Another Thread About Challenge in Warframe

[(PSN)Wil_Shatner_face]

9 minutes ago, Zimzala said:

It's just so hard to please such a large base of divergent players, IMO.

I play these games for relaxation and fun. 

I am fully aware that such things are extremely subjective.

There are those that define fun in ways that I find tedious and I am sure what I find fun, someone finds boring, etc.

I understand that once I have all the things, that I then have to make my own fun in these types of games, but I know so many people push what I think should be personal responcibility, in this case finding something fun to do, onto a game company, to make it the games company's 'fault' that as a player, one simply exhausted what the company has to offer them as a gamer and that one sometimes has to make ones own fun.

I agree, and I’m not putting any blame on the developers here, but I do think WF would benefit tremendously from a game mode that is still fun even after you’ve collected all of the things. Call it “endgame” if you want, I’m not here to put labels on things, but just something to keep players engaged.

I’m still collecting things myself, but I’d like to keep playing this game even after I’ve collected all the things. Really hope they figure something out.

[Zimzala]

28 minutes ago, (PS4)Wil_Shatner_face said:

I agree, and I’m not putting any blame on the developers here, but I do think WF would benefit tremendously from a game mode that is still fun even after you’ve collected all of the things. Call it “endgame” if you want, I’m not here to put labels on things, but just something to keep players engaged.

I’m still collecting things myself, but I’d like to keep playing this game even after I’ve collected all the things. Really hope they figure something out.

When/If I get all the things, I have a lot of goodies, but not nearly all, I will do what I always do - I will find things and combinations of things that clear content that are more fun to play.

I love-love sideways progression.

I will try and build each frame with weapon combos that look cool and play fun (for me) and clear content that don't rely on the 'meta'.

I will go out of my way to clear content with things others say cannot clear the content.

There are so, so many ways to have fun in this kind of game without the need for further vertical progression, if you simply take the time to look.

I already love playing Frost and clearing content, for example, after reading numerous Internet voices claim that frame is no longer 'current' or whatever, that it is outclassed and no longer relevent, blah blah blah.

We will find plenty of fun in WF, even as the naysayers, content locusts, and general gaming meta eltitists try and tell us we are 'doing it all wrong'. 🙂 

[(PSN)Wil_Shatner_face]

1 hour ago, Zimzala said:

There are so, so many ways to have fun in this kind of game without the need for further vertical progression, if you simply take the time to look.

I already love playing Frost and clearing content, for example, after reading numerous Internet voices claim that frame is no longer 'current' or whatever, that it is outclassed and no longer relevent, blah blah blah.

We will find plenty of fun in WF, even as the naysayers, content locusts, and general gaming meta eltitists try and tell us we are 'doing it all wrong'. 🙂 

I wish more players could view the game through this light. I like to look at warframe like a giant sandbox to do whatever the hell I want. You are right, there are endless possibilities and ways to entertain yourself in a game like this. Doesn’t change the fact that I wish it had just one challenging game mode, but you’re right, I’ll continue having fun with it regardless.

[Zimzala]

7 minutes ago, (PS4)Wil_Shatner_face said:

I wish more players could view the game through this light. I like to look at warframe like a giant sandbox to do whatever the hell I want. You are right, there are endless possibilities and ways to entertain yourself in a game like this. Doesn’t change the fact that I wish it had just one challenging game mode, but you’re right, I’ll continue having fun with it regardless.

I am hopeful, even confident, that DE can find some ways to entertain a larger portion of the playerbase with more ways to play.

I still think the best ideas I have seen are around adding in random mechanics that already exist, like a random Nightmare mode kicks in 'per round', enemies with random strengths and immunities, etc.

I would love having to take in a loadout or team of loadouts that cannot simply be tuned for a specific task and must be able to handle 'everything'. Sure, some people would create a 'meta' they cannot help themselves, but IMO, RNG is a key point for WF and should be exploited in this case to provide trully random sets of circumstances, including virtually 'no win' situations.

What I see so very many gamers want over the course of playing games and goofing on forums is that players tend to want something more like the current movie scene, where one can know everything about the movie beforehand so one can decide if the movie is "worth watching" and already know the plot, etc. before ever watching. IME, this is what the masses want - they want to pick up someone elses saved game, follow the guide, get the goodies and then move to the next game.

Not mention the RNG hate that already exists in WF, but I know so very many players would detest now knowing what a mission will hold - even now we see complaints when  mission turns into a kill-all unexpectedly.

Unexpected events and having to deal with them, IME, are what drive real fun in games.

[spirit_of_76]

10 hours ago, Aldain said:

LOWERING THE INSANE POWER GAP in order to keep the wider variety of options available without compromising the potential challenge because one weapon/frame does everything with no effort

they did this to an extent with melee 3.0 but most melees i see are still pole arms or what ever we used before hand because lazy however they are can be replaced with out hurting your self too much.  

[(PSN)Wil_Shatner_face]

1 hour ago, (PS4)JohnWickHitman said:

Hmm, so what I'm seeing, are people with no life, who follow the meta, who min-maxed a build(s), and who dictate team make ups, complaining the game isn't hard enough and have trivialized the content this way?

Is this correct??

Really, you got the cajone's to be here crying?? 

Maybe...

Don't play so much

Don't follow the meta/ "master" weapons yada yada

Don't min-max

Don't dictate a team that trivializes content, play with what shows up...

 

Maybe you should:

Play the game for fun, ie. to relax, not turn it into a full time J-O-B

It's not the companies fault you burned through the content. They added stuff, made events and things, yet you are still complaining. Take off that "TRIVIALIZING" meta frame(s) and quit trying to be the Top 1% who "dictates" how things should be...You look like an arrogant arse. But I guess every game has them, even here I guess...

You think this game is to easy, trivial, or what have you....QUIT! Move on to another game...

Don't want to do that, then set restrictions on yourself. YOU are the one making the game trivial/easy buy using the "meta/OP" builds. Don't use them/those items.

Go help new Tenno's...and don't "PREACH" at them, guide them. Most players are literally here to escape the BS in the RW, drama/preachy attitudes are a turn off.

Just stop and enjoy the game as it is, like the rest of us...Gaming ISN'T supposed to be a J-O-B!

Relaxxxxx.....

/rant

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Dude....did you even read my post? Or any other comment I’ve left on this thread? I don’t think you did otherwise there is no way you would have taken that from it. I’ve stated that I don’t use the Bramma and I’ve stated that I don’t like super meta setups.
 

The game is still pretty easy without that, but that’s more of an observation than a complaint, as I’ve also stated that I love the game regardless of how easy it is. My only reason behind this thread is that I think the game could benefit from a truly challenging game mode that can test the limits of our frames power. Trying to be constructive, not critical. That’s it man. Chill.

[Felsagger]

2 hours ago, (PS4)Wil_Shatner_face said:

Dude....did you even read my post? Or any other comment I’ve left on this thread? I don’t think you did otherwise there is no way you would have taken that from it. I’ve stated that I don’t use the Bramma and I’ve stated that I don’t like super meta setups.
 

The game is still pretty easy without that, but that’s more of an observation than a complaint, as I’ve also stated that I love the game regardless of how easy it is. My only reason behind this thread is that I think the game could benefit from a truly challenging game mode that can test the limits of our frames power. Trying to be constructive, not critical. That’s it man. Chill.

Shatner, that account is an obvious troll account. Don't bother reasoning with him. 

To be honest some moderate challenge is always welcome. However the topic is quite sensitive and complex in terms of game design. We have to see what DE officially say on such matter. 

[BRZZAFK]

19分钟前 , (PS4)JohnWickHitman 说:

Right there!

You want more challenge, yet you "say" your not using meta.

"OK, I believe" you...

Still makes my post correct.

Quit playing so much.

Make YOUR OWN challenges.

Quit trying to force the game maker to do that.

Or better yet, just quit the game all together.

You come off as an elitist crying for content to suit you...

That makes you "1%'er"...the minority.

Game is perfectly fine as is....

Buh bye!

It's not like game offer a lot fun or challenge without meta. we already know that when grendel mission came out.

[(NSW)Greybones]

14 minutes ago, BRZZAFK said:

It's not like game offer a lot fun or challenge without meta. we already know that when grendel mission came out.

Looking forward to the Grendel missions! 👍 Then I can see for myself what all this hubbub’s about

It’s taking aaaaages to get there though since I don’t play constantly and don’t want to rush and spoiler my partner with story stuff 😞 

edit: That’s probably contributing to the anticipation, come to think of it 🤔. I’m curious enough to experience what many seem to hate that I’m going around responding to practically any post about Grendel 😅. Not my usual MO

Edited June 3, 2020 by (NSW)Greybones

[(PSN)JohnWickHitman]

50 minutes ago, BRZZAFK said:

It's not like game offer a lot fun or challenge without meta. we already know that when grendel mission came out.

Still on Ceres, no clue what you're talking bout.

Matter of fact, I haven't touched 75% of the content.

And I find it semi difficult.

Yet, again, I don't play like everyone, no meta, no speed levels, way off the map build.

Bow

Kunai

Dual Swords

Hehe...

[(PSN)Wil_Shatner_face]

6 hours ago, (PS4)JohnWickHitman said:

Still on Ceres, no clue what you're talking bout.

Matter of fact, I haven't touched 75% of the content.

And I find it semi difficult.

 

Lmao GIT GUD NOOB

[Lost_Cartographer]

Bloating enemy health pools isn't challenge, it just limits the viable weapon/frame selection to kill things in a timely enough manner that your ammo economy isn't totally in the crapper.  People complained about the Railjack troop health nerf making them "easier."  ...Except chances are people that min-max were already damn near one shotting them through out the veil, everyone else that wanted to use something like a Braton Prime without a frame that buffs damage 5-10x just ignored them because they were literally too much sponge.  
 

Meanwhile, anything representing actual challenge, like ability immunity, energy drain, etc, people scream bloody murder about because they can't just hit a button and delete enemies or, failing that, shut down the AI and turn everything into a stationary, brain dead target.  Why?  Because they're looking for a reason to brag about how good they are (mistakenly confusing math exploitation for actual skill,) not an actual challenge.  This game is won in the arsenal, not on the battlefield.  It'd be more apt to call Warframe a puzzle shooter than a twitch shooter.

If players truly wanted a challenge, step 1 is removing Zenurik energy bubbles, energy pads, severely nerfing rage and rage-like mods, and frames with near infinite energy recharge abilities/mechanics.  We were never meant to be able to spam our abilities ad nauseum.  A 100 energy ability shouldn't be as readily available as a 25 energy ability at all times.

But since people won't accept the kinds of changes needed before meaningful challenge can be introduced, we're stuck with a game I can't recommend to anyone because unless they explicitly refuse to min-max, it's more a flashier version of clicker heroes than an actual game, and Digital Extremes can't decide which side of the fence they want to design/balance future content for.

Edited June 3, 2020 by Lost_Cartographer

[(PSN)Wil_Shatner_face]

1 hour ago, Lost_Cartographer said:

But since people won't accept the kinds of changes needed before meaningful challenge can be introduced, we're stuck with a game I can't recommend to anyone because unless they explicitly refuse to min-max, it's more a flashier version of clicker heroes than an actual game, and Digital Extremes can't decide which side of the fence they want to design/balance future content for.

I understand where you’re coming from with your post but I just want to throw out there that I found warframe in the past year and I think it’s a blast. Sure I’d love if it had 1 hard game mode, that’s why I made the thread, but the game is great regardless. I think you may be a bit jaded from years of the game not living up to what it could be. I agree that warframe falls a bit short of its enormous potential, but it is still a fantastic game that I’d recommend to anyone that doesn’t mind a grind.

Just put this out there to say I think the game is still very much worth recommending.

Edited June 3, 2020 by (PS4)Wil_Shatner_face

[Zimzala]

4 hours ago, (PS4)Wil_Shatner_face said:

I understand where you’re coming from with your post but I just want to throw out there that I found warframe in the past year and I think it’s a blast. Sure I’d love if it had 1 hard game mode, that’s why I made the thread, but the game is great regardless. I think you may be a bit jaded from years of the game not living up to what it could be. I agree that warframe falls a bit short of its enormous potential, but it is still a fantastic game that I’d recommend to anyone that doesn’t mind a grind.

Just put this out there to say I think the game is still very much worth recommending.

Same.

The only people I see on the Internet hating the game at scale are the players that already beat the game and don't like to make their own fun.

IMO, it's a video game, you play it however long you like to play it, it's not a relationship-commitment, the game does not owe people anything more than it provides.

[(PSN)Wil_Shatner_face]

8 minutes ago, Zimzala said:

Same.

The only people I see on the Internet hating the game at scale are the players that already beat the game and don't like to make their own fun.

IMO, it's a video game, you play it however long you like to play it, it's not a relationship-commitment, the game does not owe people anything more than it provides.

Very true. The amount of salt poured out from people with thousands of hours in the game always cracks me up. “WF has no sustainable content” meanwhile they have 3,000 hours in the game. It’s kind of hilarious.

This is just my opinion, but I think this game has more potential than any game I’ve ever played. The possibilities are ENDLESS. Does it actually live up to its massive potential? Not really, but what’s that old saying, shoot for the moon and even if you miss you’ll land among the stars? I think that fits WF and it’s ambition pretty perfectly.

That being said, I always try to view things through the lens of others, and if I was a 5 year veteran of this game I could understand being burnt out on it or being unhappy with some of DE’s choices. But if I was in that boat I would just move on to another game rather than whine about it. DE is going to follow their own vision for the game, not whatever vision we as players want them to follow, and that’s okay. It’s their game.

Edited June 3, 2020 by (PS4)Wil_Shatner_face

[Zimzala]

15 minutes ago, (PS4)Wil_Shatner_face said:

That being said, I always try to view things through the lens of others, and if I was a 5 year veteran of this game I could understand being burnt out on it or being unhappy with some of DE’s choices. But if I was in that boat I would just move on to another game rather than whine about it. DE is going to follow their own vision for the game, not whatever vision we as players want them to follow, and that’s okay. It’s their game.

As I have done with many GaaS and other games.

It will never cease to amaze me how some gamers can conflate playing a game for hours on end into having 'invested' in some sort of 'relationship' with the game and/or it's developers, or end up acting as if they need to be some sort of parent to both the game company and the players once they decide the game has wronged them in some way.

Play the games you like, support the ones you can, has worked for me for 40 years.

Trying to convince others a game sucks because you burnt out on it is just silly.