

LOL ! The excuse put out by DE to justify the resistance of the Sentients against the abilities of the Warframes is just Vaseline.

Where does it say somewhere that Sentients are able to adapt to all kinds of damage AND, at the same time, to the capabilities of Warframes ? Before the patch note, of course... It's just bullS#&$ for not admitting that they screwed up the design of their event.

Speaking about lore... if the Sentients were created by Orokins after the Warframes, to adapt to the Warframes' abilities, it would be fine. But Sentients were created before the Warframes.The Warframes were created by the Orokins precisely to counter the Sentient's ability to adapt to damage. It would be absurd to create a weapon specifically against an enemy who is adapted to it.

DE changes the lore as it suits them at an instant T, no matter if it is coherent or not, if it's in contradiction with what is already existing or even the basics of the concept of warframes. Don't rely on it to justify the ingame mechanics.

But we're going off topic, please back to the subject.

[Tokens210]

57 minutes ago, MacIntoc said:

@Tokens210

LOL ! The excuse put out by DE to justify the resistance of the Sentients against the abilities of the Warframes is just Vaseline.

Where does it say somewhere that Sentients are able to adapt to all kinds of damage AND, at the same time, to the capabilities of Warframes ? Before the patch note, of course... It's just bullS#&$ for not admitting that they screwed up the design of their event.

Speaking about lore... if the Sentients were created by Orokins after the Warframes, to adapt to the Warframes' abilities, it would be fine. But Sentients were created before the Warframes.The Warframes were created by the Orokins precisely to counter the Sentient's ability to adapt to damage. It would be absurd to create a weapon specifically against an enemy who is adapted to it.

DE changes the lore as it suits them at an instant T, no matter if it is coherent or not, if it's in contradiction with what is already existing or even the basics of the concept of warframes. Don't rely on it to justify the ingame mechanics.

But we're going off topic, please back to the subject.

The Birth of the Sentients

The Orokin came to realize that they were bringing harm to the Origin System and sought a solution. It was proposed by Archimedian Perintol that the Orokin could populate another star system called Tau. However, Tau would need to be terraformed for habitation as would a means of traveling there need to be developed. The Orokin created a race of synthetic beings, which later became known as the Sentients, to spearhead an expansion of Orokin influence beyond the Origin System into the Tau System. By terraforming the Tau System using the Sentients, the Orokin sought to expand and prevent their empire's destruction.^[22]

Sentient fighter

These original creations could adapt to any kind of damage and reproduced by fission while developing resistance to whatever had harmed them. They could also use any materials surrounding them to repair themselves. The Sentients were perfect to enter the hostile terrain of Tau and begin the terraforming process, but there was a risk that these new lifeforms could pose a serious threat to the Orokin, with their adaptability and reproductive capability making them nigh unbeatable. The Archimedian who proposed the technology said that there was a "flaw" in their design; the Void was poisonous to them and so they would not be a danger to the Orokin should something go wrong. The Sentients in Tau evolved and grew. Realizing that their Orokin creators would only bring ruin to Tau eventually as well, they rebelled.^[23] Exposure to the Void, which they needed to travel through to return to the Origin System, did not kill the Sentients but merely rendered them sterile, unable to reproduce.^[24][25] The Sentients under Hunhow (a leader or parent to the Sentients) began an invasion of the Origin System. Thus what would become known as The Old War began.

 

 

i agree they have been slightly altering the lore lately but this has been part of sentients since the start, mentioned atleast 2 or 3 times directly during the missions related to it (second dream and old war i believe), sentients  travel thru the void to get here or tau, i forget which is which, but this is where they learned void damage not only hurts them it removes their ability to replicate, its also learned later in said missions that void energy may infact kill them if they attempt to travel back thru, which is why hunhow is all burned looking, we havent made it far enough into the story yet to know for sure, hunhow seems physically hurt from trying to go back and i believe he mentions others going back to try and bring reinforcements but they havent been heard from since and have been assumed dead, now with the new war coming will we infact learn some did make it and reinforcements are arriving, only time will tell

this is also why void damage is one of their weaknesses

warframe abilities do take effect on them (atleast on standard orokin tilesets, not 100% on newer things) but similar to high level heavy units the effect wears off almost instantly, meaning you slova or rhino stomp will slow or stop everything around you, but the sentients are going to snap out of it very very quickly almost instantly when compared to others

Edited May 24, 2020 by Tokens210

[MacIntoc]

Damage ! it's only talking about damage ! No where it'is talking about adaptation to abilities that CC them. Only adaptation to all that HURT them. No more. And why void beam, Shedu and Paracesys can't remove adaptation to CC abilities ? Why Adaptation mod can't adapt us to CC abilities ? Why haven't they adapted to CC's capabilities before Scarlet Spear ? That should not be part of lore too ? No need to answer, it's just rhetorical.

Get out of your head that lore defines gameplay and mechanics. Next event : spy mission, everybody use Loky, Octavia, Ivara to cheese the mission in few second without sweating. Answer from DE "Sentient can adapt, they can now progressively see you when you are invisible, it's part of Lore". At best, lore serves to make the mission more exciting (as long as it's consistent), at worst it serves to justify errors. That's all.

There is no more to say about this, so please, please, stop off topics.

Edited May 24, 2020 by MacIntoc