[The Outdated Parkour Thread] It Finally Happened! (Voice Your Opinion In The Poll!)

[Taihus]

At the very least it would be nice if the devs could confirm whether or not this would be possible with the Evolution engine.

[ForgemasterHD]

This is...This is epic.

 

And needed.

 

+1

[litlit]

Quality stuff, OP, I agree on every single point you raised.

 

At the very least it would be nice if the devs could confirm whether or not this would be possible with the Evolution engine.

 

I expect to see one of them post itt. I forget who it was, but someone posted in a different parkour animations thread (linked in the OP).

[Aure7]

"A great deal of the other issues (such as momentum and blending) is more on how our game engine handles that stuff. Unfortunately our animation programmer is also our main Ai programmer, and until we get more resources the poor guy is swamped. " - Jeoff

 

I don't think it's a question of whether or not it's possible. It's very clear though that it's tied to the engine but people there are very busy with something else.

[Taihus]

Well, at least that explains why both AI and animations are rough around the edges.

[ForgemasterHD]

"A great deal of the other issues (such as momentum and blending) is more on how our game engine handles that stuff. Unfortunately our animation programmer is also our main Ai programmer, and until we get more resources the poor guy is swamped. " - Jeoff

 

I don't think it's a question of whether or not it's possible. It's very clear though that it's tied to the engine but people there are very busy with something else.

 

Methinks DE should get more Animation Programmers...

[Guest]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P3ALwKeSEYs http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P3ALwKeSEYs

[LostGryphon]

All of my issues compiled into one post. Bravo, sir/madam.

[Derpo]

Outstanding parkour thread, kudos to OP and responders. &

I'd like to add that pressing three keys repeatedly is exhausting. The parkour key-combinations should be mappable to other key combinations or to single keys.

Additionally:

- ALL character control key mappings should be mappable to single OR multiple keys

- We need multiple save slots for different key mappings for each character control

For example, the key combination for wall run in my config is W (move forward) + [space] (sprint) + E (jump). I often screw this up, or it's flaky, or most likely both. It doesn't work well. And other key combinations are worse, at least for me. I'd like to map this to Q. Then I can move forward normally with W, jump with E, and wall run with Q. Easy. But I'd also like to keep the existing forward/sprint/jump mapping, so I can use either that or just the Q.

Anyway kudos to the original poster and to the best community in gaming.

Edited October 20, 2013 by Derpo

[Khunvyel]

With so many reputations on that post, it is clear to see that this topic is made of awesomeness and I largely agree with it :) allow me to drop my comments, especially on those that I don't agree with, and why;

 

 

1) I disagree on the ability to control wallrunning with mouselooking, because this removes the ability to wallrun in one direction and shoot in another one.

 

2) absolute agreement with the first image. Not sure about the second, this jump-back only happens to me when I am pressing the jump button too often or run into a dead end surface. But any architecture that makes our warframe jump back in shock after a wallrun should be an indicator to fix this mechanic, absolutely. Because your red arrow up just lets you run upwards to hit your head because there is no way up, so I am not sure if I visualize correctly what you are getting at. When there is room up, I always succeed from walljumping and then running up. So this case seems to be really just a bugout with the jump mechanics in confined spaces and has to be dealt with.

 

3) I do want to have walljumps more controllable, hence my suggestion to have it tie to the strafe keys instead of letting the system decide. I am not sure if yet another key for charge-of the jump is going to be helpful, we only have so many fingers and controller-based players will curse at that :D however, I can totally see to use the Dodge button as the charger. I am just not sure how viable it would become.

You CAN however get down gently from your wallrun by using the crouch key. The problem is timing it well enough that you land with the slide animation else you are auto-rolling again, which is not part of the exercise :/ And releasing the forward key lets us fall straight down on the floor very awkwardly. That shouldn't be at all.

I agree that tapping the jump shouldn't fling you half across the map, but I might see where they were coming from; you propel yourself will full force and just use the wall as platform to do so. Because the problem is, that once you let go of the jump key during the wall run, you jump away, but I do want to have this "jump-at-the-wall-and-let-go" less forcefull and more controlled. At any rate, the quick jump should not result in more forward momentum than a regular jump from the wall.

 

4) Yes, I would like to see more angular force into the direction the camera is looking, or at least which direction keys are pressed. As it is, you just hop away and have little movement control over it. Even if you look into the other direction, it just slows down the diagonal jump earlier. But like 1, I am not sure if I want more mouse control over this. I'd like to have control over where I am jumping with my direction keys, so I can concentrate my aim into the direction I want to shoot.

Here is one thing though: Once we are sliding down, we only require the jump button to be held, no direction key at all. So we should be able to dictate the direction that we want to propel away by pressing said keys, and then release jump. This way we would have the best of two worlds. Directional keys for jumping, and we can use our mouse for continued shooting.

When wallrunning up, we should be able to hold the left and right keys prior to let go of the jump button, so that would at least give us a general direction where we want to hop from there. My qualms with that is; you have to again keep the forward button pressed. If you let go of it, your wallrun up is coming to an abrupt end. In my opinion, only the jump button held should be enough to keep you running up.

 

5) I like it, and to provide more substance to the suggestion: I think it would totally be doable that you jump and instantly CLING to the wall by keeping jump pressed but stop holding the forward button. So you just release it a moment before impact to not lose all your momentum from way before.

 

6) My agreement for vaulting. I am not sure about tapping the jump key for lots of forward movement and holding it for height. Sometimes you only want to make a small jump and not suddenly cross the grand canyon. We can already do sprint+crouch+jump for a good gap-closer.

 

7) Yes, please make some of the bumpy "grab-and-rollover-objects" animation faster and more responsive for chained up movements.

 

8) I might be mistaken, and it might have been coincidence (or a simple bug), but occasionally I found myself hitting the dodge key out of reflex as I was staggered (GW2 reflex) and SOMEtimes - not always - my stagger animation was interrupted and I proceeded with the dodge roll. I would absolutely support the idea to press dodge in order to get out of a stagger regularly, and have a different, fluid, escapist animation doing so.

 

________________________

 

Comments to your "much needed fixes" :

 

1) This should be fixed once we get the previous 7. A different move to traverse objects will likely also fix this thing. Though it is weird in your second image there; I'd totally have pushed "crouch" to kick towards the pillar and have grabbed it with a wallrun up. That is still possible when you are being nudged away due to architecture but I agree that it is hard to pull of. It shouldn't be that unforgiving.

 

2) Yes, autoroll should really only occur after a certain distance fallen, regardless of being in sprint mode or not. I understand the fact that autorolling is there to "cause less falling damage" but let us be fair, we are Tenno and apparently we don't get scratched by such meager things as falling damage. Despite or because autorolling? I have no idea. But rolling should only come into place when falling a normally absolutely lethal distance. Anything in between could and should just be done with a different animation that causes us to not lose as much control.

 

3) Ah yes, this is really bothersome. If DE doesn't want us to brain-afk run up over everything, they should at least give us the "grab the ledge" animation so we finish standing on said horizontal obstacle.

[Otaiken]

SO. MUCH. YES!

[Liverslices]

As far as the momentum goes, I have never in 300 hours of gameplay ran into this problem. Yeah its a pain when you hit the ground and roll, resulting in a fall into a bottomless pit, but I have never had your momentum problem.

 

Aside from that good ideas! bumpin

[Toaman1994]

Good, good.....I fully support this. Advanced parkour and movement systems, yes.

[underverse]

+9000 this should be great improvements just hope DE is already working on this :) you got all my respect Aure7

[Aure7]

With so many reputations on that post, it is clear to see that this topic is made of awesomeness and I largely agree with it :) allow me to drop my comments, especially on those that I don't agree with, and why;

 

 

1) I disagree on the ability to control wallrunning with mouselooking, because this removes the ability to wallrun in one direction and shoot in another one.

 

2) absolute agreement with the first image. Not sure about the second, this jump-back only happens to me when I am pressing the jump button too often or run into a dead end surface. But any architecture that makes our warframe jump back in shock after a wallrun should be an indicator to fix this mechanic, absolutely. Because your red arrow up just lets you run upwards to hit your head because there is no way up, so I am not sure if I visualize correctly what you are getting at. When there is room up, I always succeed from walljumping and then running up. So this case seems to be really just a bugout with the jump mechanics in confined spaces and has to be dealt with.

 

3) I do want to have walljumps more controllable, hence my suggestion to have it tie to the strafe keys instead of letting the system decide. I am not sure if yet another key for charge-of the jump is going to be helpful, we only have so many fingers and controller-based players will curse at that :D however, I can totally see to use the Dodge button as the charger. I am just not sure how viable it would become.

You CAN however get down gently from your wallrun by using the crouch key. The problem is timing it well enough that you land with the slide animation else you are auto-rolling again, which is not part of the exercise :/ And releasing the forward key lets us fall straight down on the floor very awkwardly. That shouldn't be at all.

I agree that tapping the jump shouldn't fling you half across the map, but I might see where they were coming from; you propel yourself will full force and just use the wall as platform to do so. Because the problem is, that once you let go of the jump key during the wall run, you jump away, but I do want to have this "jump-at-the-wall-and-let-go" less forcefull and more controlled. At any rate, the quick jump should not result in more forward momentum than a regular jump from the wall.

 

4) Yes, I would like to see more angular force into the direction the camera is looking, or at least which direction keys are pressed. As it is, you just hop away and have little movement control over it. Even if you look into the other direction, it just slows down the diagonal jump earlier. But like 1, I am not sure if I want more mouse control over this. I'd like to have control over where I am jumping with my direction keys, so I can concentrate my aim into the direction I want to shoot.

Here is one thing though: Once we are sliding down, we only require the jump button to be held, no direction key at all. So we should be able to dictate the direction that we want to propel away by pressing said keys, and then release jump. This way we would have the best of two worlds. Directional keys for jumping, and we can use our mouse for continued shooting.

When wallrunning up, we should be able to hold the left and right keys prior to let go of the jump button, so that would at least give us a general direction where we want to hop from there. My qualms with that is; you have to again keep the forward button pressed. If you let go of it, your wallrun up is coming to an abrupt end. In my opinion, only the jump button held should be enough to keep you running up.

 

5) I like it, and to provide more substance to the suggestion: I think it would totally be doable that you jump and instantly CLING to the wall by keeping jump pressed but stop holding the forward button. So you just release it a moment before impact to not lose all your momentum from way before.

 

6) My agreement for vaulting. I am not sure about tapping the jump key for lots of forward movement and holding it for height. Sometimes you only want to make a small jump and not suddenly cross the grand canyon. We can already do sprint+crouch+jump for a good gap-closer.

 

7) Yes, please make some of the bumpy "grab-and-rollover-objects" animation faster and more responsive for chained up movements.

 

8) I might be mistaken, and it might have been coincidence (or a simple bug), but occasionally I found myself hitting the dodge key out of reflex as I was staggered (GW2 reflex) and SOMEtimes - not always - my stagger animation was interrupted and I proceeded with the dodge roll. I would absolutely support the idea to press dodge in order to get out of a stagger regularly, and have a different, fluid, escapist animation doing so.

 

________________________

 

Comments to your "much needed fixes" :

 

1) This should be fixed once we get the previous 7. A different move to traverse objects will likely also fix this thing. Though it is weird in your second image there; I'd totally have pushed "crouch" to kick towards the pillar and have grabbed it with a wallrun up. That is still possible when you are being nudged away due to architecture but I agree that it is hard to pull of. It shouldn't be that unforgiving.

 

2) Yes, autoroll should really only occur after a certain distance fallen, regardless of being in sprint mode or not. I understand the fact that autorolling is there to "cause less falling damage" but let us be fair, we are Tenno and apparently we don't get scratched by such meager things as falling damage. Despite or because autorolling? I have no idea. But rolling should only come into place when falling a normally absolutely lethal distance. Anything in between could and should just be done with a different animation that causes us to not lose as much control.

 

3) Ah yes, this is really bothersome. If DE doesn't want us to brain-afk run up over everything, they should at least give us the "grab the ledge" animation so we finish standing on said horizontal obstacle.

Your post really made an impact, glad that you got involved in this!

now there's a lot of things i'd like to explain about my suggestions and how you reacted to them.

1) control wallrun only when not shooting, SOLVED. It would still be a superb ability to trim your wallrun so you run just right where you need.

2) the main point of those 2 pictures is the DELAY when switching walls which makes it feel clumsy. I just want it smoother and more successful. Walls feel like magnets that you turn on and off now. And the first picture just shows that I'd rather have smooth animated transitions that do not require you to aim and use wall-catapult.

3) gonna add your things to my suggestions giving credit to you. And yes it kind of makes sense that you can use wall to jump from it without running on it too long, this only applies to jumping when you can actually AIM where to jump. Catapulting forward with same direction all the time sucks.

 

getting down from wallruns is still troublesome. I did not make much effort on purpose on that second gif. As I have experienced on Overgrowth, it's much more satisfying to return back to the floor while still running without no interruptions.

6) It's not going to be "lots of forward momentum" I would mostly be used for vaulting.

 

Fixes

1) No no teleporting to random directions after ledge-grab is absolutely unacceptable and it messes something up on every mission for me.

[Khunvyel]

ad1) Two new ideas:

A) it might very well be possible that you aim and look at the wall, and your angle upon touching it determines the angle you are running along on it, until you either run out of stamina or decide to hop off. Anything from horizontal 0° to 45° would cause you to gradually "run down" when your stamina runs out. anything from 45° and above would have you cling to the wall and slide down. This way you only need one initial direction that you want to have and then can concentrate on aiming.

B) Fully control movement with direction keys. So lets say you hit the wall to your right and start running. From this moment on, you only need to keep forward and jump pressed (though I would be TOTALLY fine to remove the jump button and just have the forward key a requirement to keep wallrunning, so you can safely release "Jump" and only tap it again when you want to hop away from the wall) Keeping the right key pressed lets you ascend the wall, and pressing the left key descends you.

 

ad2) Yes, and I was in absolute agreement with the first :) I just mentioned that the behaviour of the second looks more like bad coding how to behave in confined places when running headlong into a wall than anything else.

 

ad3) ">> Catapulting forward with same direction all the time sucks."

Indeed, yes. your steering with direction keys / mouselook should have more impact into the direction you get propelled. I'm purposefully adding "direction keys" in there because the game is scheduled to become a PS4 title. I do not purposefully want to screw console gamers over and/or force them to buy mouse & keyboard only to compete with PC peripherals.

And I fully support the opinion of "coming down from walls should be not so troublesome and smoother, so we are not as limited in our mobility when we try to execute those wonderful acrobatics." *thumbsup*

 

ad6) Yes, I fear I mistook you there. I should have taken it with context, and that would be: "you'd only be jumping with lots of forward move when there is something to jump over in the first place!" So the system will be changing the jump motion when you're going to hop off a ledge and if the other end would be in legit reach. And if you are jumping when not at a ledge, you get the normal jump. Now I got it, sorry :D

 

 

[Guest]

bump

[Taihus]

Bump because why hasn't a dev said anything about this yet?

[nekrojiji]

As a haevy parkour user I hope DE looks at this....

[Taihus]

Seriously, a third-person action game NEEDS to have excellent animations. You're looking at them all the time, after all!

[Keetsune]

It should be on TOP

[DreadScourge]

The parkour is neat in this game, but it really needs to be refined before it's reliable.

 

+1

[Mohfuu]

Suggestion for OP.

 

The transition from running to wall-running has this incredibly weird "latching" moment where the warframe pins itself to the wall.

It would be much better if the warframe inherited it's velocity from when the wallrunning was initiated instead of coming to a stop and then accelerating.

 

Also would be fun to be able to lodge your melee in the wall and hang there, would be useful for taking out targets, sniping long distance, altering direction mid-wallrun.

 

The wallrun melee attack is very stiff, I think it would be better if it was like this.. basically having the body align with the trajectory, and having the "attack" follow through to the landing, maybe this could be a way of triggering an execution/finisher move.

[awolin]

really great suggestion

[Azote]

 

 

Do you agree with these? Do you think this is worth their time? Do you also want to see a perfect game animation and parkour wise?

 YES SIR !