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Kuva Bramma Changes: Explanation and Timeline.


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4 minutes ago, kaotis said:

How exactly is a weapon meant to kill enemies destroying your gameplay? Your gameplay supposedly (if you aren't hunting, flying railjack or fishing) is technically to kill stuf.

Because a single user on their own can level a whole room, The issue isnt the weapon per se its the fact its removing 'fun' from other people by instantly deleting the map.

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Posted (edited)
28 minutes ago, kaotis said:

How exactly is a weapon meant to kill enemies destroying your gameplay? Your gameplay supposedly (if you aren't hunting, flying railjack or fishing) is technically to kill stuf.

Well, my cup of tea is not necessary involves your opinion of taste. 
Imagine if daikyu, zhuge prime and bramma, what will you choose ?
Why you choose bramma instead of others? And apply that reason to why I choose not bramma, then ya, that's why. 
IN short, No aiming ? No skills required ? sounds like brain dead to me.
I prefer killing in style, not destructions. Killing is an art, explosions are for kids

Edited by Aoennor
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This is why I don't even bother using new "OP" weapons in game anymore. You get a new toy and BAM, nerfed. The lesson is "don't get attached."

I don't really care what weapon is most popular. How about making the weapons more fun (gimmiks) or more effective based on the current state of the game. How about adding equippable powers/abilities that can take the place of a weapon slot ("Control" a paranormal game revolving around Telekensis abilities comes to mind). 

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6 hours ago, Kayll said:

There's 100's of weapons in the game, its much simpler to focus on outliers who are too powerful then try to raise 100 other weapons to match their potency.

That wasn't quite what I expressed. I simply stated that there are some DEAD weapons that need to be brought back to life. Never said that ALL OTHER weapons should be raised to the level of the Kuva Bramma. Some ( not all ) are quite dead, but I've never seen a fix in this direction.

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This is a super minimal nerf it seems, but now I just want to see some actual gun balancing instead of relying on rivens so much to do it for you. Some guns are so atrociously bad that they're not even salvageable.

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Posted (edited)
18 minutes ago, Aoennor said:

Well, my cup of tea is not necessary involves your opinion of taste. 
Imagine if daikyu, zhuge prime and bramma, what will you choose ?
Why you choose bramma instead of others? And amply that reason to why I choose not bramma, then ya, that's why. 
IN short, No aiming ? No skills required ? sounds like brain dead to me.
I prefer killing in style, not destructions. Killing is an art, explosions are for kids

wonderful. it seems I'm not alone out here.

When you've got most everything in the arsenal and don't care for the rewards as heavily, you tend to want to beat the badguys with something a bit more civilized or fancy/stylish. or atleast, shenanigans.

Edited by Darkmega18
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5 minutes ago, Darkmega18 said:

wonderful. it seems I'm not alone out here.

When you've got most everything in the arsenal and don't care for the rewards as heavily, you tend to want to beat the badguys with something a bit more civilized or fancy/stylish. or atleast, shenanigans.

then comes the problem that your 3 teammates are very unlikely to think that way and you'll be staring at empty corridors and/or Bramma explosions.

 

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Posted (edited)
15 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

- It has a smaller reserve ammo (15 to 5), and gains fewer arrows from ammo pickups

I don`t agree with this part, DON`T ADD THIS. i don`t need to use it to know this is a bad idea (like Ash`s blade storm). Everything else is ok but not this, don`t ruin another good weapon like you did with the telos boltace. This will make me not use this weapon and I don`t even use it like everyone else does.

Edited by (PS4)Vexx757
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Looks like good and balanced changes overall. Hope this is an indication that we may eventually see some changes to the few outlier AoE damage frames aswell.

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Posted (edited)

Like others have said no need to reduce the ammo however instead have a longer recharge time or even reload time?? This will prevent spam & quick kills! 

Plus Instead of 3 Cluster Bombs how about we make it 4 or 5 the max? In return the recoil or Aim Speed is slow requiring skill to hit target with Accuracy.. 

Other then that I guess the changes are ok as long as damage is left be! As it should still wreck level +150 emenies as it should... 

Just wish you wouldn't mess with the AOE as it's ok where it was.. that said I guess the longer radius & it dealing more damage is a good trade off.. 

That said 3.5 radius is good but can't we atheist make it 4 or 5.0 max?? If not ok just don't mess with anything else & we should be good hopefully..

Edited by (PS4)LegionOfZoom1410
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47 minutes ago, (XB1)Tyreal2012 said:

there's plenty of other choices out there,

It's not much of a choice when it requires intentionally using something inferior. i.e. every other weapon in the game right now compared to Bramma.

That's why some modicum of balance needs to be maintained.

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Posted (edited)
18 minutes ago, VeraElena said:

then comes the problem that your 3 teammates are very unlikely to think that way and you'll be staring at empty corridors and/or Bramma explosions.

 

That's why they're not my teammates. and if they are, I'm using them to level my gear and i'm playing a support and letting them have fun while simultaneously running off and having flares on and disobeying their desires for camping in a single spot. 😉

Edited by Darkmega18
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2 minutes ago, Akimbo said:

It's not much of a choice when it requires intentionally using something inferior. i.e. every other weapon in the game right now compared to Bramma.

That's why some modicum of balance needs to be maintained.

NO denying, but as i've stated previously im not Meta, so i've lots of choices 🙂 

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hm, this seems more like a buff then a nerv.

bigger cluster explosion, less fall off. i don´t think there will be any impact of usage for this weapon

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15 hours ago, Arkennstar said:

So this is the Catchmoon fiasco all over again...

I just need to ask.. how does this happen again and again. Weapon is released so blatantly powerful that everyone and their mother is using it. Usage statistics spike. Weapon is nerfed to the ground (Bramma is still not nerfed enough in my opinion, but we'll see). All the people who invested time and resources into these obviously broken weapons are disappointed.

How hard is it to see at the conception of a weapon that it is so stupidly overpowered and easy to use that it will no doubt end up in this situation? A weapon that does more damage than snipers, is massively AoE, has absolutely no drawbacks.. Isnt it time to look at weapon balance at release instead of a few months after? I mean it doesnt take a clairvoyant to see if a weapon is going to be so over the top that it makes every other weapon obsolete. 

If I had to guess?

Because there's only one meaningful gameplay situation in Warframe right now. Crowd clearing. There's no room for sidegrades, utility weapons, loadouts, because everything save the boss fights only comes down to 'here's a lot of enemies, get rid of them as fast as possible'.  There are very few enemies that matter, those few that do are spammed inconsiderately for some barest hint at variety, which just leads to annoying spam in the form of randomly-appearing deflector shields that turn off powers. Ancient Healers don't matter, Bursas don't matter, Bombards don't matter - we spam Area of Effect weapons or powers into the crowd of mooks they're in and they die just as fast.

In other words, there's no niches for DE to make a weapon to fit into. Precision weapons are fundamentally less powerful than explosives, because a fast time to kill on a single target genuinely does not matter, because you almost never have a reason to burst down a single target. If you do, then that's the only thing you need to do anyway, so now crowd clearers aren't useful (I distinctly remember that during Hostile Mergers). Warframes and players have so few vulnerabilites and are so self-sufficient that support weapons, either of the direct boosting or weakness-covering varieties are irrelevant. Even mobility, one of the biggest selling points of Warframe and one of its most praised elements, isn't meta. Positioning and dodging is irrelevant in the face of nuking.

Without a niche for a weapon to fill, there's nowhere for DE to go to make people excited for a new weapon, because it won't be interesting. With one track, one challenge, one objective to do, then it is either better or it is useless

This is why people warn against power creep. This is why people want more balance and challenge. This is why just following the idea of 'it's a power fantasy, players should never be threatened' leads to the game getting boring. Because DE can't make their own game anymore.

 

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, Traubenzuckr said:

is this the current idea for the rework in terms of damage?

zG2nGihx_o.png

I hope so I mean we do need a super strong weapon.. if this is how it ends up with the increase damage to bomblets to 374 then I'm ok with the Changes DE is making because the weapon in terms of damage will be where it should be..

 

It's supposed to be an end game weapon so yes the damage should be untouched othet then an increase to Bomblet damage because of reduced amount of Cluster Bombs.. the damage makes up for the reduction..

 

If it turns out the way you got it in the pic then I'm ok with the changes! As weapon will still be good as it should be! Just with a few tweaks is all!

 

I'm sure the total damage will actually increase because the reduction to 3 cluster Bombs + damage fall off will surely increase the damage! So it might be higher then the 1122 Blast Damage which I'm cool with as the other changes will help offset the high damage..

 

Edited by (PS4)LegionOfZoom1410
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Honestly, I feel like people are predisposed to freaking out whenever something is getting nerfed, but these changes are honestly rather fair. Quite frankly, the Kuva Bramma has the highest overall damage of the explosive weapons, and the highest effect radius of the explosive weapons, whilst having a good rate of fire. It was by far the best explosive weapon (and arguably the best primary weapon), disproportionately so. Mind you, in some regards what I'm about to say could be a call-out towards other weapons, but in my honest opinion it was the only weapon that justified the existence of Self-Damage without the use of some sort of safety feature (such as the Lenz's delayed explosion or the arming time that some weapons had). There's a reason a large portion of the player base used it.

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2 minutes ago, Shade_Final said:

Honestly, I feel like people are predisposed to freaking out whenever something is getting nerfed, but these changes are honestly rather fair. Quite frankly, the Kuva Bramma has the highest overall damage of the explosive weapons, and the highest effect radius of the explosive weapons, whilst having a good rate of fire. It was by far the best explosive weapon (and arguably the best primary weapon), disproportionately so. Mind you, in some regards what I'm about to say could be a call-out towards other weapons, but in my honest opinion it was the only weapon that justified the existence of Self-Damage without the use of some sort of safety feature (such as the Lenz's delayed explosion or the arming time that some weapons had). There's a reason a large portion of the player base used it.

Plus after reading it over and over again there clearly increasing the damage because there will be lass Cluster Bombs so the weapon will still be at full strength damage wise if not actually better.. so the 1122 total damage will likely be higher + the Damege Falloff is improved making it even stronger 

The other changes will actually offset the higher damage while still making it end game tier as it should be...

 

So it's a should still be a win win! Which will be cool!

 

 

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1 minute ago, B0NYB0Y said:

finally

Finally what? You do know they are actually increasing the total damage it does because of the damage fall off reduction & Less Cluster Bombs! 

The weapon will still be end game level with an increase to damage which is perfectly fine.. the changes DE is making will offset the increase in damage..

So I'm cool with it because the weapon should still be very strong with higher damage..  as it should be because the Bramma is ment to be an endgame weapon..

The other changes should offset it & maybe drive people away from using it because there's less ammo & less cluster bombs while failing to understand the weapon is actually better & stronger in damage now! So there's the comprise!

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DE first of all thanks for the amazing game! Please don't become like Destiny were nerf all my year one raid weapons and make me grind for them again as exotics. Thus Warframe happened!

I understand change but this does feel like a huge nerf. I have one and I don't use it all the time. I say let people use what they like and let people grind for the weapons they want. If you fill Kuva is overwhelming, maybe the better solution is to have a public match making with an option to ban annoying weapons and frames you don't want others to come in with.....or just play solo. This change that you are about to do could be a short term solution to the bigger issues. It will be interesting to see if it is even useful afterwards. I wonder if DE should think about giving back Forma and Catalyst's if they Nerf a weapon so much.

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Posted (edited)
5 minutes ago, (XB1)MonStream00 said:

DE first of all thanks for the amazing game! Please don't become like Destiny were nerf all my year one raid weapons and make me grind for them again as exotics. Thus Warframe happened!

I understand change but this does feel like a huge nerf. I have one and I don't use it all the time. I say let people use what they like and let people grind for the weapons they want. If you fill Kuva is overwhelming, maybe the better solution is to have a public match making with an option to ban annoying weapons and frames you don't want others to come in with.....or just play solo. This change that you are about to do could be a short term solution to the bigger issues. It will be interesting to see if it is even useful afterwards. I wonder if DE should think about giving back Forma and Catalyst's if they Nerf a weapon so much.

it's not a true nerf if you read it basically the damage is untouched & will actually be increased.. 

Because the damage fall off & less Cluster Bombs is actually going to increase the damage a bit..

Where the nerfing is going to trun people away & make people think it's a bad  weapon now will be it has less ammo less Cluster bombs & less AOE so in there mind the weapon will be useless when it really remains op!

However in terms of damage it will remain end game level as it should be.. 

Those other changes will offset the increase damage it is receiving as a compromise!

Edited by (PS4)LegionOfZoom1410
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16 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

- It has a smaller reserve ammo (15 to 5), and gains fewer arrows from ammo pickups - This is to encourage players to aim the bow deliberately at crowds of enemies and not fire it wildly everywhere

This is to encourage players to use an exilus weapon adapter for Primed Rifle Ammo Mutation and/or Carrier for Ammo Case to fire it wildly everywhere

16 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

- Fewer cluster bombs are produced on impact (from 7 to 3) - Reduces the overwhelming AOE potential somewhat but also makes the Bramma less visually busy. Players have said that the many many explosions produced by Bramma are hard to see through.

Are you kidding ? There is no need to reduce the number of clusters to do that. Just reduce the particles and light effect. Please, don't take us for asses.

 

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