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Orokin Derelicts, Vaults, And How De Should Change Them To Give Us Necessary Mods


Destro6677
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Currently the Derelicts seem like a cheap way to artificially lengthen our grind and play time.

 

1. The Orokin Derelicts are currently the only place to find Orokin Vaults. 

 

2. To access the vaults, we need a Derelict key to get into the Derelict ship and a Void key (to make the dragon key) which will be consumed when the vault is opened. 

 

This promotes so much grind, at the end of the day only advanced players will be able to enjoy these places. And once they have all the mods, how many want to bother to return?

 

What I propose is this:

 

1. Move the Derelicts to the regular star map, with only regular 'essential' mods as rewards, and vault doors that can be opened by merely interacting with them. The essential mods include redirection, direct damage upgrades etc. Lower level Corrupted should spawn in these maps, so that lower level players can gain some experience fighting them and have a challenge.

 

2. The advanced Derelict mods will still be behind the keys grind wall, but will feature a revamped nightmare mode that does not gimp the player excessively aka no 'no shields + energy drain' unless the player chooses to set such extreme conditions for themselves. The keys negative effects should still be there.

 

If the regular derelicts allow players to farm their essential mods too fast, then the vault spawn rates should be tweaked accordingly.

 

Tldr: Move Derelicts back to the regular starmap, with no keys needed to open the door, but only important mods like redirection will be given as a reward if players find them. The advanced mods and 'nightmare' mode derelicts stay behind the grind wall. This allows DE to solve the problem of the tileset not being played in and helps necessary player progression.

 

Edit: Sorry if the post lacks clarity for now.

Edited by Destro6677
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I am sorry but your goals feel very unfocused and poorly defined.

 

To talk about your points:

 

1) Yes they only spawn in derelicts. This is to make them something special in the derelicts which, pre-patch, was really only for mutagen and Golem Nav co-ordinates. 

 

2) You will need a "Derelict" key and a Dragon key (This is the vault key). Please correct your "2"  in your post:

 

2. To access the vaults, we need a void key (dragon key) and a Vault key, both of which will be consumed upon use.

 

 What is wrong with consuming a key on use? Means you have limited use of them and need to actually work to earn something in this game. Derelict keys are cheap to make and you can choose which type of mission to make. Dragon keys have reuse-able recipes and getting void keys could not be easier now. DE have made its so 15 min in any non-void non-alert survival will ALWAYS rewards a void key. 15 min in Apollodonus gets you a tier 1 key. Also the keys you carry into a game having an actualy effect on the character is a lovely idea and the need to expand on this concept.  

-----------

 

Now as for your suggestions. I cant help but feel you have some underlying game problem here that you are trying to pin on Derelict Vaults. 

 

1) Why do you want more levels on the solar system map? There is plenty already. Then you want the Vault to just open for you by pushing a button and it gives you basic mods? are you struggling with some of these Mods? There are plenty of ways to obtain those mods. Go do defence missions for mod rewards as that is their purpose... You also want corrupted in easy missions for low levels to give new players a challenge! What? why? Go to Apollodronus to 15 min with a low lvl frame. Thats a challenge and your reward will be a tier 1 (lvl 20ish mobs) Void mission with corrupted enemies. Why are you so insistent to move new group content down to your level? If you cant do it yet then play some more normal missions and you will soon get to play it. Or message me and I will run you through some stuff.

 

2) Ok you actually have an excellent area to discuss here but you have mised it up a bit. You want the current corrupted mods to be on a nightmare mode but only if you choose them. Ummm like the keys already are... less hp? less shield? less speed? less damage? but optional? 

 

What you should have said for point 2 is two things:

 A) Nightmare mode needs redoing (at pesent no reason to do a nightmare outside of Venus!)

 B) Derelict keys should get lvl versions that require more nav co-ordinates (e.g. Derelcit capture 1, Derelcit Capture 2). Only difference is harder mobs (for fun!) and maybe tier the corrupted mods onto different tiers of vaults. BTW same goes for Golem nav, J-2000, Lephantis or whatever. Needs a lvl 2 key version that takes 50 Golem navs but is lvl 100+.

 

Your need for "essential" mods confuses me. Is there something you need that your missing? Hornet strike and serration are odd to get atm but apart from that the others are quite obtainable. 

 

I think you need to break your ideas down to each point and think what it would bring to the game that is not already there. The game needs difficulty and a bit of carrot dangling atm. I don't mind a bit of a grind. If everything was obtainable immediately then nothing would be special. 

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The grind fest of the Derelict Vaults is irrelevant. The RNG fest inherit in them, however, is not.

the only RNG there is is that you might carry the wrong key. that is only present in solo, and this is a coop game. and im saying this as someone that hasn´t played online in more than a month

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What you should have said for point 2 is two things:

 A) Nightmare mode needs redoing (at pesent no reason to do a nightmare outside of Venus!)

 B) Derelict keys should get lvl versions that require more nav co-ordinates (e.g. Derelcit capture 1, Derelcit Capture 2). Only difference is harder mobs (for fun!) and maybe tier the corrupted mods onto different tiers of vaults. BTW same goes for Golem nav, J-2000, Lephantis or whatever. Needs a lvl 2 key version that takes 50 Golem navs but is lvl 100+.

 

Your need for "essential" mods confuses me. Is there something you need that your missing? Hornet strike and serration are odd to get atm but apart from that the others are quite obtainable. 

 

I think you need to break your ideas down to each point and think what it would bring to the game that is not already there. The game needs difficulty and a bit of carrot dangling atm. I don't mind a bit of a grind. If everything was obtainable immediately then nothing would be special. 

I just did a level 105 Corpus rescue alert solo. There's plenty of high level content I can handle.

 

The problem is with our current system of RNG, no one is guaranteed important mods like redirection, vitality etc and it becomes a roadblock for lower level players. Have you been keeping up with the forums lately? Newer players are getting stuck at Earth because armor piercing mods are not dropping for them.

 

Yes, the game needs difficulty, which is why I suggested that lower level Corrupted be included. It's training for Voids.

 

I agree with your point 2 that I should have broken it down into 2 separate parts. You said what I had been trying to say.

 

The problem of the grindfest is that in order to experience this content, you need to grind for credits, materials and etc to build the derilict key. That's one. Two, in order to actually access the vault, you need a key which was built using a void key, which you need to grind Xini defense for (or Apollodorus Survival, as you said).

 

You guys are not acknowledging that this much grind just to reach a new tileset and enjoy the content there is a major turnoff for players, especially if the RNG fails to give them the mods they need to advance past Earth.

 

I did not ask that the Derelicts be made easier, only that the road there should not be as grindy. 

 

Edit: In fact, veteran players are turned off by the grind as well. How many veterans do you know who will bother to return to the Derelicts once they have gotten all the Derelict Vault mods?

 

I agree that nightmare mode needs redoing, but about the second point being a more advanced key, I think I will have to disagree. The game is already putting too much importance on grind.

Edited by Destro6677
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the only RNG there is is that you might carry the wrong key. that is only present in solo, and this is a coop game. and im saying this as someone that hasn´t played online in more than a month

 

Wrong key, and potential of a mod you have yet to acquire is bad enough. Not everyone has the potential to play in big groups, either due to connection issues or whatever.

 

This inane idea that Warframe being a coop game meaning that solo players should get shafted at every turn is sickening to say the least...

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Way to over-dramatise the situation. "Sickening"? I honestly think you need to re-focus.

 

This has nothing to do with the vaults, and everything to do with the community. One bad word about how bad the gates grind/rng is and people always say "go join a team" as if that solution wasn't obvious. But again, not everyone has the potential to join a good team, or even any team at all, to work on the vaults. But people time and again insist this is somehow the fault of the player rather than a simple oversight in the design of the vaults that needs to be fixed. Sickening is the proper word to use to describe someone like that, because the idiocy one must have to even think that someone needs to be made to suffer for the way they choose to play (or be forced to play in the case of those with horrible connection issues) is that disgusting. It's very reminiscent to the attitude people took back when clans were first introduced and prices to do anything with the halls were so insane that smaller clans had absolutely no chance of doing anything this them, but people insisting that this was somehow OK... It wasn't OK then, and it's not OK now...

 

As for the vaults themselves, if this game is meant to be co-op only, the solo play option shouldn't exist. If they're gonna keep it, the least they could do is make all events and major game additions support the option. At least until they fix the damned strict NAT issues many people have that keep them from going co-op...

Edited by ToeSama
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There's already drop locations for all those "required" mods. those capture/spy/rescue missions drop redirection etc. and scorpions are on mercury so you can easily farm there for serration. we dont need another set of planets. we dont need easier vaults. and we already have drop locations for necessary mods.

 

as for people not being able to pass earth... kunai. morphics? mercury. ferrite? mercury. nanospores? saturn. salvage? mars/jupiter.

Edited by xenapan
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There's already drop locations for all those "required" mods. those capture/spy/rescue missions drop redirection etc. and scorpions are on mercury so you can easily farm there for serration. we dont need another set of planets. we dont need easier vaults. and we already have drop locations for necessary mods.

 

as for people not being able to pass earth... kunai. morphics? mercury. ferrite? mercury. nanospores? saturn. salvage? mars/jupiter.

Did you read the other topic in which everyone is comparing what mods they did not get?

 

I can count at least a few people who said they don't have enough redirection, vitality, serration or hornet strike.

 

Just because it's not your problem doesn't mean no one else is affected.

 

Tldr: Stop being such an elitist.

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What irritates me the most about this is that some of us do not have the hardware for the ODs. Take mine for instance. It runs smooth as a whistle on most maps maybe some FPS loss on infested which is nothing to cry over. Maybe 5 frames at it's worst. The ODs on the other hand tend to make me lose nearly 80% of my frames in most of the rooms. How does this relate to the INSANE requirement for Mutagen Samples? It's simple, if the OD maps were more optimized (More frame rate efficient) running ODs would not be such a hassle. The rate of them is almost as bad as Orokin Cells on some missions. You can get at most 25 a run in a OD Defense but what good does that do? You need 10 per mass and every weapon takes multiple masses to build. I honestly think it is BS that the ONLY way you can get them is from an OD. It takes way too much effort to grind for something that should be easier to get especially considering it's demand. I would think either it's drop rate should be increased or make it drop from more locations. Taking it out of the solar system maps was in my opinion a stupid idea.

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